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Author Topic: [CLOSED] - Stumptown Miners - Avalon PCB Assembly - West Coast USA  (Read 30535 times)
Kushedout
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May 21, 2013, 03:17:28 PM
 #81

Interested in 6  K64s.

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May 21, 2013, 03:18:13 PM
 #82

Also interested, but on the eastcoast. Anyone tried an eastcoast assembler? I would be interested in K16 and K1 if possible.
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May 21, 2013, 06:56:44 PM
 #83

Also interested, but on the eastcoast. Anyone tried an eastcoast assembler? I would be interested in K16 and K1 if possible.

+1
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May 21, 2013, 07:05:28 PM
 #84

Also interested, but on the eastcoast. Anyone tried an eastcoast assembler? I would be interested in K16 and K1 if possible.

+1

Steamboat is in FL and working on something.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2225167#msg2225167

I'm fairly sure you don't have to be in his group buy.
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May 21, 2013, 07:07:05 PM
 #85

Also interested, but on the eastcoast. Anyone tried an eastcoast assembler? I would be interested in K16 and K1 if possible.

+1

Steamboat is in FL and working on something.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2225167#msg2225167

I'm fairly sure you don't have to be in his group buy.

I have been following steamboat and have been very tempted to just pull the trigger on batch 3. I guess I did not see if HE was the assembler or if he HAD an assembler. He is across the alley for me, so I'll bug him some more.
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May 21, 2013, 07:09:11 PM
 #86

Also interested, but on the eastcoast. Anyone tried an eastcoast assembler? I would be interested in K16 and K1 if possible.

+1

+2 I am on the east coast as well.

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May 21, 2013, 07:14:41 PM
 #87

For the people interested in the K64 boards...aren't you concerned that if the board goes bad it takes out all 64 chips from your mining?
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May 21, 2013, 09:26:22 PM
 #88

For the people interested in the K64 boards...aren't you concerned that if the board goes bad it takes out all 64 chips from your mining?

If you read the Klondike thread (or at least just BkkCoins' posts in that thread), it appears that the chips are organized in clusters of 8 and that the worst-case scenario has one chip taking out a cluster of 8. The K64s are little more than four K16s printed on a single PCB and pre-wired together. I understand that there are a couple of components that can be omitted in that particular configuration, but that's basically all they are. Thus the worst-case scenario for chip failure on a K64 also only has a bank of 8 being taken out. (And more realistically, BkkCoins contends that in most scenarios a bad chip would just generate bad hashes, which would get ignored, and the other 7 chips would stay in commission.)
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May 23, 2013, 08:35:47 PM
 #89

In the interests of transparency, here's a list of companies I've contacted for quotes so far:
- Sunstone Circuits
- RelianceCM
- Westak
- Colin Fitzgerald
- Cascade Systems Technology (Still out. I dropped the ball and just today picked it up again.)
- Hi-Tek Electronics
- SMT NW (Still out. No reply since 8 days ago, so I'm counting them out for now.)
- PCB Unlimited
- Screaming Circuits
- Bright Manufacturing
- PJRC.com
- ESP Seattle (Still out. No reply since 7 days ago, so I'm counting them out for now.)
- Two or three California plants that only had contact forms on their websites. (They never emailed me, so I wasn't able to find any records in my inbox.)

I also had someone from Dorkbot offer to beat whatever price I could find online if I paid half the price of a pick and place machine. I'll be following up with them later, but for now I'm going with Tate Technology's quote.

I plan on opening escrow and figuring out batches soon, as I think I've got a good enough feel for how much this is going to cost now.
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May 24, 2013, 01:51:25 AM
Last edit: May 24, 2013, 02:12:05 AM by Vycid
 #90

In the interests of transparency, here's a list of companies I've contacted for quotes so far:
- Sunstone Circuits
- RelianceCM
- Westak
- Colin Fitzgerald
- Cascade Systems Technology (Still out. I dropped the ball and just today picked it up again.)
- Hi-Tek Electronics
- SMT NW (Still out. No reply since 8 days ago, so I'm counting them out for now.)
- PCB Unlimited
- Screaming Circuits
- Bright Manufacturing
- PJRC.com
- ESP Seattle (Still out. No reply since 7 days ago, so I'm counting them out for now.)
- Two or three California plants that only had contact forms on their websites. (They never emailed me, so I wasn't able to find any records in my inbox.)

I also had someone from Dorkbot offer to beat whatever price I could find online if I paid half the price of a pick and place machine. I'll be following up with them later, but for now I'm going with Tate Technology's quote.

I plan on opening escrow and figuring out batches soon, as I think I've got a good enough feel for how much this is going to cost now.

Awesome. Thanks for doing all this legwork.

Are you seriously entertaining quotes from California companies? There's some plants in the valley I could take a look at, if you'd like - seems like the least I could do. Been too busy the past couple weeks to send any RFQs.

