[4+ EH] Slush Pool (slushpool.com); Overt AsicBoost; World First Mining Pool

[Trongersoll]

Slush's pool is relatively popular. I'm a small miner, two 16 Mhash workers and one 6 Mhash worker, so i contemplate what being small means, how i am impacted. There are 5Ghash miners coming into existance now. there will be a time where they will reap huge shares until the difficulty adjusts to compensate for them. we had a 32 sec block? either great luck or a fast hasher.

once the difficulty adjusts, Mhashers will obviously become the slow guys, equivalent to the current CPU miners. But, considering the slow deliverys on the Ghash machines it will be sometime before the difficulty adjusts totally in their favor, probably 3-6 months.

The point is that with the fast machines coming into being we are going to see more and more blocks where we've been excluded from the payout or got a really small portion. But, the alternative is not mining. sure you could go to another pool where there is less competion for the share. But, small pools will have less of a chance of finding a block in the first place.

Maybe Slush needs to add more zeroes to the right of the decimal so we feel like we aren't mining for nothing. Or, we just accept that there will be some 0BTC blocks for us little guys. Personally, I like Slush's pool will hang in there. Someday there will be reasonable delivery times on Ghash machines and i'll be able to get some and claw my way back up to the level of the playing field. In the mean time anything that i get is better than not mining. I'm enjoying mining as a hobby, hobbies are rarely profitable.

What are you mining with? My i5 laptop can get 10+MHash! For a while I had a cluster of dual-core desktops I have access to (I don't pay the leckie and the ToU didn't prohibit it. Stopped when I got a "Theres some strange activity on your account" email from the admin) getting me 100+MHash and there can only have been 25 of them running at most!

heh, I built the little 6Mhash machine specifially to mine with. it has cost me $180 to build. it is using about 40watts. the two bigger Hashers are my desktop with two Nvidea  graphics cards. that was built for gaming and not mining. I only started on the desktop machine because i was having trouble getting the little machine running and wanted to see some progress.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004DDI0IE/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001H0BA24/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007ZT1FAI/ref=oh_details_o02_s01_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

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[Mikko8]

BTC0.0002 on #17792
BTC0.0014 on #17793
and 202 shares and counting for this round

I am signing off, too. It's too late here in Latvia. Thanks Kruncha! Thanks Lucko, you can stop today. Wouldn't be nice to ask others work while I sleep.
I am now at BTC0.0054. Thanks again! Will be back tomorrow with some screenshots and advising what not to do

[Mikko8]

Regarding BFL: I saw this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=114329.0 claiming thay are a scam. So, are they not?

[Kruncha]

BTC0.0002 on #17792
BTC0.0014 on #17793
and 202 shares and counting for this round

I am signing off, too. It's too late here in Latvia. Thanks Kruncha! Thanks Lucko, you can stop today. Wouldn't be nice to ask others work while I sleep.
I am now at BTC0.0054. Thanks again! Will be back tomorrow with some screenshots and advising what not to do

Your welcome, It was Lucko much more than me.

Regarding BFL: I saw this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=114329.0 claiming thay are a scam. So, are they not?

They are well overdue and have poor customer info skills, the rest is speculation. (I'm still unsure, being a bit paranoid with bitcoin will serve you well)

K.

[Lucko]

Regarding BFL: I saw this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=114329.0 claiming thay are a scam. So, are they not?

Nope: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6mmTRheUzg

[Lucko]

BTC0.0002 on #17792
BTC0.0014 on #17793
and 202 shares and counting for this round

I am signing off, too. It's too late here in Latvia. Thanks Kruncha! Thanks Lucko, you can stop today. Wouldn't be nice to ask others work while I sleep.
I am now at BTC0.0054. Thanks again! Will be back tomorrow with some screenshots and advising what not to do

OK blocks 17793 and 17794 were my donation... I hope you wake up to nice surprise I got you to 0.007 and someone else get you to 0.01...

[sinergy]

Ok, I am surprised that the scoring system works that way....

It means even if I am an ASIC miner if I have an outage of 90minutes due to a storm then I lose all my shares value. Everyone else profited from my shares. So down time is my enemy.

How does the score system work? (I am sorry for my ignorance!)

There are some resets of the scores also so after a reset you don't get any... 90 minutes is more then enough for reset to accrue... Probably more then once. So even 1000 ASIC wouldn't help... That way I was asking for pool to have a maintenance mode and that way I'm using backup PPS pool in time of maintenance... And also why backup pool is PPS. So I get something out... If the backup pool would use Slush method for short outage I would get close to 0. But then again I could be lucky... For some time I used PPLNS method but I got out about 10% of what I lost so PPS is probably much better... But then again I might be wrong...

