Buying Bitmain or Bitfury ASIC chips directly

[bsp]

When (time of year) did you ask for a quote?

The messaging was rather disjointed, but I'm still not sold that more than two people (BF side) were involved in the exchange. I watched an interview with a BitFury guy at some conference from Oct 2017 where he said the price for B8 units was 5200 and I was quoted $7k. Maybe they do it to see if you balk at the price tag or ask more questions?

Conversation took place on Dec 18, 2017.
“We sell integrator kit (see attached) for $20k. This is reimbursed against final invoice when $2M+ chips purchased.

They also said that bulk order chips will be ready by September 2018 (if ordered now).  Thus, I’m very confused about their pricing and ability to ‘actually’ deliver.

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[cerberusmining]

Wow, thats pretty silly. It appears there are a few things going on here.

I wasn't told anything about getting reimbursed for the Integrator Pack purchase. So for the policy to change from that to what I was quoted in a span of two days is odd.

Spend 2 Mil and wait for a year to get your product. I don't think I have that kind of trust for vendors in general, let alone here.

What was attached for the integrator kit information? I had to ask for the B8 and asic chip spec sheets.

[bsp]

It was a general promo-sheet about integrator pack and B8. Did they give you spec sheets?

I sent you PM about it.

[cerberusmining]

I saw your PM, but apparently, I am unable to respond because I am over my limit of 2 pms since I registered today and am a new user (I've been lurking here since 2010).

I asked for the B8 and Asic spec sheets and they sent them over. I was told, but not provided documentation about the Integrator Pack.

[bsp]

I saw your PM, but apparently, I am unable to respond because I am over my limit of 2 pms since I registered today and am a new user (I've been lurking here since 2010).

I asked for the B8 and Asic spec sheets and they sent them over. I was told, but not provided documentation about the Integrator Pack.

Once you get your PM working, give me your email, we will talk there without restrictions.

[x8664amd]

When (time of year) did you ask for a quote?

The messaging was rather disjointed, but I'm still not sold that more than two people (BF side) were involved in the exchange. I watched an interview with a BitFury guy at some conference from Oct 2017 where he said the price for B8 units was 5200 and I was quoted $7k. Maybe they do it to see if you balk at the price tag or ask more questions?

Conversation took place on Dec 18, 2017.
“We sell integrator kit (see attached) for $20k. This is reimbursed against final invoice when $2M+ chips purchased.

They also said that bulk order chips will be ready by September 2018 (if ordered now).  Thus, I’m very confused about their pricing and ability to ‘actually’ deliver.

$20k for an Integrator Kit? What the hell? Is it like 100TH/s machine?

[bsp]

$20k for an Integrator Kit? What the hell? Is it like 100TH/s machine?

You wish

Performance
Hashrate: from 30 TH/s ±5% (max power efficiency) to 49 TH/s ±5% (max performance)
Power Efficiency: variable, from 0.101 to 0.133 J/GH
Power Consumption: variable, 6.4 KW (max)

Features
576 Bitfury 16nm BF8162B ASIC chips
Variable DC voltage for variable efficiency
Upgradable design
Proprietary Bitfury string power design
Proprietary Bitfury mining soſtware running on Debian Linux

Dimensions and Weight
Form factor: Rack (6U)
H × W × D: 19” × 17.32” × 25.6” (270 × 440 × 650 mm)
Weight: 37 kgs

Environmental Requirements
AC Power (2 inputs): 85–305 VAC, 200–277 VAC (nominal), 45–66 Hz, 16.5 ARMS
Networking: Ethernet 100BASE-TX, IEEE 802.3u
Operating Temperature: -20°C to 40°C (5–95% RH)

[cerberusmining]

I've been informed that due to surging demand the price of the integrator kit is now $30k and still requires a $2M order and a 6/7 month lead time.

[x8664amd]

I've been informed that due to surging demand the price of the integrator kit is now $30k and still requires a $2M order and a 6/7 month lead time.

With a 6-7 month lead time, I feel like we would be seeing next gen product (S10?) from Bitmain by then, which makes having a B8 Integrator Kit entirely pointless.

[vegascoinpool]

Well let me throw a new voice in the pile...

I reached out to BF this past week, and received a response Monday from sales@bitfury.com to contact Hut 8 Mining who now controls all BF product sales inside North America.

When I reached out to Hut 8, I received an almost immediate response that plans to sell chips in bulks are currently suspended. So talk about mixed messages, I got no such response about $2m minimums or anything.

I Google’d a bit and learned that BF and Hut 8 are essentially merging, and it appears the focus is now on creating the largest mining facility in North America, using BF hardware technologies I’m assuming.

[bsp]

So much for decentralization.

[vegascoinpool]

So much for decentralization.

Yeah, I kind of feel the same way.

My small group of affiliated miners (kind of a brain trust group, all separate, but sharing collective knowledge) has been toying with the idea of some kind of "mini miner" that packs enough hashing power to be worthwhile (5-7 TH) but also affordable to manufacture, so one could have the ability to scale on a budget, but more importantly on their own terms. A shelf full of mini miners, in theory, may not be as efficient as the Antminers of the world (hey, maybe they could be with some strong teamwork, and some good folks behind it) but at least we'd have access to them on our own terms vs. being at the mercy of these larger corps. and their mood swing, batch releases, shipping delays, and other complexities.

Feels nearly impossible, without access to chips, though.

[sidehack]

I've been interested in (and actively working on) building miners for about 3 years now, but I have zero interest in building something over about 500 watts. That's a practical draw for noise and cooling concerns of non-industrial customers.

