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Author Topic: Bitcoins cannot be legal in India.  (Read 4415 times)
BLife
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June 04, 2017, 10:56:05 AM
 #21


In many cases it can be identified not in all cases. Noob who don't know how to hide can be trace.

Same kind of reasons gave in your other article. Don't have time to quote all points what say it can be annoymous and so you must read carefully to understand what writer trying to saying.


 If it can be identified even in "many  cases" how can bitcoin be anonymous? If the user is adding external technology like VPN/TOR/Shell Accounts/etc then these provide the critical link in gaining anonomity not the bitcoin, so saying bitcoin is anonymous is not correct.

 Said that I have read the article and don't understand what you are saying, care to explain?

Regards,
BLife
 
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deadley
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June 04, 2017, 12:16:36 PM
 #22


In many cases it can be identified not in all cases. Noob who don't know how to hide can be trace.

Same kind of reasons gave in your other article. Don't have time to quote all points what say it can be annoymous and so you must read carefully to understand what writer trying to saying.


 If it can be identified even in "many  cases" how can bitcoin be anonymous? If the user is adding external technology like VPN/TOR/Shell Accounts/etc then these provide the critical link in gaining anonomity not the bitcoin, so saying bitcoin is anonymous is not correct.

 Said that I have read the article and don't understand what you are saying, care to explain?

Regards,
BLife
 

It is identified in many cases because many user gave identity to exchanges where you can identify them if they use their service.

Just tell me if I buy new laptop/Mobile/Hardware wallet use public wifi service download new wallet and send BTC to that wallet how you will track me. It's not Bitcoin who lost anonymous nature it's user who did not care or don't want to be anonymous.


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BLife
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June 04, 2017, 12:52:16 PM
 #23

*previous quote sniped*

It is identified in many cases because many user gave identity to exchanges where you can identify them if they use their service.

Just tell me if I buy new laptop/Mobile/Hardware wallet use public wifi service download new wallet and send BTC to that wallet how you will track me. It's not Bitcoin who lost anonymous nature it's user who did not care or don't want to be anonymous.

Ok here are few questions then,

1.Where is this previous address(one or many?) you are sending resides?
2.What was the previous address used for?
3.What transaction was made from the previous address?
4.How you got the coins into the previous address in the first place?
5.What are the transaction that you are doing with your new address?
6.Is there any repetition transaction that matches with your old address?
7.Does the area of operation of new and old address matches? (IP wise?)
8.Was there any conversion done with the previous address?(btc to real world cash?) If so where and to whom?

I could go on and but I hope this gives you an idea. Anonymity of bitcoin was not lost it never had any to begin with. Buying new laptop/mobile/hardware wallet doesn't add anything to anonymity unless your old ones are bugged, and if thats the case law enforcement has already have very clear idea, this new gadgets wont make any difference. 

Regards,
BLife
deadley
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June 04, 2017, 01:15:16 PM
 #24

*previous quote sniped*

It is identified in many cases because many user gave identity to exchanges where you can identify them if they use their service.

Just tell me if I buy new laptop/Mobile/Hardware wallet use public wifi service download new wallet and send BTC to that wallet how you will track me. It's not Bitcoin who lost anonymous nature it's user who did not care or don't want to be anonymous.

Ok here are few questions then,

1.Where is this previous address(one or many?) you are sending resides?
2.What was the previous address used for?
3.What transaction was made from the previous address?
4.How you got the coins into the previous address in the first place?
5.What are the transaction that you are doing with your new address?
6.Is there any repetition transaction that matches with your old address?
7.Does the area of operation of new and old address matches? (IP wise?)
8.Was there any conversion done with the previous address?(btc to real world cash?) If so where and to whom?

I could go on and but I hope this gives you an idea. Anonymity of bitcoin was not lost it never had any to begin with. Buying new laptop/mobile/hardware wallet doesn't add anything to anonymity unless your old ones are bugged, and if thats the case law enforcement has already have very clear idea, this new gadgets wont make any difference. 

Regards,
BLife

lol do you know there is mixer, gambling site who don't take any ID I just send them and they will send back to me in diff wallet address. After that I can sell those easily. And those site not comes into any regulation. Mostly from unknown places and unknown face. No one know real owner.

If tracking bitcoin easy then dark world don't use bitcoin. Ransomware attacker still free even he is attacking since so many months even attacked many govt. offices in world. Why Authority still not able to track them.


