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Question: Which of these countries can become a better market for Bitcoins in the future ?
Australia
Japan
United States of America
Denmark
Georgia
Singapore
Hongkong
New Zealand
South Africa
Norway
South Korea
India
Argentina
Cuba
UAE (Dubai)
Belize
Chile
Papua New Guinea
Panama
MALTA
Ecuador
Sweden
Netherlands
Zaire / DRC Congo
Democratic Republic of Sao Tome and Principe
Republic of Congo
Dominica

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Author Topic: The Switzerland of Bitcoin  (Read 21726 times)
legendster
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April 24, 2013, 03:29:23 AM
Last edit: February 06, 2015, 07:27:36 PM by legendster
 #1

Original Post :



I am going to re-post or rather copy paste an article from siliconindia here with my question that will follow it :

Original Article :
Location plays an important role in the progress of any business. Also, obstacles are an integral factor in the expansion of any business. Lesser are the obstacles, better growth can be expected in the business.


Nowadays, most of the nations are targeting on the revenues, coming from the business, inside their boundaries. While some countries already had friendly policies for the ‘already developed’ or ‘developing’ business within its boundaries, some other countries are now accepting newer policies to encourage the same.


According to the list of the ‘business-friendly’ countries in the world by ‘doing business’, India ranks 132, while Singapore tops the list.


1. Singapore


From the last few years, Singapore has been ranked as the best country for business. Singapore provides an encouraging environment to all the newcomers, irrespective of their gender, nationality, etc.


At present, Singapore is the fourth largest financial center in the world and is also an impactful nation. Major portion of Singapore’s GDP comes from its manufactured goods. Export and import also plays an important role in the economy of Singapore.


It has the fifth largest as well as the busiest ports in the world.


2. Hong Kong


Hong Kong is highly known for its low taxation and free trade policy, has retained its second position this year; it ranked the second position last year. Hong Kong’s per capita income is very high compared to other Asian countries.


In terms of business, Hong Kong provides the maximum economic and financial freedom in the Asian region. The quality of life in Hong Kong is also very high and has already received many appreciations from the UN and WHO.


3. New Zealand


New Zealand has a highly protectionist economy that offers a free-trade economy. Its free trade policies are one of the main reasons; it is still the third best country for business.


New Zealand has one of the modernized as well as developed economies in the world. It’s GDP and PPP is also very high.


Agriculture is one of the main reasons behind the economic growth of New Zealand. Over the past century, wool was the main agricultural products of New Zealand. However, the reduction in the price has made dairy farming as one of the main source in the recent times.


4. United States


The nineteenth century has been the best period for the economic growth of U.S.


U.S. stands in the fourth rank in this list; it was also the same in 2012. It has the largest economy in the world as well as a higher rate of per capita GDP.


It has a capitalist mixed economy, which depends mostly on its natural resources. The U.S. currency is one of the mostly used currencies across the globe.


5. Denmark


Doing business rank (2011): 5 Doing business rank (2012): 5


Denmark is the pioneer nation to introduce social and labor-market reforms. This took place in Denmark in the early twentieth century. Well, this is the main reason of Denmark’s highly developed economy.


Denmark has the most flexible labor market in the Europe. It has also been ranked as the easiest place to do business. Setting up a business in Denmark can be accomplished within a few hours and the cost is also comparatively low. The flexibility in the market allows the employers to hire employees whenever they want and also do the same, in case they has to fire the employees.


6. Norway


Norway has made a progress of one move. When last year, it was on the seventh position, this year, Norway has made it to the sixth rank in this list.


It is second wealthiest county in the world. From the last six years, it has been the leader in the Human Development Index rate. The Norwegian economy is considered as one of the most stable economies in the world.


The main resources of Norway are petroleum, hydropower, forests, minerals and fish. It also has one of the highest standards of living in the world.


7. United Kingdom


Last year, United Kingdom was ranked as the sixth best nation to carry out business. This year, it has slipped down to one slot to the seventh position in the same list.


United Kingdom is the world’s first industrialized nation of the world and is considered as one of the developed nations in the world at present. Its economy is the sixth largest in the world.


It is an impactful country and has a higher influence in the international trade and commerce. It offers much freedom of business to the insiders as well as to the outsiders.


8. South Korea


South Korea has climbed up by seven slots and is ranked as the eighth best country for doing business; last year, it was on the fifteenth place.


The economy of South Korea, which is highly dependent on the exports, is the fourth largest economy in the world. In order to promote international trade, South Korea joined hands for a free trade government in 2010.


South Korea is one of the global leaders in exporting robotics, electronic products, petrochemicals, automobiles, ships and petrochemicals.


9. Georgia


Since Georgia is very closely associated with the Black Sea, it has been the trading partners of many other nations from the ages. During the olden times, Georgia was one of the leaders in trading valuable and precious metals; gold, silver and coppers were the chief metals. Wine making has also been one of the traditional businesses in Georgia.


At the recent times, Georgia has reformed itself into a free market economy. It is one of the fastest growing nations in the world. It has been ranked as the ‘the number one economic reformer in the world’ by the World Bank.


10. Australia


In the year 2010, Australia was ranked as the third country in the list of 'Index of Economic Frredom'. Australia has the thirteenth largest economy in the world and is also the country with fifth largest per capita GDP.


Australia's trade and commerce started rising vigorously by the starting of the twenty-first century. even though the Australian economy tasted growth in the early 2012-2013, its non-mining economy affected its economy by a certain extent.


Agriculture has been one of the main sources of Australia’s economic growth.



NOW My Question :

Some of these countries are already Bitcoin friendly, after all most of the Miners and traders are from Japan and US. But which of these countries has the best possibility to turn into what 'Switzerland is to Fiat currency' .. in other words, which of these countries are still under exposed to the concept of Bitcoin and why do you think they can become a better market in the future.
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April 24, 2013, 03:41:18 AM
 #2

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

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April 24, 2013, 03:43:48 AM
 #3

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

Its just a small platform on 2 giant Pillars !!! no way in hell will it be ale to support & sustain itself in the long run ... let alone support the Bitcoin community !
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April 24, 2013, 03:53:05 AM
 #4

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

Its just a small platform on 2 giant Pillars !!! no way in hell will it be ale to support & sustain itself in the long run ... let alone support the Bitcoin community !
3 things:
1) How much space do you need to run a bunch of servers? A digital Switzerland for a digital currency.
2) How long-run do you need? It's been going since '67.
3) And like I said, there are other micronations. It doesn't have to be Sealand.

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April 24, 2013, 03:59:14 AM
 #5

How about Tor?

 Grin

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April 24, 2013, 04:27:57 AM
 #6

Denmark is listed twice. Relevant: http://cheezburger.com/3106281216

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April 24, 2013, 04:43:51 AM
Last edit: February 06, 2015, 07:31:29 PM by legendster
 #7

How about Tor?

 Grin

Isnt that a Browser ?

Edit -

1) How much space do you need to run a bunch of servers? A digital Switzerland for a digital currency.

At least a few large hangars. That little shelf isnt as big as a single hangar.

2) How long-run do you need? It's been going since '67.

If I remember correctly they are trying to sell it.

3) And like I said, there are other micronations. It doesn't have to be Sealand.
Well yeah but Micronations arent really strong or powerful enough to make an impact globally
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April 24, 2013, 04:45:17 AM
 #8

Denmark is listed twice. Relevant: http://cheezburger.com/3106281216

Fixed Wink
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April 24, 2013, 09:27:23 AM
 #9

Iceland!

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April 24, 2013, 09:33:14 AM
 #10

Iceland!

I don't know how it is to do business in Iceland but I believe after 2007 it got better (as the big banks were wiped out).

Though considering what happened with megaupload I think US and HK are absolutely out of the question. NZ might be possible I have no idea about the others.

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April 24, 2013, 09:48:54 AM
 #11

Iceland!

I don't know how it is to do business in Iceland but I believe after 2007 it got better (as the big banks were wiped out).

Though considering what happened with megaupload I think US and HK are absolutely out of the question. NZ might be possible I have no idea about the others.


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April 24, 2013, 10:25:17 AM
 #12

Curious ... Switzerland is not listed as poll option?

Why can't Switzerland be the Switzerland of bitcoin?

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April 24, 2013, 12:01:08 PM
 #13

Belize, one of the few blacklisted nations by OCSE.

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April 24, 2013, 12:26:28 PM
 #14

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

Exactly, bitcoin need a totally different country since most of the existing countries are all tied to the same old financial system

Another possibility is off-shore tax heaven countries

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April 24, 2013, 12:33:50 PM
 #15

And don't forget the Cayman Islands. Antigua. Etc. the poll is not broad enough IMHO. :-)

Belize, one of the few blacklisted nations by OCSE.
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April 24, 2013, 01:08:19 PM
 #16

If you mean Switzerland of its former banking reputation, then the whole concept does not apply to bitcoin. All you need is net access, power and a place you gear won't get rained on.
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April 24, 2013, 01:36:38 PM
 #17


Scandinavian countries might be able to fit that role.
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April 24, 2013, 01:40:18 PM
 #18

methinks finland is best

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April 24, 2013, 02:23:30 PM
 #19

First it is necessary to establish what is desirable for a "switzerland of bitcoin."

It certainly must have multiple sound and long established links into the major banking systems.  The banks should preferably not be owned or operated by the State.  There should be multiple independent international banks which can accept wire transfers and do wire transfers without restrictions.  (Belize has some problems in these respects, as does Hong Kong.)

Having said that, I'd vote for multiple places to include the Bahamas and Singapore.
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April 24, 2013, 03:37:28 PM
 #20

Curious why none of you take the name of middle eastern countries like UAE ??
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April 24, 2013, 05:35:33 PM
 #21

Iceland? Cheap electricity that cannot be moved outside, only wasted inside (perfect for mining farms). Newly elected government, yet not communistic. The moment BTC becomes their reserve or daily currency, they become the richest country on the planet.

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April 24, 2013, 05:42:24 PM
 #22

I think the U.S. is crucial to the ability of the Bitcoin to become a stable currency (without a USD exchange, it's not a viable currency). Hopefully the oligarchs don't catch on too early, and shut down the exchanges. Once Bitcoin is capable of standing on its own, I believe Singapore is the next most important piece of the pie, and the U.S. can then go ahead and die an economic death, and it won't affect BTC much, globally. Not before, however.

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April 24, 2013, 05:51:43 PM
 #23

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

You can't pick Sealand or other micronations, because they are not recognized by other countries. It only takes 3 boats full of cops for the UK to wipe Bitcoin out of there.
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April 24, 2013, 05:59:00 PM
 #24

I am going to re-post or rather copy paste an article from siliconindia here with my question that will follow it
LOL. How can I vote for Switzerland?
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April 24, 2013, 06:05:30 PM
 #25

... Some of these countries are already Bitcoin friendly, after all most of the Miners and traders are from Japan and US. But which of these countries has the best possibility to turn into what 'Switzerland is to Fiat currency' .. in other words, which of these countries are still under exposed to the concept of Bitcoin and why do you think they can become a better market in the future.

You mean what Switzerland *was* to Fiat currency.

