That Great Big Beautiful Wall

[GreenBits]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social? How can a person that is not on a voting roll, vote?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible, because such interaction greatly increases the odds that they and/or their families will be deported. About the only public organization that doesn't ask any questions are the public schools, when new kids are presented by their parents.

This unwillingness to interact with government officials has disadvantages for the rest of us (beyond driving down wages, and not being able to "ship them out"). Crimes go unreported. Illnesses go untreated until the sufferer is finally forced to crowd into an emergency room. Drivers go onto the streets without proper instruction or knowing the rules of the road.

[Regarding Bill AB60:] California attempted to address the last symptom by allowing illegal residents to obtain driver's licenses with no questions regarding immigration status. While obtaining a license, the applicant is "automatically" registered to vote, unless they opt out. Potential voters have to demonstrate proof of age, for which most people show a birth certificate or a passport, which reflects citizenship.

Even if an invalid application makes it beyond a service window at the DMV, they electronically transfer the voter registration information to the Secretary of State's office, and the state rejects those for which they have no computerized record of citizenship. So, the state gets two whacks at preventing illegal voter registration. No registration means no name on the voter lists at the balloting sites come election day.

And the kids are citizens. They get whatever citizens get

[Spendulus]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

[GreenBits]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

And pray tell where would that be? A place in America where the majority speaks Spanish, including law enforcement?

[Spendulus]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

And pray tell where would that be? A place in America where the majority speaks Spanish, including law enforcement?

?

Man it seems there's a lot of places you have not seen.

[riorondon1234]

"TEAR THAT NATIONAL BARREL DOWN"
One day I was walking down to the river.
On a plane near the riverbank, I saw a barrel in upright position.
In approaching to that barrel, I heard in my left ear a voice.
When I came to that barrel I lifted myself on my feet, and leaned over the rim.
Then I heard clearly that someone is calling loudly:
„Help, my god, help me somebody!“. I said: „How can I help you, I am just a boy, fourth grader, I am only Secular God Zikalkis, not Almighty God,
 what are you doing there, I don't see you!?“.
He replied: „You can't see me, I am black, I am Obama, I am chained here at the bottom of the barrel!“
I said: „I can't reach you, maybe I push this barrel in horizontal position, but it is too heavy for me!“
He said: „Go and find first people and tell them to help you to tear this barrel down!“. OK, I said, and went upstream to look for people.
Soon, I saw two men fishing on the other bank of the river.
I shouted: „Hi!“  .... http://zikalkis.blogspot.com and http://zikalkiszik.blogspot.hr/
They said: „Shut up boy, you may scare big fish!“
I sat down, calmly, thinking to myself:“ Zik, you are Secular God, you can't shut up in such matters!“.
Then I shouted: „Hi, You, Obama is in the barrel chained and I am too weak to tear that barrel down, come and help me!“
They smiled and said: „Can't he unchain himself!?“.
I answered: „No he can't. More he moves chains more squeeze!“.
After some consultations, they said, reluctantly: „Okay, okay, boy, we are coming!“.
They booted themselves and crossed the river and followed me to the barrel.
They leaned over and said: „ We don't see anybody!“
I said:  „How can you see a black man in that darkness!“ and I said firmly: „Tear this barrel down!“.
When they heard my strong command and weak voice of Obama they pushed barrel down to horizontal position.
I went inside and unchained himself and we went out:
He said: „I see now, there is god, but I couldn't imagine that it is you!“.
„I know, I know!“ said I, „ Will you now buy me a Berliner Doughnuts!?!“.
„You merit one barrel of Zinfandel!“ said he .... hahahaha .... we laughed!
But, after 2 mandates, not a bottle of Zinfandel arrived to my realm. Reminds me of the situation when usa peoples
collected money for the pedestal for the Statue of Liberty, or for to pay financial dues to UN. Rich to no poor it gives away.
I added you as hundred .... as the song: "you are one in a million" ... or, as "i am the one with a zillion" .....

[GreenBits]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

And pray tell where would that be? A place in America where the majority speaks Spanish, including law enforcement?

?

Man it seems there's a lot of places you have not seen.