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BLife
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June 04, 2017, 02:02:19 PM
 #25


lol do you know there is mixer, gambling site who don't take any ID I just send them and they will send back to me in diff wallet address. After that I can sell those easily. And those site not comes into any regulation. Mostly from unknown places and unknown face. No one know real owner.

If tracking bitcoin easy then dark world don't use bitcoin. Ransomware attacker still free even he is attacking since so many months even attacked many govt. offices in world. Why Authority still not able to track them.


 I believe you have never heard of big data and big data analysis before right? There are few things,

1. Regarding ransom ware here is one link for you https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/bitcoin-seeking-ransomware-scam-busted/
2. Regarding dug dealers here is a link for you, https://darkwebnews.com/bitcoin/denmark-bitcoin-traced-drug-dealer-arrests/
3. if you are going to ask why others are not arrested, there are many things at play here(country that doesn't care, state sponsored, etc,etc), this thread is not the place for those discussions.

You say you will sell them easily, how? if you are thinking about skins, game codes, etc, those are still trails. There is no such thing as above regulation, its all well and good till law enforcement takes interest in it.

So I am to believe that people use only anonymous currency for all their illegal activity? if you are so naive to believe that then who am i to say otherwise?

This discussion is now going in circles, just saying mixer, tumbler wont cut it, as there are methods that can defeat those with timing/location/usage pattern/link analysis, search the Internet for BTC blockchain analysis and you will get it. Now either you make a strong case to prove BTC is anonymous disproving all the points that I have said or else this discussion is going nowhere.

Regards,
BLife

deadley
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June 04, 2017, 07:49:23 PM
 #26


lol do you know there is mixer, gambling site who don't take any ID I just send them and they will send back to me in diff wallet address. After that I can sell those easily. And those site not comes into any regulation. Mostly from unknown places and unknown face. No one know real owner.

If tracking bitcoin easy then dark world don't use bitcoin. Ransomware attacker still free even he is attacking since so many months even attacked many govt. offices in world. Why Authority still not able to track them.


 I believe you have never heard of big data and big data analysis before right? There are few things,

1. Regarding ransom ware here is one link for you https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/bitcoin-seeking-ransomware-scam-busted/
2. Regarding dug dealers here is a link for you, https://darkwebnews.com/bitcoin/denmark-bitcoin-traced-drug-dealer-arrests/



Posting 2015 article regarding Ransomware. Even last month they attacked very big in so many countries. If that was busted in 2015 how they are
still attacking and getting BTC for unlocking PC.

Regarding drug dealer, 1 guy arrested, there is 1000's or or 10000's dealer there. If they really cracked everything why we are not getting daily news about arresting of those dealer.

About big data I heard about that too and know guys who work on them. It's not magic wands that it will just decrypt everything about btc.

P.S. This is last post about this topic. You did not provide anything solid that BTC is not annoynmous. Some cases there because of user stupidity but if user want it can easily hide.


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SimonJones
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June 05, 2017, 06:22:12 AM
 #27

Bitcoin will not be made legal because India has very strict money laundering rules.
Is it possible to wire money to foreign trade exchanges? The answer is NO or extremely difficult - that's why the rate is so much higher in India because you cannot arbitrate with foreign exchanges. So why will the govt allow users to buy BTC with Indian Rupees and move it to other countries without restrictions? This is one main reason BTC cannot be made legal. How to stop people who are doing it (moving BTC out of the country) is another question.

Second reason is that Indian exchanges are amateur operations. See how many times the Indian exchanges go down or face problems with withdrawals and deposits. They are dealing with crores of rupees and BTC - it's a joke. Users face so many problems with these exchanges that it is inevitable that govt steps in to do something.

Third reason is that India is still backward in technology awareness and investing compared to other countries. (Compared to other countries, very few people invest in the Stock Market in India). A simple sms is enough to scam users even in investing in the stock market. How will you stop users from getting duped in BTC scams which will be much more complicated for the common investor to understand? These scams will undoubtedly force the govt. to do something - and it probably won't be good for BTC in India.
*Just look at this thread and the replies. It's like kids fighting with nothing to add. If this is the state of Indians in Bitcointalk, wonder about the common investors/people.

Fourth is in the forex market in India, only Rupee pairs are allowed. Why will the govt. allow BTC/Dollars or Dollars/Crypto when Rupee can easily be converted to BTC and so it can be indirectly traded with other currencies/cryptos?

But the problem for the govt is, how will they stop BTC trading? It's decentralized and and almost impossible to stop it. The govt. is in a big problem and the only thing it can do is wait and watch what happens or ban BTC/cryptos.

