What is Usury? "De Florijn" project and interest-free credit.

[odolvlobo]

Interest is essentially the price of trust and liquidity (which is very similar !).

Of course trust is a factor (people with lower credit rating pay higher interest), but the primary factor is opportunity cost.

If I have money, I can choose to either invest it or loan it. If I loan it at no interest, then I have lost any money I could have made by investing it. If you want me to loan you money that I could otherwise invest, it is going to cost you.

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[Przemax]

Every loaning on % has one mathematical problem. You are lending 100% of something and you expect the 105% of the same. Where are you going to take this 5% from? Many would say that they will take that money from the market, or from the estimated market growth. That kind of behaviour is called an exteriorization of the costs. The cost of transaction between the two individuals are being financed by the society and its need of growth to make the loan even physicly possible without causing the deflation.

You can not have a healthy economy where everybody else but me must pay the costs. Sooner or later such a kicking away the ball must end bad as there will be noone else to exploit. Thats the moment when the empires, by the way always builded on the usury, fail.

I believe much of the national "debt" is simply just money supply and it was never intended to be paid off. In fact, as you said, it can't be. Why do they always talk about the national debt as if it is something that we owe? If the national debt was completely paid off (which is physically impossible) it would wipe out all of the currency supply.

I do not know if thats what its called. I think you complicate the matters too much. Some of the numbers must be ficticious for the mathematics to be right. If those are those ficticious numbers, ok let them be. To be honest I do not know what numbers are real and what are not.

In the Bible you have described a monetary system for the Israelites that was to be different than the current Babylonian system. It involved clearing up the debt as a clean slate every 7 years. That was so because people back then new that Babylonian system is not sustainable as it was based on ficticious math (babylonian mysteries) that was done by usury.

I think some of the debt abolishment from time to time would be great, for the start. Its ficticious either way, so what difference does it make?

[Xester]

His explanation of usury is very broad and is somehow a pain in the head. For common people it would be a waste of time reading since it takes a while decrypting the message that he wants to relay. For me usury is simple it is using other people to achieve something without giving a value to the efforts of the people who helped you achieved your goal. Thus usury is done out of greediness.

[merchantofzeny]

Interest-free credit is a total nonsense.Nobody would give a loan without any interest.
This guy doesn`t know anything about economics and finance.
Is this Usury thing some other altcoin?

Well to be fair, I think some people would lend money interest free. For example, I bought a car from my parents and instead of paying them they allowed me to make monthly payments with zero interest. Of course, they trust me and that's sort of the core of the issue I think, as @dinofelis said.

They're family sir. Banks deal with strangers. This is why I think there should be more focus on platforms similar to Kickstarter and Indiegogo. By spreading out the source of funding, the borrower can get a larger amount of money and lenders don't take much risk because they only give a small amount of money. It's this moments that I wish I can as 50 cents from each working person on the planet.  

To bad we can't have microtransactions now. I while ago I was thinking of sending a Youtuber a dollar but when I checked the total cost in the exchange, the fee was around 87 cents. Ridiculous. I was late to bitcoins, I've heard it was a good platform for donations in the past.

Of course, I was just pointing out that, "nobody would give a loan without interest" is false. It has to do with trust.

I think all of these new platforms will be good. The more choices the better.

Yes, there should be options for people that would normally not be able to obtain loans from banks. I believe someone has already started some sort of crowdfunding for farmers. It's not exactly interest free but I believe you can buy "shares" for as low as 40 cents. This is given to the farmers for seed and I believe machinery rental. Funders then get a small interest when the rice is harvested and sold.

EDIT: Oh I looked around and finally found an article about them. http://inc-asean.com/editor-picks/start-helping-filipino-farmers-one-crowdfunded-farm-time/

I believe I first heard about it a few years ago so I didn't remember the exact details.

[Mometaskers]

Interest is essentially the price of trust and liquidity (which is very similar !).

Of course trust is a factor (people with lower credit rating pay higher interest), but the primary factor is opportunity cost.

If I have money, I can choose to either invest it or loan it. If I loan it at no interest, then I have lost any money I could have made by investing it. If you want me to loan you money that I could otherwise invest, it is going to cost you.

True, which is why I don't understand why some people have a hard time accepting interests. Every action while opening options, also limit you by closing of other paths not chosen. In addition to losing the option to use the money you have lent, prices rise, if you just loan out money without interest, by the time it is returned, it would have already lost some value. In short, you can even say you lost money!

I'm not sure with commercial banks but maybe part of the interest is also used to reduce the damages from defaults. I mean, I heard that's the real reason loansharks charge a high interest.

The good thing these days is that people who are not eligible for loans have a bit more option to obtaining funding, depending on the nature of their enterprise.

[Lampaster]

Interest-free loans is fake. When the market falls in order to heat it use this mechanism. But at this moment in the country there is deflation and the Bank loses nothing. As soon as the economy grows interest-free loan is impossible.

[minor-transgression]

To see the role of interest correctly, you should look at the macro picture.
When talking about a Nation's balance of payments, it's important to see  
that not everyone can have an export surplus. It's a zero-sum game.

Interest paid is similar to this. Dollars demand dollars paid in interest.
BTC will demand BTC paid in interest. Hence it is rational to think of
Dollars, or Yen, in much the same way as we think of exports of imports
from the USA or Japan. You can't pay dollar interest in Yen.

So, suppose Alice mines Bitcoin, and Bob mines an altcoin called Scamcoin.
Bob borrows 100BTC from Alice for a year at 10% interest. Bob can never
pay his debt to Alice in full without some form of debt cancellation.

So, set aside the mechanics of the deal, and ask who has control here?
Who has the leverage and how did that happen?

And if Alice once accepts payment in Scamcoin, is her situation any different
to someone accepting Central Bank fiat money?