cavirtex.com - Canadian Bitcoin Exchange now LIVE

[grady2000]

Hello all, after weeks of legal research and beta we are finally live and let Canadians Buy and Sell BTC, check us out at
www.cavirtex.com

[1713263015]

1713263015

[1713263015]

1713263015

[1713263015]

1713263015

[1713263015]

1713263015

[1713263015]

1713263015

[1713263015]

1713263015

[Bimmerhead]

Fantastic!  Congratulations, I hope your exchange is a resounding success.  It's functioned very well for me so far.

[Stephen Gornick]

we are finally live and let Canadians Buy and Sell BTC

 Added to wiki using basic template.  Please feel free to edit / improve.
 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/VirtEx

[project10]

Sweet, thank you

[byronbb]

It looks great. Glad to see you did some hard work to put it all together.  I found this part of the TOS interesting:

1.2 By using the VirtEx site and VirtEx services, you acknowledge and agree that:

1.2.1 this VirtEx site and the VirtEx services do not constitute a trading of, or an exchange in, securities, investment contracts or any document, instrument or writing commonly known as a "security", at law or otherwise;

1.2.2 Bitcoins do not constitute a currency, an asset or a form of property at law or otherwise;

1.2.3 Bitcoins have no inherent or underlying monitory or other value and may, at any time and without warning or notice, have no such value whatsoever;

[kseistrup]

monitory

Should that have been ‘monetary’?

Cheers,

[edd]

Added you to The Bitcoin List as well: http://www.thebitcoinlist.com/listing/virtex/

[phillipsjk]

Yeah, I was excited until I read the VIRTEX TERMS OF SERVICE.

If Bicoins are not a currency or commodity security, what are they exactly? A novelty? Why should I trust an exchange that considers Bitcoins a novelty?

The line about no inherent value can probably be re-worded as well.

The sections that concern me more:

3.1 VirtEx retains the right to change or amend this Agreement at any time. You can check what terms and conditions are in effect by reading the Agreement on the website (www.cavirtex.com).

That link does not even reference the terms of service. Clauses like this are common ernough that I have been considering writing a robot that would periodically (daily) crawl all of the websites I use and check if the "Terms Of Service" have changed. If they have, the bot would generate an e-mail with the diffs.

10.6 Because VirtEx is not and cannot be involved in user-to-user dealings, in the event that you have a dispute with one or more users, we hereby disclaim and you hereby waive any recourse to or against us and agree to release and indemnify us, our directors, officers, employees, agents and third-party contractors and suppliers, including those parties with whom we have contracted for marketplace design and technology (collectively "VirtEx parties") from and against any and all claims, demands, damages, losses, costs and expenses or every kind and nature, known and unknown, suspected and unsuspected, disclosed and undisclosed, arising out of or in any way connected with such disputes or any breach of this Agreement.

The word "indemnify" means I have to pay for their lawyers. I am also expected to cover any undisclosed indemnity agreement they have entered into as well.

13.1 If you have not used your VirtEx account for more than 1 year, VirtEx will charge an inactivity fee of $50 per month up until such a time when the account balance reaches zero.

The account draining clause is quite steep. It is not clear what happens to any bitcoins, since the agreement only talks about Canadian dollars (Article 16).

18.1 ANY CLAIM, DISPUTE, OR CONTROVERSY (WHETHER IN CONTRACT, TORT, OR OTHERWISE, WHETHER PREEXISTING, PRESENT OR FUTURE, AND INCLUDING STATUTORY, COMMON LAW, INTENTIONAL TORT AND EQUITABLE CLAIMS CAPABLE IN LAW OF BEING SUBMITTED TO BINDING ARBITRATION) AGAINST VIRTEX, its agents, employees, officers, directors, successors, assigns or affiliates (collectively for purposes of this paragraph, "VirtEx") arising from or relating to this Agreement, its interpretation, or the breach, termination or validity thereof, the relationships between the parties, whether pre existing, present or future, (including, to the full extent permitted by applicable law, relationships with third parties who are not signatories to this Agreement), VirtEx's advertising, or any related purchase SHALL BE RESOLVED EXCLUSIVELY AND FINALLY according to the Alberta Arbitration Act R.S.A. 2000, c. A-43. The place of arbitration shall be Calgary, Alberta, Canada. The language of the arbitration shall be English. The arbitration will be limited solely to the dispute or controversy between Customer and VirtEx. Any award of the arbitrator(s) shall be final and binding on each of the parties, and may be entered as a judgment in any court of competent jurisdiction.