It's stupid to ask the govt. to come and regulate BTCs or make it legal like the exchanges in India are doing because the hands of the govt. are tied by it's own rules and regulations. What the exchanges should do is just wait and watch and buy more time. As other countries come up with regulations for BTC, it will make it easier for India to decide what to do too. Right now, the easiest solution for the govt. out of this mess is to ban BTC which would actually be bad for the country.

karan1498
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June 05, 2017, 06:37:17 AM
 #28

Bitcoin will not be made legal because India has very strict money laundering rules.
Is it possible to wire money to foreign trade exchanges? The answer is NO or extremely difficult - that's why the rate is so much higher in India because you cannot arbitrate with foreign exchanges.. So why will the govt allow users to buy BTC with Indian Rupees and move it to other countries without restrictions? This is one main reason BTC cannot be made legal. How to stop people who are doing it (moving BTC out of the country) is another question.

Second reason is that Indian exchanges are amateur operations. See how many times the Indian exchanges go down or face problems with withdrawals and deposits. It's a joke. Users face so many problems with these exchanges that it is inevitable that govt steps in to do something.

Third reason is the India is still backward in technology awareness compared to other countries. A simple sms is enough to scam users even in investing in the stock market. How will you stop users from getting duped in BTC scams which will be much more complicated for the common investor to understand? These scams will undoubtedly force the govt. to do something - and it probably won't be good for BTC in India.

Fourth is in the forex market in India, only Rupee pairs are allowed. Why will the govt. allow BTC/Dollars or Dollars/Crypto when Rupee can easily be converted to BTC and so it can be indirectly traded with other currencies/cryptos.

But the problem for the govt is, how will they stop BTC trading? It's decentralized and and almost impossible to stop it. The govt. is in a big problem and the only thing it can do is wait and watch what happens.

It's stupid to ask the govt. to come and regulate BTCs or make it legal like the exchanges in India are doing because the hands of the govt. are tied by it's own rules and regulations. The easiet solution for the govt. out of this mess is to ban BTC which would actually be bad for the country.



well said. these guyz dont understand these simple facts about indian govt and people of india .

Plus to all the people debating for anonymity of bitcoin, bitcoin was created for anonymity only , the biggest fact till now : we still dont know who is satoshi nakamoto , because the team wants to remain anonymous Smiley , if satoshi nakamoto was identified then ,today there would be no bitcoins in the world Smiley .


BTC , TOR , JULIAN ASSANGE are all big players in anonymity . So you never know whats going on .
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June 05, 2017, 06:56:39 AM
 #29

Bitcoin is not illegal in India. Bitcoin is legal under all existing laws of India. White paper are released by a leading law firm of india against bitcoin to be legal. Center of internet and society has also posted a nice article regarding this.

My personal view is that bitcoin is getting legal status in most countries so it will follow same fate in India.

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June 05, 2017, 06:57:45 AM
 #30

Bitcoin is not illegal in India. Bitcoin is legal under all existing laws of India. White paper are released by a leading law firm of india against bitcoin to be legal. Center of internet and society has also posted a nice article regarding this.

My personal view is that bitcoin is getting legal status in most countries so it will follow same fate in India.

please share link of whitepaper.
Smarty14392
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June 05, 2017, 07:33:01 AM
 #31

Bitcoin is not illegal in India. Bitcoin is legal under all existing laws of India. White paper are released by a leading law firm of india against bitcoin to be legal. Center of internet and society has also posted a nice article regarding this.

My personal view is that bitcoin is getting legal status in most countries so it will follow same fate in India.

please share link of whitepaper.
I cant post link here. I have send a link of pdf to your personal messege, you can check there. That has almost all legal knowledge of bitcoin. Feel free to contact me if any help needed thanks.

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June 05, 2017, 07:34:59 AM
 #32

Service like paypal is still illegal or unauthorised ,idk . So how do you expect btc to be legal in india. Basically its simple govt cannot earn from btc , govt is still only finding a way to how to earn from btc as they earn from corruption money  which is way too much and this is how India works. govt knows all the pros and cons of btc , and they cannot simply make it legal and earn from the fees of these exchanges. So all you guyz having dates for btc announcements from authorities and hoping to find an answer , dude its a very long run in India just within a month after taking btc into consideration it wont get legal. Paytm has got just permission to be a bank after years that too with the lowest limits .
Its people like you because of whom my father was asking me the other day : " Is bitcoin illegal in India?" It isnt illegal and never can be. It only depends on the way you use it that can make it illegal. I have seen people using it for money laundry and at the same time I have seen people filling up taxes on bitcoin. Its just the way you use it.


