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Author Topic: Bitcoin in China  (Read 4350 times)
jgarzik
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December 28, 2010, 09:50:05 PM
 #21

There are some currency exchange applications available but seem unsuported and out of date. Mostly for LETS type systems.

But this is not the problem, how is the RMB given to the purchaser? How can they use their RMB that they have bought with BTC? How can they get it? And how can someone who wishes to purchase BTC get their RMB to the exchanger?

This kind of system is entirely illegal here, even electronically there is no way to transfer RMB out of the country. From account to account (in China) you must use UnionPay, it is the only interbank transfer service in China. For online processing you must use ChinaPay.

BTC coming in is no difficult problem, but how to redeem your exchange, ok you know you have RMB, held for you in China, what then?

Yes, to be legal, this exchange would be limited to in-country, China-only RMB deposits and withdrawals.

This is similar to https://btcex.com/ which only permits deposit/withdrawal of Rubles in Russia, too, if I understand correctly.

Each exchange must comply with national money transfer laws.

Jeff Garzik, bitcoin core dev team and BitPay engineer; opinions are my own, not my employer.
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caveden
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December 28, 2010, 09:56:23 PM
 #22

Tor bridges sold for BTC so china gov has to mine? Smiley

Good idea. Smiley

I was thinking something like that recently. One problem of these anonymous p2p networks is the lack of monetary incentive for those who donate their bandwidth. Plus, with this China thing, not only you need to be willing to donate bandwidth freely, as you'll also have your IP blocked from accessing anything inside the Great Firewall.

If we could figure out a way to combine Tor and BTC in order to allow micro-donations to those who contribute with their bandwidth, this could create a better incentive for more Tor relays. If a protocol could be developed in a way that Tor relays would only redirect "paying traffic", this could bring professional, profit oriented players to the Tor network, and bust its bandwidth considerably.
But it's a bit hard to implement such a thing in a way that scales... paying for each data packet would create an immense amount of overhead to both networks, so there should be some sort of "long term subscription"...
Anyway, it's complicated... I might create a topic to discuss these better with all the clever people of this forum, but not tonight, too late already. Smiley

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December 28, 2010, 10:22:54 PM
 #23

Tor bridges sold for BTC so china gov has to mine? Smiley

Good idea. Smiley

I was thinking something like that recently. One problem of these anonymous p2p networks is the lack of monetary incentive for those who donate their bandwidth. Plus, with this China thing, not only you need to be willing to donate bandwidth freely, as you'll also have your IP blocked from accessing anything inside the Great Firewall.

If we could figure out a way to combine Tor and BTC in order to allow micro-donations to those who contribute with their bandwidth, this could create a better incentive for more Tor relays. If a protocol could be developed in a way that Tor relays would only redirect "paying traffic", this could bring professional, profit oriented players to the Tor network, and bust its bandwidth considerably.
But it's a bit hard to implement such a thing in a way that scales... paying for each data packet would create an immense amount of overhead to both networks, so there should be some sort of "long term subscription"...
Anyway, it's complicated... I might create a topic to discuss these better with all the clever people of this forum, but not tonight, too late already. Smiley

An idea I've just had (it's in another thread also) is some of my better students can translate some of the bitcoin.it wiki for a few bitcoins. which they could then spend on Tor bridges (are there private bridges? where the IP is not in any way publically shared?) that are rented out (for BTC). A simple web based "rent tracking" application could be made. The application lets you know if the rent has been paid, also it would keep the payment in escrow to ensure the service is delivered.

It wouldn't be too difficult to implement, as no actual Tor/BTC integration is required. The renter and rentee would need to keep track of their usage(aided by the web based application) which would manage the payments through an escrow.

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BioMike
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December 28, 2010, 10:57:58 PM
 #24

Maybe they can help you with this: http://www.torservers.net/ (See under services)

At least they accept bitcoin as a donation method.
Anonymous
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December 28, 2010, 11:16:25 PM
 #25

Maybe they can help you with this: http://www.torservers.net/ (See under services)

At least they accept bitcoin as a donation method.

http://www.technologyreview.com/web/26981/?mod=chfeatured&a=f

Tor are going to start selling their own routers soon. Pretty awesome.
Anonymous
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December 28, 2010, 11:25:48 PM
 #26

I'm in China, English teacher, slow/poorish Ruby webdev programmer.

I'm wondering what can I do here to make use of the BTC I have and to earn some BTC?

I know that Chinese currency (RMB) is not traded on the markets (internationally at least). Is there something that I can do to earn BTC?

Idea's appreciated.

Maybe you could do some English tutoring and recommend clients pay in bitcoin ?

