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Author Topic: [1500 TH] p2pool: Decentralized, DoS-resistant, Hop-Proof pool  (Read 2029250 times)
yslyung
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June 17, 2015, 09:59:20 AM
 #12801

my miners worked hard regardless & whoalla a block

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Songminer
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June 17, 2015, 01:50:21 PM
 #12802

I'm having no problems with my S5's.   I'm running the Jan 2015 firmware.    I did have some anomoly recently where my shares just fell off without new ones, but a restart turned that around quickly.

Ironically, I've tried to upgrade to the latest May firmware, but keeping getting an error that the tar file is too short.   Perhaps this is a blessing in disguise?

What exactly is happening with the firmware that has hurt P2Pool mining?

While block frequency continues to be a problem with the P2Pool, I'm consistently doing better than expected in block yields with my hardware.

The network hashrate variation, also ironically, is actually advantageous for those who stay on the network 24/7, as share difficulty goes down in the 1-1.5 PH/s range, whereas blocks are found in the 2-3 PH/s range.

Staying around for the low Hashrate times builds up the shares, so when the Hashing returns to the pool, those who stayed are rewarded.

Of course, when the pool goes 3 days without a block, not so much, although this cycle actually makes the accumulation of shares even better for those who stick around.

If the hashing never returns, however, all bets are off.
jonnybravo0311
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June 17, 2015, 02:47:20 PM
 #12803

Thank you -ck & kano for chiming in, your experience & knowledge is greatly appreciated  Smiley  I've read a lot about this subject throughout the thread, it seems to me that bitmain are actually working against p2pool, despite their claims in their pool thread that they actively support it:

We support p2pool protocol

.....and has been significantly developed during the development of Antpool.

This is simply not true. Shouldn't forum rules/admins require them to change this statement? Doing so would also save a lot of confusion for new users of p2pool who wonder why they can't get the most out of their bitmain hardware while using p2pool. They seem to be trying to transfer p2pools unique decentralised nature for their own marketing needs - despite being an obviously centralised pool.

As bitmain refuse to fix their firmware (or more likely - they're unable/don't know how to), I'd be more than willing to chip in towards a bounty for a revised & fully functional S5 firmware for p2pool - if kano/-ck would be willing? The S5's are still being sold, & will remain workable for a while yet I think, so it would certainly boost p2pools attractiveness to new users if they could simply connect & mine like any other pool.  What do you think?

Tak.
I've posted quite a few times in their thread asking them to remove the references to p2pool.  They don't.  Thankfully one of the mods (I believe it was -ck) changed their thread title to get rid of the bogus "supporting decentralization" claim it spouted.  I completely disagree with dogie's statements about it being a "lost in translation" thing.  Bitmain took forrest's code and added some database stuff to it.  They didn't create their own implementation, or attempt to fix any of the variance problems.  Whatever they did was certainly not the $100,000s effort claimed, and they abandoned it since they realized they didn't know what they were doing.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
mdude77
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June 17, 2015, 04:59:47 PM
 #12804

Bitmain hardware is awful.  IMHO the last good hardware they made were the S1s.  Everything from there has gone downhill.

As others have correctly stated, p2pool "restarts" the work a lot more often than "conventional" pools.  In layman's terms, the conversation between your miner and p2pool goes something like this:

p2pool: here is some work, stop everything you are doing and start working on this
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible
(avg 30 seconds later): p2pool: here is some work, stop everything you are doing and start working on this
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible

and so forth.  That "stop everything you're doing" part is what Bitmain hardware sucks at doing.  Spondoolie hardware seems to manage it just fine.  As always, YMMV.  Some folks have luck tweaking their S2/S3/S4/S5/Swhatever, sometimes regularly.  I never had any luck with it, and have long since given up on Bitmain junk hardware.

For comparison, conventional pools look like this:

pool: here is some work, switch when you can, I'll continue accepting your prior work for a while
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible
pool: here is some work, switch when you can, I'll continue accepting your prior work for a while
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible
pool (approx ~10 mins): here is some work, stop everything you are doing and start working on this

M

MMinerMonitor author, monitor/auto/schedule reboots/alerts/remote/MobileMiner for Ants and Spondoolies! Latest (5.2). MPoolMonitor author, monitor stats/workers for most pools, global BTC stats (current/nxt diff/USD val/hashrate/calc)! Latest (v4.2) 
Buyer beware of Bitmain hardware and services.
jonnybravo0311
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June 17, 2015, 05:06:41 PM
 #12805

Bitmain hardware is awful.  IMHO the last good hardware they made were the S1s.  Everything from there has gone downhill.

