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Author Topic: Hacks & puppets & forks - how to destroy bitcoin  (Read 3128 times)
Kiweikoo
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December 05, 2017, 02:24:16 PM
 #61

The reputation of bitcoin is getting destroyed slowly because of the forks that has been launching for bitcoin and it seems that it doesn't affect the performance at all because i believe that the reason for having forks are to improve the quality of the coin and to make major improvements that everyone would feel after the launch of fork but right now it is just like making forks that will completely just for money and not improvements.
And ridiculous hardfok that are happening with the coin, first with that haunt that calls BBCHASH, Bitcoin Diamond that already is more than 50 dollars and now for December we have three more the called "Super Bitcoin" should leave in the block 498.888 around 15 of December, while Bitcoin Platinum and even more bizarre Bitcoin Cash Plus are expected to take place December 23 and 31, respectively. Man, this is putting an end to the currency's reputation, I do not know how the community accepts that.

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centralbanksequalsbombs
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December 12, 2017, 11:16:05 PM
 #62

The reputation of bitcoin is getting destroyed slowly because of the forks that has been launching for bitcoin and it seems that it doesn't affect the performance at all because i believe that the reason for having forks are to improve the quality of the coin and to make major improvements that everyone would feel after the launch of fork but right now it is just like making forks that will completely just for money and not improvements.
And ridiculous hardfok that are happening with the coin, first with that haunt that calls BBCHASH, Bitcoin Diamond that already is more than 50 dollars and now for December we have three more the called "Super Bitcoin" should leave in the block 498.888 around 15 of December, while Bitcoin Platinum and even more bizarre Bitcoin Cash Plus are expected to take place December 23 and 31, respectively. Man, this is putting an end to the currency's reputation, I do not know how the community accepts that.

Ahem, each of these 'forks' are just scamcoins - really, as time goes on, they will be lost in the sea of altcoins. Why?

Simple: with each derivative fork the new altcoin makes itself much weaker in ALL of these ways:


-less hashing power than the real Bitcoin network. Thus new scamcoin will be less secure.

-less open, global development of protocol codebase than real Bitcoin. Thus new scamcoin slow to innovate and be more vulnerable.

-less (true) independent full nodes on the network than real Bitcoin. New scamcoin more susceptible to attacks on protocol and hijacking.

-more concentration of coins to fewer individuals than the real Bitcoin network. Thus new scamcoin becomes more unfair with time.

-more geographic concentration of mining than the real Bitcoin network. Thus the new scamcoin will have more points of failure.

-more hardforks demonstrate all these points moreso with each iteration to global public. Thus new scamcoins lose value vs Bitcoin every year.

-is just another altcoin

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December 12, 2017, 11:47:58 PM
 #63

i also believe forks will Destroy bitcoin in future especially BCH  .

but price will destroy bitcoin more than hacks

The opposite of what you state is true. The forks reveal themselves worthless, especially BCH.
The price demonstrates more worth over time. Altcoins, like BCH and other scamcoins are more susceptible to hacks. Bitcoin's code has been unbreakable and running for 9 years.

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December 24, 2017, 07:00:58 PM
 #64

Hope this is helpful - there are fundamental points above.

Please comment if helpful or to raise any questions or disagreements.

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February 02, 2018, 01:33:48 AM
 #65

Who's excited about Lightning network and decentralized exchange   "cross-chain atomic swaps"Huh

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February 02, 2018, 10:12:10 AM
 #66

Who's excited about Lightning network and decentralized exchange   "cross-chain atomic swaps"Huh


What can you conclude about Bitcoins use cases and scarcity on this ?

Carpe diem  -  cut the down side  -  be anti-fragile - don't dillute Bitcoin!
Memo: 1AHUYNJKPfY7PjVK1hNQFo5LrdGixuiybw
The simple way is the genius way - in Moore and Satoshi we trust.
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June 03, 2018, 01:26:36 AM
 #67

Who's excited about Lightning network and decentralized exchange   "cross-chain atomic swaps"Huh


What can you conclude about Bitcoins use cases and scarcity on this ?

Can you please re-phrase your question or elaborate on what it is you are trying to ask?

I don't understand your question.

Bitcoin will remain scarce as its max supply is 21million coins and there have been millions of burned coins (addresses that will never spend). Small finite supply in an infinite fiat supply world.

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June 03, 2018, 11:26:29 AM
 #68

Who's excited about Lightning network and decentralized exchange   "cross-chain atomic swaps"Huh


What can you conclude about Bitcoins use cases and scarcity on this ?

