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Author Topic: Traumatic brain injury has left me with multiple seed phrases please help!  (Read 1737 times)
virasog
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June 06, 2017, 01:18:48 PM
 #21

There are not many software wallets that this applies to, but I have run into at least too that either through some forked code or a software update that was intense, the passphrase were no longer working with the new versions.  It may have also been that the wallet had written installation data to the appdata folder that, when not present, preventing the acceptance of a passphrase that is unknown to the software. 

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June 08, 2017, 11:24:49 PM
 #22

There are not many software wallets that this applies to, but I have run into at least too that either through some forked code or a software update that was intense, the passphrase were no longer working with the new versions.  It may have also been that the wallet had written installation data to the appdata folder that, when not present, preventing the acceptance of a passphrase that is unknown to the software. 

I do not know what methods that you are using to input your account info, but always use importing/sweeping as a last resort before giving up on a passphrase for a given wallet.
 
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December 23, 2017, 01:27:13 AM
 #23

Hello all,

Sorry it’s been a while.  I’ve had so many medical problems especially memory wise so I just put most of this up until I improved some.


So where I’m at now is I have got three of the 8 mnemonic phrases to work.  Was able to see my balance and tx history.


On the rest though no balance and no tx history pops up.  I know that I never made any mnemonic backups unless that wallet had been or was being used.  I would put them all in the same envelope.

If I go to MultiBit enter the phrase until the next button activates ( they’re hard to read ) then I go through the rest of the process and wait for it to sync.

If no tx history is there and I know I’ve used that wallet before then does that mean I have not entered the correct words?  Does it work like that?  Where I could enter words that will make the next button activate but they’re not actually the corrrect words and therefore would show no tx history?

ie I have one that has the what I used that wallet for and the ending bal written on it so I know ive used it but it shows no tx history at all.

Is this possible?  Does it work this way?

Much thanks in advance.
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December 23, 2017, 12:06:42 PM
 #24

No... the seed phrases include a "checksum" so that you can't just enter any old random phrase and it will generate a wallet. Changing just one word is likely to result in an invalid phrase (not always, but in my rather non scientific testing, maybe only 15 words out of the 2048 in the wordlist will generate a valid phrase if one word is changed)...

If you have the correct words, and nothing is showing up... then could it be possible that this seed phrase was for a different coin/wallet? (Not all wallets use the same derivation path)

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November 24, 2018, 01:26:56 PM
 #25



Hello again all ,


Its been a while but all of this was actually good for me according to my Dr even though Im pretty sure he had no idea what I was talking about.

Where I am now.

Same situation with the mnemonics.  Some I can put the words in Multibit HD , MyCelium , Bread , and ive tried Electrum.

I can figure out my chicken scratch handwriting and get the wallet to accept the words as a valid mnemonic and about three or four have worked but mostly once it scans the BC it shows no tx no history nothing.

I dont know what or if there were passwords on the mnemonics.

So question # 1 - If I enter a mnemonic and it verifies by saying it is a correct mnemonic I click next and dont enter a password or if the wallet requires it I enter a new one.  If there is no tx history can I assume the wallet was not restored?  As in IF I did put a password on the  mnemonic when I made it , then dont use that password and / or use a new one will that make the wallet not show any tx?




Question 2 - I have a 85 character string or characters.  I have no idea what I did but it looks to me as the first part is an address and the second a key.  The first character is a 1 ( unless its a lower case L , Im open to any possibility now).  I know I cant post the whole thing but Im stuck here so this is what I have without compromising it.

85 characters - this is how it looks

1NeGXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX x VKudme       ( I put a space on the lower case x as its written it looks like it could be part of the sting or a seperator )
( s or 5 ) KRovXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
2q880XXXXXXX

If there is a better way to securly put this that would be easier on you guys let me know.  Just didnt want to put too much info.