Not how the "reset" works. It's more of a "renormalisation".

OK then way my scores goes to 0? If it was renormalisation it would be some small number... And since I have a lot of problems with my miner right now I see score 0 toooooo many times right now...

If you are having problems with your miner, you should probably get those resolved first before complaining about what slush is doing.  Seriously, when my miners are stable, which is almost all the time, my payouts are constant and regular.  I've never had to worry about the score normalizing.

About the score resets I just can't see how can they help. So lets suppose the resets are happening at each 90 minutes and I am constantly mining a block for 3 hours now. For this time I got two score resets which I would normally say it is OK. However the block is found after 3 hours and 10 minutes. Now I have been mining totally 190 minutes but I get the same score as those who joined just 5-10 minutes before the block is found. What is the point of using score when it resets on given period of time?

I do not mean to offend anyone and I am actually still a noob but am I missing something here or the score reset is faulted?

PS Off-topic after the OVH hack I would like to change my e-mail associated with the account but I just do not see such option. I am probably just blind   but is it possible to change the e-mail and from which menu?

[Kruncha]

PS Off-topic after the OVH hack I would like to change my e-mail associated with the account but I just do not see such option. I am probably just blind  but is it possible to change the e-mail and from which menu?

Go to 'my account', and at the top of the page go to 'account settings'.

EDIT: I like the scoring as it is, no one can plan to come in late, as some rounds are only a few minutes long. It balances out in the end.

K.

[Lucko]

About the score resets I just can't see how can they help. So lets suppose the resets are happening at each 90 minutes and I am constantly mining a block for 3 hours now. For this time I got two score resets which I would normally say it is OK. However the block is found after 3 hours and 10 minutes. Now I have been mining totally 190 minutes but I get the same score as those who joined just 5-10 minutes before the block is found. What is the point of using score when it resets on given period of time?

I do not mean to offend anyone and I am actually still a noob but am I missing something here or the score reset is faulted?

PS Off-topic after the OVH hack I would like to change my e-mail associated with the account but I just do not see such option. I am probably just blind   but is it possible to change the e-mail and from which menu?

Basely this is done so that pool hoppers get less on a longer runes since they take away from you on a shorter runs... So you loose only 2% of income not 20%... It is all explained in Slush annucment of implementation of the method. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1976.msg50002#msg50002

[sinergy]

Go to 'my account', and at the top of the page go to 'account settings'.

EDIT: I like the scoring as it is, no one can plan to come in late, as some rounds are only a few minutes long. It balances out in the end.

K.

Thank you Kruncha but at My Account I see just "Change the password" which I already did after the hack and "Delete my account". Don't have any menu for e-mail change.

About the score resets I just can't see how can they help. So lets suppose the resets are happening at each 90 minutes and I am constantly mining a block for 3 hours now. For this time I got two score resets which I would normally say it is OK. However the block is found after 3 hours and 10 minutes. Now I have been mining totally 190 minutes but I get the same score as those who joined just 5-10 minutes before the block is found. What is the point of using score when it resets on given period of time?

I do not mean to offend anyone and I am actually still a noob but am I missing something here or the score reset is faulted?

PS Off-topic after the OVH hack I would like to change my e-mail associated with the account but I just do not see such option. I am probably just blind  but is it possible to change the e-mail and from which menu?

Basely this is done so that pool hoppers get less on a longer runes since they take away from you on a shorter runs... So you loose only 2% of income not 20%... It is all explained in Slush annucment of implementation of the method. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1976.msg50002#msg50002

Lucko, its 2:40 AM here and I am probably missing something but let me try to explain what I see...

Pool hoppers get more on shorter runs and I understand that but what is the point of score reset? On shorter runs, there won't be enough time for the score to reset and the pool hoppers will screw me again. However on longer runs they will screw me again because the score resets on each xx minutes and even though I mined for several hours, a person that is switching pools each 5-15 minutes will get just the same score as mine after 3 hours of mining?

I do not want to offend anyone here and I personally think that Slush is a great guy (impressed me quite a lot during the hack outrages) but nevertheless I just can't get this resets...

Edit: Yes, before I started these score reset posts I already had read Slush's explanation on the topic, still the resets are not making any point to me.

[Kruncha]

Thank you Kruncha but at My Account I see just "Change the password" which I already did after the hack and "Delete my account". Don't have any menu for e-mail change.