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April 24, 2013, 06:12:54 PM
 #26

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

You can't pick Sealand or other micronations, because they are not recognized by other countries. It only takes 3 boats full of cops for the UK to wipe Bitcoin out of there.

On the contrary, they've already tried to kick him out, and failed:
http://www.sealandgov.org/history
Quote
During his summing up the judge said “This is a swash buckling incident perhaps more akin to the time of “Sir Francis Drake” but it is my judgment is that the UK courts have no jurisdiction.” This was Sealand’s first de facto recognition.

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April 24, 2013, 06:14:44 PM
 #27

Singapore is the best country of doing business. So I guess bitcoin is going to be best accepted there.

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April 24, 2013, 06:34:46 PM
 #28

No Chile?

Here's a thought for you; Perhaps we don't WANT a 'Switzerland of bitcoin?'

Remember that thing called decentralization? It's hard to stay decentralized when a nation becomes a prominent miner.

Frankly I'd be much more happy to learn that ALL countries started mining some bitcoin each...


On the contrary, they've already tried to kick him out, and failed:
http://www.sealandgov.org/history
Quote
During his summing up the judge said “This is a swash buckling incident perhaps more akin to the time of “Sir Francis Drake” but it is my judgment is that the UK courts have no jurisdiction.” This was Sealand’s first de facto recognition.
I think we both know that if Sealand were pumping up oil or something that the UK wanted, that judge would never have been allowed to even address the subject.

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April 24, 2013, 06:43:25 PM
 #29

On the contrary, they've already tried to kick him out, and failed:
http://www.sealandgov.org/history
Quote
During his summing up the judge said “This is a swash buckling incident perhaps more akin to the time of “Sir Francis Drake” but it is my judgment is that the UK courts have no jurisdiction.” This was Sealand’s first de facto recognition.
I think we both know that if Sealand were pumping up oil or something that the UK wanted, that judge would never have been allowed to even address the subject.
Probably not, no. But he was, and he said it, and it's been the basis of Sealand's ongoing independence since. It's in international waters, and everyone seems to respect it's "borders," So I'd say it's de facto recognized, even without a UN declaration.

Frankly I'd be much more happy to learn that ALL countries started mining some bitcoin each...
As would I. Get them involved in the currency wars on the light side of the Force.

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April 24, 2013, 07:30:12 PM
 #30

As would I. Get them involved in the currency wars on the light side of the Force.
Wouldn't that be sweet, sweet irony?

Politicians can be quite dumb sometimes though, perhaps we could pull it off. Wink

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April 24, 2013, 07:32:45 PM
 #31

Offshore jurisdictions or maybe Singapore.

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April 24, 2013, 07:33:22 PM
 #32

Japan.

Most of the Earth is currently in the year 2013.  Japan I think exists in the year 2015, or 2015 and a half.

I mean they have robot spiders and stuff.

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April 24, 2013, 07:37:26 PM
 #33

@myrkul: Sealand, offshore offline bitcoin cold storage?

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April 24, 2013, 07:39:59 PM
 #34

@myrkul: Sealand, offshore offline bitcoin cold storage?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_haven

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April 24, 2013, 07:40:41 PM
 #35

Yeah, Bitcoin doesn't really need a "capital" or anything. But Japan wouldn't be the very worst option, with it being the (currently) accommodating home of Magic The Gathering Online eXchange.

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April 24, 2013, 07:45:26 PM
 #36

yes, but thats all about big data. a private key can you have in your head... there would be no need for a data haven in bitcoin's case.

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April 24, 2013, 07:48:52 PM
 #37

yes, but thats all about big data. a private key can you have in your head... there would be no need for a data haven in bitcoin's case.
Not for individual wallets, no. But a data haven would be a great place for Bitcoin businesses to be "registered" and hosted.

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April 24, 2013, 07:58:23 PM
 #38

Not for individual wallets, no. But a data haven would be a great place for Bitcoin businesses to be "registered" and hosted.
I think we should set our standards higher than this.

Instead of so many putting so many eggs in one single basket, even if that basket is on Neptune, governments have proven themselves sinister and will go anywhere and break any law to take out these single points of failure that this strategy would create. Look at what they did to KimDotCom.

Whenever a problem presents itself like this, any time in the future, just remember that Decentralized, peer-to-peer software can solve it. ANY problem.


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April 24, 2013, 08:03:48 PM
 #39

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

A bonkers guy with his family? Nah.

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April 24, 2013, 08:07:06 PM
 #40

Curious why none of you take the name of middle eastern countries like UAE ??

Name one that is stable enough, and is a democracy that can guarantee future stability.

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April 24, 2013, 08:10:19 PM
 #41

Curious why none of you take the name of middle eastern countries like UAE ??

Name one that is stable enough, and is a democracy that can guarantee future stability.

Those two things? Mutually exclusive.

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April 24, 2013, 08:13:27 PM
 #42

Ecuador, when they adopt bitcoin as advised by Julian Assange

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April 24, 2013, 10:30:48 PM
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Where is Argentina on this list?
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April 24, 2013, 10:38:04 PM
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You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

You can't pick Sealand or other micronations, because they are not recognized by other countries. It only takes 3 boats full of cops for the UK to wipe Bitcoin out of there.

On the contrary, they've already tried to kick him out, and failed:
http://www.sealandgov.org/history
Quote
During his summing up the judge said “This is a swash buckling incident perhaps more akin to the time of “Sir Francis Drake” but it is my judgment is that the UK courts have no jurisdiction.” This was Sealand’s first de facto recognition.
Yes, but did they anything harmful to the UK except for being rebels? I don't think so. If bitcoin would base there they would wipe it out immediatly. I like your out-of-the-box thinking, i think however that it is better for bitcoin to base in a country which has better diplomatic relations with the current powers.
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April 24, 2013, 10:44:10 PM
 #45

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

You can't pick Sealand or other micronations, because they are not recognized by other countries. It only takes 3 boats full of cops for the UK to wipe Bitcoin out of there.

On the contrary, they've already tried to kick him out, and failed:
http://www.sealandgov.org/history
Quote
During his summing up the judge said “This is a swash buckling incident perhaps more akin to the time of “Sir Francis Drake” but it is my judgment is that the UK courts have no jurisdiction.” This was Sealand’s first de facto recognition.
Yes, but did they anything harmful to the UK except for being rebels? I don't think so. If bitcoin would base there they would wipe it out immediately. I like your out-of-the-box thinking, i think however that it is better for bitcoin to base in a country which has better diplomatic relations with the current powers.
I'd rather bitcoin not base in any country. It's stateless as it is, it should stay that way. Maybe Somalia?  Cheesy

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April 24, 2013, 10:47:43 PM
 #46

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

You can't pick Sealand or other micronations, because they are not recognized by other countries. It only takes 3 boats full of cops for the UK to wipe Bitcoin out of there.

On the contrary, they've already tried to kick him out, and failed:
http://www.sealandgov.org/history
Quote
During his summing up the judge said “This is a swash buckling incident perhaps more akin to the time of “Sir Francis Drake” but it is my judgment is that the UK courts have no jurisdiction.” This was Sealand’s first de facto recognition.
Yes, but did they anything harmful to the UK except for being rebels? I don't think so. If bitcoin would base there they would wipe it out immediately. I like your out-of-the-box thinking, i think however that it is better for bitcoin to base in a country which has better diplomatic relations with the current powers.
I'd rather bitcoin not base in any country. It's stateless as it is, it should stay that way. Maybe Somalia?  Cheesy
I prefer the moon or mars.
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April 24, 2013, 10:52:03 PM
 #47

I prefer the moon or mars.
http://applicants.mars-one.com/

We need to make sure one of these guys is a Bitcoiner, then.

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April 24, 2013, 10:55:21 PM
 #48

Curious why none of you take the name of middle eastern countries like UAE ??

Name one that is stable enough, and is a democracy that can guarantee future stability.

UAE is stable enough.
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April 25, 2013, 12:28:04 AM
 #49

I'd like to see an exchange created within a native American reservation territory in the USA

 
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April 25, 2013, 12:41:27 AM
 #50

I'd like to see an exchange created within a native American reservation territory in the USA

That's... a really good idea.

I wonder how the AML stuff would play out.

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April 25, 2013, 06:00:40 AM
 #51

You must add : ICELAND to the pool, as they are aiming to become the switzerland of the information.. With cheap electricity, and an interesting geographic position, their politicians have understood the potential.. ICELAND may become to the information/internet what Switzerland was to the money !
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April 25, 2013, 08:02:39 PM
Last edit: April 25, 2013, 08:30:05 PM by cr1776
 #52

I agree, please add Iceland, The Cayman Islands, Antigua, the Cook Islands, Panama, and Monaco.  Many are tax havens and could be amenable to other ideas that would help their economies.   :-)

Edit: and Honduras  - perhaps in one of their new cities:
http://www.economist.com/node/21541392


You must add : ICELAND to the pool, as they are aiming to become the switzerland of the information.. With cheap electricity, and an interesting geographic position, their politicians have understood the potential.. ICELAND may become to the information/internet what Switzerland was to the money !

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April 25, 2013, 08:57:44 PM
 #53

Disagree about the tax-havens, as they are generally connected to crime.

BTC should be everywhere. There should be a large network of smaller exchanges that together make a huge one. Just like the internet, you want many accessspoints and you want the accesspoints to be connected to several other nodes.

Try getting your fiat in and out of the BTC, unless you are in the US, it takes days! It's quicker to get in a car drive non-stop to the receiving bank than it is to wire it.

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April 25, 2013, 09:34:32 PM
 #54

Disagree about the tax-havens, as they are generally connected to crime.
LOL... and of course Bitcoin isn't... Roll Eyes

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April 25, 2013, 11:06:30 PM
 #55

Disagree about the tax-havens, as they are generally connected to crime.
LOL... and of course Bitcoin isn't... Roll Eyes

My point exactly  Wink

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April 25, 2013, 11:08:28 PM
 #56

in scandinavia sweden will be first, they are the technology geeks of this area.

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April 25, 2013, 11:46:06 PM
 #57

in scandinavia sweden will be first, they are the technology geeks of this area.

U sure? How about Finland? I think Finland have a pretty large footprint online compared to number of inhabitants. Hey - even Linus Torvalds is from Finland.

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April 26, 2013, 05:11:25 AM
 #58

The real obstacle for bitcoin according to MY THINKING is its comparison to USD.

Lets face it Bitcoin is the currency of the future it is NOTHING like the paper money, yet when we talk about profitability for mining bitcoins we consider what is it's price relative to USD or EURO .. seriously dont you think that this is a drawback ?

I would say any country that adopts bitcoins in a way and allows small shops and local vendors to accept bitcoins instead of credit cards  and also allow banks to accept such,

If Sealand allows this then sealand it is if England allows this then England it is.
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April 26, 2013, 05:32:59 AM
 #59

It's hard to take this poll seriously when it doesn't have Thailand or Iceland.

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April 27, 2013, 03:22:22 AM
 #60

It's hard to take this poll seriously when it doesn't have Thailand or Iceland.
Other voters and commenters have Smiley
Explain your reason for adding those countries ? WHY are they any better ?
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April 27, 2013, 10:07:42 AM
 #61

Statist/socialists don't like bitcoin because they lose control.

