Bitcoin bubble

[Giric]

Even if you had “bought in” all those moons ago, there was no guarantee your investment would have made money. Something to think on.

Only if you sold too early.

Perhaps I should have finished the 'if only':

... if only I'd bought £100 pounds worth back then, and decided to sell today."

[Aneelal]

Even if you had “bought in” all those moons ago, there was no guarantee your investment would have made money. Something to think on.

Only if you sold too early.

Perhaps I should have finished the 'if only':

... if only I'd bought £100 pounds worth back then, and decided to sell today."

Yes, but what if the value of your investment had gone down. The grass is always greener on the other side of the wall.

[Renr]

Even if you had “bought in” all those moons ago, there was no guarantee your investment would have made money. Something to think on.

Only if you sold too early.

Perhaps I should have finished the 'if only':

... if only I'd bought £100 pounds worth back then, and decided to sell today."

Yes, but what if the value of your investment had gone down. The grass is always greener on the other side of the wall.

True but can’t you say that about anything ‘ risky ‘ ?
Stocks , shares even gold . You have no idea if your investment is going to go up like you wish . Doesn’t stop millions of people investing in the stock market does it or investing in precious metals .

What’s the big difference in people putting their money into Bitcoin and potentially losing it as opposed to buying shares ?

[Usine]

Even if you had “bought in” all those moons ago, there was no guarantee your investment would have made money. Something to think on.

Only if you sold too early.

Perhaps I should have finished the 'if only':

... if only I'd bought £100 pounds worth back then, and decided to sell today."

Yes, but what if the value of your investment had gone down. The grass is always greener on the other side of the wall.

An investment in gold bullion or a company is always backed by s omething physical, that’s the key difference.

An investment in bitcoin is intangible, illusory.

[Kesecer]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

[Amial]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You can say that about any investment though. Hindsight is always 20:20. I wish I'd bought a ton of Glencore shares two years ago. It doesn't work like that.

[Bamel]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You can say that about any investment though. Hindsight is always 20:20. I wish I'd bought a ton of Glencore shares two years ago. It doesn't work like that.

Yes but if I had bought gold 5 yrs ago at $1700 and ounce and then read today that my gold ' investment ' was only worth $1300 per ounce I wouldn't care less what my gold investment was ' backed ' by . All I would know is that I had lost money. If gold is backed by something physical does that mean I get my initial stake back ?

[Renr]

Even if you had “bought in” all those moons ago, there was no guarantee your investment would have made money. Something to think on.

Only if you sold too early.

Perhaps I should have finished the 'if only':

... if only I'd bought £100 pounds worth back then, and decided to sell today."

Yes, but what if the value of your investment had gone down. The grass is always greener on the other side of the wall.

At that point you can always opt for the gold itself - an investment that never loses it’s value

[Usine]

Even if you had “bought in” all those moons ago, there was no guarantee your investment would have made money. Something to think on.

Only if you sold too early.

Perhaps I should have finished the 'if only':

... if only I'd bought £100 pounds worth back then, and decided to sell today."

Yes, but what if the value of your investment had gone down. The grass is always greener on the other side of the wall.

At that point you can always opt for the gold itself - an investment that never loses it’s value

Then they would have lost £100 hardly as stressful as missing out on £100k

[Kesecer]

We are entering a new era where most young people do not think like that. They have come into the tech age where everything is "virtual" and in fact most of our money already is. Im old but I understand this which is one reason why Im in bitcoin.

[Amial]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You are exactly right. Bitcoin is approaching 10 years~ old already.I am under 25 and people my age are already accustomed to digital everything... I don't see this going away

Bitcoin is the future. Failing that, cryptocurrency is, anyway.

[Renr]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You are exactly right. Bitcoin is approaching 10 years~ old already.I am under 25 and people my age are already accustomed to digital everything... I don't see this going away

Bitcoin is the future. Failing that, cryptocurrency is, anyway.

Any loss in monetary value is more than made up for by golds’ prestige and spending power..

[Usine]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You are exactly right. Bitcoin is approaching 10 years~ old already.I am under 25 and people my age are already accustomed to digital everything... I don't see this going away

Bitcoin is the future. Failing that, cryptocurrency is, anyway.

Any loss in monetary value is more than made up for by golds’ prestige and spending power..

It's a bubble looking for a pin, and as always happens will pop when people least expect it.

[Kesecer]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You are exactly right. Bitcoin is approaching 10 years~ old already.I am under 25 and people my age are already accustomed to digital everything... I don't see this going away

Bitcoin is the future. Failing that, cryptocurrency is, anyway.

Any loss in monetary value is more than made up for by golds’ prestige and spending power..

It's a bubble looking for a pin, and as always happens will pop when people least expect it.

No thats the stock and bond markets.

[Amial]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You are exactly right. Bitcoin is approaching 10 years~ old already.I am under 25 and people my age are already accustomed to digital everything... I don't see this going away

Bitcoin is the future. Failing that, cryptocurrency is, anyway.

Any loss in monetary value is more than made up for by golds’ prestige and spending power..

It's a bubble looking for a pin, and as always happens will pop when people least expect it.

No thats the stock and bond markets.

The stock and bond markets have an underpinning foundation of assets based on a valuation of companies and organisations trading performance, growth or downward trajectory forecasts and their ability or otherwise to repay their debts.

Cryptos have absolutely nothing of value to support or sustain these valuations other than sentiment.