[vegascoinpool]

I've been interested in (and actively working on) building miners for about 3 years now, but I have zero interest in building something over about 500 watts. That's a practical draw for noise and cooling concerns of non-industrial customers.

Fan of what you've done thus far. I have 12 2Pacs grinding away at my home.

I don't know how much hashing power one can eek out of 500 watts, but don't hate the idea. We'd not yet conversed about power consumption on our side, except to say that we wanted the unit to be meaningful/functional. Rough math (please don't hate me for not being an engineering guru) is that with 500 watts you could get somewhere around 4.5 - 4.9 TH, give or take?? That's more than reasonable, and if if manufacturing can be scalable it'd be sweet to pull off.

We'd even talked (this is quite a ways down the rabbit hole, but why not) about how even if this "mini miner" wasn't as efficient as Antminers or some of the others... the idea that if we can get/make this accessible... have a shelf full of mini miners because you can actually get ahold of them, and replace them later with the bigger/badder units when possible... and make the minis available to others at affordable rates in the aftermarkets.

I know our group would invest some cash and energy into trying to make it happen, though I have to admit we've not been far enough down the road to know what kind of undertaking it is, or whom we could even partner with, but we damn sure love to try.

Would love to pick your brain some day, and I'd happily fly to you and pay for a nice dinner to do that. Unless you live in Nairobi or something. Haha.

[bsp]

Looks like we are getting forced to make our own community sourced miners and because chips are not available from big guys... our own ASIC chips as well. Bummer.

I work for a company that manufactures custom electronics, automation and various controls.
We have clients who want some specific custom miners to be made but we can not manufacture those without chips. We have access to manufacturing facilities in Asia and Europe and I am familiar with outsourcing manufacturing on larger scale (do this every day). There’s a definite demand for miners on the market, as we all know. Nothing stops us to make these units available for community as well (with quantities increase - cost per unit decreases).
 
Looks like we will be making our own ASIC chips at this point. We are talking to some fellow miners to join the effort. PM for more info.

Anyways, as sidehack said, 500W medium miners would be the units we will be going after as one of product in the portfolio. 500W on standard 120v North American power source will draw just a bit more than 4A. You can safely plug this one in any standard outlet at home. They would be waaaaaay quieter than typical Antminer and such.
If you really want, you can run 2 or even 3 or them on same circuit.
Something to talk about, for sure...

[hireblade]

Hello, I have a reseller in China who is able to give me BM1387 (the chip used in S9) but without the datasheet we can't create our own miner.
Is there someone able to find the datasheet? Clearly BITMAIN hasn't released it

[NotFuzzyWarm]

Bitmain has never sold their s9 chips. Period. That ^^ reseller is either selling stolen chips, ones salvaged from improperly disposed scrap, or relabled dummy chips. No matter what it is a highly ILLEGAL operation. DO NOT SUPPORT ANY GRAY-MARKET ACTIVITIES LIKE THAT.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

digging this thread, what would be the most cost efficient way of buying T/H? Lets all go in together and start a cloud mining site! I can raise some funds!

a. Cloudmining discussions are verboten in this area and thread
b. Cloudmining in general sucks the sweat off of a hogs balls because a good part of the income goes to the operators and NOT the miners

[HoleShot]

Hello, I have a reseller in China who is able to give me BM1387 (the chip used in S9) but without the datasheet we can't create our own miner.
Is there someone able to find the datasheet? Clearly BITMAIN hasn't released it

You won't need a datasheet. Just copy or build an electrically equivalent board to mount a stack of chips on. The only think tricky about this ASIC is the secret recipe inside.

All the circuitry of miners is very, very simple.

If you get ASICs to sample, we can just replace one ASIC on a working board to test. easy, easy.

Head's up. Common Chinesium scam method:
- send working samples, aka actual ASICs pulled from S9 miner, to build trust
- continue to send pulled chips to get the pump primed
- receive money for bulk order
- send 20% real chips, 80% fakes
- Oh, so sorry for your trouble, please return failed units so we can analyze
- replace the 80% fakes with another 20/80 mix
- Oh, so sorry for your trouble, our analysis indicates you have installation method problem. We will offer you another replacement. Please return the chips that failed.
- return a 30/70 mix
Oh, so sorry. It looks like you did not fully correct you installation techniques. Perhaps we should build these boards for you here. Send us more money so we can start.

You see how this works? Many people there get very, very rich with this scam.

[digger888]

Hello, I have a reseller in China who is able to give me BM1387 (the chip used in S9) but without the datasheet we can't create our own miner.
Is there someone able to find the datasheet? Clearly BITMAIN hasn't released it

You won't need a datasheet. Just copy or build an electrically equivalent board to mount a stack of chips on. The only think tricky about this ASIC is the secret recipe inside.

All the circuitry of miners is very, very simple.

If you get ASICs to sample, we can just replace one ASIC on a working board to test. easy, easy.

Head's up. Common Chinesium scam method:
- send working samples, aka actual ASICs pulled from S9 miner, to build trust
- continue to send pulled chips to get the pump primed
- receive money for bulk order
- send 20% real chips, 80% fakes
- Oh, so sorry for your trouble, please return failed units so we can analyze
- replace the 80% fakes with another 20/80 mix
- Oh, so sorry for your trouble, our analysis indicates you have installation method problem. We will offer you another replacement. Please return the chips that failed.
- return a 30/70 mix
Oh, so sorry. It looks like you did not fully correct you installation techniques. Perhaps we should build these boards for you here. Send us more money so we can start.

You see how this works? Many people there get very, very rich with this scam.

Great idea. Maybe we can start another Bitconnect and label it as ASIC designers instead of bitcoin trading robots.