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Marma Kalari
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June 05, 2017, 08:48:37 PM
 #33

Its people like you because of whom my father was asking me the other day : " Is bitcoin illegal in India?" It isnt illegal and never can be. It only depends on the way you use it that can make it illegal. I have seen people using it for money laundry and at the same time I have seen people filling up taxes on bitcoin. Its just the way you use it.
If you have seen people using it to launder money then you should report it to the authorities and never aid those criminals because aiding them is supporting them. Tongue i am not a big time earner but i am paying my taxes and since the world is accepting bitcoin then there is no way India could oppose it,but you never know what stupid and surprising decision some people might take as some are willing to kill a human to save a cow.(those who follow the news will understand this)

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cryptoheadd
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June 05, 2017, 09:24:22 PM
 #34

I cant post link here. I have send a link of pdf to your personal messege, you can check there. That has almost all legal knowledge of bitcoin. Feel free to contact me if any help needed thanks.

Can you send me a link to the PDF as well?

Thanks

Edit: Sent you a PM. Smiley
@prashant
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June 06, 2017, 08:07:54 AM
 #35

Simple is that bitcoin is not authorized by government nor there is any news of banning it.bitcoin can be taken as virtual asset that now many indians are taking interest in investing their money in it so they can get profit.some of government members are against it because it is anonymous and before demonatisation black holders while hiding their money in it.

 Don't take it the wrong way but how on earth a transparent blockchain like BTC can be used to hide black money? why do people still think bitcoin is anonymous?


transparent in which sense?have you ever read satoshi whitepaper ?,it clearly tell you that bitcoin is a anonymous asset.regarding black money,kindly check bitcoin price in during India demonetisation,do not tell me it was coincidence in sudden surge in bitcoin price.if you check bitcoin analysis report ,you will find there was a great amount of bitcoin transaction done during demonetisation period.

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kabit9
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June 07, 2017, 12:58:56 PM
 #36

Service like paypal is still illegal or unauthorised.
Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

well said. these guyz dont understand these simple facts about indian govt and people of india .
please enlighten us about the simple facts...

Quote
BTC , TOR , JULIAN ASSANGE are all big players in anonymity . So you never know whats going on .
it's quite apparent that YOU never know whats going on, others seem to have a clue.

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stingers
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June 07, 2017, 04:57:47 PM
 #37

Its people like you because of whom my father was asking me the other day : " Is bitcoin illegal in India?" It isnt illegal and never can be. It only depends on the way you use it that can make it illegal. I have seen people using it for money laundry and at the same time I have seen people filling up taxes on bitcoin. Its just the way you use it.
If you have seen people using it to launder money then you should report it to the authorities and never aid those criminals because aiding them is supporting them. Tongue i am not a big time earner but i am paying my taxes and since the world is accepting bitcoin then there is no way India could oppose it,but you never know what stupid and surprising decision some people might take as some are willing to kill a human to save a cow.(those who follow the news will understand this)
Those guys were really organised and had more muscle power than I have right now. Plus they weren't harming me personally and fingering them would have been a grave threat to me. So i really don't care about what morals and ethics say, but I didnt have any reason to report them and it wasn't wise to report them.


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karan1498
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June 08, 2017, 07:34:01 AM
 #38

it's quite apparent that YOU never know whats going on, others seem to have a clue.

please enlighten us by the clues you have.

and i told paypal is illegal or unauthorised , " IDK" . I got it , It is restricted . So all you people try to understand you are taking this topic oppose to me only for paypal. :/
kabit9
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June 08, 2017, 08:08:51 AM
 #39

it's quite apparent that YOU never know whats going on, others seem to have a clue.

please enlighten us by the clues you have.

and i told paypal is illegal or unauthorised , " IDK" . I got it , It is restricted . So all you people try to understand you are taking this topic oppose to me only for paypal. :/

if you read the news, maybe you would have a clue too: http://www.businesstoday.in/current/economy-politics/how-to-buy-bitcoins-in-india-sell-legal-in-india-price/story/253734.html


do you know what PayPal is? have you used it? do you know what restricted means?

..C..
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........Finally C is .........
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karan1498
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June 09, 2017, 03:51:35 AM
 #40


How to buy/sell btc in india? is bitcoin legal or no?

These are the clues you want me to know? LOL
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