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Author Topic: PPLNS  (Read 718 times)
shine_
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September 26, 2017, 03:34:42 PM
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Hi, I wanted to clarify a couple of things regarding PPLNS pool system. As far as I understand, your shares are evenly distributed to average shares needed for a round. What I'm trying to say - if the round is shorter than average, some part of your shares go to the next round. And if the round is longer, it'e being cut. Is it correct ? Also I'm curious about a couple of things :
  • Is it possible to get shares for multiple rounds ahead ? Let's say we're super lucky for 5 rounds in a row and hit them 10 times faster than usual
  • How exactly nanopool system works ? They have PPLNS over time. So if the time is 20 minutes, I'm getting my shares averaged out for next 20 minutes or what ?
  • Is there some possibility to get advantage/disadvantage mining at specific time ? Like pool hopping or something
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AlphaWolf
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September 27, 2017, 09:29:04 PM
 #2

Hi, I wanted to clarify a couple of things regarding PPLNS pool system. As far as I understand, your shares are evenly distributed to average shares needed for a round. What I'm trying to say - if the round is shorter than average, some part of your shares go to the next round. And if the round is longer, it'e being cut. Is it correct ? Also I'm curious about a couple of things :
  • Is it possible to get shares for multiple rounds ahead ? Let's say we're super lucky for 5 rounds in a row and hit them 10 times faster than usual
  • How exactly nanopool system works ? They have PPLNS over time. So if the time is 20 minutes, I'm getting my shares averaged out for next 20 minutes or what ?
  • Is there some possibility to get advantage/disadvantage mining at specific time ? Like pool hopping or something

It is not possible to get shares for multiple rounds. At least unknown as positive for me.
About how it works, you can see here - https://eth.nanopool.org/help
Pool hopping is a waste of time.
doublebit21
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October 04, 2017, 09:53:22 AM
 #3

Hi, I wanted to clarify a couple of things regarding PPLNS pool system. As far as I understand, your shares are evenly distributed to average shares needed for a round. What I'm trying to say - if the round is shorter than average, some part of your shares go to the next round. And if the round is longer, it'e being cut. Is it correct ? Also I'm curious about a couple of things :
  • Is it possible to get shares for multiple rounds ahead ? Let's say we're super lucky for 5 rounds in a row and hit them 10 times faster than usual
  • How exactly nanopool system works ? They have PPLNS over time. So if the time is 20 minutes, I'm getting my shares averaged out for next 20 minutes or what ?
  • Is there some possibility to get advantage/disadvantage mining at specific time ? Like pool hopping or something

First of all, if you’re talking about PPLNS it’s important to understand how it works. One round is the time between the first share after the last found block and the share which solves a block. PPLNS however means that we no longer consider valid shares of one round, but we consider a number N of shares, no matter if they’re apart of the round or not. The number N is currently for each blockchain twice the difficulty (actually rounded down to an easy to calculate integer value). The important point is that you as loyal pool member have an advantage over pool hoppers. Even if you only mine occasionally, such as if you want silence in your mining room for once, you still have an advantage.
BitcoinPC
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October 31, 2017, 03:25:26 PM
 #4

Hi, I wanted to clarify a couple of things regarding PPLNS pool system. As far as I understand, your shares are evenly distributed to average shares needed for a round. What I'm trying to say - if the round is shorter than average, some part of your shares go to the next round. And if the round is longer, it'e being cut. Is it correct ? Also I'm curious about a couple of things :
  • Is it possible to get shares for multiple rounds ahead ? Let's say we're super lucky for 5 rounds in a row and hit them 10 times faster than usual
  • How exactly nanopool system works ? They have PPLNS over time. So if the time is 20 minutes, I'm getting my shares averaged out for next 20 minutes or what ?
  • Is there some possibility to get advantage/disadvantage mining at specific time ? Like pool hopping or something