Where is Argentina on this list?
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April 27, 2013, 05:04:44 PM
 #62

Statist/socialists don't like bitcoin because they lose control.

Where is Argentina on this list?

+1
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April 27, 2013, 05:08:04 PM
 #63

Statist/socialists don't like bitcoin because they lose control.

Where is Argentina on this list?
+1

Well, in that case, why is any country on this list? They all stand to lose control of their currency if they adopt Bitcoin.

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April 28, 2013, 10:18:31 AM
 #64

Statist/socialists don't like bitcoin because they lose control.

Where is Argentina on this list?
+1

Well, in that case, why is any country on this list? They all stand to lose control of their currency if they adopt Bitcoin.

If the local police didnt loose their jobs because the 'Interpol' existed why would these governments loose their indigenous currency if 'Bitcoins' exist ?
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April 28, 2013, 01:35:58 PM
 #65

Statist/socialists don't like bitcoin because they lose control.

Where is Argentina on this list?
+1

Well, in that case, why is any country on this list? They all stand to lose control of their currency if they adopt Bitcoin.

If the local police didnt loose their jobs because the 'Interpol' existed why would these governments loose their indigenous currency if 'Bitcoins' exist ?
You're talking about a country becoming the "Switzerland" of Bitcoin, ie basing a large percentage, perhaps even 100%, of it's economy on Bitcoin services. Any country that did so would soon find that it's currency was valued in Bitcoins, rather than the other way around, and in any economy where one can live entirely in bitcoin, the local government has officially lost control of that economy. The best it can hope for is to tax around the edges.

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April 28, 2013, 05:54:58 PM
 #66

Germany!
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April 29, 2013, 04:34:42 AM
 #67

Please add Kazakhstan to vote Smiley

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April 29, 2013, 07:29:48 AM
 #68

Statist/socialists don't like bitcoin because they lose control.

Where is Argentina on this list?
+1

Well, in that case, why is any country on this list? They all stand to lose control of their currency if they adopt Bitcoin.

If the local police didnt loose their jobs because the 'Interpol' existed why would these governments loose their indigenous currency if 'Bitcoins' exist ?
You're talking about a country becoming the "Switzerland" of Bitcoin, ie basing a large percentage, perhaps even 100%, of it's economy on Bitcoin services. Any country that did so would soon find that it's currency was valued in Bitcoins, rather than the other way around, and in any economy where one can live entirely in bitcoin, the local government has officially lost control of that economy. The best it can hope for is to tax around the edges.

We have to look past the fact how the OLD currency system used to work. Everyone knows that paper money is not made for online transactions. So for a country to become the 'switzerland' of bitcoin does not necessarily have to depend it's ENTIRE economy on bitcoin, it can simply adopt it's traditional currency for day to day & physical use  while adopting Bitcoins as the officially recognized currency for online transactions.

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April 29, 2013, 07:30:28 AM
 #69

Please add Kazakhstan to vote Smiley

If you want a certain country included then please explain your reasons as to why it should be included.
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April 29, 2013, 01:24:38 PM
 #70

My reasons to include Argentina were:

- people are willing to take a risk, as the fiat status quo is already financially extremely risky
- there is already a functional système D in Argentina, functioning outside of official boundaries and procedures
- this is not a third world country, there is a large middle class that is reasonably well informed and with internet in Argentina
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April 29, 2013, 02:35:41 PM
 #71

Given the events in Argentina, I believe it would be possible that a lot of *people* would be interested in bitcoin to preserve wealthy and get money out of the country.  Under the current regime, having it official is highly unlikely, but having it unofficial seems much more reasonable.  Avalon or Butterfly (or ?) could no doubt sell a lot of units there in order to seed bitcoins in the area.  This seems to be the problem - there are a lot of people who have pesos, converting them to BTC or USD or any other currency is difficult.

(Similarly, Venezuela could have used a similar vehicle in the late 1990s.)




My reasons to include Argentina were:

- people are willing to take a risk, as the fiat status quo is already financially extremely risky
- there is already a functional système D in Argentina, functioning outside of official boundaries and procedures
- this is not a third world country, there is a large middle class that is reasonably well informed and with internet in Argentina

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April 29, 2013, 02:39:46 PM
 #72

We have to look past the fact how the OLD currency system used to work. Everyone knows that paper money is not made for online transactions. So for a country to become the 'switzerland' of bitcoin does not necessarily have to depend it's ENTIRE economy on bitcoin, it can simply adopt it's traditional currency for day to day & physical use  while adopting Bitcoins as the officially recognized currency for online transactions.
I see. So, Why isn't "The Internet" on the list?

Switzerland's economy is largely banking and finance-based. In order for something to become the "Switzerland of Bitcoin" it would need to base a large portion of it's economy on bitcoin services. If you mean by that, only online services, then why must there be a physical location at all?

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May 02, 2013, 09:37:54 AM
 #73

We have to look past the fact how the OLD currency system used to work. Everyone knows that paper money is not made for online transactions. So for a country to become the 'switzerland' of bitcoin does not necessarily have to depend it's ENTIRE economy on bitcoin, it can simply adopt it's traditional currency for day to day & physical use  while adopting Bitcoins as the officially recognized currency for online transactions.
I see. So, Why isn't "The Internet" on the list?

Switzerland's economy is largely banking and finance-based. In order for something to become the "Switzerland of Bitcoin" it would need to base a large portion of it's economy on bitcoin services. If you mean by that, only online services, then why must there be a physical location at all?

I m not an all knowing expert or a guru, I m just saying what I think is right according to me, I could be probably wrong and hence I started this discussion.

My point : Just because the Internet came into existence didnt mean the SW radios went extinct.
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May 02, 2013, 04:16:01 PM
 #74

You can send your coins to my moon base... I'll only take a fee for storage to cover my cost... Should I start a kickstarter project? C'mon and fund moon.bit....

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May 02, 2013, 04:48:59 PM
 #75

We have to look past the fact how the OLD currency system used to work. Everyone knows that paper money is not made for online transactions. So for a country to become the 'switzerland' of bitcoin does not necessarily have to depend it's ENTIRE economy on bitcoin, it can simply adopt it's traditional currency for day to day & physical use  while adopting Bitcoins as the officially recognized currency for online transactions.
I see. So, Why isn't "The Internet" on the list?

Switzerland's economy is largely banking and finance-based. In order for something to become the "Switzerland of Bitcoin" it would need to base a large portion of it's economy on bitcoin services. If you mean by that, only online services, then why must there be a physical location at all?
False: The financial sector is only about 12% of GDP.

Switzerland looks as good for BTC as it does for Fiat precisely for exactly the same reasons: neutrality, stability, independence. Laws aren't set on the whims of those in Government or their sponsors (mainly since the people have full control over the laws, partly since you don't have one overall leader and/or leading political party), and due process is more or less guaranteed.
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May 04, 2013, 09:33:19 AM
 #76

You can send your coins to my moon base... I'll only take a fee for storage to cover my cost... Should I start a kickstarter project? C'mon and fund moon.bit....



+1 lol
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May 04, 2013, 09:37:55 AM
 #77

We have to look past the fact how the OLD currency system used to work. Everyone knows that paper money is not made for online transactions. So for a country to become the 'switzerland' of bitcoin does not necessarily have to depend it's ENTIRE economy on bitcoin, it can simply adopt it's traditional currency for day to day & physical use  while adopting Bitcoins as the officially recognized currency for online transactions.
I see. So, Why isn't "The Internet" on the list?

Switzerland's economy is largely banking and finance-based. In order for something to become the "Switzerland of Bitcoin" it would need to base a large portion of it's economy on bitcoin services. If you mean by that, only online services, then why must there be a physical location at all?
False: The financial sector is only about 12% of GDP.

Switzerland looks as good for BTC as it does for Fiat precisely for exactly the same reasons: neutrality, stability, independence. Laws aren't set on the whims of those in Government or their sponsors (mainly since the people have full control over the laws, partly since you don't have one overall leader and/or leading political party), and due process is more or less guaranteed.


+2
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May 04, 2013, 02:46:09 PM
 #78

I think that Bitcoin would be important in some parts of Africa too.

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May 04, 2013, 07:57:43 PM
 #79

I think that Bitcoin would be important in some parts of Africa too.

Lol most of them (Africanos) dont have computers Tongue
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May 04, 2013, 07:59:50 PM
 #80

I think that Bitcoin would be important in some parts of Africa too.

Lol most of them (Africanos) dont have computers Tongue
But a surprising amount have cell phones.

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May 04, 2013, 08:21:32 PM
 #81

I think that Bitcoin would be important in some parts of Africa too.

Lol most of them (Africanos) dont have computers Tongue
But a surprising amount have cell phones.

In all seriousness I believe South Africa can be a great place to start with Bitcoin in Africa.
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May 05, 2013, 01:03:20 AM
 #82

Australia... *chuckles*

South Africa!
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May 07, 2013, 04:26:25 AM
 #83

Finland not on the list? Surprising:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100618694
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May 07, 2013, 08:37:35 AM
 #84

Iceland!

Possibly the coolest country in the world - and with plenty of cheap, green power for server farms....

A lot of frustrated people there who are tech savvy, highly educated and savvy with banking and exchange - they have to be!

Gets my vote - seriously.

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May 07, 2013, 11:06:30 PM
 #85

Somewhere in Asia most likely.

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May 08, 2013, 10:46:54 AM
 #86

Guys take a look.

Leave Feedback PLEASE Read my entire post & all the replies/comments there before asking anything.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=195234.0;all
Thanks
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June 07, 2013, 07:58:21 PM
 #87

So I guess I should take off america from the List now ?? #Prism Huh
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June 07, 2013, 09:10:23 PM
 #88

So I guess I should take off america from the List now ?? #Prism Huh
I don't understand why it was ever on there, frankly.

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June 08, 2013, 06:06:41 AM
 #89

Macau maybe?
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June 08, 2013, 01:18:03 PM
 #90

I find it ironic that Switzerland is not on the list Smiley

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WALLET




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September 04, 2013, 09:08:03 AM
 #91

I find it ironic that Switzerland is not on the list Smiley
I find it ironic when Iron has nothing to do with Ironic.
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September 04, 2013, 09:16:35 AM
 #92

I can't answer the question, but shouldn't Panamá at least be on the list?

They have no central bank. They're also "dollarized". The Panamanian government has much less motivation to resit Bitcoin than most others, as it doesn't control money supply (so it doesn't feed itself from inflation) and it doesn't even have a central bank cartel to look after. Of course, when pressure comes from uncle Sam, they may eventually fold. But that applies to all of them.
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September 04, 2013, 09:27:40 AM
 #93

I can't answer the question, but shouldn't Panamá at least be on the list?

They have no central bank. They're also "dollarized". The Panamanian government has much less motivation to resit Bitcoin than most others, as it doesn't control money supply (so it doesn't feed itself from inflation) and it doesn't even have a central bank cartel to look after. Of course, when pressure comes from uncle Sam, they may eventually fold. But that applies to all of them.

