[OPEN] Confirmed*PAID* USA NO VAT KnC Neptune#3 - .25 BTC = 17 Shares = ~60 Gh/s

[siliclone]

I cosign every cynical and accusatory post here. This thing smells to high heaven.

[danieldaniel]

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I cosign every cynical and accusatory post here. This thing smells to high heaven.

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[siliclone]

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I cosign every cynical and accusatory post here. This thing smells to high heaven.

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Much obliged.

[prodigits7]

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I cosign every cynical and accusatory post here. This thing smells to high heaven.

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Daniel would you care to meet with me tomorrow? I know you're on the East Coast as well. Let's settle all this in person, you could then relay all the progress to rest of the people in this group. This will provided the transparency needed so there won't be any more accusations by the severely misguided people on here.

I'm just fuckin sick of this shit. Please make time in your schedule for me tomorrow. Thanks daniel

[danieldaniel]

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I cosign every cynical and accusatory post here. This thing smells to high heaven.

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Daniel would you care to meet with me tomorrow? I know you're on the East Coast as well. Let's settle all this in person, you could then relay all the progress to rest of the people in this group. This will provided the transparency needed so there won't be any more accusations by the severely misguided people on here.

I'm just fuckin sick of this shit. Please make time in your schedule for me tomorrow. Thanks daniel

Hehe, I was just joking about the signature (because he said "cosign").

Anyways, I have to think about that.  I try not to meet with people from online (no offense).  I'll let you know.

[prodigits7]

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I cosign every cynical and accusatory post here. This thing smells to high heaven.

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Daniel would you care to meet with me tomorrow? I know you're on the East Coast as well. Let's settle all this in person, you could then relay all the progress to rest of the people in this group. This will provided the transparency needed so there won't be any more accusations by the severely misguided people on here.

I'm just fuckin sick of this shit. Please make time in your schedule for me tomorrow. Thanks daniel

Hehe, I was just joking about the signature (because he said "cosign").

Anyways, I have to think about that.  I try not to meet with people from online (no offense).  I'll let you know.

I totally understand where's your coming from. It could be in a public place of your choice. I'm also free today if that's easier for you.

[physalis]

Daniel would you care to meet with me tomorrow? I know you're on the East Coast as well. Let's settle all this in person, you could then relay all the progress to rest of the people in this group. This will provided the transparency needed so there won't be any more accusations by the severely misguided people on here.

I'm just fuckin sick of this shit. Please make time in your schedule for me tomorrow. Thanks daniel

If you're just an honest guy helping us out here, you have nothing to fear. You'll get rewarded nicely by the many people who'll tip you for your help, if you get them their money back. You'll not just be doing this to be a nice guy like you want to picture it, you'll end up sacking a lot of money by it. So please stop with the "I'm sick of this shit" martyr attitude.

And you have to understand our suspicions. People are afraid of losing a lot of money here. And it's very easy for a scammer to have a sock puppet running around that tells people everything is on track and keeps delaying and delaying.

I don't think you need to meet with more people for anything, what would that accomplish? Please just answer the questions that you've been asked:

- what is the deal with the whole august 20th movement now? Was that the day the miners were payed or not?
- you are saying "there will be serious risk involved with virtually every step in the refund process". What is that supposed to mean? There is no "risk". It should be quite easy and not at all involve ragin's Paypal account. Only KnC sending the money back (they don't have to send it back to ragin's PP!) and you buying btc back and assigning it to the people here. There might be some loss in the btc conversion, so people might not get all their btc back, but that's about it.
- what actual problems do you see in getting this done within the next days?

[prodigits7]

Daniel would you care to meet with me tomorrow? I know you're on the East Coast as well. Let's settle all this in person, you could then relay all the progress to rest of the people in this group. This will provided the transparency needed so there won't be any more accusations by the severely misguided people on here.

I'm just fuckin sick of this shit. Please make time in your schedule for me tomorrow. Thanks daniel

If you're just an honest guy helping us out here, you have nothing to fear. You'll get rewarded nicely by the many people who'll tip you for your help, if you get them their money back. You'll not just be doing this to be a nice guy like you want to picture it, you'll end up sacking a lot of money by it. So please stop with the "I'm sick of this shit" martyr attitude.

