[ANN] ChipMixer.com - Bitcoin mixer / Bitcoin tumbler - mixing reinvented

[brianddk]

In the example of two 0.0015 deposits, both are above the minimum chip size. In your example, the second deposit is below the minimum chip size and is therefore treated as a donation.

you misunderstood the example in the faq,
the minimum amount per deposit (1mbtc) is still intact
the minimum amount rule applies to each deposit (utxo), NOT total amount of deposit

that statement gives an example condition of 2 deposits over 1mbtc each
the example simply explains that you won't lose the fraction if they sum up to a full mbtc

I'd agree that the current example is a little confusing... and can certainly understand why you thought it would work that way. I think the ChipMixer admins should tidy that FAQ section up a little to make it a bit more obvious.

@TheQuin, @Thirdspace, @HCP,
   My adblocker had nix'd your sigs so looking back through the thread it looks like you guys might be ChipMixer admins.  My apologies for not realizing it earlier.  I was looking for an official response and here were many.  Anyway, I get the layout and now follow the intent of the FAQ.  Thanks to all for helping straighten it out.  Overall been pleased with the service.  Been using the onion so didn't get hit with the SSL hickup earlier.  Thanks for providing Tor access BTW.

[1713574399]

1713574399

[DarkStar_]

it looks like you guys might be ChipMixer admins

They aren't admins; they're part of an advertising campaign ran by ChipMixer. ChipMixer is the only official admin account.

[moejoejay]

@hcp:

ok i thought sth. i didnt get it


1. u made the mixining on chipmixer and  

2. then sweep the private keys to a new wallet

so where is the connection between 1 and 2 related to the blockchain  ?

in the faq's it is mentioned it just like an normal mixing step if u do this in that way

regards moejoejay

[LoyceV]

1. u made the mixining on chipmixer and  

2. then sweep the private keys to a new wallet

so where is the connection between 1 and 2 related to the blockchain  ?

I think you're confused by the names used. In short:
Import: add a private key to a wallet without moving the funds.
Sweep: use the private key to move the funds from the old address to a new address in your own wallet.

"Import" happens off-chain.
"Sweep" happens on the blockchain.

Long version: See for instance 99bitcoins.com.

[brianddk]

Question about the mixing internals. Are internal tumblers used at ChipMixer? What does a chain analysis through ChipMixer look like?  I tried by hand, and got lost in the weeds, but most analysts will be more clever than I.  So to illustrate my question, here's what I imagine happen, but would like some confirmation.

• [1] User Bob deposits 0.0031 BTC to ChipMixer address 1BoB...wVFR
• [2] ChipMixer tumbles 1BoB...wVFR with other deposits and creates outputs of 1, 4, 32... mBTC
• [3] User Carol deposits 0.0052 BTC to ChipMixer address 1CaroL...LnGu
• [4] ChipMixer tumbles 1CaroL...LnGu with other deposits and creates outputs of 2, 8, 16... mBTC
• [5] Carol withdrawals a 4-chip and 1-chip (possibly from tumbler [2] transaction)

Is this close to correct?  Are there tumblers guaranteed between deposits and withdrawals or are one user's deposits sometimes passed directly to another user's withdrawal without a tumbler in between?  If someone made a deposit of exactly 0.001, 0.002, 0.004, could those be passed on without tumbling?

Perhaps (if internal tumblers aren't guaranteed) this is a motive for people to tip and make odd shaped deposits, so that they won't end up in someone else's future transaction history.

[jackg]

No this isnt what happens at all.

When I've used them. In the past they use ptm transactions to keep the fees low(ish) I wouldn't be surprised if they were mining their consolidation inputs at the same time since they only need 1 block per day.

When I've withdrawn in the past, and if you try this, check your address and go to the transaction that funded it, you'll see that if its a 0.001btc chip for example it probably had an input of 0.02btc which was split into those transactions. I'm not sure how larger chips work (ive used them they're just really far down my history) but for the smaller ones this is definitely true. Since transactions also have a fee rate that is lower after several inputs and outputs are combined and presumably these funds are sent to cold storage once they arrive the coins coming in will likely be merged with many others too making it less untraceable.

These funds do look like they come from a mixing service or a similar service such as a pool that uses the same payrate with chips but a lot of people use these mixers for fun anyway or to obfuscate a source of funds say between a personal and business address.

[moejoejay]

@LoyceV

But when i export the private key from chipmixer first and then i sweep in a new wallet, the connection on the blockchain is broken or ?

1. chipmixer ---> export private key to a wallet = cut off from blockchain

2. Sweep the exported keys to a new wallet = happens on blockchain but no connection to 1.


so if i do so, i have the same privacy ( + get a new key for my funds)   as if i'm only export the keys metioned on 1. or ?   
are my assumptions correct ?

regards moejoejay

[TryNinja]

-snip-

Yes. If you sweep to a new wallet/address not connected to your first one (used to deposit), then there is no link between the two of them.