Good point, but you also failed to notice that you are the first person even mentioning Panama.
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September 04, 2013, 09:47:27 AM
 #94

Not really: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=186038.msg1944078#msg1944078

But anyway, I was just trying to explain why I think Panamá is a decent candidate, not criticizing you for not having put it there from the start.
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September 04, 2013, 10:02:31 AM
 #95

South East Asia.

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You Can See Me Now, Hi :}
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September 04, 2013, 10:57:21 AM
 #96

Your points regarding Panama are very good.

Not really: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=186038.msg1944078#msg1944078

But anyway, I was just trying to explain why I think Panamá is a decent candidate, not criticizing you for not having put it there from the start.
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September 04, 2013, 02:04:41 PM
 #97

Canada:        TIMBITCOINS!
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September 04, 2013, 03:01:34 PM
 #98

It feels like there never will be one individual "Bitcoin country", the propagation so far has been thin and disparate. The imbalance of having an economy (especially a small national economy) that all but forces all foreign inflows and outflows to convert into and out of BTC should act as a natural barrier to it. What I'd expect is the low-level prevalence to gently climb amongst many economies and "common business pathways", until BTC use and inter-use get to some significant minority status within these numerous nations. Then, it's make or break (before that stage happens, transaction rate scaling problems must be solved + economic crisis must be kicked further into the rough)

Right now, the Bitcoin safe haven is confined to bedrooms, basements, apartments and datacenters across the whole world. Better than a nation state IMO.

Vires in numeris
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September 04, 2013, 05:16:26 PM
 #99

It feels like there never will be one individual "Bitcoin country", the propagation so far has been thin and disparate. The imbalance of having an economy (especially a small national economy) that all but forces all foreign inflows and outflows to convert into and out of BTC should act as a natural barrier to it. What I'd expect is the low-level prevalence to gently climb amongst many economies and "common business pathways", until BTC use and inter-use get to some significant minority status within these numerous nations. Then, it's make or break (before that stage happens, transaction rate scaling problems must be solved + economic crisis must be kicked further into the rough)

Right now, the Bitcoin safe haven is confined to bedrooms, basements, apartments and datacenters across the whole world. Better than a nation state IMO.

I think we should form a virtual state.
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September 04, 2013, 05:16:46 PM
 #100

Not really: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=186038.msg1944078#msg1944078

But anyway, I was just trying to explain why I think Panamá is a decent candidate, not criticizing you for not having put it there from the start.

I appreciate your research and admit my fault.
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September 04, 2013, 05:42:23 PM
 #101

It feels like there never will be one individual "Bitcoin country", the propagation so far has been thin and disparate. The imbalance of having an economy (especially a small national economy) that all but forces all foreign inflows and outflows to convert into and out of BTC should act as a natural barrier to it. What I'd expect is the low-level prevalence to gently climb amongst many economies and "common business pathways", until BTC use and inter-use get to some significant minority status within these numerous nations. Then, it's make or break (before that stage happens, transaction rate scaling problems must be solved + economic crisis must be kicked further into the rough)

Right now, the Bitcoin safe haven is confined to bedrooms, basements, apartments and datacenters across the whole world. Better than a nation state IMO.

I think we should form a virtual state.

I think we might already be doing it  Grin

Vires in numeris
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September 04, 2013, 07:29:19 PM
 #102

I can't answer the question, but shouldn't Panamá at least be on the list?

They have no central bank. They're also "dollarized". The Panamanian government has much less motivation to resit Bitcoin than most others, as it doesn't control money supply (so it doesn't feed itself from inflation) and it doesn't even have a central bank cartel to look after. Of course, when pressure comes from uncle Sam, they may eventually fold. But that applies to all of them.

Panama is one of a few countries that use USD in stead of its own money. Digging just a bit, it appears that they also have a Panama Balboa, which is pegged to the USD. They have not printed bills for years, and their coins have the same shape as the USAian ones. They have a relatively small government consistent with absense of the inflation tax. It could also be non-related. There is close connection to the USA via different treaties, Panama Canal, return of bases, war on drugs. Supposedly some of the police and militarty support programs from USA could compensate for the lack of inflation tax. They also have a "vibrant" financial sector.
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September 04, 2013, 11:15:18 PM
 #103

It feels like there never will be one individual "Bitcoin country", the propagation so far has been thin and disparate. The imbalance of having an economy (especially a small national economy) that all but forces all foreign inflows and outflows to convert into and out of BTC should act as a natural barrier to it. What I'd expect is the low-level prevalence to gently climb amongst many economies and "common business pathways", until BTC use and inter-use get to some significant minority status within these numerous nations. Then, it's make or break (before that stage happens, transaction rate scaling problems must be solved + economic crisis must be kicked further into the rough)

Right now, the Bitcoin safe haven is confined to bedrooms, basements, apartments and datacenters across the whole world. Better than a nation state IMO.

I think we should form a virtual state.

I think we might already be doing it  Grin

These are actually really important ideas. I'm not sure if you have read Stephenson's "SnowCrash" but there is a theme running through it whereby virtual nations are formed around common virtual currencies, kind of like rewards point or etc issued by multi-nationals and other groups.

So imagine if many local bitcoin groups formed their own bitcoin-friendly trading areas (e.g. Kreuzberg), gated communities, villages or similar all over the world. Then when any bitcoin user is travelling they can stay at the local bitcoin village and use his/her bitcoins there. These 'enclaves' form something of separate micro-economy in each of the countries they reside but are all connected by the common currency globally. Like a global 'virtual' state that exists inside every nation state they are allowed to ...

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September 05, 2013, 01:54:56 AM
 #104

Presently Bitcoin is in Beta phase-it is in CORRECTION MODE.The Switzerland of Bitcoin is that virtual land where BTC is freely convertible to any fiat currency/precious metal.....and where NO FUCKING HACKER  can dance as every Bitcoin exchange functions with GOLD STANDARD as its FUNDAMENTAL STRENGTH....Please check www.milligold.org

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September 05, 2013, 06:13:34 AM
 #105

Ukraine?
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September 05, 2013, 10:13:08 AM
 #106

Ukraine?

Support your Answer with reason ?
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September 05, 2013, 05:57:22 PM
 #107

You forgot The Principality of Sealand.

No, I'm not trolling. I think they, or another micronation, could very well take Switzerland's place in the Bitcoin economy.

Its just a small platform on 2 giant Pillars !!! no way in hell will it be ale to support & sustain itself in the long run ... let alone support the Bitcoin community !

All they need is a lot of servers and good bandwidth.  Why would the size of the platform get in the way?
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September 05, 2013, 07:44:10 PM
 #108

It feels like there never will be one individual "Bitcoin country", the propagation so far has been thin and disparate. The imbalance of having an economy (especially a small national economy) that all but forces all foreign inflows and outflows to convert into and out of BTC should act as a natural barrier to it. What I'd expect is the low-level prevalence to gently climb amongst many economies and "common business pathways", until BTC use and inter-use get to some significant minority status within these numerous nations. Then, it's make or break (before that stage happens, transaction rate scaling problems must be solved + economic crisis must be kicked further into the rough)

Right now, the Bitcoin safe haven is confined to bedrooms, basements, apartments and datacenters across the whole world. Better than a nation state IMO.

I think we should form a virtual state.

I think we might already be doing it  Grin

These are actually really important ideas. I'm not sure if you have read Stephenson's "SnowCrash" but there is a theme running through it whereby virtual nations are formed around common virtual currencies, kind of like rewards point or etc issued by multi-nationals and other groups.

So imagine if many local bitcoin groups formed their own bitcoin-friendly trading areas (e.g. Kreuzberg), gated communities, villages or similar all over the world. Then when any bitcoin user is travelling they can stay at the local bitcoin village and use his/her bitcoins there. These 'enclaves' form something of separate micro-economy in each of the countries they reside but are all connected by the common currency globally. Like a global 'virtual' state that exists inside every nation state they are allowed to ...

Indeed, the proto-state-virtual trail seems to be nearing unbroken chain proportions according to coinmap.org. USA and EU can almost be traversed spending BTC on the vitals as you go, but there just isn't quite enough take-up to reliably get all goods everywhere. I thought the recent thread asking "are we in a closed-loop economy yet?" was interesting, it seems that Finland is closest of all. And you might expect that independent, self-reliant attitude from that sort of culture. Maybe the virtual state trail isn't yet possible trans-nationally, but you could have a close simulation by taking a week or a weekend out in Helsinki. Like a Bitcoin POS shop window  Cheesy

Vires in numeris
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September 05, 2013, 09:08:57 PM
 #109

what about germany ?

http://www.coindesk.com/german-government-relieves-capital-gains-tax-on-bitcoin-positions/

http://www.coindesk.com/germany-official-recognises-bitcoin-as-private-money/
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September 06, 2013, 09:41:41 PM
 #110

Canada should be on that list.

FinTrac is the FinCen equivalent here, and their guidance is regards to digital currencies is much more favourable than our neighbours south of the border.






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September 06, 2013, 11:28:17 PM
 #111

Germany is missing from the list. Berlin is already most popular Bitcoin city and attitude towards Bitcoin in Germany has been very friendly at the political level. After the nightmare of Weimar inflation a such deflationary currency is certainly an appealing proposition. It's also great way for Germans to escape the upcoming massive ECB printing.


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September 07, 2013, 09:45:55 PM
 #112

Maybe India if they get their head out of their ass

they just dumped their currency 25% recently so the people got hosed there.. but it keeps the outsource jobs flowing

~~BTC~~GAMBIT~~BTC~~Play Boardgames for Bitcoins!!~~BTC~~GAMBIT~~BTC~~ Something I say help? Donate BTC! 1KN1K1xStzsgfYxdArSX4PEjFfcLEuYhid
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September 14, 2013, 02:22:19 AM
 #113

Maybe India if they get their head out of their ass

they just dumped their currency 25% recently so the people got hosed there.. but it keeps the outsource jobs flowing

I would be shocked if it is a country as vast, diverse, undeveloped, and superstitious as India. It would benefit them greatly if/when they do embrace virtual currency, but I cannot envision them leading the way. It will almost certainly be a small, progressive, technologically advanced country like Finland.
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September 14, 2013, 01:06:10 PM
 #114

Maybe India if they get their head out of their ass

they just dumped their currency 25% recently so the people got hosed there.. but it keeps the outsource jobs flowing

I would be shocked if it is a country as vast, diverse, undeveloped, and superstitious as India. It would benefit them greatly if/when they do embrace virtual currency, but I cannot envision them leading the way. It will almost certainly be a small, progressive, technologically advanced country like Finland.

I'm sort of surprised that Iceland haven't had more (visible) BTC take-up, although maybe they're just not shouting about it. Smaller than Finland, progressive, and technologically advanced too, plus there's the Internet Freedomtm branding as well. Maybe they're cautious about wild sounding banking concepts after their banking collapse, though.

Vires in numeris
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September 14, 2013, 08:00:55 PM
 #115

You guys are way off base.


You need to look at which countries have the best privacy laws.