Or rather, this magical  majority Spanish speaking place in the USA, doesn't exist. And yeah, I'm a homebody. Haven't travelled since I was a kid, in earnest at least.

[Sithara007]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

[Spendulus]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

And pray tell where would that be? A place in America where the majority speaks Spanish, including law enforcement?

?

Man it seems there's a lot of places you have not seen.

Or rather, this magical  majority Spanish speaking place in the USA, doesn't exist. And yeah, I'm a homebody. Haven't travelled since I was a kid, in earnest at least.

Get out, go where the tacos and cold beer is, and have fun. Look for streets with lots of tire and hubcap shops. You can point at menu items and be understood. The key words are Cerveza and Tacos. Those will get you by.

Don't worry you will be accepted and sort of respected as one of the old white honkies. Just don't start prattling off that liberal horseshit or someone might decide you needed a lesson. They might be right, come to think of it.

[GreenBits]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

And pray tell where would that be? A place in America where the majority speaks Spanish, including law enforcement?

?

Man it seems there's a lot of places you have not seen.

Or rather, this magical  majority Spanish speaking place in the USA, doesn't exist. And yeah, I'm a homebody. Haven't travelled since I was a kid, in earnest at least.

Get out, go where the tacos and cold beer is, and have fun. Look for streets with lots of tire and hubcap shops. You can point at menu items and be understood. The key words are Cerveza and Tacos. Those will get you by.

Don't worry you will be accepted and sort of respected as one of the old white honkies. Just don't start prattling off that liberal horseshit or someone might decide you needed a lesson. They might be right, come to think of it.

I'm colored folk, for some reason I think me and the 'hombres' would be fine, I love vibrant culture, good food, and good people that can show me something different. And tacos are fucking delicious. The carnitas ones (slow cooker pork) are the best.

Although I'm a spirits guy, beer takes too long for me. Some tequila, racist bartender!

But seriously, you are describing SpanishTown USA. These are small communities in which the majority of residents are indeed Spanish speaking, but this doesn't include the law enforcement. Given that the majority of citizens in the US are white, the majority of police are as well, proportional. Ergo, no matter if the whole city speaks Spanish; the authorities that would interact with these 'bad hombres' and 'welfare queens' would not be the same ethnicity, and therefore have no tribal affiliation.



This is similar to ChinaTown USA, pretty much x town USA where x = an immigrant group that lives over here in a community. Shit, even whites and blacks do this, people always tend to cluster around others that share their culture. Not to their exclusion, but certainly for familiarity.

We have taken a diversion, but let's return to the priori dispute. I cited something that said that illegal immigrants avoid interaction with Leo's in order to avoid arrest, you disputed this with the assertion that this occurs in majority Spanish speaking communities. I concede that there are large concentrations of immigrants in these areas, but I advance that this still does not enable them the ability to vote, because of the nature of the process, and the language preferences of the community would not influence policing outcomes, as the police are typically of a different race than tthehe suspect, ESP in this situation.
I simply cannot envision a scenario where people would risk arrest to cast a vote, that barely even matters given the nature of the electoral college.

[BADecker]

How do you get welfare benefits, or any social welfare, without a valid and unique SSN?

Oh.. common... we are talking about a country where there is no ID proof requirement for voting. Once an illegal manages to enroll in the voters list, he can cast his ballot in any election.

I'll concede that, in one of the States that doesn't ID. But being on a voter roll doesn't make you a citizen, it doesn't confer a valid ID, and it doesn't make you eligible for SNAP benefits. Even if they did manage to vote. SNAP is a federal thing provisioned by the state. The requirements are the same in all states.

BTW, don't you think it's odd that for all the millions of illegal votes, none had abnormal vote counts? How do you add extra people to a system, that only counts votes attached to a social?

https://www.quora.com/How-easy-is-it-for-an-illegal-immigrant-to-vote-in-California

The main point is that illegal immigrants generally avoid any interaction with local, state, or the Federal government if at all possible....

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

And pray tell where would that be? A place in America where the majority speaks Spanish, including law enforcement?

?

Man it seems there's a lot of places you have not seen.