[DarkStar_]

Are there tumblers guaranteed between deposits and withdrawals or are one user's deposits sometimes passed directly to another user's withdrawal without a tumbler in between?  If someone made a deposit of exactly 0.001, 0.002, 0.004, could those be passed on without tumbling?

I'm quite certain that tumblers are guaranteed between deposits/withdraws because it would needless complicate things and create various issues to only gain back a tiny transaction fee. For example, here's an 8 mBTC deposit that was used to create 4.096BTC chips, rather then being put into the chip pool as an 8 mBTC chip.

[moejoejay]

@tryninja:

but i think this is the more secure way to withdraw ur funds from chipmixer

1. export keys first
2. sweep after export.

so why is this not mentioned in the faq ?

 regards moejoejay

     

[TryNinja]

@tryninja:

but i think this is the more secure way to withdraw ur funds from chipmixer

1. export keys first
2. sweep after export.

so why is this not mentioned in the faq ?

 regards moejoejay

It doesn’t really matter. If you sweep from ChipMixer, the coins will go from the chip address to your final address. If you export them and sweep through your favorite wallet software, the same will happen. The only difference is that ChipMixer can do it for you (optionally) or you can do on your own.

[moejoejay]

@tryninja

But i thought if im sweep directly from chipmixer to the wallet the transaction is on the blockchhain and traceable on the contrary to the export key  method to ur wallet.

regards johnjoejay

[TryNinja]

@tryninja

But i thought if im sweep directly from chipmixer to the wallet the transaction is on the blockchhain and traceable on the contrary to the export method.

regards johnjoejay

Imagine this:

Case 1:
- I deposit 0.01 from my address 1NinjabXd... and get a chip of 0.01;
- I sweep from ChipMixer to my final address 1FinalJkfC...
- Status: 1FinalJkfC... address with 0.01;
- There is no direct link between my address 1NinjabXd... and my final address 1FinalJkfC...

Case 2:
- I deposit 0.01 from my address 1NinjabXd... and get a chip of 0.01;
- I export the chip;
- I open my Electrum wallet and sweep the chip private key to my address 1FinalJkfC...
- Status: 1FinalJkfC... address with 0.01;
- There is no direct link between my address 1NinjabXd... and my final address 1FinalJkfC...

See how both end results are the same? ChipMixer’s sweep function is the dame as any other wallet’s sweep function.

What can help with your anonymity is when you will sweep/spend from the chips and how many chips you create, how much you donated (output lower than input), etc... so, instead of sweeping from ChipMixer right after mixing, you can export the chip and sweep them in a different day. Or create a voucher and sweep from ChipMixer in a different day.

[HCP]

You missed Case 3, which seems to be the case moejoejay is referring to...

Case 3:
- I deposit 0.01 from my address 1NinjabXd... and get a chip of 0.01;
- I export private key from ChipMixer and import the private key into <SomeWallet>...
- Status: 1rAnD0mAddrFromMixer... address with 0.01;
- There is no direct link between my original address 1NinjabXd... and the final address 1rAnD0mAddrFromMixer... HOWEVER, ChipMixer knows the private key for this address! I must now trust that ChipMixer will not steal the funds until I spend them (or sweep them to a different address).

[bitwise]

Please explain what will happen in this situation.

1) I send 2.049 BTC to ChipMixer and choose to get a a voucher.
What kind of voucher(s) I get? Is it one for 2.049 BTC or two for 2.048 BTC + 0.001 BTC?
2) Another mix, I send 2.048 BTC, also choose to get a voucher.
What kind of voucher(s) I get?
3) I want to sweep my vouchers. So I submit all of them from steps 1&2, what are my options now?
Can I specify what kind of chips I want to get? Can I choose 4.096 BTC chip now? Do I have to completely spend the whole value I have in vouchers right now (can I keep 0.001 BTC for the future mix in voucher form)?
Can I choose to make ChipMixer send me the whole 4.097 BTC to my single address in 1 tx (note, it's not a size of a chip)?
Can I choose ChipMixer to give me 1.024 BTC chip privkey? What will happen to the remainder value (3.073) in vouchers? Will I get new vouchers?
4) If I choose to make ChipMixer send me the value I want, what fee do they use?


PS How big is ChipMixer's pool? If I want to mix 100 BTCs in a month will I start getting my own BTC in a week or will they all be not the ones I deposited?

[AdolfinWolf]

Please explain what will happen in this situation.

1) I send 2.049 BTC to ChipMixer and choose to get a a voucher.
What kind of voucher(s) I get? Is it one for 2.049 BTC or two for 2.048 BTC + 0.001 BTC?
2) Another mix, I send 2.048 BTC, also choose to get a voucher.
What kind of voucher(s) I get?
3) I want to sweep my vouchers. So I submit all of them from steps 1&2, what are my options now?
Can I specify what kind of chips I want to get? Can I choose 4.096 BTC chip now? Do I have to completely spend the whole value I have in vouchers right now (can I keep 0.001 BTC for the future mix in voucher form)?
Can I choose to make ChipMixer send me the whole 4.097 BTC to my single address in 1 tx (note, it's not a size of a chip)?
Can I choose ChipMixer to give me 1.024 BTC chip privkey? What will happen to the remainder value (3.073) in vouchers? Will I get new vouchers?
4) If I choose to make ChipMixer send me the value I want, what fee do they use?