Off the top of my head:


Principality of Andorra (located between Spain and France)
Monaco (Principality)
Samoa
Bahrain
Malta
Seychelles
Sultunate of Brunei
Mauritius
Panama
Belize
Bahamas
British Virgin Islands
Gibraltar (UK)



Read this website: http://www.streber.st/
It talks about the best countries to form an offshore corporation based on privacy laws and taxation laws. I believe the same principles would apply to this thread.









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September 15, 2013, 02:48:21 AM
 #116

It would make a lot of sense for a state with adversarial relations with the United States (Iran comes to mind) to embrace Bitcoin. It would be a great way to get around the economic sanctions, while posing more of a threat to Washington than it could ever do militarily.
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September 15, 2013, 03:46:25 AM
 #117

It would make a lot of sense for a state with adversarial relations with the United States (Iran comes to mind) to embrace Bitcoin. It would be a great way to get around the economic sanctions, while posing more of a threat to Washington than it could ever do militarily.

If you want Bitcoin to die a quick death, then hope for that scenario. Really, could your suggestion be any dumber?
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September 15, 2013, 10:08:57 AM
 #118

It would make a lot of sense for a state with adversarial relations with the United States (Iran comes to mind) to embrace Bitcoin. It would be a great way to get around the economic sanctions, while posing more of a threat to Washington than it could ever do militarily.

If you want Bitcoin to die a quick death, then hope for that scenario. Really, could your suggestion be any dumber?
Any arguments to back your statement?
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September 15, 2013, 06:53:28 PM
 #119

It would make a lot of sense for a state with adversarial relations with the United States (Iran comes to mind) to embrace Bitcoin. It would be a great way to get around the economic sanctions, while posing more of a threat to Washington than it could ever do militarily.

If you want Bitcoin to die a quick death, then hope for that scenario. Really, could your suggestion be any dumber?
Any arguments to back your statement?


Sorry, I thought I was dealing with someone who knew better...


But to help you out, look at the state of Iran's current economy. In the last 2 years it has had crippling inflation, produce is unaffordable for the average Iranian.
Why? Because the US and cooperating International Countries have levied sanctions on this murderous regime who threatens to commit genocide on an entire nation, while actively pursuing nuclear weapons. Why would you want to side with the enemy of the USA and allied countries?

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible. That is a line you do not want to cross.

I almost forgot to mention, their are international economic sanctions on Iran, with VERY HARSH PENALTIES for ANYONE who does business with Iran in any way, shape or form.

Plus, who the hell wants to be associated with Iran? The country's leaders regularly preach "death to the infidel" (any non-Muslims). They follow Sharia Law and accordingly cut off the hands of thieves, make raped women marry their rapist, and worse.



Still think it's a good idea?
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September 15, 2013, 08:34:45 PM
 #120

plzzzz pick Nigeria!!1

Best Bank for Bitcoins, under 12,500€ annonym Smiley https://banking.fidor.de/registrierung?ibid=52874443
Best Direct-Cash Market https://www.bitcoin.de/de/r/4879q2
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September 15, 2013, 09:14:31 PM
 #121

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible.
My little boy, the whole question is not about Iran. It is about the US. Nobody will care about Bitcoin if the US government can destroy it at their will.
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September 15, 2013, 09:27:59 PM
 #122

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible.
My little boy, the whole question is not about Iran. It is about the US. Nobody will care about Bitcoin if the US government can destroy it at their will.


If you do not think that is true, then you must be more deluded than I originally thought.
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September 15, 2013, 09:42:40 PM
 #123

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible.
My little boy, the whole question is not about Iran. It is about the US. Nobody will care about Bitcoin if the US government can destroy it at their will.


If you do not think that is true, then you must be more deluded than I originally thought.
Then be responsible and tell everyone that is currently paying $140 per 1 bitcoin that they are diluded!
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September 16, 2013, 12:18:41 AM
 #124

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible.
My little boy, the whole question is not about Iran. It is about the US. Nobody will care about Bitcoin if the US government can destroy it at their will.


If you do not think that is true, then you must be more deluded than I originally thought.
Then be responsible and tell everyone that is currently paying $140 per 1 bitcoin that they are diluded!


How ridiculous.

There is no threat to Bitcoin now by the US Govt, but the minute you want to use it to aid a country like Iran, you're talking crazy. Maybe get off the computer for a couple days and watch some Fox News, you might learn something.
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September 16, 2013, 01:21:57 AM
 #125

It would make a lot of sense for a state with adversarial relations with the United States (Iran comes to mind) to embrace Bitcoin. It would be a great way to get around the economic sanctions, while posing more of a threat to Washington than it could ever do militarily.

If you want Bitcoin to die a quick death, then hope for that scenario. Really, could your suggestion be any dumber?
Any arguments to back your statement?


Sorry, I thought I was dealing with someone who knew better...


But to help you out, look at the state of Iran's current economy. In the last 2 years it has had crippling inflation, produce is unaffordable for the average Iranian.
Why? Because the US and cooperating International Countries have levied sanctions on this murderous regime who threatens to commit genocide on an entire nation, while actively pursuing nuclear weapons. Why would you want to side with the enemy of the USA and allied countries?

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible. That is a line you do not want to cross.

I almost forgot to mention, their are international economic sanctions on Iran, with VERY HARSH PENALTIES for ANYONE who does business with Iran in any way, shape or form.

Plus, who the hell wants to be associated with Iran? The country's leaders regularly preach "death to the infidel" (any non-Muslims). They follow Sharia Law and accordingly cut off the hands of thieves, make raped women marry their rapist, and worse.

Still think it's a good idea?

You make one good point, that in the case Iran successfully integrated Bitcoin into its economy the United States government would likely make greater efforts to destroy Bitcoin. However, Iran has murdered orders of magnitude fewer people than the United States in the past hundred years, and it is not a threat to the people of the United States in any possible way. Yes, Islam is a despicable political/religious system, but I thought one of the main points of Bitcoin is that anyone can use it freely, regardless of whether or not any other government or entity gives its permission. Besides, if Bitcoin would help Iran's economy improve, Islamic extremism would lose influence, as has happened in numerous cases in recent history.
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September 16, 2013, 01:28:02 AM
 #126

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible.
My little boy, the whole question is not about Iran. It is about the US. Nobody will care about Bitcoin if the US government can destroy it at their will.


If you do not think that is true, then you must be more deluded than I originally thought.
Then be responsible and tell everyone that is currently paying $140 per 1 bitcoin that they are diluded!


How ridiculous.

There is no threat to Bitcoin now by the US Govt, but the minute you want to use it to aid a country like Iran, you're talking crazy. Maybe get off the computer for a couple days and watch some Fox News, you might learn something.


Fox News? OK, I admit, I have been trolled.
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September 16, 2013, 04:42:31 AM
 #127

It would make a lot of sense for a state with adversarial relations with the United States (Iran comes to mind) to embrace Bitcoin. It would be a great way to get around the economic sanctions, while posing more of a threat to Washington than it could ever do militarily.

If you want Bitcoin to die a quick death, then hope for that scenario. Really, could your suggestion be any dumber?
Any arguments to back your statement?


Sorry, I thought I was dealing with someone who knew better...


But to help you out, look at the state of Iran's current economy. In the last 2 years it has had crippling inflation, produce is unaffordable for the average Iranian.
Why? Because the US and cooperating International Countries have levied sanctions on this murderous regime who threatens to commit genocide on an entire nation, while actively pursuing nuclear weapons. Why would you want to side with the enemy of the USA and allied countries?

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible. That is a line you do not want to cross.

I almost forgot to mention, their are international economic sanctions on Iran, with VERY HARSH PENALTIES for ANYONE who does business with Iran in any way, shape or form.

Plus, who the hell wants to be associated with Iran? The country's leaders regularly preach "death to the infidel" (any non-Muslims). They follow Sharia Law and accordingly cut off the hands of thieves, make raped women marry their rapist, and worse.

Still think it's a good idea?

You make one good point, that in the case Iran successfully integrated Bitcoin into its economy the United States government would likely make greater efforts to destroy Bitcoin. However, Iran has murdered orders of magnitude fewer people than the United States in the past hundred years, and it is not a threat to the people of the United States in any possible way. Yes, Islam is a despicable political/religious system, but I thought one of the main points of Bitcoin is that anyone can use it freely, regardless of whether or not any other government or entity gives its permission. Besides, if Bitcoin would help Iran's economy improve, Islamic extremism would lose influence, as has happened in numerous cases in recent history.

How's the weather in anti-American land, oh ignorant one? America's murdered more than Iran? Putin must be very proud of you, comrade.

You ignore that the poster referred to using Bitcoin to bypass American sanctions imposed on Iran. That's just illegal.



And finally, I'll address this gem:
It [Iran] is not a threat to the people of the United States in any possible way.


Your thinking isn't only stupid, it's dangerous. If you really feel that way why don't you go pay a visit to Iran. I'm sure they will welcome you with open arms and treat you the way you deserve to be treated.  Roll Eyes
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September 16, 2013, 04:53:33 AM
 #128

Quote
Fox News? OK, I admit, I have been trolled.



That's right, I forgot.


You like to watch MSNBC and get that chill up your leg every time they mention what a great job Obama is doing.

Go back to your basement ya douche!
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September 16, 2013, 07:34:15 AM
 #129

You ignore that the poster referred to using Bitcoin to bypass American sanctions imposed on Iran. That's just illegal.
American sanctions are just American sanctions. The free world doesn't care about them. Maybe it's time for you to consider renouncing your US passport and move to live in some free country. Bitcoin is not a property of the US government.
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September 16, 2013, 12:12:42 PM
 #130

Quote
Fox News? OK, I admit, I have been trolled.



That's right, I forgot.


You like to watch MSNBC and get that chill up your leg every time they mention what a great job Obama is doing.

Go back to your basement ya douche!


Can we keep it on topic ... the disturbing nationalist fervour has no place in an Economics topic ...

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September 16, 2013, 05:10:12 PM
 #131

You ignore that the poster referred to using Bitcoin to bypass American sanctions imposed on Iran. That's just illegal.
American sanctions are just American sanctions. The free world doesn't care about them. Maybe it's time for you to consider renouncing your US passport and move to live in some free country. Bitcoin is not a property of the US government.

Sorry, I am a proud American. You can keep your filthy commie ideas to yourself.



If you choose to ignore US, and NATO, and EU sanctions on Iran, that is your choice. Your douchey life, your choice.



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September 16, 2013, 05:19:00 PM
 #132

United States has one of the highest corporate tax rates in the world. No. Not good for business. I dont even have to mention Obamacare. Fail.
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September 16, 2013, 05:28:33 PM
 #133

Bitcoins will thrive in China.
China has a totalitarian regime that robs people of their savings via relentless inflation and intervention.
Bitcoins allows them to store their money in a way that its out of the reach of the state and their financial planners.
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September 16, 2013, 05:31:09 PM
 #134

Bitcoins will thrive in China.
China has a totalitarian regime that robs people of their savings via relentless inflation and intervention.
Bitcoins allows them to store their money in a way that its out of the reach of the state and their financial planners.