Can you please re-phrase your question or elaborate on what it is you are trying to ask?

I don't understand your question.

Bitcoin will remain scarce as its max supply is 21million coins and there have been millions of burned coins (addresses that will never spend). Small finite supply in an infinite fiat supply world.

Bitcoin was built to be the world's peer to peer crypto cash layer, you think thats still on track with BTC + LN + AtomicSwap (= bridge to other crypto) + all that forks that are done, cause BTC was not inclusive enough?

IMO BCH is much more willing to be exactly that scarce world currnency / cash and allows all such needed things happens on a singel chain, in a very inclusive way that will not further dillute the cryptoverse by means of real Bitcoin scarcity.  Thats exclusive Wink



Carpe diem  -  cut the down side  -  be anti-fragile - don't dillute Bitcoin!
Memo: 1AHUYNJKPfY7PjVK1hNQFo5LrdGixuiybw
The simple way is the genius way - in Moore and Satoshi we trust.
centralbanksequalsbombs
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June 19, 2018, 05:29:58 AM
 #69

bitcoin 101: https://youtu.be/Bhe61JaNFLU
history of money/centralbanks: https://vimeo.com/8757743 or link2 https://youtu.be/UrJGlXEs8nI

To any intelligent observer, it has been apparent that bitcoin’s primary use has emerged to be store of value/investment. Yes, bitcoin’s decentralized/permissionless solution to creating an immutable cryptographically secured database brings a vast array of different potential revolutionary applications not seen since the advent of the internet but again, the primary use has emerged to be store of value/investment. and bitcoin has been so good at this store of value thing that it has become detrimentally successful - enter the (well-funded) hacks and puppets…attacks from the outside and from within - some of which via spread of (FUD) tangent ideas with coders, media, investors, and within bitcoin community to maybe start an idea of even ‘slight’ change.

First, please realize no other tool in modern-day finance has been so successful at being an effective savings mechanism which unlike traditional ‘savings accounts’ this bitcoin actually keeps up in value for you to be able to afford higher cost of rent, education, healthcare, vacations, etc. (due to its beautiful combination of scarcity, a ceiling of 21mill coins, immutable, permissionless->not controlled/influenced, secure, and being established/developed). This effective savings tool of bitcoin is made accessible to the 99% of us and cuts to the core of exposing the flaw of the central bank fiat system with its funny-money creation out of thin air paper/credit-currencies benefiting the privileged institutions and then last to benefit would be the rest of us. it can also expose flaws of fraudulent funneling of extra paper-currencies created by central banks…now think, even those privy to any fraudulent funneling of funny-money will see what’s going on and understand something like bitcoin as an alternative being effectively immune to these games that even these bad-actors themselves would buy bitcoin! Bitcoin changes the paradigm of central-bank funny-money (Bitcoin is the anti-funny-money warrior: open & mechanism)….and it has taken off….and will catch the attention of the central banks who by definition, have nearly unlimited systemic resources and influence (think governments, telecoms ISP providers, hardware/chip manufacturers, software developers, search engines, exchange conartists).

Even if a hard-fork doesn’t happen anytime in the next couple of years, it’s the threat that an attack on this pure beautiful store of value system to something even slightly different that can actually gain a noticeable percentage raises the question…is it possible that someday that the groups influencing bitcoin (those controlling mining or those involved with coding development, or the rest buy/transacting in bitcoin) would (either out of ignorance/misunderstanding or out of vested-interest to undermine bitcoin) start demanding (even slight) changes that may contradict the store-of-value that bitcoin is???

That is the big question that if the answer starts looking like yes…then value would plummet as bitcoin no longer be seen as a store of value but would eventually turn into another app coin (i.e. Ethereum) that can do many amazing things but not the one store-value amazing thing that it has done these past few years. the price would be zero-bound (compared to what we’ve been accustomed to with bitcoin today).

If the answer to that question is no (that you reading this, this community, software coders, mining operators, investors, everyday folk, work to stay educated on the above and act to keep the integrity of this bitcoin system)…then even a $50 billion market cap would still be seen as trivial in the financial assets arena where one bitcoin can easily go above $5,000 USD. But really, as the years pack on and integrity remains intact, the price would be infinity-bound.