I've got some concerns about how the Avalon chips are going to be loaded into a pick-and-place. I assume they come on reels of 10,000 (can anyone confirm?) but they're going to be all cut up into strips by the time they get to you. Any ideas?

Also, it occurs to me that we haven't discussed heatsinks. I imagine you might want those included with the miners, right? I'll start looking at prices in order to get a ballpark figure, but from what I've seen on the Klondike thread, I expect that to kick the price up by $3 to $5.

I'd defintely want them on my boards, or at least included. It'd be tough buying heatsinks at a good price as an individual. $3 to $5 wouldn't be bad at all. I'd be more concerned that we actually won't be able to get enough of them - heatsinks tend to be made-to-order rather than off-the-shelf.

Vycid

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May 24, 2013, 04:07:36 AM
 #91

Awesome. Thanks for doing all this legwork.

No problem! :-)

Are you seriously entertaining quotes from California companies? There's some plants in the valley I could take a look at, if you'd like - seems like the least I could do. Been too busy the past couple weeks to send any RFQs.

Yeah, I'd be alright with Californian companies. They're within driving distance for me. Idaho would work too, honestly, if there are any Idahoans reading this. But they'd have to be able to offer *very* competitive rates. ~$45 for assembly seems pretty good...

I've got some concerns about how the Avalon chips are going to be loaded into a pick-and-place. I assume they come on reels of 10,000 (can anyone confirm?) but they're going to be all cut up into strips by the time they get to you. Any ideas?

I'm hoping to get in contact with the people running the group buys for the people involved in this effort and having them send all the chips from each given group-buy as single, long strips. If that fails, I can just get the cut tape spliced together.

I'd defintely want them on my boards, or at least included. It'd be tough buying heatsinks at a good price as an individual. $3 to $5 wouldn't be bad at all. I'd be more concerned that we actually won't be able to get enough of them - heatsinks tend to be made-to-order rather than off-the-shelf.

That's fair. I admit that I haven't spent much time sourcing heatsinks. It looks like there's at least one viable, BkkCoins-approved design on the Klondike thread now, though, so I'll start looking for sources.
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May 24, 2013, 04:11:29 AM
 #92

Have you made any arrangements with BkkCoins about getting programed PIC chips?
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May 24, 2013, 04:15:47 AM
 #93

No, I haven't. I was planning on sourcing and programming the PICs myself.
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May 24, 2013, 04:26:06 AM
 #94

No, I haven't. I was planning on sourcing and programming the PICs myself.
Sounds good if BkkCoins releases a image file to load into the PIC.
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May 24, 2013, 04:36:50 AM
 #95

Sounds good if BkkCoins releases a image file to load into the PIC.

It sounds like they're open to the idea of releasing it to specific vendors who are willing to pay them a fee per PIC.

Now, regarding escrow, is it alright with everyone if I gave JohnK my personal identity and then held the funds myself? I'm going to have to pay the assembly and fabrication plants and I don't have enough money on hand to fund a full batch of 100 on my own. If I fail to deliver, JohnK will release my personal information and you all can choose to pursue legal action.

Are there any objections to this arrangement?
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May 24, 2013, 05:01:05 AM
 #96

Now, regarding escrow, is it alright with everyone if I gave JohnK my personal identity and then held the funds myself? I'm going to have to pay the assembly and fabrication plants and I don't have enough money on hand to fund a full batch of 100 on my own. If I fail to deliver, JohnK will release my personal information and you all can choose to pursue legal action.

Are there any objections to this arrangement?

That's totally fine with me. I know you from raginazn628's group buy and have every reason to believe you're on the level.

I assume you want BTC?



Are you seriously entertaining quotes from California companies? There's some plants in the valley I could take a look at, if you'd like - seems like the least I could do. Been too busy the past couple weeks to send any RFQs.

Yeah, I'd be alright with Californian companies. They're within driving distance for me. Idaho would work too, honestly, if there are any Idahoans reading this. But they'd have to be able to offer *very* competitive rates. ~$45 for assembly seems pretty good...


It is pretty good, and most of the companies I know of mostly deal in high-end networking or military hardware. On the bright side, their volumes are usually low, but $45 is hard to beat.


I've got some concerns about how the Avalon chips are going to be loaded into a pick-and-place. I assume they come on reels of 10,000 (can anyone confirm?) but they're going to be all cut up into strips by the time they get to you. Any ideas?


I'm hoping to get in contact with the people running the group buys for the people involved in this effort and having them send all the chips from each given group-buy as single, long strips. If that fails, I can just get the cut tape spliced together.


Ok, all the people involved in this will need to verify the transfer with their respective group buys, then. That should probably get worked out sooner rather than later. It does have the potential to save the group buy operators some trouble, so hopefully they'll be on board.

