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Author Topic: USD *is* a virtual currency  (Read 2491 times)
dserrano5
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July 11, 2011, 06:04:52 PM
 #21


1 person asking for $1000 in cash isn't going to make a dent in a bank. 1000 people withdrawing $1000 might be a problem. I have personally taken $5k out of my bank in cash upon asking for it without a problem and I'm positive I could do it anytime. You vastly underestimate the holdings of a bank, they are required to keep a a certain amount of cash on hand just in case. That's why big banks have big safes, and small banks don't.
I know of two banks in my country, the largest two, who will most likely tell you you have to notify them atleast one day before you wish to have your money in cash. They will also ask you what you intend to do with such large sums of cash (might avoid this question of youre a native and wear a suit and tie).

Although I have been in a bank where it was no problem taking out $2000. I guess this depends on banks.

Not long ago, while at the queue, I could take a glance to a paper describing the monthly movements in that branch's vault. At no moment the balance was lower than 70k€. Since I know nothing about the banking world, I'm leaving open the question about it being "enough" (for what?) or not.

I usually withdraw 1200€-1900€ (at least once a month) and I've never had any problem with that.

Oh, this is Spain BTW.

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em3rgentOrdr
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July 11, 2011, 06:23:50 PM
 #22

Im pretty sure banks have whatever amount of currency they got somewhere as "real" currency. Coins etc.

Maybe not real coins, but the government does have guns to back up their currency.  Basically you must pay taxes in FRN even if your business only used bitcoins or some other commodity for transactions.  That gives USD some value.

"We will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.

Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks, but pure P2P networks are holding their own."
Steve
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July 11, 2011, 06:42:34 PM
 #23

Another non bitcoin thread. Admin please move this fed bash trash.
My original post was about how bitcoin being virtual doesn't make it unique among the world's national currencies (other things make it unique, yes, but not the fact that it's virtual).

(gasteve on IRC) Does your website accept cash? https://bitpay.com
foggyb
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July 11, 2011, 06:49:42 PM
 #24


Maybe not real coins, but the government does have guns to back up their currency.  

US citizens own way, way more guns than the government. The government guns don't back up the US dollar. Government guns protect the citizens. Without us, there is nothing to protect. To destroy the US Dollar forcibly one must attack the people that stand behind it.

Is bitcoin not similarly backed by its proponents?
CurbsideProphet
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July 11, 2011, 06:54:42 PM
 #25

Just because transfers are done electronically doesn't make it a virtual currency.  I can buy a gold ETF, everything is electronic.  Is gold also virtual currency now?

The USD is not virtual, you can hold tangible bills if you choose.  You do not have that option with Bitcoin. 

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foggyb
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July 11, 2011, 07:31:26 PM
 #26

Just because transfers are done electronically doesn't make it a virtual currency.  I can buy a gold ETF, everything is electronic.  Is gold also virtual currency now?

The USD is not virtual, you can hold tangible bills if you choose.  You do not have that option with Bitcoin.  

Yes you can hold tangible bills, they are called bitbills. Google them.

No matter what you hold, both parties must agree on a the value of a currency in order to trade in it. The value is not built-in.

You are just holding a promise to pay, a debt note. That's all it is. It is only tangible because there is no way to do business by trust alone. There must be a physical exchange. Does that physical exchange have to be made of paper? No, it can be electronic as well, or it can be a signature on a contract. Electronic data is physical matter, bits of data describing a unit of exchange. We can observe the electronic data visually in software, if we wish, like the ink on a dollar bill.

The real issue is trust. Do we trust that bitcoin payments are safe? Trust, but verify, the saying goes. Paper money can be (and often is) counterfeited. So in summary, bitcoin can be a valid currency, if people accept it.
Grant
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July 11, 2011, 08:40:57 PM
 #27

Is gold also virtual currency now?


No, gold isn't a currency, but yes it's virtual as anything else in the universe on our level of "seeing/touching"...