When will people of China revolt against their Communist aggressors?
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September 17, 2013, 12:38:11 AM
 #135

Bitcoins will thrive in China.
China has a totalitarian regime that robs people of their savings via relentless inflation and intervention.
Bitcoins allows them to store their money in a way that its out of the reach of the state and their financial planners.

China is also making a concerted effort to encourage its people to buy gold and silver. Walk into any Chinese bank or look at any bank advertisement, and you will see what I mean.
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September 17, 2013, 12:42:24 AM
 #136

Bitcoins will thrive in China.
China has a totalitarian regime that robs people of their savings via relentless inflation and intervention.
Bitcoins allows them to store their money in a way that its out of the reach of the state and their financial planners.

When will people of China revolt against their Communist aggressors?

The odds of that happening are no greater than the odds of the people of the United States revolting against its government.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0YjL9rZyR0
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September 17, 2013, 01:54:14 AM
 #137

Bitcoins will thrive in China.
China has a totalitarian regime that robs people of their savings via relentless inflation and intervention.
Bitcoins allows them to store their money in a way that its out of the reach of the state and their financial planners.

When will people of China revolt against their Communist aggressors?

The odds of that happening are no greater than the odds of the people of the United States revolting against its government.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0YjL9rZyR0
Well I agree with the commentator.
Let countries decide their own fate.
If you ask me though the Chinese like many former communist countries didn't know how to transition to democracy.
So they turned to a dictator with some capitalism.
With +1 billion people some capitalism can go a long way.
I didn't know about the state urging them to buy gold though, uh...
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September 17, 2013, 03:32:43 AM
 #138

Well, I think most libertarian-minded people believe gold and silver are better and less totalitarian than fiat currency. The fact the the Chinese government is encouraging its citizens to invest in gold and silver is an indication that it is less totalitarian and communist than most Americans believe.
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September 17, 2013, 05:30:31 AM
 #139

Well, I think most libertarian-minded people believe gold and silver are better and less totalitarian than fiat currency. The fact the the Chinese government is encouraging its citizens to invest in gold and silver is an indication that it is less totalitarian and communist than most Americans believe.



You do realize all the mines in the country are all or partially state owned, and the only reason they are encouraging their slaves citizens to buy it, is so the government profits.

The Chinese banks ONLY sell Chinese mined gold. Internationally mined gold need not apply. Another act of self containment which will end up destroying China internally.
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September 18, 2013, 02:21:44 AM
 #140

Well, I think most libertarian-minded people believe gold and silver are better and less totalitarian than fiat currency. The fact the the Chinese government is encouraging its citizens to invest in gold and silver is an indication that it is less totalitarian and communist than most Americans believe.



You do realize all the mines in the country are all or partially state owned, and the only reason they are encouraging their slaves citizens to buy it, is so the government profits.

The Chinese banks ONLY sell Chinese mined gold. Internationally mined gold need not apply. Another act of self containment which will end up destroying China internally.

not quite accurate. china imports around 2x what it mines.

http://www.mineweb.com/mineweb/content/en/mineweb-gold-news?oid=197040&sn=Detail

as for slaves .....well i think most here would have a similar opinion about amerikans
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September 21, 2013, 05:13:48 AM
 #141

Well, I think most libertarian-minded people believe gold and silver are better and less totalitarian than fiat currency. The fact the the Chinese government is encouraging its citizens to invest in gold and silver is an indication that it is less totalitarian and communist than most Americans believe.



You do realize all the mines in the country are all or partially state owned, and the only reason they are encouraging their slaves citizens to buy it, is so the government profits.

The Chinese banks ONLY sell Chinese mined gold. Internationally mined gold need not apply. Another act of self containment which will end up destroying China internally.

not quite accurate. china imports around 2x what it mines.

http://www.mineweb.com/mineweb/content/en/mineweb-gold-news?oid=197040&sn=Detail

as for slaves .....well i think most here would have a similar opinion about amerikans

Not sure how you can compare American Labor Law and Fair/Minimum Wage to Chinese Sweatshops. Just google China Foxconn. Wink That one's free.
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September 21, 2013, 07:13:52 PM
 #142

I hear FoxConn has to put up nets near all the ledges on the higher stories of their building, because people were throwing themselves trying to commit suicide rather than continue working there.


Really no comparison in USA vs China in regards to slave or even slave like labor.
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September 28, 2013, 05:53:46 AM
 #143

Another vote for Iceland from me.  As people have pointed out they have a lot of things going for them  Might be an idea to get eve to accept them first though.
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September 28, 2013, 11:27:25 AM
 #144

But to help you out, look at the state of Iran's current economy. In the last 2 years it has had crippling inflation, produce is unaffordable for the average Iranian.
Why? Because the US and cooperating International Countries have levied sanctions on this murderous regime who threatens to commit genocide on an entire nation, while actively pursuing nuclear weapons. Why would you want to side with the enemy of the USA and allied countries?

If you want to attach Bitcoin to Iran you are guaranteeing that the US will focus it's efforts at destroying Bitcoin, in everyway possible. That is a line you do not want to cross.

I almost forgot to mention, their are international economic sanctions on Iran, with VERY HARSH PENALTIES for ANYONE who does business with Iran in any way, shape or form.

Plus, who the hell wants to be associated with Iran? The country's leaders regularly preach "death to the infidel" (any non-Muslims). They follow Sharia Law and accordingly cut off the hands of thieves, make raped women marry their rapist, and worse.

Oh boy, someone has swallowed the propaganda hook, line and sinker  Grin

to stay on topic: As mentioned by other people, small, technologically advanced countries like Iceland and Finland might lead the way. I would personally love to see the scenario of African countries adopting Bitcoin come to pass. Those people stand to gain a lot from adoption.

It's all bullshit. But bullshit makes the flowers grow and that's beautiful.
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September 28, 2013, 09:24:33 PM
 #145

Finland: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=303406.0

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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September 28, 2013, 09:30:43 PM
 #146

I would personally love to see the scenario of African countries adopting Bitcoin come to pass. Those people stand to gain a lot from adoption.

Many African countries are leading the way with mobile internet access etc, so it makes sense that BTC may well take off there.  Lack of infrastructure and mining  (in a BTC sense) probably limits exposure, but the concept is perfect for African communities.

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October 02, 2013, 06:42:14 PM
 #147

methinks finland is best
No way Finland. Finland stopped to accept huge russian cash deposits coming over border early 1990's. Without that move, Finland would be now really rich country... real tax heaven - but now - forget. Bureaucracy and real police state and current finnish government full of idiots. I have discussed with one finnish minister and one member of parliament few months ago about bitcoins and both admitted that they don't even know what it means. Ouch. Bye bye finland.
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October 02, 2013, 06:57:36 PM
 #148

Why not add Estonia on the poll? They have at least currently good tax laws regarding company profits (actually Estonia is 'tax heaven' as long as you keep profits in the company / or invest profits in the business) and quite dynamic government also at IT things. So, they maybe able to adpot BTC somehow fast in legal system also.
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October 02, 2013, 08:31:06 PM
 #149

    but how secure is secure?? wont the government find a way?
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October 09, 2013, 12:39:54 AM
 #150

'Merica

Bitcoin: The currency of liberty
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November 08, 2013, 10:46:32 PM
 #151

Sweden should be on there !!! as it has been a perfect hiding place for the piratebay !!
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December 15, 2013, 10:58:12 AM
 #152

`Why Malta?`

A 12-minute film highlighting the attractions of living, working and running a business in Malta, the `Why Malta` film which is available online, on usb or DVD is an excellent tool to use when talking to potential customers.

As well as showcasing Malta`s inspiring potential and great opportunities, along with its rich and cultured history, the film highlights the island`s position as a centre of excellence in a number of sectors and a perfect international hub for business.

HSBC Malta CEO Mark Watkinson describes Malta`s location as one of the world`s largest trade routes, connecting Asia, the Middle East and Europe. He also highlights HSBC`s role in supporting Malta`s growth and adding value to its economy, as well as using its global connectivity to help companies prosper at home and overseas.

`Why Malta?` focuses on the key attributes that makes Malta such an attractive business location, from its excellent telecommunications and flight connections to Malta`s Grand Harbour which lies at the crossroads of some of the world`s largest shipping routes.

As HSBC Malta Head of Commercial Banking Michel Cordina explains, HSBC aims to connect customers to opportunities with over 50 relationship managers providing that level of support and insight of the local market. He continues that Malta has a strategic location and has a huge potential to become a main hub as a logistics, warehousing and distribution centre from where companies can service European and North African markets.

Malta`s excellence across a range industries, including financial services, knowledge-based sectors, high-end manufacturing, maritime and aircraft maintenance, is also featured along with its high levels of education and its skilled workforce.

Chris Bond, HSBC Malta Head of Global Banking and Markets describes how Malta has rapidly become an International Financial Services Centre. It has benefitted from its membership in the European Union, it enjoys a robust banking sector, it has a sound regulatory framework and economic performance has been remarkably resilient especially through the financial crisis. He points out that HSBC shares the government's vision for the financial services sector to become an increasing part of local GDP.

To provide the all-important perspective of a business that has established a presence in Malta and is enjoying everything that the country has to offer, we also hear from David Walsh CEO of IT Solutions provider Crimsonwing.

As a modern, cost-effective Eurozone jurisdiction with attractive investment incentives, double tax agreements with major countries and a clear regulatory framework, Malta is an excellent place to do business. The `Why Malta?` film demonstrates the island`s business attributes in a clear, professional manner as well as showcasing its natural beauty and attraction as a great place to live and work.

Original Article
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December 15, 2013, 11:38:33 AM
Last edit: December 15, 2013, 11:52:03 AM by AnonyMint
 #153

I am thinking "better" means safe haven from government control, since you referred to Switzerland in the thread title.

All the countries you are listed are slaves to the banksters and the U.S.A.. Heck Hong Kong even pegs their currency to the dollar.

Your list is missing Ecuador!!

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2013/06/23/china-allows-snowden-to-leave-hong-kong-seek-asylum-in-ecuador/

Quote
President Correa’s background is rooted in education and economics. He spent his earlier years in education and served as a director at the Ministry of Education and Culture (MEC) after volunteering at a pre-school in remote village in Ecuador for a year. His wife is also a teacher. President Correa studied economics in Belgium and the US. His questioning of the US was after his father spent five years and a half years in prison after being convicted of smuggling drugs into the US and witnessing the lack of due process of law and the 99% conviction rate. In December 2008, Correa declared Ecuador’s national debt illegitimate, and defaulted on over $3 billion worth of bonds eventually reducing the debt by 60%. Mr Correa said he had given the order not to approve debt default describing the international lenders as “monsters”.

However keep this in mind for any country, as we saw Iceland turn back to being controlled by the USA recently:

Quote
Snowden should be careful for everything could change in Ecuador with a different President

http://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2013/sep/04/ecuador-president-failed-country-yasuni-itt

http://www.freedomhouse.org/blog/muzzling-dissent-ecuadors-yasuni-oil-drilling-plan

P.S. I am voting for India, because my (unverified) belief the people give the middle finger to the government.