Your right, sorry, I hadn't noticed. I've looked everywhere, and that option doesn't seem to be available .

K.

[sinergy]

Thank you Kruncha but at My Account I see just "Change the password" which I already did after the hack and "Delete my account". Don't have any menu for e-mail change.

Your right, sorry, I hadn't noticed. I've looked everywhere, and that option doesn't seem to be available .

K.

That's fine, I got the thought that maybe Slush disabled it after the hack so they can not steal our accounts but I was just not sure if I am missing something.

[Kruncha]

The score resets have nothing to do with pool hopping, they're simply reset when scores get to a certain size/capacity. The score reset doesn't affect your amount of shares. Pool hopping prevention is done by shares 'decaying' in value over time. so, yeah, if someone jumps in at the end of a round, they'll get a great reward for it. But, it's not possible to predict when a round will end, as we have seen it could be 5 seconds to 6+ hours.

K.

[nybbler905]

just got back home and checked what the morning CPU mining did... total of 7 shares found, dificulty 1 ( max of 1.1MHash/sec when firefox is closed etc ) and find the following block is calculated ( and time showing last 2 of them were at end of round )

17791    2013-05-01 20:01:25  5:00:24 36782329  7 0.00000000    234096   25.58139100

normaly i'd shrug it off due to the over 36 million shares, this time i know at least 2 shares were in the last few min of the round

Unfortunally for such long round you probably need last minute not last minutes at that speed...

i'd believe most of the advice and as I have previously stated ( somewhere in this thread ) getting 0E-8 is my ' usual ' for CPU mining.
That said, in another round i get the following.

17795    2013-05-01 23:34:54  0:26:48  3199350  1  0.00000002  234122  25.10240000

For the duration/shares versus timing of the share, it seems that there is something wrong with the system since DDos attacks.
I am not crying ' boo hoo, 7 shares and got squat ', to the contrary, i'm saying i KNOW i got 2 in the last 10 min of a round and got squat and not like the newly mentioned payout for only 1 share on a short round.  I also recommend for those that can LOG when/how many shares to do so and start looking at the timing of the depreciation of shares per round as I suspect that is the issue.
If I find more like this, I will not be posting it here, i'll be sending the info to Slush.  I ask you do the same.

This all could still be fallout from the attack and I do not mind the 10% Slush gets when I use GETWORK.  I do however mind if there is something wrong and no one looks in to it to see if they also are experiencing the issue so it can be looked at properly.  I never did say how many PCs i got CPU mining, just that I do CPU mining currently.

[organofcorti]

just got back home and checked what the morning CPU mining did... total of 7 shares found, dificulty 1 ( max of 1.1MHash/sec when firefox is closed etc ) and find the following block is calculated ( and time showing last 2 of them were at end of round )

17791    2013-05-01 20:01:25  5:00:24 36782329  7 0.00000000    234096   25.58139100

normaly i'd shrug it off due to the over 36 million shares, this time i know at least 2 shares were in the last few min of the round

Unfortunally for such long round you probably need last minute not last minutes at that speed...

i'd believe most of the advice and as I have previously stated ( somewhere in this thread ) getting 0E-8 is my ' usual ' for CPU mining.
That said, in another round i get the following.

17795    2013-05-01 23:34:54  0:26:48  3199350  1  0.00000002  234122  25.10240000

For the duration/shares versus timing of the share, it seems that there is something wrong with the system since DDos attacks.
I am not crying ' boo hoo, 7 shares and got squat ', to the contrary, i'm saying i KNOW i got 2 in the last 10 min of a round and got squat and not like the newly mentioned payout for only 1 share on a short round.  I also recommend for those that can LOG when/how many shares to do so and start looking at the timing of the depreciation of shares per round as I suspect that is the issue.
If I find more like this, I will not be posting it here, i'll be sending the info to Slush.  I ask you do the same.

This all could still be fallout from the attack and I do not mind the 10% Slush gets when I use GETWORK.  I do however mind if there is something wrong and no one looks in to it to see if they also are experiencing the issue so it can be looked at properly.  I never did say how many PCs i got CPU mining, just that I do CPU mining currently.

It's a bit tricky to guess what's going on here. I have no doubt you're seeing what you describe, but the only thing that can change your payment is a change in the score method, so it's probably not an error at the pool end.