It is appropriate at this point to bring back some old-school sentiments: proudhon song: link1 (https://vid.me/Jvql) or link2 (https://youtu.be/A7TuFy0fcuw)

How can a $50 billion market cap be trivial or seen as under-the-radar?
see here: link1 (http://i1.wp.com/money.visualcapitalist.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/all-the-worlds-money-and-markets.png?w=1346) or link2 (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/75/9b/63/759b63f98e8569498bee62738fda954b.jpg)

These ideas are kinda interesting (or i think you’re a paranoid idiot), can you point me to better presentable information about bitcoin i can share with others?
bitcoin 101: link1 (https://youtu.be/Bhe61JaNFLU)

What about bigger block-size?
If there were attackers spamming transactions, it is a lot more digestible to withstand 1mb blocks, but bigger blocks could open door for bigger spam, larger bloat of the blockchain - hindering small folk and consolidate power to the well resourced.
Also, say if most the mining competition were to go-away for some reason, you or myself can take a standard computer and internet connection and be able to mine-away with a 1mb block.
..if you were to double this to 2mb block, or even larger, this becomes a lot more difficult over time and our standard internet connections would begin to be much less adept for throughput required.
such a move in block-size would again consolidate power to the well-resourced.
hack.

What about “scalability” doing many many fast-transactions/lightning network?
there are many options and none of them have to involve changing bitcoin. with fiat you have outside counterparties assigning responsibility for fast coffee transactions, i.e. Visa network or MasterCard network. Come up with a counterparty solution or let another coin become a credit-card or have a startup either become a trusted solution or develop a sidechain or some trustless solution.
Last i checked, its been clear that many of us around the world have been able to send/receive bitcoin with no issue - as so many of our friends have been doing in Japan, India, Russia, Greece, America, China, Nigeria, various South American countries, the UK. all around the world bitcoin transactions have been happening for already for years and are happening even as i type this.
Fully On-chain “scalability” forced upon bitcoin would destroy bitcoin’s primary use of store of value.
hack.
(Segwit is okay but not Seg2x or any other derivative fork)

Priceless info on how money and central banks work: the money masters: link1 (https://vimeo.com/8757743) or link2 (https://youtu.be/UrJGlXEs8nI)
competition is good. centralized control/monopolies are bad.
one random tidbit from this was the last big country that successfully eliminated a central bank (and did this multiple times) has been…believe it or not, America. But the most recent establishment of a central bank in America, called the Federal Reserve has sunk its claws in for now over 100 years.
If you want more, listen to lectures or read from the great Murray Rothbard (https://www.mises.org/profile/murray-n-rothbard)

What about ethereum with that ether?
ethereum is an amazing application/contract technology and funding tool for mainly scam ICOs, i'd suggest it not as a use for store of value like bitcoin. two different things. ethereum is permissioned allowing central-authority styled intervention at times…. but bitcoin is permissionless, decentralized control…pure to word immutable.

What about this other alt-coin or blockchain?
most are scams - lookup discussions on altcoins/scamcoins. I’m seeing an article title “99% of blockchain startups are bullshit”

WHERE ARE THE TRUSTLESS DECENTRALIZED EXCHANGES?
any others picking up ground besides locabitcoins? talk about lack of options!
[edit] ...or is decentralized exchange here? https://cointelegraph.com/news/segwit-first-steps-to-ecosystem Cross-Chain Atomic Swaps (pick any two? LTC-DCR-VTC-BTC)

Who was Satoshi Nakamoto?
in my opinion the brains behind the team Satoshi Nakamoto lay in someone who was a very modest, gifted, and a generous handicapped man.
EVERYTHING makes sense if David Kleiman was Satoshi Nakamoto. Here’s why: (https://seebitcoin.com/2016/05/everything-makes-sense-if-david-kleiman-was-satoshi-nakamoto-heres-why/)


Never trust another person or company or exchange with your bitcoin. see mt. gox, cryptsy, shutdown China-exchanges, many other scams.

hacks (these people may have been well-meaning previously...but people change...):
Mike Hearn : “the "Bitcoin experiment" has "failed." goes on to Ethereum an app coin.
Hearn - Big Bank Bitcoin Bully - https://medium.com/@tradertimm/hearn-big-bank-bitcoin-bully-c61531c082e#.okh9viyze
Craig Wright - desperately claimed to be Satoshi & then flees fraud trying to file a bunch of IP patents! LOL!
Mark Karpeles
Paul Vernon
Josh Garza
Roger Ver
Jeff Garzik (2017 recent; hard forking BTC1 / segwit2x)
"Jeff Garzik wants you to connect to his Bitcoin transaction analytics (spy) company Skry, by default, in the SegWit2x fork. Jeff is a sneaky snake!":https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/6n9grc/jeff_garzik_wants_you_to_connect_to_his_bitcoin/
Barry Silbert (and his DCG portfolio of companies-ie Coinbase, Bitpay, sponsoring ilk of Jeff Garzik characters)

Even if you never to touch a bitcoin, please consider keeping your deposits with a smaller community bank or credit union and NOT any of the larger banks in your country. a shift in deposits, go a long way in control and power.