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December 15, 2013, 07:41:51 PM
 #154

Australia is great, however Power, water and utility companies have been looting the public and raising Cost of living in the last couple of years (among other factors). The Government has been v complacent in the insane rise of cost of living and unaffordable housing.

Also Mining in Australia would be v expensive

However, extreme cost of living in Australia gives Bitcoin adoption an advantage, as people want a currency that can keeps up with the rises.


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December 16, 2013, 12:27:28 AM
 #155

Australia is not really 'safe' for Bitcoins in my opinion the govt hasnt shown any signs of readiness to accept it there.
Ecuador, Malta and Sweden however are really on the spotlight.
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December 16, 2013, 12:29:10 AM
 #156

If you guys have a time do participate on the pole here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=369645.20 and do comment if you have to share anything that you deem useful.
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December 16, 2013, 02:28:43 PM
 #157

Exactly, bitcoin need a totally different country since most of the existing countries are all tied to the same old financial system

Another possibility is off-shore tax heaven countries
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December 16, 2013, 08:47:26 PM
 #158

Hmmm.... what about using a large retired shipping liner? As long as it stays in international waters it's safe (except from pirates. Grrrr, those damn pirates!).

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December 17, 2013, 07:23:30 AM
 #159

Cyprus? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZDmpiSdTTk (starting at 22:00 minutes).

Might help them make up for the beating they took earlier this year.
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December 17, 2013, 09:38:19 AM
 #160

South Africa doesn't have any taxation for cryptocurrencies, not even capital gains tax Cheesy
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January 03, 2015, 07:28:11 PM
 #161

I think Dubai is good  Wink
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January 04, 2015, 03:56:25 PM
 #162

add romania to list
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January 05, 2015, 06:21:05 AM
 #163

Australia is not really 'safe' for Bitcoins in my opinion the govt hasnt shown any signs of readiness to accept it there.

There is more than one 'government' in Australia; there's about a dozen. You're forgetting you can pay taxes with bitcoin in Launceston, Tasmania.


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January 05, 2015, 09:12:17 AM
 #164

add romania to list

at the moment, just wait till our govenment finds out , it will tax the shit out of it Sad
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January 05, 2015, 09:40:25 AM
 #165

Netherlands.

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January 05, 2015, 09:41:40 AM
 #166

Texas

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
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January 05, 2015, 04:37:28 PM
 #167

USA will be main BTC country  Grin At this stage no one country have so many BTC users as USA  Grin
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January 07, 2015, 12:59:34 PM
 #168

I think the Switzerland of bitcoins should be..... Switzerland.
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January 07, 2015, 03:35:31 PM
 #169

The Netherlands

Sometimes, if it looks too bearish, it's actually bullish
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January 07, 2015, 04:25:41 PM
 #170

The Netherlands

I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.

While the rest of those countries are very statist, and will probably ban in in the future.
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January 07, 2015, 08:00:39 PM
 #171

The Netherlands

I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.

While the rest of those countries are very statist, and will probably ban in in the future.

Are you dutch ?
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January 07, 2015, 08:07:50 PM
 #172

The Netherlands

I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.

While the rest of those countries are very statist, and will probably ban in in the future.

Are you dutch ?

No, but i like their open mindedness, they are by far the most free society in europe. Most of the states in europe if not all of them are poisoned by socialism.

If any of them, then they will be the ones that will first make BTC the legal tender and their official currency.
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January 07, 2015, 09:06:19 PM
 #173

The Netherlands

I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.

While the rest of those countries are very statist, and will probably ban in in the future.

Are you dutch ?

No, but i like their open mindedness, they are by far the most free society in europe. Most of the states in europe if not all of them are poisoned by socialism.

If any of them, then they will be the ones that will first make BTC the legal tender and their official currency.

Ever heard of the phrase 'The grass is always greener on the other side" ??

I have a friend from Netherlands, albeit the only dutch I know and he has some... other views about his country.
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January 08, 2015, 10:00:52 AM
 #174

The Netherlands

I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.

While the rest of those countries are very statist, and will probably ban in in the future.

Are you dutch ?
Yes, I'm Dutch. The Netherlands is the Switzerland of Bitcoin.

Sometimes, if it looks too bearish, it's actually bullish
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January 08, 2015, 04:19:54 PM
 #175

The Netherlands

I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.

While the rest of those countries are very statist, and will probably ban in in the future.

Are you dutch ?
Yes, I'm Dutch. The Netherlands is the Switzerland of Bitcoin.

Opinions vary I guess..
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January 09, 2015, 04:01:23 PM
 #176

USA will be main BTC country  Grin At this stage no one country have so many BTC users as USA  Grin

I guess the dollar has something to do with that.  Tongue
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January 10, 2015, 07:17:52 AM
 #177

It would have to be Sweden, they're the only country that truly remains neutral..out of everyone's business, doing their own thing an keeping cool with everyone.

An alternative would be the Cayman Islands, was that on the list?

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January 10, 2015, 07:31:38 AM
 #178

It would have to be Sweden, they're the only country that truly remains neutral..out of everyone's business, doing their own thing an keeping cool with everyone.

An alternative would be the Cayman Islands, was that on the list?

Sweden =/ Switzerland

Saying that you don't trust someone because of their behavior is completely valid.
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January 10, 2015, 08:53:01 AM
 #179

It would have to be Sweden, they're the only country that truly remains neutral..out of everyone's business, doing their own thing an keeping cool with everyone.

An alternative would be the Cayman Islands, was that on the list?

Sweden =/ Switzerland

Haha not even Switzerland does that anymore, they are minions of the EU now.

They devalue their currency, then they peg it to the EUR.

And now they even vote down the referendum to get more gold reserves.

They are clearly being infested with globalist Keynesian manipulators.
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January 10, 2015, 11:19:50 AM
 #180

Russia would be the most obvious Bitcoin state, but they seem dead against it. Zimbabwe maybe??
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January 10, 2015, 05:10:58 PM
Last edit: January 10, 2015, 07:10:49 PM by clochard
 #181


I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.


I am from the Netherlands and based on the population I would vote yes. The population is very internationally oriented, most people posess an advanced level of English and many also one ore more other foreign languages, the population is tech savvy, everywhere in the country there is superfast internet and Dutch people are big online consumers and even grandparents buy stuff online. Furthermore, everyone uses iDeal, a money transfer systems that all webshops accept and allows you to buy instantly goods online with your debit card. There are systems that allow you to buy and sell Bitcoins in seconds with your debit card and without any account nor verification such as www.bitonic.nl. In certain Dutch cities such as Amsterdam, The Hague or Arnhem, there are already a lot of shops and services accepting Bitcoin. Heck, Arnhem is the Bitcoin capital of the world! In my surroundings (I have to admit, I study in a university, so the people here are already a bit more tech savvy) I see quite an interest in Bitcoin. In 2013 during the autumn bubble, I have explained many of them about Bitcoin and at least 10 other students from my study now also possess Bitcoin. Many of my friends as well. So population wise: definitely a yes!

Furthermore, a lot of Bitcoin companies are locating themselves in Amsterdam, such as for example Bitpay.

Even my parents have a 'Bitcoin wallet' now, since I talked them into using Gems Smiley

The Netherlands could be a Switzerland of Bitcoin, for Europe at least. Let Hong Kong or Singapore be it for the world Smiley
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January 10, 2015, 08:35:36 PM
 #182


I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.


I am from the Netherlands and based on the population I would vote yes. The population is very internationally oriented, most people posess an advanced level of English and many also one ore more other foreign languages, the population is tech savvy, everywhere in the country there is superfast internet and Dutch people are big online consumers and even grandparents buy stuff online. Furthermore, everyone uses iDeal, a money transfer systems that all webshops accept and allows you to buy instantly goods online with your debit card. There are systems that allow you to buy and sell Bitcoins in seconds with your debit card and without any account nor verification such as www.bitonic.nl. In certain Dutch cities such as Amsterdam, The Hague or Arnhem, there are already a lot of shops and services accepting Bitcoin. Heck, Arnhem is the Bitcoin capital of the world! In my surroundings (I have to admit, I study in a university, so the people here are already a bit more tech savvy) I see quite an interest in Bitcoin. In 2013 during the autumn bubble, I have explained many of them about Bitcoin and at least 10 other students from my study now also possess Bitcoin. Many of my friends as well. So population wise: definitely a yes!

Furthermore, a lot of Bitcoin companies are locating themselves in Amsterdam, such as for example Bitpay.

Even my parents have a 'Bitcoin wallet' now, since I talked them into using Gems Smiley

The Netherlands could be a Switzerland of Bitcoin, for Europe at least. Let Hong Kong or Singapore be it for the world Smiley

Very true. I'm also from the Netherlands. My study mates, 2 brothers and my parents also have a Bitcoin wallet(more then 1 bitcoin each). People in my neighborhood are open to try something.

Sometimes, if it looks too bearish, it's actually bullish
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January 31, 2015, 03:36:14 AM
 #183


I agree, the OP left out it from the poll, which is funny since Netherlands has the most ATM's and the most liberal ideology there (actually libertarian) ,which I really admire.


I am from the Netherlands and based on the population I would vote yes. The population is very internationally oriented, most people posess an advanced level of English and many also one ore more other foreign languages, the population is tech savvy, everywhere in the country there is superfast internet and Dutch people are big online consumers and even grandparents buy stuff online. Furthermore, everyone uses iDeal, a money transfer systems that all webshops accept and allows you to buy instantly goods online with your debit card. There are systems that allow you to buy and sell Bitcoins in seconds with your debit card and without any account nor verification such as www.bitonic.nl. In certain Dutch cities such as Amsterdam, The Hague or Arnhem, there are already a lot of shops and services accepting Bitcoin. Heck, Arnhem is the Bitcoin capital of the world! In my surroundings (I have to admit, I study in a university, so the people here are already a bit more tech savvy) I see quite an interest in Bitcoin. In 2013 during the autumn bubble, I have explained many of them about Bitcoin and at least 10 other students from my study now also possess Bitcoin. Many of my friends as well. So population wise: definitely a yes!

Furthermore, a lot of Bitcoin companies are locating themselves in Amsterdam, such as for example Bitpay.

Even my parents have a 'Bitcoin wallet' now, since I talked them into using Gems Smiley

The Netherlands could be a Switzerland of Bitcoin, for Europe at least. Let Hong Kong or Singapore be it for the world Smiley

Very true. I'm also from the Netherlands. My study mates, 2 brothers and my parents also have a Bitcoin wallet(more then 1 bitcoin each). People in my neighborhood are open to try something.

Did they acquire the coins to hold it as a novelty (virtual) item ? or are they actually looking to use them as a currency ?
No country can be the 'Switzerland of Bitcoin' unless there is a thriving exchange of the currency itself.
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January 31, 2015, 07:49:58 AM
 #184

im living in portugal now i wish i could be a better place for indicator fo a crypto courrencies its just plug the net and plug the paypal and plug the bank acount and euros come out that would be good.