[Bamel]

Shares have more of a "real" value, because they give you access to something beyond ownership of the instrument itself - you own a stake of a company that has physical assets and (hopefully) makes profits, a share of which it may well pay to you in dividends. Buying shares is an investment that brings returns beyond mere rises in the price of the instrument itself and is underpinned in part by real, useful assets.

Bitcoin is a currency. Buying currencies for any other purpose than buying goods or services with them is speculating. Furthermore with Bitcoin, it's impossible to work out how to assign any value to them. You can get an idea of the real value to you of a physical currency by looking at what it can buy you with it in its country of origin (compared to what you can buy elsewhere with other currencies), interest rates in that country, inflation, and how rapidly the currency base is expanding compared to economic growth. With Bitcoin, how its value should be measured is anyone's guess.

You are exactly right. Bitcoin is approaching 10 years~ old already.I am under 25 and people my age are already accustomed to digital everything... I don't see this going away

Bitcoin is the future. Failing that, cryptocurrency is, anyway.

Any loss in monetary value is more than made up for by golds’ prestige and spending power..

It's a bubble looking for a pin, and as always happens will pop when people least expect it.

No thats the stock and bond markets.

The stock and bond markets have an underpinning foundation of assets based on a valuation of companies and organisations trading performance, growth or downward trajectory forecasts and their ability or otherwise to repay their debts.

Cryptos have absolutely nothing of value to support or sustain these valuations other than sentiment.

That's why institutional investors have started flooding in. Futures trading has been authorised in some US states. This is just the beginning and please Guardian can you please try to present an accurate Bitcoin article for once - Bitcoin does not have to be stored online. It can be stored in a physical paper wallet or in several types of offline wallets

[Stianyd]

I agree that some stocks have value related to the valuation of the companies, but some are hugely inflated, and are based on future gains (eg Tesla). Similar to Bitcoin - people are speculating on the future value of the asset.

Also there are other markets which have very low, if not non-existent "backing" that sustains their value, such as fiat currencies and gold. Yes, gold has some industrial uses but its high value is based mostly on belief. And yes, you can pay taxes in fiat but its value too, is based on collective belief.

Bitcoin is the same - it has no intrinsic value per se (really the only things that have true intrinsic value IMO are things like food and water), but people's collective belief gives it value, because so many people understand the implications of such a technology.

If the bubble pops (if it is a bubble), then there will be plenty of people buying back in at lower prices and sustaining the value - it's not going away without something drastic happening, such as a flaw in the protocol - and this becomes less and less likely as time goes on.

[Giric]

I agree that some stocks have value related to the valuation of the companies, but some are hugely inflated, and are based on future gains (eg Tesla). Similar to Bitcoin - people are speculating on the future value of the asset.

Also there are other markets which have very low, if not non-existent "backing" that sustains their value, such as fiat currencies and gold. Yes, gold has some industrial uses but its high value is based mostly on belief. And yes, you can pay taxes in fiat but its value too, is based on collective belief.

Bitcoin is the same - it has no intrinsic value per se (really the only things that have true intrinsic value IMO are things like food and water), but people's collective belief gives it value, because so many people understand the implications of such a technology.

If the bubble pops (if it is a bubble), then there will be plenty of people buying back in at lower prices and sustaining the value - it's not going away without something drastic happening, such as a flaw in the protocol - and this becomes less and less likely as time goes on.

Stock markets also rely on sentiment and they are priced in fiat currency. What happens when "sentiment" changes about the value of that?

[Aneelal]

I agree that some stocks have value related to the valuation of the companies, but some are hugely inflated, and are based on future gains (eg Tesla). Similar to Bitcoin - people are speculating on the future value of the asset.

Also there are other markets which have very low, if not non-existent "backing" that sustains their value, such as fiat currencies and gold. Yes, gold has some industrial uses but its high value is based mostly on belief. And yes, you can pay taxes in fiat but its value too, is based on collective belief.

Bitcoin is the same - it has no intrinsic value per se (really the only things that have true intrinsic value IMO are things like food and water), but people's collective belief gives it value, because so many people understand the implications of such a technology.

If the bubble pops (if it is a bubble), then there will be plenty of people buying back in at lower prices and sustaining the value - it's not going away without something drastic happening, such as a flaw in the protocol - and this becomes less and less likely as time goes on.

Stock markets also rely on sentiment and they are priced in fiat currency. What happens when "sentiment" changes about the value of that?

The longer they take to catch up the better for those of us buying it now.

[Renr]

I agree that some stocks have value related to the valuation of the companies, but some are hugely inflated, and are based on future gains (eg Tesla). Similar to Bitcoin - people are speculating on the future value of the asset.

Also there are other markets which have very low, if not non-existent "backing" that sustains their value, such as fiat currencies and gold. Yes, gold has some industrial uses but its high value is based mostly on belief. And yes, you can pay taxes in fiat but its value too, is based on collective belief.

Bitcoin is the same - it has no intrinsic value per se (really the only things that have true intrinsic value IMO are things like food and water), but people's collective belief gives it value, because so many people understand the implications of such a technology.

If the bubble pops (if it is a bubble), then there will be plenty of people buying back in at lower prices and sustaining the value - it's not going away without something drastic happening, such as a flaw in the protocol - and this becomes less and less likely as time goes on.

Stock markets also rely on sentiment and they are priced in fiat currency. What happens when "sentiment" changes about the value of that?

The longer they take to catch up the better for those of us buying it now.

Oh god, you just said "fiat currency" in the same breath as positive comments about crypo-currencies.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!