As others have correctly stated, p2pool "restarts" the work a lot more often than "conventional" pools.  In layman's terms, the conversation between your miner and p2pool goes something like this:

p2pool: here is some work, stop everything you are doing and start working on this
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible
(avg 30 seconds later): p2pool: here is some work, stop everything you are doing and start working on this
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible

and so forth.  That "stop everything you're doing" part is what Bitmain hardware sucks at doing.  Spondoolie hardware seems to manage it just fine.  As always, YMMV.  Some folks have luck tweaking their S2/S3/S4/S5/Swhatever, sometimes regularly.  I never had any luck with it, and have long since given up on Bitmain junk hardware.

For comparison, conventional pools look like this:

pool: here is some work, switch when you can, I'll continue accepting your prior work for a while
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible
pool: here is some work, switch when you can, I'll continue accepting your prior work for a while
miner: got it, I'll start working on it as soon as possible
pool (approx ~10 mins): here is some work, stop everything you are doing and start working on this

M
You got it.  The reason is because of the share-chain shares in p2pool.  Approximately every 30 seconds (averaged, it could be 1 second, it could be 100), a new share is added to the share chain.  P2Pool broadcasts the "stop everything" message every time this happens.  In a traditional pool, that "stop everything" message only comes once a block is found.  Traditional pools will broadcast new work, i.e. they've just done a GBT call and created a new chunk of work for miners, but they don't force a restart, they'll still accept the old work from the miner.

Edit:

The only cases where p2pool behaves differently is when a miner submits a share that solves a block of BTC.  A dead share is work that a miner was doing on a previous set of work after the node has accepted a newer share on the chain.  If that share solves a block, it gets submitted and if accepted, miners are paid based on the information in that share.

This is also why sometimes you'll see a p2pool mining transaction in your wallet, but your node UI doesn't show the block.  Since that share never made it onto the share chain, the UI doesn't see it.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
Geremia
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June 17, 2015, 05:16:48 PM
 #12806

That "stop everything you're doing" part is what Bitmain hardware sucks at doing.
What about Bitmain hardware makes "stop everything you're doing" hard?

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Meuh6879
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June 17, 2015, 05:20:48 PM
 #12807

the only problem of miner ... is the linux card.
not the chip or the supply.

that why USB miner don't have any problem ... on P2Pool.

 Grin question : can i connect an bitmain product in USB without the linux card controller ?

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June 17, 2015, 05:32:26 PM
 #12808

the only problem of miner ... is the linux card.
Why would that be a problem?

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jonnybravo0311
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June 17, 2015, 05:36:53 PM
 #12809

Grin question : can i connect an bitmain product in USB without the linux card controller ?
I remember there was a bounty out there to see if anyone could connect S1 boards to use an rPi as the controller... not sure how that ever turned out.  Also, you might want to check out sidehack's BM1384 project.  They're trying to build their own miner based on the chips in the S5.  I think they're designing their own PCBs, so it's not a direct "take Bitmain board and use different controller".

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
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June 17, 2015, 05:56:01 PM
 #12810

Bitmain hardware is awful.  IMHO the last good hardware they made were the S1s.  Everything from there has gone downhill.


Again, I have no problem with my s5's.  I migrated right from the S1 to S5 on P2Pool.

Maybe it would improve with a change in the software, but my average take and status is well above estimates on any BTC calculator.

I make less on Slush's pool than P2Pool.

Maybe I'm missing something.
mdude77
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June 17, 2015, 09:14:57 PM
 #12811

Bitmain hardware is awful.  IMHO the last good hardware they made were the S1s.  Everything from there has gone downhill.


Again, I have no problem with my s5's.  I migrated right from the S1 to S5 on P2Pool.

Maybe it would improve with a change in the software, but my average take and status is well above estimates on any BTC calculator.

I make less on Slush's pool than P2Pool.

Maybe I'm missing something.

As always, YMMV.  Some folks have luck tweaking their S2/S3/S4/S5/Swhatever, sometimes regularly.  I never had any luck with it, and have long since given up on Bitmain junk hardware.

M

MMinerMonitor author, monitor/auto/schedule reboots/alerts/remote/MobileMiner for Ants and Spondoolies! Latest (5.2). MPoolMonitor author, monitor stats/workers for most pools, global BTC stats (current/nxt diff/USD val/hashrate/calc)! Latest (v4.2) 
Buyer beware of Bitmain hardware and services.
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June 17, 2015, 10:41:49 PM
 #12812

As always, YMMV.  Some folks have luck tweaking their S2/S3/S4/S5/Swhatever, sometimes regularly.  I never had any luck with it, and have long since given up on Bitmain junk hardware.

M
[/quote]

No tweaking here.  Two production units out of the box.   No down time for 6 months.  Overclocked to 1.25TH/s.
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June 17, 2015, 10:48:48 PM
 #12813

No tweaking here.  Two production units out of the box.   No down time for 6 months.  Overclocked to 1.25TH/s.