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February 01, 2015, 03:15:32 AM
 #185

I dont drink you can draw a papel with fiat, bitcoin is global and its everywhere.
But i guess china could be it if they start buying like crazy again.
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February 05, 2015, 05:05:19 PM
 #186

This topic has such a funny name that I have to ask whether Switzerland might be the Switzerland of bitcoin.
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February 06, 2015, 06:32:05 PM
 #187

Awesome thread.
BTW id say Panama, 0 internet laws.
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February 06, 2015, 07:24:47 PM
 #188

The recent news of Dominica and the initiative named  “Let the Bit Drop” was compelling enough to have their island's name put up on the poll.

Anyone knows of any bct forum threads related to any of these parties involved : Coinapult, Aspen Assurance, Bitcoin Beauties, and the College Cryptocurrency Network (CCN)
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February 07, 2015, 11:50:32 AM
 #189

This topic has such a funny name that I have to ask whether Switzerland might be the Switzerland of bitcoin.

I thought I would read China as the Swiss bank of Bitcoins.

Not any more they arent, countries that are predominantly communist like China and Bangladesh are strictly against Bitcoins and all that it stands for, but for some reason Russia are still very open towards it.
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February 08, 2015, 10:25:35 AM
 #190

well swiss will never be becuse they are de centralization of all banks its unbelivalbe thay would aceppt bitcoin that is too much registred as being crime form midle east but they do aceppt all soo i dont know lol

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February 08, 2015, 11:34:25 AM
 #191

Original Post :



I am going to re-post or rather copy paste an article from siliconindia here with my question that will follow it :

Original Article :
Location plays an important role in the progress of any business. Also, obstacles are an integral factor in the expansion of any business. Lesser are the obstacles, better growth can be expected in the business.


Nowadays, most of the nations are targeting on the revenues, coming from the business, inside their boundaries. While some countries already had friendly policies for the ‘already developed’ or ‘developing’ business within its boundaries, some other countries are now accepting newer policies to encourage the same.


According to the list of the ‘business-friendly’ countries in the world by ‘doing business’, India ranks 132, while Singapore tops the list.


1. Singapore


From the last few years, Singapore has been ranked as the best country for business. Singapore provides an encouraging environment to all the newcomers, irrespective of their gender, nationality, etc.


At present, Singapore is the fourth largest financial center in the world and is also an impactful nation. Major portion of Singapore’s GDP comes from its manufactured goods. Export and import also plays an important role in the economy of Singapore.


It has the fifth largest as well as the busiest ports in the world.


2. Hong Kong


Hong Kong is highly known for its low taxation and free trade policy, has retained its second position this year; it ranked the second position last year. Hong Kong’s per capita income is very high compared to other Asian countries.


In terms of business, Hong Kong provides the maximum economic and financial freedom in the Asian region. The quality of life in Hong Kong is also very high and has already received many appreciations from the UN and WHO.


3. New Zealand


New Zealand has a highly protectionist economy that offers a free-trade economy. Its free trade policies are one of the main reasons; it is still the third best country for business.


New Zealand has one of the modernized as well as developed economies in the world. It’s GDP and PPP is also very high.


Agriculture is one of the main reasons behind the economic growth of New Zealand. Over the past century, wool was the main agricultural products of New Zealand. However, the reduction in the price has made dairy farming as one of the main source in the recent times.


4. United States


The nineteenth century has been the best period for the economic growth of U.S.


U.S. stands in the fourth rank in this list; it was also the same in 2012. It has the largest economy in the world as well as a higher rate of per capita GDP.


It has a capitalist mixed economy, which depends mostly on its natural resources. The U.S. currency is one of the mostly used currencies across the globe.


5. Denmark


Doing business rank (2011): 5 Doing business rank (2012): 5


Denmark is the pioneer nation to introduce social and labor-market reforms. This took place in Denmark in the early twentieth century. Well, this is the main reason of Denmark’s highly developed economy.


Denmark has the most flexible labor market in the Europe. It has also been ranked as the easiest place to do business. Setting up a business in Denmark can be accomplished within a few hours and the cost is also comparatively low. The flexibility in the market allows the employers to hire employees whenever they want and also do the same, in case they has to fire the employees.


6. Norway


Norway has made a progress of one move. When last year, it was on the seventh position, this year, Norway has made it to the sixth rank in this list.


It is second wealthiest county in the world. From the last six years, it has been the leader in the Human Development Index rate. The Norwegian economy is considered as one of the most stable economies in the world.


The main resources of Norway are petroleum, hydropower, forests, minerals and fish. It also has one of the highest standards of living in the world.


7. United Kingdom


Last year, United Kingdom was ranked as the sixth best nation to carry out business. This year, it has slipped down to one slot to the seventh position in the same list.


United Kingdom is the world’s first industrialized nation of the world and is considered as one of the developed nations in the world at present. Its economy is the sixth largest in the world.


It is an impactful country and has a higher influence in the international trade and commerce. It offers much freedom of business to the insiders as well as to the outsiders.


8. South Korea


South Korea has climbed up by seven slots and is ranked as the eighth best country for doing business; last year, it was on the fifteenth place.


The economy of South Korea, which is highly dependent on the exports, is the fourth largest economy in the world. In order to promote international trade, South Korea joined hands for a free trade government in 2010.


South Korea is one of the global leaders in exporting robotics, electronic products, petrochemicals, automobiles, ships and petrochemicals.


9. Georgia


Since Georgia is very closely associated with the Black Sea, it has been the trading partners of many other nations from the ages. During the olden times, Georgia was one of the leaders in trading valuable and precious metals; gold, silver and coppers were the chief metals. Wine making has also been one of the traditional businesses in Georgia.


At the recent times, Georgia has reformed itself into a free market economy. It is one of the fastest growing nations in the world. It has been ranked as the ‘the number one economic reformer in the world’ by the World Bank.


10. Australia


In the year 2010, Australia was ranked as the third country in the list of 'Index of Economic Frredom'. Australia has the thirteenth largest economy in the world and is also the country with fifth largest per capita GDP.


Australia's trade and commerce started rising vigorously by the starting of the twenty-first century. even though the Australian economy tasted growth in the early 2012-2013, its non-mining economy affected its economy by a certain extent.


Agriculture has been one of the main sources of Australia’s economic growth.



NOW My Question :

Some of these countries are already Bitcoin friendly, after all most of the Miners and traders are from Japan and US. But which of these countries has the best possibility to turn into what 'Switzerland is to Fiat currency' .. in other words, which of these countries are still under exposed to the concept of Bitcoin and why do you think they can become a better market in the future.

Honk Kong, New-Zeland failed to protect Dotcom.

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February 08, 2015, 04:33:24 PM
 #192

All of these countries can become better Bitcoin market places. There is still a lot of work to do.
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February 08, 2015, 04:44:11 PM
 #193

All of these countries can become better Bitcoin market places. There is still a lot of work to do.

There could be more than a Switzerland of Bitcoin like there is more than one place that is business friendly.

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February 08, 2015, 06:36:50 PM
 #194

I think Belize would be able to become the "Switzerland of Bitcoin" in the future  Smiley
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February 08, 2015, 07:28:12 PM
 #195

I think Belize would be able to become the "Switzerland of Bitcoin" in the future  Smiley

I doubt it.

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February 08, 2015, 07:33:19 PM
 #196

How about Uruguay, since you need a country small enough that they feel profit from its position,
and politicians that wont get easily bribed by banks or other financial institutions.
Their president seams straight up person, and i doubt they would mind being the best at atleast something :]
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February 08, 2015, 08:01:59 PM
 #197

How about Uruguay, since you need a country small enough that they feel profit from its position,
and politicians that wont get easily bribed by banks or other financial institutions.
Their president seams straight up person, and i doubt they would mind being the best at atleast something :]

Bitcoin needs freedom, it needs the people to understand the value of really owning your wealth.

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June 07, 2015, 11:05:59 AM
 #198

How about Uruguay, since you need a country small enough that they feel profit from its position,
and politicians that wont get easily bribed by banks or other financial institutions.
Their president seams straight up person, and i doubt they would mind being the best at atleast something :]

Are you implying that people in Uruguay arent the best at anything ??
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June 07, 2015, 11:09:43 AM
 #199

 the Isle of Man should be on this list ..just saying


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June 08, 2015, 04:44:13 AM
 #200

the Isle of Man should be on this list ..just saying



Why do you think so ? The point of the post is to back up the country you think should be on the list with some valid reasoning.
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June 08, 2015, 06:31:40 AM
 #201

the Isle of Man should be on this list ..just saying



Why do you think so ? The point of the post is to back up the country you think should be on the list with some valid reasoning.


http://www.coindesk.com/isle-man-welcomes-digital-currency-exchanges-license-required/

http://www.coindesk.com/isle-of-man-introduces-regulation-for-bitcoin-businesses/



http://www.bbc.com/news/business-32394170


they are a small out of the way place..but they seem busy enough on trying to be the Switzerland of bitcoin Smiley

underdog thou they may be

just for the above links  think they should have made the list if Belize did imho


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June 10, 2015, 10:42:50 AM
 #202

well i guess the best are the usa and europe and japan cause the others are just to colsed to bitcoin vision but america south too its good.

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June 10, 2015, 09:40:37 PM
 #203

The most countries that need it are the ones are people with most financial restrictions or developing countries.

I`d choose india, and has a mass population that hasnt even touched enough yet.

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June 11, 2015, 12:01:57 AM
 #204

the land of bitcoin is china since big mining company there already but  the best country well ,potencial several of them the best well no one since all are making lays to try control bitcoin .... that is decentralized crypto coin ....
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June 11, 2015, 12:08:15 AM
 #205

the land of bitcoin is china since big mining company there already but  the best country well ,potencial several of them the best well no one since all are making lays to try control bitcoin .... that is decentralized crypto coin ....

I tend to agree china is the next wave.

Only because the population difference is so huge compared to u.s that it`ll probably make a huge mark for prices.

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June 12, 2015, 04:43:56 PM
 #206

the land of bitcoin is china since big mining company there already but  the best country well ,potencial several of them the best well no one since all are making lays to try control bitcoin .... that is decentralized crypto coin ....

I don't see China becoming bitcoin friendly. It would mean loosening capital control - something which is not going to happen soon.


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Amph
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June 12, 2015, 07:10:56 PM
Last edit: June 14, 2015, 02:55:27 PM by Amph
 #207

the land of bitcoin is china since big mining company there already but  the best country well ,potencial several of them the best well no one since all are making lays to try control bitcoin .... that is decentralized crypto coin ....

I don't see China becoming bitcoin friendly. It would mean loosening capital control - something which is not going to happen soon.

in fact they will not, they are too much attached to the money of bitcoin, not to bitcoin itself, they don't care too much about what it can offer in the future over their currency, or over fiat in general

i still can't understand why japan cannot embrace it yet, they are always in favor of new tech, they love new technology...

anyway my vote go to singapore
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June 12, 2015, 07:14:16 PM
 #208

The switzerland of bitcoin is anywhere a bitcoin wallet is. No one is controlling my wallet and only I own the wallet key.

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June 14, 2015, 01:13:49 AM
 #209

Looks like Switzerland is making claimms on being Switzerland of bitcoin more and more.
http://bitcoinassociation.ch/blog/no-vat-on-bitcoin-in-switzerland/

... and treatment as foreign currency status, i.e. no capital gains applicable.

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