Or rather, this magical  majority Spanish speaking place in the USA, doesn't exist. And yeah, I'm a homebody. Haven't travelled since I was a kid, in earnest at least.

Get out, go where the tacos and cold beer is, and have fun. Look for streets with lots of tire and hubcap shops. You can point at menu items and be understood. The key words are Cerveza and Tacos. Those will get you by.

Don't worry you will be accepted and sort of respected as one of the old white honkies. Just don't start prattling off that liberal horseshit or someone might decide you needed a lesson. They might be right, come to think of it.

I'm colored folk, for some reason I think me and the 'hombres' would be fine, I love vibrant culture, good food, and good people that can show me something different. And tacos are fucking delicious. The carnitas ones (slow cooker pork) are the best.

Although I'm a spirits guy, beer takes too long for me. Some tequila, racist bartender!

But seriously, you are describing SpanishTown USA. These are small communities in which the majority of residents are indeed Spanish speaking, but this doesn't include the law enforcement. Given that the majority of citizens in the US are white, the majority of police are as well, proportional. Ergo, no matter if the whole city speaks Spanish; the authorities that would interact with these 'bad hombres' and 'welfare queens' would not be the same ethnicity, and therefore have no tribal affiliation.



This is similar to ChinaTown USA, pretty much x town USA where x = an immigrant group that lives over here in a community. Shit, even whites and blacks do this, people always tend to cluster around others that share their culture. Not to their exclusion, but certainly for familiarity.

We have taken a diversion, but let's return to the priori dispute. I cited something that said that illegal immigrants avoid interaction with Leo's in order to avoid arrest, you disputed this with the assertion that this occurs in majority Spanish speaking communities. I concede that there are large concentrations of immigrants in these areas, but I advance that this still does not enable them the ability to vote, because of the nature of the process, and the language preferences of the community would not influence policing outcomes, as the police are typically of a different race than tthehe suspect, ESP in this situation.
I simply cannot envision a scenario where people would risk arrest to cast a vote, that barely even matters given the nature of the electoral college.

That's what elections are all about... in small towns especially. Get your people together and elect a mayor and town council who are going to do it your way if you don't like white cops. After all, some very big cities have many black and hispanic cops... even chiefs of police.

[GreenBits]

*killed the quote train, it was getting long*

But community race/police race affiliation doesn't seem to correlate to positive policing outcomes for minorities. Although they may have minority department leaders, this does not necessarily represent a more permissive environment for said represented minority. Let me cite:

http://www.newsweek.com/racial-makeup-police-departments-331130


The Washington Post has written on several studies detailing the link between police diversity and community relations. Lydia DePillis noted that a 2004 analysis of data from St. Petersburg, Florida and Indianapolis, Indiana concluded “black officers are more likely to conduct coercive actions” than their white colleagues when resolving conflicts. DePillis also references a 2006 analysis of Cincinnati Police Department records; in her words, the study found “white officers were more likely to arrest suspects than black officers overall—but it also found that black officers were significantly more likely to make an arrest when the suspect was black.”

Moreover, she writes that a 2011 Washington Post poll found that black residents rated the police department at a “relatively low 60 percent” even though “the force is highly integrated.” She also notes: “The New York Police Department’s demographics are close to those of the rest of the city, but a Quinnipiac poll from 2014 found that only 54 percent of black residents approved of its performance. The Detroit police department is so dominated by African Americans that it’s been sued for discrimination against whites, and yet only 18 percent of black Wayne County residents approved of its work in 2009.”

This is just one place, but I'm suggesting that having a minority leader doesn't indicate sympathy for the policed community. The policing institution is much older than the recent uptick of diversity than it has experienced.  I'm not suggesting there is not truth to what you are saying; I'm suggesting that the prevalence of this would be miniscule at best. If this was where the illegal voting happened, they would not be able to have much of an influence, given the size of the communities. An abnormal number of votes in places like this would be really obvious as well. And there would still be Republican oversight in these places even if in minority. They would not stand for that bullshit, and rightfully so.

[iram3130]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

[Spendulus]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

Spanish explored and settled the southwestern US a long, long time ago. Think in terms of starting in the 1600s.