If that's the case, & you're using bitmains cgminer - you're losing potential earnings. You should use kano's cgminer for the S5 instead as mentioned a page or so back  Wink

Edit: Just a heads up - Matt Corello has released an updated version of his excellent relaynodeclient with some huge performance improvements - p2pool users can benefit greatly by using his software:

http://bitcoinrelaynetwork.org/

https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/RelayNode

Nice stuff Matt  Smiley
jonnybravo0311
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June 18, 2015, 12:14:31 AM
 #12814

No tweaking here.  Two production units out of the box.   No down time for 6 months.  Overclocked to 1.25TH/s.

If that's the case, & you're using bitmains cgminer - you're losing potential earnings. You should use kano's cgminer for the S5 instead as mentioned a page or so back  Wink

Edit: Just a heads up - Matt Corello has released an updated version of his excellent relaynodeclient with some huge performance improvements - p2pool users can benefit greatly by using his software:

http://bitcoinrelaynetwork.org/

https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/RelayNode

Nice stuff Matt  Smiley
Been using it for quite some time on my node.

Songminer, I highly suggest downloading and using -ck's cgminer for the S5.  Bitmain's throws away potential block solving shares.

Jonny's Pool - Mine with us and help us grow!  Support a pool that supports Bitcoin, not a hardware manufacturer's pockets!  No SPV cheats.  No empty blocks.
kano
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June 18, 2015, 01:21:15 AM
 #12815

No tweaking here.  Two production units out of the box.   No down time for 6 months.  Overclocked to 1.25TH/s.

If that's the case, & you're using bitmains cgminer - you're losing potential earnings. You should use kano's cgminer for the S5 instead as mentioned a page or so back  Wink

Edit: Just a heads up - Matt Corello has released an updated version of his excellent relaynodeclient with some huge performance improvements - p2pool users can benefit greatly by using his software:

http://bitcoinrelaynetwork.org/

https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/RelayNode

Nice stuff Matt  Smiley
Well ... Smiley
P2pool solves the relay issue itself - since everyone on p2pool should be running their own node, p2pool distributes the blocks quickly amongst all the p2pool nodes - thus other non-p2pool nodes also get the blocks quickly.

Of course, there's a lot of p2pool nodes that are centralised, so that reduces some of that advantage ...

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Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with Stratum, the best protocol to mine Bitcoins with ASIC hardware
p3yot33at3r
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June 18, 2015, 10:50:58 AM
 #12816


Is anyone using the Avalon 4.1's with p2pool? I'm interested in how they perform........

Tak.

Nobody using these with p2pool?  Sad
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June 18, 2015, 06:34:19 PM
 #12817


[/quote]
Well ... Smiley
P2pool solves the relay issue itself - since everyone on p2pool should be running their own node, p2pool distributes the blocks quickly amongst all the p2pool nodes - thus other non-p2pool nodes also get the blocks quickly.

Of course, there's a lot of p2pool nodes that are centralised, so that reduces some of that advantage ...
[/quote]

I'm not running on my own node anymore..  I did for awhile but I didn't see the advantage since I'm going out through MiningRigRentals and they have a node close to a zero fee dependable node.

I may install it on one of my two and see if there's a difference.

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June 18, 2015, 07:51:21 PM
 #12818

I'm not running on my own node anymore..  I did for awhile but I didn't see the advantage since I'm going out through MiningRigRentals and they have a node close to a zero fee dependable node.

I may install it on one of my two and see if there's a difference.

Because you are renting your rigs, whatever node has the lowest latency to your miners will preform better.


p3yot33at3r
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June 19, 2015, 06:54:09 PM
 #12819


Is anyone using the Avalon 4.1's with p2pool? I'm interested in how they perform........

Tak.

Nobody using these with p2pool?  Sad

Well, that's a shame. I was thinking of buying a couple of these, but it's a bit of a risk to splash out the BTC they are charging only to find out they don't work properly with p2pool.... Sad

I know they say their firmware supports p2pool, but they're just too expensive to risk finding out for sure. Guess I'll stick with 2nd hand spondoolies gear then - getting a little thin on the ground now though......
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June 19, 2015, 07:39:26 PM
 #12820

No tweaking here.  Two production units out of the box.   No down time for 6 months.  Overclocked to 1.25TH/s.

If that's the case, & you're using bitmains cgminer - you're losing potential earnings. You should use kano's cgminer for the S5 instead as mentioned a page or so back  Wink

Edit: Just a heads up - Matt Corello has released an updated version of his excellent relaynodeclient with some huge performance improvements - p2pool users can benefit greatly by using his software:

http://bitcoinrelaynetwork.org/

https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/RelayNode

Nice stuff Matt  Smiley
Been using it for quite some time on my node.

Songminer, I highly suggest downloading and using -ck's cgminer for the S5.  Bitmain's throws away potential block solving shares.

So, how do I go about doing that on the S5?  Has anybody posted a good instruction on how to do that?

Thanks.
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