The "don't sue" clause.

[Rogue Star]

deposit fees sound pretty sweet, but I'd rather use a high volume American exchange and worry less about trading fees.

Fees: 1% of transaction value in either CAD (buying) or BTC (selling)

seems a bit steep, especially with all the trading fee specials going on right now.

0.01 (CAD/BTC) minimum

the trading fees on small trades are unprecedentedly high, major turn off

No MD5s here: The MD5 hashing algorithm is known to be weak for storing password hashes. We do not use MD5 to hash your password. Nor will we be using something equivalently insecure.

would be better to say what you ARE using BEFORE bashing a documented standard. mystery standards are worse than a well documented bad standard.

[Quix]

It looks great. Glad to see you did some hard work to put it all together.  I found this part of the TOS interesting:

1.2 By using the VirtEx site and VirtEx services, you acknowledge and agree that:

1.2.1 this VirtEx site and the VirtEx services do not constitute a trading of, or an exchange in, securities, investment contracts or any document, instrument or writing commonly known as a "security", at law or otherwise;

1.2.2 Bitcoins do not constitute a currency, an asset or a form of property at law or otherwise;

1.2.3 Bitcoins have no inherent or underlying monitory or other value and may, at any time and without warning or notice, have no such value whatsoever;

This section is to get around Canadian laws involving exchange of securities, which would require VirtEx be licensed as a bank (which in Canada is quite difficult to achieve and very expensive.). If Bitcoins are a currency the exchange would need to be licensed as a currency exchange, a smaller expense and pain but still quite bad. #3 should probably be re-worded or dropped because it will put off people with a big investment in bit coins and I can't see a legal need for it

Canada has very strict banking laws, which is the biggest reason why there are really only 5 Canadian banks which are all enormous. .

[phillipsjk]

I get the impression that 1.2.3 is there so that the Arbitrator sides with Cavirtex when you complain they took all of your Bitcoins. Maybe I am just being cynical.

Bitcoins do have value: they are backed by proof-of-work and a public transaction history. It is possible people won't value them in the future, but for now they have value.

When I was reading 1.2.1 and 1.2.2, I was thinking: Why does it matter what I think they are? If there are legal issues in dealing with a commodity or currency, doesn't it only matter what the regulators think?

There is a good argument for saying it is not a currency: it is not backed by any Government. Most the laws dealing with currency assume currency must be backed by government. Using that logic, Canadian Tire money is not considered a currency either. Both Canadian Tire money and Bitcoin are "Money" (a medium of exchange).

I suspect "Security" has a similar specific legal definition. I don't know why I equated securities with commodities earlier. Edit: I believe commodities have inherent value; ruled out by 1.2.3.

[Stephen Gornick]

VirtEx doesn't have much coverage here from the OP so I'll post an email I got which provides some updates:

From: *@cavirtex.com
Subject: VirtEx Canada Update March 5 2012
Date: Tue,  6 Mar 2012