And you have to understand our suspicions. People are afraid of losing a lot of money here. And it's very easy for a scammer to have a sock puppet running around that tells people everything is on track and keeps delaying and delaying.

I don't think you need to meet with more people for anything, what would that accomplish? Please just answer the questions that you've been asked:

- what is the deal with the whole august 20th movement now? Was that the day the miners were payed or not?
- you are saying "there will be serious risk involved with virtually every step in the refund process". What is that supposed to mean? There is no "risk". It should be quite easy and not at all involve ragin's Paypal account. Only KnC sending the money back (they don't have to send it back to ragin's PP!) and you buying btc back and assigning it to the people here. There might be some loss in the btc conversion, so people might not get all their btc back, but that's about it.
- what actual problems do you see in getting this done within the next days?

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that not all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

So when I say "risks", I mean things like that. Imagine getting the refund from KnCMiner finally but we can't touch our funds for another 6 months.

You have to be prepared for those risks. Just doing my best to mitigate that risk and other unforeseen circumstances that may arise from that.

[jongaper]

PRODIGITS, since the Jupiter 2, was not purchased, can thus refund be executed ASAP, as KNC was not sent money for this miner

[floatyfish]

PRODIGITS, since the Jupiter 2, was not purchased, can thus refund be executed ASAP, as KNC was not sent money for this miner

I believe that due to so many people filing complaints against Raging, they froze his account so the money can't be transferred out at this time.

[physalis]

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that now all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

Thanks for the information.

About paypal: Believe me, I know how much of a pain in the ass they can be, in many aspects. But my point was that it shouldn't be necessary to get that account free/unlocked to do the refund. There should be no money on that paypal account that concerns us right now anyway, all the money should be at KnC already. So if they return the money, they can just return it to a different account (i.e. your's).
At the very least for the miners that were payed via bitpay, because they had absolutely nothing to do with Paypal. So even with the locked PP account, you can get the refund from KnC and start buying BTC back, before BTC price starts going up again. Then you can already pay back all the people that have payed in BTC.

edit: oh ok I forgot about the not-yet-payed Jupiter#2, that money would be in the PP account. But still, the rest is not concerned with that. So you could start refunding all the btc payers soon.

[danieldaniel]

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that now all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

Thanks for the information.

About paypal: Believe me, I know how much of a pain in the ass they can be, in many aspects. But my point was that it shouldn't be necessary to get that account free/unlocked to do the refund. There should be no money on that paypal account that concerns us right now anyway, all the money should be at KnC already. So if they return the money, they can just return it to a different account (i.e. your's).
At the very least for the miners that were payed via bitpay, because they had absolutely nothing to do with Paypal. So even with the locked PP account, you can get the refund from KnC and start buying BTC back, before BTC price starts going up again. Then you can already pay back all the people that have payed in BTC.

Yeah, this is what I don't get.  According to prodigits, all the money is at KNC...

[prodigits7]

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that now all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

Thanks for the information.

About paypal: Believe me, I know how much of a pain in the ass they can be, in many aspects. But my point was that it shouldn't be necessary to get that account free/unlocked to do the refund. There should be no money on that paypal account that concerns us right now anyway, all the money should be at KnC already. So if they return the money, they can just return it to a different account (i.e. your's).
At the very least for the miners that were payed via bitpay, because they had absolutely nothing to do with Paypal. So even with the locked PP account, you can get the refund from KnC and start buying BTC back, before BTC price starts going up again. Then you can already pay back all the people that have payed in BTC.

Agreed. This is exactly the plan right now.

[prodigits7]

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that now all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

Thanks for the information.

About paypal: Believe me, I know how much of a pain in the ass they can be, in many aspects. But my point was that it shouldn't be necessary to get that account free/unlocked to do the refund. There should be no money on that paypal account that concerns us right now anyway, all the money should be at KnC already. So if they return the money, they can just return it to a different account (i.e. your's).
At the very least for the miners that were payed via bitpay, because they had absolutely nothing to do with Paypal. So even with the locked PP account, you can get the refund from KnC and start buying BTC back, before BTC price starts going up again. Then you can already pay back all the people that have payed in BTC.

Yeah, this is what I don't get.  According to prodigits, all the money is at KNC...

