1 BTC = 250x fees then you will remain with 0 BTC

[FanatMonet]

Large fee for miners, as well as their greed, can greatly damage BTC, in the worst case they will let it ruin it if there appear 2nd strong crypto currency which will combine all the best (Fast transactions, Large block size, small transfer fees)

[1713862380]

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[1713862380]

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[1713862380]

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[pearlmen]

Wonder how many realize this. Basically you are feeding the whales.

At this time PayPal fees are cheaper  

Based on this and other analysis I have read, I don't think the fees is way cheaper than bitcoin and aside that even if it is PayPal is cheaper, I would still prefer bitcoin than that simply because of the regulations around PayPal where scammers can exploit the most important is the reversible nature of transactions no matter the mode or form of transferring it. The issue we all face in bitcoin is getting the right amount of transaction fees in which wallet providers has failed us in recommending amount not enough to carry out such transaction.

[franky1]

While the fee looks very high and not suitable for small/micro transaction, it still lower than most payment service if you're from different country or send big amount of money.
If you're angry with high fees, consider use altcoin, use lower fees if you're not in hurry or use payment service that you think have lower fees

facepalm
its not about small/ micro transactions. its about normal people transactions.
an average tx is about 400~ bytes. fee on average is 250sat/byte. = 0.00100000 = ~$2

which even paying a week of groceries or a week of car fuel is like 4% tx fee

yep 4% of first world utility weekly things
or worse 6 months of thing in developing countries has a 4% tx fee..

again dont compare bitcoin to the most expensive 'other' methods.. think of it in comparison to average/normal methods
remove utility for average joe and bitcoin becomes useless to average joe. bitcoin becomes only used by the snobby rich. thus becomes as corrupt as how snobby rich have corrupted fiat

bitcoin meant to exist to solve this issues of snobby rich, to help the unbanked.
letting core halt REAL natural growth is a snobby mindset
and dont even go exaggerating it to be about 'gigabytes by midnight' or 'coffee'.. again thats just the snobby rich excuse to not let bitcoin naturally grow.

telling people to use other services or alternative networks is just trying t push people away from bitcoin (triple facepalm)
there are many ways to code in rules to find a equilibrium without going into making bitcoin only for the snobs.

P.S
i have many many many btc and born and raised in a first world country with a long anscestry of such. yet even i can see passed my own lifestyle to recognise the issues

..
remember this.
people on this forum have already heard about bitcoin. they dont need snobs to try stroking ego's and glossing over the bad points to sell the ever narrowing path to what they pretend is utopia. they dont need to be preached to be converted. people reading this forum dont need the gloss.. they prefer the hard truths.

you can only solve an issue when you admit there is an issue

[franky1]

Wonder how many realize this. Basically you are feeding the whales.

At this time PayPal fees are cheaper  

Based on this and other analysis I have read, I don't think the fees is way cheaper than bitcoin and aside that even if it is PayPal is cheaper, I would still prefer bitcoin than that simply because of the regulations around PayPal where scammers can exploit the most important is the reversible nature of transactions no matter the mode or form of transferring it.

i suggest you never use LN..   research CSV revoke codes and you will see what i mean

[darthmaul]

The average price right now for a transaction that would be confirmed in less than 25 minutes is 0,005USD/byte and the average TX size is 250 bytes, so 0.005 * 250 = 1.25USD.

If you are not in a hurry and can wait up to 24 hours, you can go with a 0.001USD/byte, so 0.001 * 250  = 0.25USD.

That's pretty cheap IMO.

Thats pretty amazing calculation. I mean did not know how to calculate the fees really. But usually wait for the confirmation a lot. I waited for $ 22 transaction for 6 days one time. That was the longest may be as I did not pay the fees at all. Lol. I mean I paid very less fees for that. So I guess my byte rate was very much moderate to perform the fast transaction. But anyway I always wait for longer times to avoid the fees as it is my hard earned money.

[davis196]

Wonder how many realize this. Basically you are feeding the whales.

At this time PayPal fees are cheaper  

Paypal fees are cheaper?Don`t make me laugh.
Yesterday i received 31,45 USD paypal payment and the fee was 1,78 USD.
I use paypal only because most of the people use it.

[Nahl]

apparently for now on bitcoin isn't the options for those who liked cryptocurrency with low fees because with increasing bitcoin price followed also with raising the fee but in my country the fee using bitcoin is more cheap than transactions use fiat however this is the risk of bitcoin users and we should be facing it

[lighpulsar07]

well, i don't have problems sending fees because it depends how huge transaction you will be created i usually pay 0.0004 btc fee for my transaction and it confirms quickly and also, the bitcoin price is high so, the fees will be higher in terms of fiat but in bitcoin it isn't. so, stop thinking the fees are high blah blah live with it.

[bitbunnny]

The average price right now for a transaction that would be confirmed in less than 25 minutes is 0,005USD/byte and the average TX size is 250 bytes, so 0.005 * 250 = 1.25USD.

If you are not in a hurry and can wait up to 24 hours, you can go with a 0.001USD/byte, so 0.001 * 250  = 0.25USD.

That's pretty cheap IMO.