Here's some ideas off the top of my head:
 * Slush's score method causes more variance for miners. CPU mining has a very low hashrate, with few shares submitted. Someone with a higher hashrate would see increases and decreases in their earnings, but if you are only submitting a few shares per round you'll see rounds where you have no reward at all, and others where you have more reward than expected (your expected reward per share is B/D, or bitcoin reward/difficulty).
 * As the pool hashrate increases its proportion of the network, your score decays faster since more shares are being scored in the same time period.
 * Slush might have changed the 'c' in the score method. As the pool increases its share of the network, 'c' must be increased to keep the pool less hoppable. Increasing 'c' increases the variance, so it wouldn't be surprising (in your case, at your hashrate) to get a bunch of 'no rewards" in a row.

None of these might be right, but it does give you an idea of the complexities involved.

[vs3]

just got back home and checked what the morning CPU mining did... total of 7 shares found, dificulty 1 ( max of 1.1MHash/sec when firefox is closed etc ) and find the following block is calculated ( and time showing last 2 of them were at end of round )

17791    2013-05-01 20:01:25  5:00:24 36782329  7 0.00000000    234096   25.58139100

normaly i'd shrug it off due to the over 36 million shares, this time i know at least 2 shares were in the last few min of the round

Unfortunally for such long round you probably need last minute not last minutes at that speed...

i'd believe most of the advice and as I have previously stated ( somewhere in this thread ) getting 0E-8 is my ' usual ' for CPU mining.
That said, in another round i get the following.

17795    2013-05-01 23:34:54  0:26:48  3199350  1  0.00000002  234122  25.10240000

For the duration/shares versus timing of the share, it seems that there is something wrong with the system since DDos attacks.
I am not crying ' boo hoo, 7 shares and got squat ', to the contrary, i'm saying i KNOW i got 2 in the last 10 min of a round and got squat and not like the newly mentioned payout for only 1 share on a short round.  I also recommend for those that can LOG when/how many shares to do so and start looking at the timing of the depreciation of shares per round as I suspect that is the issue.
If I find more like this, I will not be posting it here, i'll be sending the info to Slush.  I ask you do the same.

This all could still be fallout from the attack and I do not mind the 10% Slush gets when I use GETWORK.  I do however mind if there is something wrong and no one looks in to it to see if they also are experiencing the issue so it can be looked at properly.  I never did say how many PCs i got CPU mining, just that I do CPU mining currently.

Guys - I just did a quick check to see if I should be complaining of the way shares are calculated or not .. and got an unexpected result - see below

The "non-exp value" column was just a straight %-based calculation (my % of shares as part of the total - 2% fee). For the record - my average hash rate is around 900MH/s.
(PM me if you want the raw .xls file)