We should probably give raginazn628 a heads up and see what he thinks.



I'd defintely want them on my boards, or at least included. It'd be tough buying heatsinks at a good price as an individual. $3 to $5 wouldn't be bad at all. I'd be more concerned that we actually won't be able to get enough of them - heatsinks tend to be made-to-order rather than off-the-shelf.

That's fair. I admit that I haven't spent much time sourcing heatsinks. It looks like there's at least one viable, BkkCoins-approved design on the Klondike thread now, though, so I'll start looking for sources.

Ok. Have you seen this?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=208381.0

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May 24, 2013, 05:01:29 AM
 #97

That's totally fine with me. I know you from raginazn628's pool and have every reason to believe you're on the level.

Thanks!

I assume you want BTC?

Yep. I'll be converting it to USD upon receipt, though. I have to pay the plants in USD and I don't particularly want to get screwed by exchange rates.

Yeah, for this volume $45 is really pretty excellent, and most of the companies I know of are really more for high end network or military hardware. Couldn't hurt to try, I guess.

True facts. As for myself, though, I've decided to assume Tate's is the cheapest (barring that guy on Dorkbot proving to be legit) and start looking at heatsinks and components. I also need to source PCB fabrication, but I'm not too worried about that since there wasn't much variation among the preliminary fabrication quotes I was getting earlier. (They were all about $10 each for quantities over 100.)
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May 24, 2013, 05:06:01 AM
 #98

Ok. Going to have to get all the people involved in this to verify with their respective pools, then. It does have the potential to save the group buy operators some trouble, so hopefully they'll be on board.
My thoughts exactly. I'm going to put together a simple website to start taking bitcoin and registering how many chips to expect from each group buy soon. Right now my freelance work is pretty much taking up all my time, but I should get a chance to put it together soon.

We should probably give raginazn628 a heads up and see what he thinks.

Yeah, definitely. I'll probably send him a message once I have some hard numbers to lend more weight to my request.
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May 24, 2013, 05:32:47 AM
Last edit: May 24, 2013, 05:59:29 AM by Vycid
 #99

Ok. Going to have to get all the people involved in this to verify with their respective pools, then. It does have the potential to save the group buy operators some trouble, so hopefully they'll be on board.
My thoughts exactly. I'm going to put together a simple website to start taking bitcoin and registering how many chips to expect from each group buy soon. Right now my freelance work is pretty much taking up all my time, but I should get a chance to put it together soon.

Here's a thought: each group buy had a public address that was associated with it. Based on the prices and fees for each group buy, it'd be straightforward to make a formula to calculate how many chips each sending address purchased.

In order to use the website, perhaps the payment for board assembly has to come from the same address that was used to purchase chips, so it can be verified that X number of chips (less than or equal to the number of chips on the boards being made) actually belong to that person. That'd constitute proof, in the blockchain, for the group buy operators to release those chips... assuming the chip ownership wasn't transferred after the fact (that'd have to be handled through the forums).

Or perhaps there's a better way to do this. It does seem a little convoluted, but I'm imagining scammers trying to get boards made with other peoples' chips.



Edit: After 5 minutes of thinking about it, this is a terrible idea. Maybe it's good for settling disputes, but it shouldn't be the primary verification method.

The pool operators just need the individuals that want to redirect their chips to you to inform them the same way they initially provided shipping info. Since the pool operators are trusted entities, they can simply provide you a list of everyone who redirected their chips. (All of this assumes the pool operators will be amenable to the idea of redirecting chips in the first place).

What YOU need, then, is some way to connect payment for the boards to the identity of the individuals who provided chips. You COULD use the blockchain method I described, but that has the complication of post-order ownership transfer. Since the pool operators will probably be providing you forum usernames, maybe the website could spit out a confirmation code that we'd PM to you.

Sorry about the brain dump, hope something useful came out of it.

Edit 2: Oh, duh, just put the forum username into the website. I'm a little slow today.


Let me consolidate the rambling into a coherent suggestion:

1) It's recommended we use the same address to send bitcoins for making the boards that we originally used buy the chips. This will help settle any disputes that arise.

2) We pay up front for boards on the website, and leave our forum username and probably an email address.

3) We inform group buy operators about the change in delivery address. Hopefully they'll be OK with this (since it saves them shipping $ and trouble), and they'll provide you a list of forum usernames that are now sending chips to you (and the associated number of chips).

4) You can validate the people rerouting chips against the people who paid on your website using forum usernames, as well ensuring they're not having more boards made than they're having chips sent.

5) Hopefully this means nobody gets scammed.

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May 24, 2013, 07:08:05 AM
 #100

So far I like how this thread has been going, I was wondering just in case BTC crashes to 80-90$ levels.
Is it OK if I paid you in USD when it comes time to order?
Heck we can even meet up for a few drinks with the other local miners too  Grin
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