Thanks
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November 24, 2018, 02:02:56 PM
 #26

It appear that is a legacy address. paste the address in this explorer and see if the coins are there https://www.blockchain.com
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November 24, 2018, 02:14:28 PM
Last edit: November 25, 2018, 11:02:09 AM by AdolfinWolf
 #27

I dont know what or if there were passwords on the mnemonics.

So question # 1 - If I enter a mnemonic and it verifies by saying it is a correct mnemonic I click next and dont enter a password or if the wallet requires it I enter a new one.  If there is no tx history can I assume the wallet was not restored?  As in IF I did put a password on the  mnemonic when I made it , then dont use that password and / or use a new one will that make the wallet not show any tx?
Someone should correct me if i'm wrong, but i am fairly certain that it is NOT possible to put a password on a mnemonic seed. That'd be a first for me.

EDIT: See the answers below. It may very well be that you encrypted your mnemonic. Apologies.

Quote
Question 2 - I have a 85 character string or characters.  I have no idea what I did but it looks to me as the first part is an address and the second a key.  The first character is a 1 ( unless its a lower case L , Im open to any possibility now).  I know I cant post the whole thing but Im stuck here so this is what I have without compromising it.

85 characters - this is how it looks

1NeGXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX x VKudme       ( I put a space on the lower case x as its written it looks like it could be part of the sting or a seperator )
( s or 5 ) KRovXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
2q880XXXXXXX

If there is a better way to securly put this that would be easier on you guys let me know.  Just didnt want to put too much info.

Code:
1NeGXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXxVKudme

This could be a legacy adress, as it is 34 chars, starting with a 1.
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/List_of_address_prefixes


Code:
(5)KRovXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX2q880XXXXXXX

Could be an (un)compressed private key? (It's missing 1 character though?) Although, you mentioned you had 85 characters. 85-34= 51, which means that this is probably indeed an uncompressed privkey. I don't get where the K is coming from though, if that's the case.

(EDIT: I now just saw the "(S or 5)" part.. This is an uncompressed private key, for sure.) The K confused me for a bit longer than i am willing to admit. Roll Eyes

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Private_key
Quote
For private keys associated with uncompressed public keys, they are 51 characters and always start with the number 5 on mainnet (9 on testnet). Private keys associated with compressed public keys are 52 characters and start with a capital L or K on mainnet (c on testnet). This is the same private key in (mainnet) wallet import format:


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November 24, 2018, 03:53:21 PM
Merited by vapourminer (1)
 #28

Someone should correct me if i'm wrong, but i am fairly certain that it is NOT possible to put a password on a mnemonic seed. That'd be a first for me.

It possible to add 13th or 25th word which acts as a password without which you won't get access to your desired wallet (different word will cause generation of completely different addresses). However, it is not the same as wallet encryption available in Electrum (I am not sure about other clients because I haven't used any of them much).

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November 24, 2018, 04:56:16 PM
 #29

So question # 1 - If I enter a mnemonic and it verifies by saying it is a correct mnemonic I click next and dont enter a password or if the wallet requires it I enter a new one.  If there is no tx history can I assume the wallet was not restored?  As in IF I did put a password on the  mnemonic when I made it , then dont use that password and / or use a new one will that make the wallet not show any tx?

If your wallet shows you that the mnemonic is valid, but doesn't show any transaction history, chances are relatively high that you had a 'password' (or better: a so-called 25th word) added to your seed.

This 25th word acts similar to a salt, giving your seed some additional 'security mechanism'.

So, if you added such an additional word to your seed, and are now restoring it without this word, you are effectively generating a different set of private-/public- keys.
This word is mandatory to generate the same private-/public- keys to access your funds.

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November 24, 2018, 11:39:57 PM
Merited by LoyceV (2), AdolfinWolf (1)
 #30

Someone should correct me if i'm wrong, but i am fairly certain that it is NOT possible to put a password on a mnemonic seed. That'd be a first for me.
It would appear you aren't entirely familiar with BIP39 and how seed mnemonics work then... For reference:

From mnemonic to seed
A user may decide to protect their mnemonic with a passphrase. If a passphrase is not present, an empty string "" is used instead.