Yes daniel it is all with KnCMiner, now we'll be asking them to send it back.

So this is where we are at, hopefully it can be sent back ASAP after we call them and request it tomorrow.

[floatyfish]

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that now all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

Thanks for the information.

About paypal: Believe me, I know how much of a pain in the ass they can be, in many aspects. But my point was that it shouldn't be necessary to get that account free/unlocked to do the refund. There should be no money on that paypal account that concerns us right now anyway, all the money should be at KnC already. So if they return the money, they can just return it to a different account (i.e. your's).
At the very least for the miners that were payed via bitpay, because they had absolutely nothing to do with Paypal. So even with the locked PP account, you can get the refund from KnC and start buying BTC back, before BTC price starts going up again. Then you can already pay back all the people that have payed in BTC.

Yeah, this is what I don't get.  According to prodigits, all the money is at KNC...

I feel like the only issue would be if KnC refunded the BTC from the account that it came from, and the only way that would be a problem is if only Ragin had access to that account. ProDigits, do you know the answer to this?

[prodigits7]

From my understanding, each miner was paid for separately. It wasn't like they were paid all at once on August 20th, so you're completely off with assuming that much. Ragin logged into his PayPal in front of me and I did actually see, with my own eyes, completed payments in June to "Kennemar & Cole AB" (aka "KncMiner"). Now if you refer back to the screenshot, you will see that now all were paid by BitPay, the first five were done via PayPal. The first two Saturns were ordered on June 13th, the third and fourth on June 14th and the fifth Saturn on June 17th. So right now, I can only speak for the machines paid for by PayPal because I witnessed the transaction confirmation first hand. I can't say the same for the ones paid by BitPay.

So I apologize to the group that I wasn't able to get more information about the BitPay situation, but I will. The plan right now is to refund each machine sequentially, starting with Saturn #1 and working up from there. But I'm still actively trying to work with JohnK to get more information about how that all the BitPay paymnts went down. Regardless, KncMiner will be able to shed more light about that tomorrow. Daniel, you are more than welcome to join us. So once we all figure that out, we can figure out how to unravel it and get the payments back to people.

Physalis you obviously have never dealt with PayPal's risk dept or their security personnel. Once you're account is frozen, it can take up to 180 days for them to unfreeze it! I can assure you that it's happened before and it can happen again. Here's it is in their TOS:

http://bit.ly/14DEwcd

Thanks for the information.

About paypal: Believe me, I know how much of a pain in the ass they can be, in many aspects. But my point was that it shouldn't be necessary to get that account free/unlocked to do the refund. There should be no money on that paypal account that concerns us right now anyway, all the money should be at KnC already. So if they return the money, they can just return it to a different account (i.e. your's).
At the very least for the miners that were payed via bitpay, because they had absolutely nothing to do with Paypal. So even with the locked PP account, you can get the refund from KnC and start buying BTC back, before BTC price starts going up again. Then you can already pay back all the people that have payed in BTC.

Yeah, this is what I don't get.  According to prodigits, all the money is at KNC...

I feel like the only issue would be if KnC refunded the BTC from the account that it came from, and the only way that would be a problem is if only Ragin had access to that account. ProDigits, do you know the answer to this?

Yes floatyfish, I share your same EXACT concern. That was a big part of the debate from Friday. I'm very worried that we finally get a refund but then it doesn't get dispersed properly or in a timely manner. That is the bulk of what I've been working on behind the scenes.

I initially proposed we have a third-party, like JohnK, receive the BTCs instead since Ragin has been unstable. Ragin has agreed to this in principle. We will work out the logistics tomorrow with John.

[bitterdog]

I'm curious as to why there'd be heated debates and strong-arming, I'd like to know what argument Ragingazn had in his defence.

Come on man... you seriously believe this clown?

[regular]

Considering they are both part of "neo-asics", they are more than just random acquaintances.  I'm surprised everyone is just waiting nicely for their BTC back without calling for more action instead.

[peterlex]

But is there the possibility to change the GB escrow and keep on this?

[regular]

But is there the possibility to change the GB escrow and keep on this?

There is no escrow on this.  However, Raginazn has a seperate escrowed Avalon chip groupbuy with JohnK.