#   Block found at   Duration   Total shares   Your shares   Your BTC reward   Block #   Block value   Validity   non-exp BTC   diff   diff, %
17798   5/2/2013 02:36   02:32:25   18926024   1959   0.0021944800   234140   25.3631500000              0.0025727899   (0.0003783099)   (14.70)
17797   5/2/2013 00:04   00:20:39   2524877   239   0.0023771300   234126   25.2525000200              0.0023425460   0.0000345840    1.48
17796   5/1/2013 23:43   00:08:50   1088076   113   0.0026432800   234123   25.4665500000              0.0025918831   0.0000513969    1.98
17795   5/1/2013 23:34   00:26:48   3199350   332   0.0030787500   234122   25.1024000000              0.0025528051   0.0005259449    20.60
17794   5/1/2013 23:08   00:54:00   6434057   694   0.0026248300   234118   26.1599000100              0.0027652648   (0.0001404348)   (5.08)
17793   5/1/2013 22:14   00:06:53   837922   75   0.0021734500   234107   25.3016400000              0.0022193838   (0.0000459338)   (2.07)
17792   5/1/2013 22:07   02:05:48   15164478   1541   0.0029759200   234105   25.0000000000              0.0024896670   0.0004862530    19.53
17791   5/1/2013 20:01   05:00:24   36782329   3889   0.0026115300   234096   25.5813910000              0.0026506290   (0.0000390990)   (1.48)
17790   5/1/2013 15:01   01:04:02   4347321   476   0.0031200000   234069   25.1445935100              0.0026980869   0.0004219131    15.64
17788   5/1/2013 13:56   01:37:25   11785876   1262   0.0027317000   234062   25.3624057100              0.0026614236   0.0000702764    2.64
17787   5/1/2013 12:19   00:43:01   5192237   541   0.0022621400   234050   25.1066000000              0.0025636382   (0.0003014982)   (11.76)
17786   5/1/2013 11:36   02:54:05   20879847   2279   0.0028000700   234048   25.1799600000              0.0026933831   0.0001066869    3.96
17785   5/1/2013 08:42   02:09:13   15234727   1597   0.0020876700   234041   25.0298000000   confirmed   0.0025713056   (0.0004836356)   (18.81)
17784   5/1/2013 06:33   00:49:16   5723542   581   0.0023853700   234023   25.1871000100   confirmed   0.0025056217   (0.0001202517)   (4.80)
17783   5/1/2013 05:43   00:18:44   2170999   240   0.0028526300   234014   25.2799574200   confirmed   0.0027387604   0.0001138696    4.16
17782   5/1/2013 05:25   00:24:04   2825058   286   0.0029775400   234012   25.4393658300   confirmed   0.0025238935   0.0004536465    17.97
17781   5/1/2013 05:01   00:57:51   6673060   811   0.0027347900   234010   25.4912000100   confirmed   0.0030360728   (0.0003012828)   (9.92)
17780   5/1/2013 04:03   00:12:34   1482016   164   0.0029840100   234002   25.4611940000   confirmed   0.0027611869   0.0002228231    8.07
17779   5/1/2013 03:50   00:20:56   2425366   284   0.0026129900   234001   25.1994000000   confirmed   0.0028917273   (0.0002787373)   (9.64)
17778   5/1/2013 03:29   00:24:00   2767926   311   0.0029644700   233998   25.3604159600   confirmed   0.0027924690   0.0001720010    6.16
17777   5/1/2013 03:05   00:40:08   4582519   513   0.0034625700   233995   25.4935847600   confirmed   0.0027968558   0.0006657142    23.80
17776   5/1/2013 02:25   02:25:43   16453036   1873   0.0029811200   233992   25.4016363200   confirmed   0.0028338672   0.0001472528    5.20
17775   4/30/2013 23:59   03:34:17   24772020   2752   0.0026284900   233974   25.2387222200   confirmed   0.0027477704   (0.0001192804)   (4.34)
17774   4/30/2013 20:25   02:03:23   14233698   1578   0.0025780100   233955   25.3464811700   confirmed   0.0027538038   (0.0001757938)   (6.38)
17773   4/30/2013 18:22   00:25:12   2885972   322   0.0026078800   233943   25.1313000000   confirmed   0.0027479245   (0.0001400445)   (5.10)
17772   4/30/2013 17:57   00:22:15   2543353   289   0.0029461900   233937   25.3707005900   confirmed   0.0028252035   0.0001209865    4.28
17771   4/30/2013 17:34   00:00:35   51130   3   0.0015165600   233934   25.2156100000   confirmed   0.0014499099   0.0000666501    4.60
17770   4/30/2013 17:34   02:18:03   15697265   1802   0.0028537800   233933   25.5807000000   confirmed   0.0028778576   (0.0000240776)   (0.84)
17769   4/30/2013 15:16   00:07:59   927381   105   0.0030657500   233923   25.2111000000   confirmed   0.0027973640   0.0002683860    9.59
17768   4/30/2013 15:08   01:31:02   10285822   1188   0.0024144400   233921   25.1781000400   confirmed   0.0028498793   (0.0004354393)   (15.28)
Total:                                       258897284   28099   0.0802475400              759.6374585800              0.0793029735   0.0009445665    1.19

So although on a few rounds I was significantly towards the losing end, it seems the rounds where I was closer to the winning end not only compensated but actually I'm at a 1.19% bonus

I'll be curious to see how others compare - if anyone else wants to do a similar check and share the results.

[favelle75]

Hey guys, sorry if this has already been asked, but is there a backlog of "unconfirmed rewards"? Mine seem to be accumulating rapidly (as expected), but that is it...they are not converting to "confirmed reward" really at all.

[silicont]

We should have a sticky/faq for miners under 700mhs.  There are lots of repeat questions and chatter in the lower mhs ranks.  I'm only at ~2ghs and there's nothing to talk about from my perspective--fair, even, consistent and well supported pool...

[killingtime]

One thing to note for the low mhash users, there was recently an increase in the bitcoin difficulty, thus causing a reduction in overall share value, and in terms of a pseudo-proportional scoring system like on slush's pool, that means your score will go down, and thus your reward.  I see some people talking about how things are "different" after the DDoS attack, but coincident to this attack, was the recent bump in difficultly, thus making a before/after comparison moot.

[vs3]

[...] fair, even, consistent and well supported pool...

+1