I run a bitcoin rebate program for Amazon and it would be great to have an associate from china who could represent amazon.cn



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December 29, 2010, 07:20:34 AM
 #27

I imagine bitcoin will be banned much earlier in China than in the US. Bitcoin is a subversive currency that will anger all the world powers.

We have an IM client/network here called QQ, by numbers I think it is the most popular IM network in the world, but it is mostly based in China (it is owned by TenCent, a Chinese company). You could by QQ coins which could be used to buy items for your or other persons QQ avatars. They became so popular that ordinary people were begining to accept them as currency for some goods (mostly young people). It became so popular that the government banned the use of QQ coins as a trading coin,

But citizens are ignoring this ban?

What violations of the law will be in your exchange business? How strictly are punished?

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Nefario
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December 30, 2010, 06:08:46 AM
 #28

I imagine bitcoin will be banned much earlier in China than in the US. Bitcoin is a subversive currency that will anger all the world powers.

We have an IM client/network here called QQ, by numbers I think it is the most popular IM network in the world, but it is mostly based in China (it is owned by TenCent, a Chinese company). You could by QQ coins which could be used to buy items for your or other persons QQ avatars. They became so popular that ordinary people were begining to accept them as currency for some goods (mostly young people). It became so popular that the government banned the use of QQ coins as a trading coin,

But citizens are ignoring this ban?

What violations of the law will be in your exchange business? How strictly are punished?

Most complied because the coins are created by the Tencent company, and all coins are for redemption on tencent servers so they would be useless otherwise. I'm saying this poorly, basically the company complied with the governments request.

Violation of this law would at first be ignored, until it crosses a line(in terms of usage numbers or value or bothers the wrong person) then punishment would be severe. Most small crimes, theft, pickpocketing go unpunished here even when reported. I think no one would even know this was a crime until it reaches a certain mass or the wrong person becomes aware of it.

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caveden
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December 30, 2010, 08:46:21 AM
 #29

Most small crimes, theft, pickpocketing go unpunished here even when reported.

hehe, maybe by the government, but not by the mob: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALXBlAk1wKw
This one is nice too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63xNCYrj7Vk

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Nefario
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December 30, 2010, 02:31:57 PM
 #30

Most small crimes, theft, pickpocketing go unpunished here even when reported.

hehe, maybe by the government, but not by the mob: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALXBlAk1wKw
This one is nice too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63xNCYrj7Vk

Sorry caveden, I'd like to have a look at those links but youtube is blocked and the ssh connection I had to the outside world has also been blocked. All the most useful sites on the web have been blocked and I don't have a credit card to buy a private vpn connection.

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Cryptoman
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December 30, 2010, 04:28:16 PM
 #31

Sorry caveden, I'd like to have a look at those links but youtube is blocked and the ssh connection I had to the outside world has also been blocked. All the most useful sites on the web have been blocked and I don't have a credit card to buy a private vpn connection.
Does this help?
http://mullvad.net
They take Bitcoin.

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fabianhjr
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December 30, 2010, 05:08:40 PM
 #32

Mhh, I don't see such an option. >_<
Do you know the current Bitcoin prices?

Cryptoman
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December 30, 2010, 05:14:54 PM
 #33

http://mullvad.net/en/bitcoin.php

24 BTC for 30 days.

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huyou
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January 20, 2011, 08:24:38 PM
 #34

I'm in China, English teacher, slow/poorish Ruby webdev programmer.

I'm wondering what can I do here to make use of the BTC I have and to earn some BTC?

I know that Chinese currency (RMB) is not traded on the markets (internationally at least). Is there something that I can do to earn BTC?

Idea's appreciated.

Ni Tai Neng Hu You Le. Ha Ha.
idev
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January 20, 2011, 08:33:38 PM
 #35

Most small crimes, theft, pickpocketing go unpunished here even when reported.

hehe, maybe by the government, but not by the mob: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALXBlAk1wKw
This one is nice too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63xNCYrj7Vk

Sorry caveden, I'd like to have a look at those links but youtube is blocked and the ssh connection I had to the outside world has also been blocked. All the most useful sites on the web have been blocked and I don't have a credit card to buy a private vpn connection.

Why don't try Anchorfree, a free vpn service.
Sultan
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January 20, 2011, 11:39:24 PM
 #36

Is there no way to smuggle the RMB out of the country?

For example hide it in a "hollow" birthday card or something?

Do they check every single package that goes out?

As far as anonymity networks are concerned, is i2p blocked? That seems to be the best one at the moment considering that the relay nodes are 'elected' by the network itself.

If there's absolutely no way to get them out of the country, the only real way is to trade amongst fellow Chinese, or if one of us decides to go on holiday in China, they would need to make a pit-stop to you to convert their moneys, I bet your exchange rate would be highly competitive anyway.

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I then use the money to buy BitCoins. You can too!
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