VirtEx Update for March 5, 2012  - www.cavirtex.com

1.      Now active with hyperwallet -  You can now deposit and withdraw funds with Hyperwallet at www.hyperwallet.com. One of the unique features they provide are INSTANT transfers from a credit union account 24/7! All hyperwallet deposits and withdrawals cost only $0.25 billed by Hyperwallet, no additional fee will be charged by us until Apr 1,2011!
2.      New Fraud Prevention Measures - More stringent verification checks are being performed on first time transactions and new accounts.  We are working with the banks and law enforcement to prevent fraudulent transactions.  We take payment fraud very seriously and are constantly improving our verification system. For those users who are already verified, our administrative team may be contacting you by telephone to confirm certain details of your account.  We appreciate your cooperation to help make VirtEx a secure and trusted exchange.
3.      Volume Increase -  on track to break 10,000 BTC per week!  We just had some large merchant and mining organizations join us, you will now see better spreads, increased volume and larger order values. If you would like your limits increased, please contact us.
4.      Administration Fees for breaching our Terms of Service -  Attempting to circumvent our terms of service or deposit limits creates extra administration work for VirtEx.  Depending on the case, a fee of up to $50 will be charged.  You are only allowed one account with Virtex and multiple accounts must be consolidated.  Any payment made to your account must originate from your identity.  Always use the notification system BEFORE making any deposits.
5.      Announcements - Our announcement page contains very important information for our users, do not skip the announcements and ensure you read them carefully.  Do not rely on email notifications for changes to the system, always refer to our announcement page (shown every time you log in to your account).
6.      Exchange Improvements - Virtex is developing new features and functionality for the exchange.  Details will be posted on the announcement page.  We appreciate your suggestions on features you would like to see and invite you to email your suggestions to admin@cavirtex.com.

> hyperwallet deposits and withdrawals cost only $0.25 billed by Hyperwallet

Nice!

> Volume Increase -  on track to break 10,000 BTC per week!

Very nice!

[Blimkat]

Looking to switch bitcoin banks.  I am looking to make my first withdrawl.  I am on MTGOX and they want me to send in a scanned government ID as well as a utility bill of some sort or government proof of residence.  Is this required on Virtex or can I just deposit with my banking information?   I do not have a scanner to scan my ID, I am a student living in rental properties so I do not have a utility bill and if I did it wouldnt match my permanent address.  Also I don't think MTGOX has paypal either.  Not looking to jump through hoops to withdraw my money so I am looking to switch banks and am planning on registering with virtex later.  Thanks in advance for any info cheers.

[DILLIGAF]

Looking to switch bitcoin banks.  I am looking to make my first withdrawl.  I am on MTGOX and they want me to send in a scanned government ID as well as a utility bill of some sort or government proof of residence.  Is this required on Virtex or can I just deposit with my banking information?   I do not have a scanner to scan my ID, I am a student living in rental properties so I do not have a utility bill and if I did it wouldnt match my permanent address.  Also I don't think MTGOX has paypal either.  Not looking to jump through hoops to withdraw my money so I am looking to switch banks and am planning on registering with virtex later.  Thanks in advance for any info cheers.

Good luck finding any that do not require verification the same as you do need here if you want to use this service on a regular basis.

[zer0]

Cavirtex.com Unverified Transfer Limits

If you wish to use the service unverified, you are only allowed to:

    deposit up to $1,000 by cash
    withdraw up to $300 by Direct Deposit
    deposit or withdraw via hyperWallet

Amount limits are applied on a 90 day time frame.

[Nyaaan]

Finally a good canadian bitcoin exchange!
I will use this now.

[Gabi]

LOL @ the don't sue clause. Do they really believe such crap has any legal means?  Do they think we are so idiot? Remember guys, the law is more important than any idiot clause.

[zer0]

LOL @ the don't sue clause. Do they really believe such crap has any legal means?  Do they think we are so idiot? Remember guys, the law is more important than any idiot clause.

Have you seen the Hyperwallet terms? Guess crazy terms is par for course in Canada
http://www.hyperwallet.com/legal/terms-of-use.html
Under 12.Jurisdiction

You agree to waive any right you may have to: (i) a trial by jury, and (ii) commence or participate in any class action against hyperWALLET

Lol. Some payday loan companies tried the same thing and lost.



In other news I've used this exchange for almost a year without any problems so far.

[teflone]

Hyperwallet no longer accepted....

[mokahless]

$6 for a direct deposit. I thought this was expensive but I couldn't find anything better. I'll just have to wait until I mine $300 worth to do another "withdrawal"