[GreenBits]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

Again, not arguing there is a significant Spanish speaking population in places in the US. If there wasnt, we wouldn't be having this conversation. I'm simply saying that the illegal.immigrants aren't walking up to the voting boths, because of the risk of detection and subsequent expulsion. I'm here hiding, and I'm trying to sneak into a government office to falsely ID myself, to vote?  That seems very unlikely to me. The article was stating that; Spend was saying that this isn't true in majority Spanish communities. I then asked for a community to be identified that would have a majority Spanish population, with the law enforcement being Spanish as well, as per BADs addition to the argument. Because I'm saying it's interaction with the government that gets you sent home; people trying to avoid going home have probably learned to largely avoid the government.

But yes, to concede your point, it is thick with Mexican immigrants in some places, just Latin Americans in general. Parts of Florida are like that too, and even when I was a kid, when I went to Texas to go to AstroWorld (6 Flags? It's been so long) I saw a bunch of really pretty Latin girls; it was my first time seeing so many Latin people in one place. I'm from Louisiana, was used to the local phenotypes if diversity means pretty ladies, then dammit, put this fucker in a blender, my man.

[Spendulus]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

Again, not arguing there is a significant Spanish speaking population in places in the US. If there wasnt, we wouldn't be having this conversation. I'm simply saying that the illegal.immigrants aren't walking up to the voting boths, because of the risk of detection and subsequent expulsion. I'm here hiding, and I'm trying to sneak into a government office to falsely ID myself, to vote?  That seems very unlikely to me. The article was stating that; Spend was saying that this isn't true in majority Spanish communities. I then asked for a community to be identified that would have a majority Spanish population, with the law enforcement being Spanish as well, as per BADs addition to the argument. Because I'm saying it's interaction with the government that gets you sent home; people trying to avoid going home have probably learned to largely avoid the government.

But yes, to concede your point, it is thick with Mexican immigrants in some places, just Latin Americans in general. Parts of Florida are like that too, and even when I was a kid, when I went to Texas to go to AstroWorld (6 Flags? It's been so long) I saw a bunch of really pretty Latin girls; it was my first time seeing so many Latin people in one place. I'm from Louisiana, was used to the local phenotypes if diversity means pretty ladies, then dammit, put this fucker in a blender, my man.

Two words...

"Sanctuary Cities."

Side note - Realistically, El Paso and Juarez form one large interconnected community, the existence of a national border down the middle is largely irrelevant. The people are the same.

That's just one town, one example.

[GreenBits]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

Again, not arguing there is a significant Spanish speaking population in places in the US. If there wasnt, we wouldn't be having this conversation. I'm simply saying that the illegal.immigrants aren't walking up to the voting boths, because of the risk of detection and subsequent expulsion. I'm here hiding, and I'm trying to sneak into a government office to falsely ID myself, to vote?  That seems very unlikely to me. The article was stating that; Spend was saying that this isn't true in majority Spanish communities. I then asked for a community to be identified that would have a majority Spanish population, with the law enforcement being Spanish as well, as per BADs addition to the argument. Because I'm saying it's interaction with the government that gets you sent home; people trying to avoid going home have probably learned to largely avoid the government.

But yes, to concede your point, it is thick with Mexican immigrants in some places, just Latin Americans in general. Parts of Florida are like that too, and even when I was a kid, when I went to Texas to go to AstroWorld (6 Flags? It's been so long) I saw a bunch of really pretty Latin girls; it was my first time seeing so many Latin people in one place. I'm from Louisiana, was used to the local phenotypes if diversity means pretty ladies, then dammit, put this fucker in a blender, my man.

Two words...

"Sanctuary Cities."

Side note - Realistically, El Paso and Juarez form one large interconnected community, the existence of a national border down the middle is largely irrelevant. The people are the same.

That's just one town, one example.