To create a binary seed from the mnemonic, we use the PBKDF2 function with a mnemonic sentence (in UTF-8 NFKD) used as the password and the string "mnemonic" + passphrase (again in UTF-8 NFKD) used as the salt. The iteration count is set to 2048 and HMAC-SHA512 is used as the pseudo-random function. The length of the derived key is 512 bits (= 64 bytes).


The ability to add passphrases to BIP39 seed mnemonics is the basis for the "Plausible Deniability":
Quote
The described method also provides plausible deniability, because every passphrase generates a valid seed (and thus a deterministic wallet) but only the correct one will make the desired wallet available.
Which, as pointed out by bob123 and BitCryptex, is a possible reason why the OP has a "valid" seed with no history... without the correct seed passphrase, they'll be unable to recover their wallet.

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November 25, 2018, 10:56:38 AM
Last edit: November 25, 2018, 11:09:43 AM by AdolfinWolf
 #31

Someone should correct me if i'm wrong, but i am fairly certain that it is NOT possible to put a password on a mnemonic seed. That'd be a first for me.
It would appear you aren't entirely familiar with BIP39 and how seed mnemonics work then... For reference:

From mnemonic to seed
A user may decide to protect their mnemonic with a passphrase. If a passphrase is not present, an empty string "" is used instead.

To create a binary seed from the mnemonic, we use the PBKDF2 function with a mnemonic sentence (in UTF-8 NFKD) used as the password and the string "mnemonic" + passphrase (again in UTF-8 NFKD) used as the salt. The iteration count is set to 2048 and HMAC-SHA512 is used as the pseudo-random function. The length of the derived key is 512 bits (= 64 bytes).


The ability to add passphrases to BIP39 seed mnemonics is the basis for the "Plausible Deniability":
Quote
The described method also provides plausible deniability, because every passphrase generates a valid seed (and thus a deterministic wallet) but only the correct one will make the desired wallet available.
Which, as pointed out by bob123 and BitCryptex, is a possible reason why the OP has a "valid" seed with no history... without the correct seed passphrase, they'll be unable to recover their wallet.

Thanks. Not sure how i haven't seen this earlier.

You reckon that this guide is more or less what you're describing in the above quote? https://github.com/libbitcoin/libbitcoin-explorer/wiki/How-to-Encrypt-a-Wallet-Seed#using-key-encryption

Is there a list of wallets that support encrypted mnemonics? I don't think for instance Electrum does?

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November 25, 2018, 11:13:43 AM
Merited by vapourminer (1), ETFbitcoin (1)
 #32

I don't think for instance Electrum does?

You can extend your seed with a custom passphrase while creating a new wallet. Just click Options and select Extend this seed with custom words. After clicking next, you will have to input your additional word. Electrum warns user that it is not the same as encrypting the wallet file.


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November 25, 2018, 09:45:53 PM
Merited by vapourminer (1)
 #33

You reckon that this guide is more or less what you're describing in the above quote? https://github.com/libbitcoin/libbitcoin-explorer/wiki/How-to-Encrypt-a-Wallet-Seed#using-key-encryption
Yes... it would appear that is doing the same thing (in the "Using Mnemonics" section). I confirmed it by using the mnemonic generated and the example passphrase in IanColeman's BIP39 tool, it generates the same BIP32 Root Key.

The thing to remember with Seed Mnemonic Passphrases, is that you're not really "encrypting" the seed as such... rather, you are just "extending" it. Hence the nomenclature used by Electrum ("Extend this seed with custom words").

Quote
Is there a list of wallets that support encrypted mnemonics? I don't think for instance Electrum does?
Off the top of my head:
- Electrum
- Mycelium
- Samourai
- Ledger
- Trezor
- Coinomi

There are probably a few others.


apologies for the thread drift!  Undecided

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