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Author Topic: [ANN] ChipMixer.com - Bitcoin mixer / Bitcoin tumbler - mixing reinvented  (Read 65087 times)
BitHodler
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October 19, 2017, 10:56:04 PM
 #661

It's not about complicating the system, it's about allowing people to obtain a higher level of privacy.

Nothing prevents me from scanning the blockchain for addresses containing the common chip values, where it's a piece of cake to differentiate between mixer owned addresses, and addresses containing regular transactions.

If the chip values would be completely random, or say 1/3 random, it would make it far more difficult to potentially link certain transactions to whatever person ~ it's just a suggestion after all, let's see what ChipMixer has to say.

BSV is not the real Bcash. Bcash is the real Bcash.
There are several different types of Bitcoin clients. Hybrid server-assisted clients like Electrum get a lot of their network information from centralized servers, but they also check the server's results using blockchain header data. This is perhaps somewhat more secure than either server-assisted clients or header-only clients.
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October 19, 2017, 11:24:46 PM
 #662

-snip-
ChipMixer has already responded to these concerns:

ChipMixer provides fungibility, not secrecy.

When you use CoinJoin or TumbleBit, you fungible bitcoins but it is no secret that you used it.
When you use Tor, it hides your connection, but it is no secret that you used it.
When you use Https, it hides your data, but it is no secret that you used it.

Fungibility means that every chip-sized transaction may be owned by anyone and there is no connection with previous transactions.

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October 22, 2017, 08:30:25 AM
Last edit: October 22, 2017, 08:41:17 AM by LoyceV
 #663

ChipMixer: do you have any special preparation for the Bitcoin Gold fork (October 25)?
At the previous fork (August 1), ChipMixer quickly ran out of chips when many people tried to exchange "new" Bitcoins for "old" Bitcoins that still had Bitcoin Cash in the private keys.
This can happen again, as ChipMixer is the only service I know that just gives away all coins they get from Bitcoin forks.

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October 22, 2017, 01:12:25 PM
 #664

ChipMixer: do you have any special preparation for the Bitcoin Gold fork (October 25)?
At the previous fork (August 1), ChipMixer quickly ran out of chips when many people tried to exchange "new" Bitcoins for "old" Bitcoins that still had Bitcoin Cash in the private keys.
This can happen again, as ChipMixer is the only service I know that just gives away all coins they get from Bitcoin forks.
I believe that it's going to be the same as what happened in the Bitcoin Cash fork, since they would need to manually move all the Bitcoin Gold coins from their chip reserves. I haven't thought about this in the last fork, but using ChipMixer to double the amount of coins in the fork chain is a very profitable idea for who is doing it.

Send 1 BTC -> Withdraw 1 BTC and 1 BCG chip -> Sell 1 BCG -> Send 1 BTC + BCG trade profit -> repeat.

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October 22, 2017, 01:43:37 PM
 #665

Send 1 BTC -> Withdraw 1 BTC and 1 BCG chip -> Sell 1 BCG -> Send 1 BTC + BCG trade profit -> repeat.

That's actually a good point, but we know that ChipMixer's reserve pool isn't all that large. Imagine how that will be in a situation where people see this as an interesting money making oppostunity. ChipMixer will get 'spammed' with mixing tasks, which eventually would result in a lot people desperately complaining about them being handed a voucher, while they had their eyes on receiving private keys with BG connected to them. Then new chips have to be prepared, and these new chips will not come with BG anymore. It's basically a first come first served situation. I personally will not do so just to obtain BG, because I find that people needing privacy shouldn't suffer any delays due to greedy people emptying the reserve pool.
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October 23, 2017, 05:27:29 AM
 #666

Send 1 BTC -> Withdraw 1 BTC and 1 BCG chip -> Sell 1 BCG -> Send 1 BTC + BCG trade profit -> repeat.

That's actually a good point, but we know that ChipMixer's reserve pool isn't all that large. Imagine how that will be in a situation where people see this as an interesting money making oppostunity. ChipMixer will get 'spammed' with mixing tasks, which eventually would result in a lot people desperately complaining about them being handed a voucher, while they had their eyes on receiving private keys with BG connected to them. Then new chips have to be prepared, and these new chips will not come with BG anymore. It's basically a first come first served situation. I personally will not do so just to obtain BG, because I find that people needing privacy shouldn't suffer any delays due to greedy people emptying the reserve pool.

Also being how the wide consensus seems to be that BCG is just a fake currency with no value, I don't think people will be able to profit from it as much as they might have done back when Bitcoin Cash itself forked from the main blockchain. Even now you still see some people strongly believing that Bitcoin Cash could be the future. I have yet to see one sane person do the same. If I had to guess, I don't think ChipMixer is concerned about people doing this "abuse" method at all, and neither is anyone else as far as I can tell. BCG is going to be DOA.