Alright, I will concede that point. I did some research on the actual policies of said sanctuary cities. I can concur that the diminished level of cooperation with federal authorities would technically constitute police assistance. But, take this with the grain of salt that this is law enforcement officers disagreeing with other, different law enforcement officers. The sanctuary policies aren't intended to harbor violent criminals, but I can see that the refusal to cooperate fully does cause 'gaps' so to speak, that allow violent immigrants to persist for longer than they should. However, I don't think the police allow crime to proliferate; I think they just aren't cooperative with federal law enforcement. Those monolithic Spanish communities you were talking about earlier? Cops rely on them to self report. The sanctuary city idea incentivized reporting of the actual bad hombres by the populace, to fill the gap in policing that I was trying to point out earlier. If they don't feel the need to cooperate with authorities, policing gets so much harder.

And none of that has to do with the fact that non citizen voting is really, really hard. Sanctuary city concept encompasses criminal deportation rather than voting issues, it seems. The protections that prevent double voting, prevent illegal voting. Otherwise, fuck illegals, people would just do this domestically if it were so easy a non citizen could do it. People would pay people to double vote, to hell with lobbying. You could literally buy the vote per citizen, or make the people up/steal identities yourself to influence the vote.

The reason you can't vote twice easily, is even more reason why an illegal can't. Do you see what I am trying to say?

If you can do this so easily in sanctuary cities, why havent underground conservative forces used this apparently very replicable technique to remove illegal influence, and restore balance?

[Sithara007]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

Again, not arguing there is a significant Spanish speaking population in places in the US. If there wasnt, we wouldn't be having this conversation. I'm simply saying that the illegal.immigrants aren't walking up to the voting boths, because of the risk of detection and subsequent expulsion. I'm here hiding, and I'm trying to sneak into a government office to falsely ID myself, to vote?  That seems very unlikely to me. The article was stating that; Spend was saying that this isn't true in majority Spanish communities. I then asked for a community to be identified that would have a majority Spanish population, with the law enforcement being Spanish as well, as per BADs addition to the argument. Because I'm saying it's interaction with the government that gets you sent home; people trying to avoid going home have probably learned to largely avoid the government.

But yes, to concede your point, it is thick with Mexican immigrants in some places, just Latin Americans in general. Parts of Florida are like that too, and even when I was a kid, when I went to Texas to go to AstroWorld (6 Flags? It's been so long) I saw a bunch of really pretty Latin girls; it was my first time seeing so many Latin people in one place. I'm from Louisiana, was used to the local phenotypes if diversity means pretty ladies, then dammit, put this fucker in a blender, my man.

This is a typical argument propagated by various liberal media outlets. But research shows that a lot of the illegal immigrants do vote, especially in the deep blue states. And deportation is not a big deal. It is a joke. Check this:

http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/05/11/lennox-lake-california-boy-hurt-dui-crash-illegal-immigrant-who-was-deported-15-times

[GreenBits]

No they don't. At least where the majority in the local culture talks Spanish, and where the immigrant is Mexican.

There are plenty of such places in the United States. For example, 37% of the population in the Greater Los Angeles area use Spanish as a home language. This figure climbs to 40% in Miami, 72% in El Paso, and 43% in San Antonio.

This is actually true. One of my friend who doesn't know Spanish stayed in El Paso for a week and he was like hunting for English stores. Learnt lots of Spanish words, we were wondering whether he went to Paso or Spain..

Again, not arguing there is a significant Spanish speaking population in places in the US. If there wasnt, we wouldn't be having this conversation. I'm simply saying that the illegal.immigrants aren't walking up to the voting boths, because of the risk of detection and subsequent expulsion. I'm here hiding, and I'm trying to sneak into a government office to falsely ID myself, to vote?  That seems very unlikely to me. The article was stating that; Spend was saying that this isn't true in majority Spanish communities. I then asked for a community to be identified that would have a majority Spanish population, with the law enforcement being Spanish as well, as per BADs addition to the argument. Because I'm saying it's interaction with the government that gets you sent home; people trying to avoid going home have probably learned to largely avoid the government.

But yes, to concede your point, it is thick with Mexican immigrants in some places, just Latin Americans in general. Parts of Florida are like that too, and even when I was a kid, when I went to Texas to go to AstroWorld (6 Flags? It's been so long) I saw a bunch of really pretty Latin girls; it was my first time seeing so many Latin people in one place. I'm from Louisiana, was used to the local phenotypes if diversity means pretty ladies, then dammit, put this fucker in a blender, my man.