PS How big is ChipMixer's pool? If I want to mix 100 BTCs in a month will I start getting my own BTC in a week or will they all be not the ones I deposited?

1) You probably get one of 2.048, and one of 0.001, yes.
However you can always split them down. So 2.048 can become 1.024 etc.

2) Correct me if i'm wrong, but that will also result in a chip of 2.048? -Except if they don't have those available, you will get a chip of 1.024 + smaller onces totalling to 2.048

3) You import the privkeys of them into a wallet such as Electrum, then send all of them to another adress you own?

Afaik, you can split down chips, although i'm not entirely sure if you can also *always* group/merge them together to get a higher one (I think i was unable to do so a couple times..?).

Can I choose ChipMixer to give me 1.024 BTC chip privkey? What will happen to the remainder value (3.073) in vouchers? Will I get new vouchers?

You'll probably end up with two of 1.024 BTC chips, and one 2.048 chip that you can withdraw.

4) You decide. they simply provide a private key with the balance. You're free to spend them with whatever fee you'd like.

PS How big is ChipMixer's pool? If I want to mix 100 BTCs in a month will I start getting my own BTC in a week or will they all be not the ones I deposited?

No one knows, except for Chipmixer themselves AFAIK.

[ChipMixer]

Please explain what will happen in this situation.

1) I send 2.049 BTC to ChipMixer and choose to get a a voucher.
What kind of voucher(s) I get? Is it one for 2.049 BTC or two for 2.048 BTC + 0.001 BTC?

Voucher is code for any amount of bitcoins over 1 mBTC and with 1 mBTC increments. You will get 2049 mBTC voucher.

2) Another mix, I send 2.048 BTC, also choose to get a voucher.
What kind of voucher(s) I get?

2048 mBTC voucher.

3) I want to sweep my vouchers. So I submit all of them from steps 1&2, what are my options now?
Can I specify what kind of chips I want to get? Can I choose 4.096 BTC chip now? Do I have to completely spend the whole value I have in vouchers right now (can I keep 0.001 BTC for the future mix in voucher form)?
Can I choose to make ChipMixer send me the whole 4.097 BTC to my single address in 1 tx (note, it's not a size of a chip)?
Can I choose ChipMixer to give me 1.024 BTC chip privkey? What will happen to the remainder value (3.073) in vouchers? Will I get new vouchers?

As always you pick sizes of chips you receive and you always get privkeys to your chips.
You may redeem both 2049 and 2048 mBTC vouchers and have 2 x 2048 mBTC chips and 1 mBTC chip. Then you may click "merge" at 2048 mBTC chip to swap 2x2048 for 1x4096 mBTC chip.
Everytime you click "withdraw" - you receive private key. When you click "Leave chips and get voucher" - every chip not withdrawn will be sum into one voucher.

4) If I choose to make ChipMixer send me the value I want, what fee do they use?

Automatic fee. If it matters how much miner fee is paid - please use private keys to import them yourself and pick any fee you wish.

PS How big is ChipMixer's pool? If I want to mix 100 BTCs in a month will I start getting my own BTC in a week or will they all be not the ones I deposited?

ChipMixer does not use first-in first-out queue. Chips are produced and awarded in random (as all fungible values should be) so you cannot ever be sure - but it is all well. Nobody can expect that you will get chips from your deposit.

Afaik, you can split down chips, although i'm not entirely sure if you can also *always* group/merge them together to get a higher one (I think i was unable to do so a couple times..?).

If you cannot use split option - it means that ChipMixer does not have at least 2 lower chips ie. you cannot split 1024 chip when there is only one 512.
If you cannot use merge option (and you have two of the same chip size) - it means that ChipMixer does not have higher chip ie. you cannot merge two 1024 chip when there is no 2048.
If you really need lower/higher chip - make a voucher and try again later.

[ChipMixer]

Lately a lot of people use scam sites like this one on .info domain. It's not our site.

USE ONLY BELOW DOMAINS:
ChipMixer.com
ChipMixerwzxtzbw.onion

[salsa321]

Lately a lot of people use scam sites like this one on .info domain. It's not our site.

USE ONLY BELOW DOMAINS:
ChipMixer.com
ChipMixerwzxtzbw.onion


Perhaps,you can make like official announcement and list link of scam site (phising site chipmixer)

[TryNinja]

~snip~

It's way simpler that way. Also, there is no way to link every phishing website in existence.
What if we forget any? It doesn't make those not in the list legit.

If not:

ChipMixer.com
ChipMixerwzxtzbw.onion

Then:

> Scam