BTC1HXUWBD28MgYs3iQzkbT5UkfteSrrYX7ng

Please feel free to copy/share this post in its entirety.

Bitcoin reached escape velocity 4-years ago in 2013 which means it cannot be stopped - cannot make it illegal or legal - governments/banks do not matter. Bitcoin cannot be controlled.

On the opposite end of the spectrum the global fiat system broke a couple of decades ago.
Fiat currencies around the world is heavily infested with:
-regulatory burden on fiat banks & system (incredibly costly)
-unemployment & other welfare costs
-inflating fiat to keep stock market rising and to keep house-prices from collapsing
-financing conflicts, bombs, and "aid"
-stabilize regions after natural disasters
-insurance claims and insurance losses
-keeping monopolies with internet access centralized and search engine crawlers centralized
-money laundering
-chargebacks
-frivolous legal costs (lawsuits bogging the system down)
-state-sponsored corruption and unofficial corruption (governments and gangs, banks and conartists)
-retirement obligations (debasement in value to keep up with payments from government or other retirement-obligations)
-fake credit (goods being transacted with credit-loss, replaced by inflation of monetary base rather than bringing perpetrators & source to justice)

Bitcoin, systemically, is free from these burdens.

(longtime reader, first time poster)


Quote before my mid-2018 edits/corrections.

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June 19, 2018, 06:57:37 AM
 #70

Very funny, how different ppl define what they feel a 'hack' is.

I d start, with the static max_block_size parameter, making this into the consensus protocol first of a (planned) rapidly / dynamically growing social system.

2nd checkout, what SW really does and how it's implemented into the protocol layer

3rd Deploy that as a SF

4th  LN ( and hope , hope for fixing companies scaling issues with 2nd layer to come)

5th legal issues with all that tech on top of first / initial layer

(Telling ppl to keep small blocks to further dictate them run RasPi nodes for MAX decentralization, but forcing them to recon only 3 MAX fee TX of some huge central clearing counter parties CCCP  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_counterparty_clearing on 2nd layers ...)
___

This mainly addresses only the tech part, and we could dive into economics, legal, social and scientific (dynamic math modelling) parts as well, but getting it up to a widely acceptable science / business level i.o. to define and remove such hacks is beyond of what can be achieved here or with any individual hack-posts.

'Please feel free to understand, discuss and constructively criticize this post.

Carpe diem  -  cut the down side  -  be anti-fragile - don't dillute Bitcoin!
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centralbanksequalsbombs
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August 16, 2018, 12:35:13 AM
 #71

A way to manipulate bitcoin price bids/demand would be to release and popularize services around the world that has users do the number one big NO-NO for Bitcoin, has users trust another entity to hold custody of their bitcoin. Today, you see many examples of that where users are keeping their Bitcoin in exchanges which exposes them to hacks, or many services that do not allow users transfer ability of the Bitcoin; examples:
Traded Bitcoin Futures (cash settled and they dont give bitcoin delivery!)
Revolut
Square Cash App
Circle Invest App
Robinhood
Many other 'custody' examples in developing countries
hack.
Stay away and secure/safely backup your own Bitcoin in your own wallet.
A bigger supply can be used to flood market for short selling supply if there's any degree of certainty of an amount of bitcoin that wont be touched at these custodial entities. Ever wonder how Gold and other commodity prices are manipulated?

i've felt it was important to add the PSA and alert people:
DO NOT LEAVE YOUR BITCOIN ON COINBASE

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August 16, 2018, 02:35:21 AM
 #72

Hackers will infiltrate the client's account to steal information and steal customer's wallet that is how hackers can attack pirate bitcoin so we should be careful and cautious.
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August 16, 2018, 04:43:11 AM
 #73

Hackers will infiltrate the client's account to steal information and steal customer's wallet that is how hackers can attack pirate bitcoin so we should be careful and cautious.
We should stop them and take concrete measures to cope. Particular care should be taken with sources of danger. It can infiltrate into our account, so we should learn how to protect the account. Try not to let them invade, appropriating property.

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