This is a typical argument propagated by various liberal media outlets. But research shows that a lot of the illegal immigrants do vote, especially in the deep blue states. And deportation is not a big deal. It is a joke. Check this:

http://insider.foxnews.com/2017/05/11/lennox-lake-california-boy-hurt-dui-crash-illegal-immigrant-who-was-deported-15-times

God protect the little girl. That's pretty tragic. But will a wall prevent someone that is this incentivized to come back? 15 times.  And I don't think those 'bollard walls' would do to much to stop a chap like this.

We would probably do well to simply jail them here. The assumption of non prosecution would largely dissappear, and the fear of a lengthy US prison sentence would dry this shit up but quickly. Would be expensive, but hey, we already jail minorities at a disproportionate rate; let's just switch up the demographic. I'd rather see violent offenders and repeat offenders in jail, than low level drug offenders. We are reembracing private prisons again despite the progress we had made moving away from this model; let's lock the real bad hombres up. Fuck deportation.

But dammit, show me this voting evidence! We keep getting tangential. I'll even take a biased article, I just need the talking points so I can investigate myself.

In the deepest blue States, does voting oversight not exist? Even at a federal level? How are illegal immigrants getting on voting rolls, when they aren't citizens? Save absentee ballot abuses, this is the only way to vote. How come, for all this sanctuary/deportation/crime rhetoric, no one can still explain to me how people with no identities vote in appreciable numbers, at the risk of incarceration?

If what you are saying is true, ICE should just camp elections. They could get millions of immigrants, no?

Hell yeah the argument is common. Common sense. It has a familiar taste because it's rooted in facts and reality, to the best of my ability. My argument has nostalgia because it's valid, you have indeed heard it before, from other sources that tried to present you with a factual truth. Like non partisan research tanks. And mainstream media outlets. But this reliance on biased news sources, to exclusion, is going to be y'alls undoing.

Reject my argument piecemeal. Dissect it. Destroy it. I want the clarification, not just the refutation:

Explain the mechanism by which illegals vote

Identify and describe the Democrat introduced legislature that enables this alleged behavior (here's a hint, try non citizen ID laws, it's a common rhetorical point on this from your side)

Describe a specific geographic region with characteristics that could facilitate illegal voting

Any of these weakens my argument, but does not invalidate it. Show me my error.

[Sithara007]

God protect the little girl. That's pretty tragic. But will a wall prevent someone that is this incentivized to come back? 15 times.  And I don't think those 'bollard walls' would do to much to stop a chap like this.

We would probably do well to simply jail them here. The assumption of non prosecution would largely dissappear, and the fear of a lengthy US prison sentence would dry this shit up but quickly. Would be expensive, but hey, we already jail minorities at a disproportionate rate; let's just switch up the demographic. I'd rather see violent offenders and repeat offenders in jail, than low level drug offenders. We are reembracing private prisons again despite the progress we had made moving away from this model; let's lock the real bad hombres up. Fuck deportation.

A better option would be to enter in to a deal with some third world nation for housing the criminal immigrants, just like what the Australians did. If the illegal commits a crime in the US, then he will serve his jail time in Uganda or Nigeria.

[Kronos21]

God protect the little girl. That's pretty tragic. But will a wall prevent someone that is this incentivized to come back? 15 times.  And I don't think those 'bollard walls' would do to much to stop a chap like this.

We would probably do well to simply jail them here. The assumption of non prosecution would largely dissappear, and the fear of a lengthy US prison sentence would dry this shit up but quickly. Would be expensive, but hey, we already jail minorities at a disproportionate rate; let's just switch up the demographic. I'd rather see violent offenders and repeat offenders in jail, than low level drug offenders. We are reembracing private prisons again despite the progress we had made moving away from this model; let's lock the real bad hombres up. Fuck deportation.

A better option would be to enter in to a deal with some third world nation for housing the criminal immigrants, just like what the Australians did. If the illegal commits a crime in the US, then he will serve his jail time in Uganda or Nigeria.

Have you thought why third world countries need in their country have found refuge thousands of criminals? No amount of money will justify itself. Besides, all criminals tend to organize gangs, and this is a threat to the state.