Nothing to say.
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October 23, 2017, 01:32:04 PM
 #667

ChipMixer: do you have any special preparation for the Bitcoin Gold fork (October 25)?
At the previous fork (August 1), ChipMixer quickly ran out of chips when many people tried to exchange "new" Bitcoins for "old" Bitcoins that still had Bitcoin Cash in the private keys.
This can happen again, as ChipMixer is the only service I know that just gives away all coins they get from Bitcoin forks.
While we do believe Bitcoin Gold is worthless[1], we intend to drain all available chips at Bitcoin Gold blockchain.
This should remove any incentive to abuse and avoid chip depletion.

[1] Bitcoin Gold has premined 200k which at BCH price would result in 20k BTC.

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October 23, 2017, 01:56:52 PM
 #668

ChipMixer: do you have any special preparation for the Bitcoin Gold fork (October 25)?
At the previous fork (August 1), ChipMixer quickly ran out of chips when many people tried to exchange "new" Bitcoins for "old" Bitcoins that still had Bitcoin Cash in the private keys.
This can happen again, as ChipMixer is the only service I know that just gives away all coins they get from Bitcoin forks.
While we do believe Bitcoin Gold is worthless[1], we intend to drain all available chips at Bitcoin Gold blockchain.
This should remove any incentive to abuse and avoid chip depletion.

[1] Bitcoin Gold has premined 200k which at BCH price would result in 20k BTC.
what do you mean by that bolded words? sorry, a bit english handicapped here Tongue
are you saying to prevent abuse, you are going to move around BTC chips so none will have BTG available
or you simply are going to transfer all BTG from eligible chips to another address you own
for e.g. I'm holding a chip (with privkey) before fork and planning to claim BTG,
are you going to transfer BTG from that address before I get the chance to do it?

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October 23, 2017, 02:12:38 PM
 #669

While we do believe Bitcoin Gold is worthless[1], we intend to drain all available chips at Bitcoin Gold blockchain.
what do you mean by that bolded words? sorry, a bit english handicapped here Tongue
are you saying to prevent abuse, you are going to move around BTC chips so none will have BTG available
or you simply are going to transfer all BTG from eligible chips to another address you own
for e.g. I'm holding a chip (with privkey) before fork and planning to claim BTG,
are you going to transfer BTG from that address before I get the chance to do it?
After you have received private key and destroyed session, we do not have it anymore.
We intend to sweep available (not claimed by anyone) chips in the mixer, so when you deposit BTC, you will receive chip with BTC, not BTC+gold.

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October 23, 2017, 02:38:11 PM
 #670

We intend to sweep available (not claimed by anyone) chips in the mixer, so when you deposit BTC, you will receive chip with BTC, not BTC+gold.
I don't know how many people hold Vouchers, but if they want to claim Bitcoin Gold, existing Vouchers should be redeemed before the fork.

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October 24, 2017, 12:50:37 AM
 #671

We intend to sweep available (not claimed by anyone) chips in the mixer, so when you deposit BTC, you will receive chip with BTC, not BTC+gold.
I don't know how many people hold Vouchers, but if they want to claim Bitcoin Gold, existing Vouchers should be redeemed before the fork.
OK, I think I understand now.
I thought you're gonna 'steal' Wink my BTG that comes with the privkeys on chips that I owned
so I guess I better hurry up send balance there, mix it, hold it and wait after fork to spend it
and just like LoyceV said, redeem existing vouchers if they want to claim their BTG shares  Cool

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October 24, 2017, 07:10:41 AM
 #672

While we do believe Bitcoin Gold is worthless
It's a shame that forks are making companies feel so pressured to credit their users.  In the case of Bitcoin Cash there was a significant user base and a significant amount of supporters, but Bitcoin Gold is clearly bullshit.

It's clearly just a money grab, and yet by crediting their users and creating systems for people to handle their Bitcoin Gold, companies are unintentionally helping with this and there's little they can do because dodgy groups like Bitfinex have already started accepting it.

People will give a value to anything.  It's just a simple code change and there are clearly plenty of ASIC-resistant coins already, yet BTG is trying to pull thousands of BTC out of this.

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October 24, 2017, 09:24:16 AM
 #673

While we do believe Bitcoin Gold is worthless[1], we intend to drain all available chips at Bitcoin Gold blockchain.
what do you mean by that bolded words? sorry, a bit english handicapped here Tongue
are you saying to prevent abuse, you are going to move around BTC chips so none will have BTG available
or you simply are going to transfer all BTG from eligible chips to another address you own
for e.g. I'm holding a chip (with privkey) before fork and planning to claim BTG,
are you going to transfer BTG from that address before I get the chance to do it?
After you have received private key and destroyed session, we do not have it anymore.
We intend to sweep available (not claimed by anyone) chips in the mixer, so when you deposit BTC, you will receive chip with BTC, not BTC+gold.

Makes sense, otherwise peolpe will just take advantage of the vouchers that do still have bitcoin gold in them like last time with the BCC fork.