"We have now discovered that there is no such thing as matter, it is all just different rates of vibration designed by an unseen intelligence." - Max Planck, upon accepting the Nobel Prize for physics in 1918

What's the difference of particles appearing and dissappearing in ultra-high-frequency around us, and leds on our monitors switching on and off every xx Hz ? We assign value to both, don't we.

d3wo
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July 11, 2011, 09:14:03 PM
 #28

Another non bitcoin thread. Admin please move this fed bash trash.

And who the f**k are u ordering mods around ?
I've seen your previous post, are you us govt insider ?

Edited  Wink

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foggyb
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July 11, 2011, 09:58:37 PM
 #29

What's the difference of particles appearing and dissappearing in ultra-high-frequency around us, and leds on our monitors switching on and off every xx Hz ? We assign value to both, don't we.

Precisely.

Gold has been preferred traditionally over other states of mass as physical store of wealth primarily because it is a very stable element.

The properties of gold that we desire, its physical beauty, malleability, weight, corrosion-resistance, etc. are all backed by mathematics, physics and electromagnetism.

Gold has its merits. But these days, there isn't enough of it to go around when used as a general medium of exchange, and its ex-changeability is questionable (few people will accept gold as payment).

What if there were an alternative, stable store of wealth and medium of exchange worthy of the information age, stored in digital form, also backed by the physical properties of the universe?

The culmination of technology is currently the information age. Why shouldn't the culmination of currency be a an info-currency, or bit-currency (bitcoin). The internet and computer systems are now sufficiently stable and redundant that we now can be virtually assured of bitcoin surviving anything but a world-ending apocalypse.

Satoshi is a genius.
elggawf
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July 12, 2011, 01:38:34 AM
 #30

And who the f**k are u ordering mods around ?
I've seen your previous post, are you us govt insider ?

We really need to stop this retarded bullshit. It seems like lately, everyone who posts anything from a contempt-ridden scathing criticism of Bitcoin to [slightly negative] industry-insider advice about a Bitcoin business, clear up to meta-comments about the relevancy of a given thread are being called US government drones.

Shut the fuck up. Seriously. Comments like this make Bitcoiners look like a bunch of fucking kooks, and let me tell you that because of the nature of Bitcoin itself we need no fucking help in that department. You know what I think would be a good forum rule? No calling someone out as a government plant unless your avatar includes a self pic with a tinfoil hat on so we all know to ignore your inane bullshit.

^_^
Giraffe.BC
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July 12, 2011, 05:12:45 AM
 #31

And who the f**k are u ordering mods around ?
I've seen your previous post, are you us govt insider ?

We really need to stop this retarded bullshit. It seems like lately, everyone who posts anything from a contempt-ridden scathing criticism of Bitcoin to [slightly negative] industry-insider advice about a Bitcoin business, clear up to meta-comments about the relevancy of a given thread are being called US government drones.

Shut the fuck up. Seriously. Comments like this make Bitcoiners look like a bunch of fucking kooks, and let me tell you that because of the nature of Bitcoin itself we need no fucking help in that department. You know what I think would be a good forum rule? No calling someone out as a government plant unless your avatar includes a self pic with a tinfoil hat on so we all know to ignore your inane bullshit.
Stop trolling, troll!!  Take your trolling trollery somewhere else!

(In addition to ranting about the government stealing their thoughts, one of the rules of being a forum crazy is that anyone who says anything you don't want to hear is automatically trolling.)

http://www.giraffeboards.com (http://www.giraffeboards.com):  a message board with the simple, understated elegance of a bum in a wedding dress.
Stardust
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July 12, 2011, 07:57:02 AM
 #32

[Maybe not real coins, but the government does have guns to back up their currency.  Basically you must pay taxes in FRN even if your business only used bitcoins or some other commodity for transactions.  That gives USD some value.

A government that backs any currency (especially with guns) is corrupt. It is kind of like mafia backing up a business. And I am not against US or my local government, just saying.
Jointops420
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July 12, 2011, 09:28:43 AM
 #33

Just a little side info for thought.
The word government is derived from the Latin verb gubernare, an infinitive meaning "to govern" or "to manage", and the Latin noun mente, meaning "mind".
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