Yeah, but what that means you are not in the hurry? One of the Bitcoin advanatges was, and I say was because seams like that was long time ago, that your funds are available to you fast and easy, wherever, whenever. Now this is not so anymore and sometimes with even very large fees you should wait more then couple of hours for confirmation. This is not good service and makes people abandon the Bitcoin despite the high price.

[aggarwal233]

This wont be happen anytime in future...

[franky1]

as for the OP's point

he is right
within a less than a thousand transactions you will spend 1BTC.

imagine it this way it does not matter if you have $2000 or $200,000
within a thousand transactions you are going to spend $2000 just on fee's

yes the snobby rich will say "thats fine because i have $200,000" ... but if you think passed the snobbery and realise the unbanked developing countries see $2000 as alot of money


for the snobs:
stop trying to preach to the converted how bitcoin is utopia and works perfectly. it doesnt
the core devs have REMOVED fee control code. removed reactive fee facilities that bring fee's down during low demand

stop turning bitcoin into something only the snobs should use and be 'entitled' to by pretending that its bitcoins intended purpose or only possible utility, by allowing devs to remove/halt utility with their snobbery

[bitcoin199]

I agree the fees now and horrible, it's not anyone's fault though IMO, the network is just too congested, the miner's mine the TX with highest fees which is just common sense. Blocks are always full so you can't complain about the miners, I don't think there are even whales here.. anyhow the congestion will probably last few weeks or so, it seems to be getting solved gradually.

On the other hand, PayPal is still much more expensive for merchant payment of anything above $40...

[Iranus]

I agree the fees now and horrible, it's not anyone's fault though IMO, the network is just too congested, the miner's mine the TX with highest fees which is just common sense. Blocks are always full so you can't complain about the miners, I don't think there are even whales here.. anyhow the congestion will probably last few weeks or so, it seems to be getting solved gradually.

On the other hand, PayPal is still much more expensive for merchant payment of anything above $40...

There are more things which have a value though.

If you hold your Bitcoin on your laptop and someone steals them, the transaction is irreversible.  Regardless of the possible reality of Bitcoin security, a trusted intermediary can make the general public feel more secure when doing everyday transactions.

Also, people are very conservative with their money, so the benefit of Bitcoin needs to be extremely clear instead of being masked behind a wall of profiteering, high fees for certain transactions and more.  Companies like PayPal can take their fee as a percentage so it doesn't appear to be so high when users make small transactions, but Bitcoin's fees can't be handled in this way.

The lesson is, Bitcoin doesn't just have to appear better than PayPal.  It has to appear better than PayPal in both security and convenience and it has to be several times lower than PayPal in fees.

Bitcoin is perfectly capable of this.

[matrix zion]

Wonder how many realize this. Basically you are feeding the whales.

At this time PayPal fees are cheaper  

Paypal fees are cheaper?Don`t make me laugh.
Yesterday i received 31,45 USD paypal payment and the fee was 1,78 USD.
I use paypal only because most of the people use it.

Yeah I agree on this one!
If not F&F paypal is expensive as fuck!!! 

I don't understand why so many people are using this, I'd rather use btc at least the money is really in your pocket!
While with paypal you pay like hell AND they can sue you months after the payments if they decide it was not correct.

Really hate PP!

[phr0stbyt3]

I'm sorry, I do not understand you mean the fee?

yeah, you can pay the fees 250 times

250 times the fees are you dumb , and yeah i agree this fees is way more than PayPal, but but bitcoin has way better features than PayPal like no receiving and sending limit , anonymous payments can be and many more. And also abt the fees it is average 1$ per transaction which is decent for now

[singularityisnear]

Miners are playing with fire by creating so much politics and delaying consensus to solve this.

[crairezx20]

According to other its a part of growing.. well instead of the fees was reducing because of the price increase reverse happening about the miners fee. Since the price of bitcoin was increase they should not change what are the fee before since its still worth it to accept them as miners fee..
Well i have some funds in bitcoin but all of them are now in paypal due to high fee for every transaction and i want always my money safe.. that is why i deposit them all in paypal instead  for online payment and buying service about seo online.. so i can save..

[SONG GEET]

I'm sorry, I do not understand you mean the fee?

yeah, you can pay the fees 250 times

It depends on transaction size, how you have calculated this. If you haven't received small amount of bitcoin than you still don't have to pay a lot. Current recommended fee for transaction with median size is just 0.00067BTC, so with 1BTC in fee you can make 1000+ transactions.

[Kprawn]

What these damn miners are not getting is this :

--> Higher fees = less transactions
--> Higher fees = less adoption

People will use Bitcoin less as a currency and more like a investment commodity. What happened to the "Cashless payment system" envisioned

by Satoshi? Will greed ultimately kill this technology too.... I think so. 

[aesma]

Clearly part of the problem is that the fee is linked to a "transaction size" that is meaningless to most people, difficult to impossible to control, and not linked at all to the amount being sent.

I think fees are too high across the board, but at least if I'm sending 1BTC or more I can accept to pay a few bucks in fees. If I want to send a few bucks, then Bitcoin is now out of the question. This needs fixing urgently, or Bitcoin will be known as the supposed "currency" that is only useful to drug dealers and money launderers who like their big banknotes.