Even if bitcoin gold is worthless intrinsically imo it'll get pumped up solely because of the fact that it has done marketing and people are talking about it. Unclaimed private chips belong to chipmixer - and chipmixer should be the ones claiming that profit.
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October 24, 2017, 10:35:12 AM
 #674

Unclaimed private chips belong to chipmixer - and chipmixer should be the ones claiming that profit.
As I said before - we do it to avoid disruption of service. There will be no profit on forks, only a disruption of normal business.

Bitcoin Gold forked, new chips will not have any "gold". Chance to receive old chip (with gold) is minimal.

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October 24, 2017, 12:15:06 PM
 #675

As I said before - we do it to avoid disruption of service. There will be no profit on forks, only a disruption of normal business.

I am actually glad that ChipMixer has spoken out about this. It shows that despite certain people here not seeing a problem with this potential abuse, that ChipMixer itself acknowledges the situation, and acts to prevent it. If it wasn't someone else who brought this point up, it wouldn't even come up in my mind to exploit the fork and this service just to obtain profits. But even if I did know it, as I said before (a few posts ago), I will not drain the chip reserve because I know that it would negatively impact those who actually need privacy. I value moral standards over potential profits.
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October 26, 2017, 12:44:19 PM
 #676

what is the best practice on mixing coins, if for e.g. I'm going to make 2 deposits of 0.0315 & 0.0335
should I create two sessions and deposit once to each? or just one session?
if I do 2 sessions, would I be able to get voucher with exact amount 0.0315 on 1st one
so then I can add up with the 2nd deposit on 2nd session to get sum of 0.065?
do vouchers also come in same sizes like chips? or can be any multiply of 0.001?
and how many times the session can be extended? thanks.

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October 26, 2017, 01:46:59 PM
 #677

what is the best practice on mixing coins, if for e.g. I'm going to make 2 deposits of 0.0315 & 0.0335
should I create two sessions and deposit once to each? or just one session?
It depends on the privacy you're looking for. If you deposit both to the same deposit address, you'll have 0.065 balance, but it links your original funds together.

Quote
if I do 2 sessions, would I be able to get voucher with exact amount 0.0315 on 1st one
No, you'll get 0.031BTC.

Quote
so then I can add up with the 2nd deposit on 2nd session to get sum of 0.065?
If you redeem your voucher to a new mixing session, you'll have 0.031 + 0.033 = 0.064BTC.

Quote
do vouchers also come in same sizes like chips? or can be any multiply of 0.001?
Vouchers can be any value, with 3 decimals.

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and how many times the session can be extended? thanks.
As often as you want, but using the same session for a long time compromises privacy.

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October 27, 2017, 09:29:39 PM
Last edit: October 27, 2017, 10:12:54 PM by ChipMixer
 #678

what is the best practice on mixing coins, if for e.g. I'm going to make 2 deposits of 0.0315 & 0.0335
should I create two sessions and deposit once to each? or just one session?
if I do 2 sessions, would I be able to get voucher with exact amount 0.0315 on 1st one
so then I can add up with the 2nd deposit on 2nd session to get sum of 0.065?
The most private way of mixing is to spend one, whole address value per session.
For example, you have two unspent outputs:
- 1Address1 - 0.3 BTC
- 1Address2 - 0.7 BTC
You could send 1 BTC (minus transaction fee) to session deposit address. This would link both addresses as owned by the same person.
This does not affect privacy of your chips, but affects your privacy.
If you send first address to first session and second address to second session then you achieve maximum privacy (but it will cost you a lot of fees).

do vouchers also come in same sizes like chips? or can be any multiply of 0.001?
Voucher is a sum of many chips ie. 1 mBTC + 8 mBTC + 32 mBTC = 41 mBTC voucher.

and how many times the session can be extended? thanks.
You can extend your session as much as you need to, but there is no need to do that.

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October 30, 2017, 08:52:26 PM
Last edit: October 30, 2017, 09:53:04 PM by ChipMixer
 #679

Due to Segwit 2x fork which is expected Nov 16 we announce that ChipMixer will be taken offline before fork (a day or two) and it will be offline for a few days till fork situation get stable. To avoid same situation as with Bitcoin Cash - chips you receive after fork will not contain bitcoins on another fork (S2X).

How to prepare for fork:

- mix your coins beforehand - you may need them before mixing services get online
- redeem your vouchers beforehand - otherwise you will lose s2x coins
- keep your bitcoins at addresses you have private keys
- keeping your bitcoins at exchange may allow you to sell forked coin at higher price, but you risk non-forked coin

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November 02, 2017, 12:42:09 AM
 #680

I don't remember exactly but I extended the session 2 days ago
I opened the saved url but it gives me different deposit address
then I checked the recover link given on the bottom of the page to make sure, exactly the same
is this mean my last session was ended/lost and new one created with same restore url?
fyi, no coins lost. I was extending it waiting for the tx fee ratio to drop before making deposit
turned out it stays the same around 250-300 sats/byte  Undecided

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