Suffice it to say this and be less complicated.  PPLNS is best for those that jump the pools. You can use it either way, but that is the best use for that protocol. If a site is fairly trusted and used that protocol, then it is going to be the same. I hope you get this point clear here.

kano
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November 01, 2017, 06:32:06 AM
 #5

Hi, I wanted to clarify a couple of things regarding PPLNS pool system. As far as I understand, your shares are evenly distributed to average shares needed for a round. What I'm trying to say - if the round is shorter than average, some part of your shares go to the next round. And if the round is longer, it'e being cut. Is it correct ? Also I'm curious about a couple of things :
  • Is it possible to get shares for multiple rounds ahead ? Let's say we're super lucky for 5 rounds in a row and hit them 10 times faster than usual
  • How exactly nanopool system works ? They have PPLNS over time. So if the time is 20 minutes, I'm getting my shares averaged out for next 20 minutes or what ?
  • Is there some possibility to get advantage/disadvantage mining at specific time ? Like pool hopping or something
Point 1:
Anyone who makes any comment about loyalty and not hopping does not understand PPLNS.
PPLNS is hop-proof for all but diff changes - but even then it's next to pointless trying to hop diff changes since your gain will be next to nothing.
Thus it doesn't matter if you hop or don't hop - if you are loyal or not loyal - makes no difference.
The main point of this is that no one  can predict when a pool will find a block.
Some people are delusional and think they can, but they cannot.
So hopping PPLNS is pointless Tongue

Point 2:
Your shares will be rewarded 0, 1 or multiple times.
The expected number of times is based on the pool's N value used.
e.g. like my pool we use 5 times the network difficulty, so you expect, if luck is 100%, to get 5 rewards of 1/5 of the share's value, thus total = the shares value.

Thus to answer what would appear to be your main question: If the pool luck is above 100% then shares will be rewarded better than expected, on low fee PPLNS.

Pool: https://kano.is Here on Bitcointalk: Forum BTC: 1KanoPb8cKYqNrswjaA8cRDk4FAS9eDMLU
FreeNode IRC: irc.freenode.net channel #kano.is Majority developer of the ckpool code
Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with full block verification on all blocks - and NO empty blocks!
majestymage
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November 01, 2017, 08:02:24 PM
 #6

Hi, I wanted to clarify a couple of things regarding PPLNS pool system. As far as I understand, your shares are evenly distributed to average shares needed for a round. What I'm trying to say - if the round is shorter than average, some part of your shares go to the next round. And if the round is longer, it'e being cut. Is it correct ? Also I'm curious about a couple of things :
  • Is it possible to get shares for multiple rounds ahead ? Let's say we're super lucky for 5 rounds in a row and hit them 10 times faster than usual
  • How exactly nanopool system works ? They have PPLNS over time. So if the time is 20 minutes, I'm getting my shares averaged out for next 20 minutes or what ?
  • Is there some possibility to get advantage/disadvantage mining at specific time ? Like pool hopping or something
Point 1:
Anyone who makes any comment about loyalty and not hopping does not understand PPLNS.
PPLNS is hop-proof for all but diff changes - but even then it's next to pointless trying to hop diff changes since your gain will be next to nothing.
Thus it doesn't matter if you hop or don't hop - if you are loyal or not loyal - makes no difference.
The main point of this is that no one  can predict when a pool will find a block.
Some people are delusional and think they can, but they cannot.
So hopping PPLNS is pointless Tongue

Point 2:
Your shares will be rewarded 0, 1 or multiple times.
The expected number of times is based on the pool's N value used.
e.g. like my pool we use 5 times the network difficulty, so you expect, if luck is 100%, to get 5 rewards of 1/5 of the share's value, thus total = the shares value.


Thus to answer what would appear to be your main question: If the pool luck is above 100% then shares will be rewarded better than expected, on low fee PPLNS.
using more than 1 network difficulty in calculating pplns makes it impossible for the pool hoppers to get a real deal out of their maneuvers.

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