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Author Topic: German VAT Ruling - On what exactly is VAT charged?  (Read 5956 times)
prophetx
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August 21, 2013, 07:41:05 PM
 #41

Given that the german tax authority falls under the Ministry of Finance, and the MoF calls it private money, what would lead you to believe that a subordinate agency would attempt to redefine that?

“The German Ministry of Finance does not classify bitcoins as e-money or as a functional currency; they cannot be regarded as a foreign currency. Nevertheless they have to be subsumed under the German term of ‘Rechnungseinheit’ as a financial instrument,” Martin Chaudhuri from the Ministry of Finance

http://translate.google.com/#auto/en/Rechnungseinheit

My message did not refer to Germany, see the "<insert country here>" part.

Also, just because a minister says something does not make it a law, merely an interpretation. Maybe the next minister will say the opposite, who knows.
It is a guideline, not a law. In order to become law it has to go through the regular circuit.

I would remain cautious about the whole thing, because right now it's still quite blurry, nothing has been said about the licensing requirements for example, do people who exchange BTC for EUR professionnally or semi-professionnally need a financial license ? Because if you extrapolate the opinion you easily reach the conclusion that yes, to exchange financial instruments as a business you need a license. This sword has two edges.

There has been a ton of hype around this, but the taxman doesn't do hype he does law.
I concur that this is a great thing though, but I'm mildly impressed by this whole thing because once you remove the hype varnish there isn't that much left in terms of cold hard law.

It's a great start, but it's just a start.

in the USA anyone exchanging BTC to any currency professionally or $1000+/day needs a licenses or licenses... if you have read enough posts in these forums you would know that also applies in EU countries.

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davout
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August 21, 2013, 08:37:42 PM
 #42

in the USA anyone exchanging BTC to any currency professionally or $1000+/day needs a licenses or licenses... if you have read enough posts in these forums you would know that also applies in EU countries.

Guess I probably missed the "Let's make up some laws, be creative!" thread in my few years here.

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August 21, 2013, 09:42:26 PM
 #43

Can someone give an idea what is situation with VAT refunds for exported bitcoins?
(IANAL, feel free to be harsh if it makes explanation more clear Smiley)

Of course I gave you bad advice. Good one is way out of your price range.
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August 22, 2013, 10:43:15 PM
 #44

People aren't looking at the big picture in here. This does in fact effect the 'little guy'. It effects everyone.

If you step back it appears as if Germany has just completely undermined the competitive advantage of Bitcoin. Even though small p2p transactions won't be taxed, anything done through an 'official' channel will be. Thus the costs to the broker/exchanger/whatever will be passed onto the little guy, which inevitably weighs heavily on the rest of the Bitcoin economy.

I would like some clarity on this issue too, because anyone considering opening a Bitcoin business in Germany or dealing with German customers must now seriously reconsider their options. Troublesome.

prophetx
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August 24, 2013, 04:20:05 PM
 #45

in the USA anyone exchanging BTC to any currency professionally or $1000+/day needs a licenses or licenses... if you have read enough posts in these forums you would know that also applies in EU countries.

Guess I probably missed the "Let's make up some laws, be creative!" thread in my few years here.

guess so...

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