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Author Topic: Attention new pool operators  (Read 3315 times)
Jack of Diamonds
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July 13, 2011, 09:45:50 AM
 #21

What you should call your service is variance stabilization.
Only a simple minded fool doesn't see this kind of service can be very valuable for a small pool operator who wishes to grow.

Not worth PPS+10% imo, but definitely 2-3%. The faster your pool solves blocks, the more people will join creating a snowball effect

Ultimately you don't even need the original 50ghash/s from Vladimir because you have momentum on your own.
Then you can collect small fees (0.5% per block) and eventually make it all back.

The less ghash/s you have the bigger the variance swings will be. In the worst case (like http://btcpool24.com )
everyone will leave after the first unlucky round due to low hash rate & high difficulty, and your entire pool dies. You'll never see a cent from block fees because none will be found.

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Sukrim
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July 13, 2011, 10:10:40 AM
 #22

Then you can collect small fees (0.5% per block) and eventually make it all back.
Why would anyone do this when there are 0% pools around? Only if you get to a size like deepbit (where ppl seem to believe it's better to pay 3% fees to get a share of ~1/2 of all blocks) you'd be able to charge fees for yourself. They also have the early adopter's bonus.

Just look at the mainframe pool, where vladimir tested this offer out. http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=24650.0

As soon as he was away, the pool dropped back to nothingness. If you want to have Vlad on your pool, even with perfect 0% luck (unrealistic, as variance is that big!) prepare to pay him ~2 BTC/day additional to the ~20 BTC he anyways would get in the long run.

Other pools have already offered some rewards per day/found block for early miners, but they still didn't bite. This offer here however is just plain arrogant in my opinion. Tiny pools have to fight with variance anyways a lot, they might be better off with writing a plugin for a pool hopper, setting their payout to proportional and praying for a few short rounds in the beginning. 50 GH/s don't stabilize much, at least not that much to rectify 10% extra to 0 variance(!).

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snoopytime
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July 13, 2011, 10:14:22 AM
 #23

Vlad if you get bored or have a stray card, point it to coolcoin.net! We are brand new but we are . .. . COOL!  Be GooD Man, thanks!

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July 13, 2011, 10:37:37 AM
 #24

Your posts and calling my offer arrogant is just plain stupid.

I'll take the liberty of ninja quoting yourself out of context:

you are just trolling.

I see the value you offer, but I still highly doubt that it is worth more than 0 variance + maybe some fixed donation amount (like 2 BTC/week or so).

As you get paid upfront (I hope for your own good... Wink ) anyways, there is little need to make a lot of profit for a much better deal than you get mining solo in the first place.

I would not match this current offer, but I'd LOVE to offer 50 GH/s (or wait! make that 1000 GH/s!) mining contracts for 399 GBP/GH just 1 GBP cheaper than you! Payment in BTC is possible and preferred (so I don't have to transfer to MtGox before) and I offer 0 variance payments of course! The nice thing is, I don't even have to buy and operate any hardware besides a PC to handle bitcoind for this. Roll Eyes

As pool hopping currently runs at more than 200% efficiency (I got lucky on a few short rounds) for me, I guess it would be dumb to cut my earnings by accepting only 105% earnings... However once more pools switch to proper payout structures, I would love to offer my hash rate for 105% payouts.

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AnnihilaT
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July 13, 2011, 10:42:20 AM
 #25

What you should call your service is variance stabilization.
Only a simple minded fool doesn't see this kind of service can be very valuable for a small pool operator who wishes to grow.

Not worth PPS+10% imo, but definitely 2-3%. The faster your pool solves blocks, the more people will join creating a snowball effect

Ultimately you don't even need the original 50ghash/s from Vladimir because you have momentum on your own.
Then you can collect small fees (0.5% per block) and eventually make it all back.

The less ghash/s you have the bigger the variance swings will be. In the worst case (like http://btcpool24.com )
everyone will leave after the first unlucky round due to low hash rate & high difficulty, and your entire pool dies. You'll never see a cent from block fees because none will be found.

+1  This is indeed the real logic behind what Vlad is doing.   In the beginning its the variance that hurts a small pool and discourages miners from joining.  Thanks for pointing this out.
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July 13, 2011, 10:45:41 AM
 #26

Then you can collect small fees (0.5% per block) and eventually make it all back.

Just look at the mainframe pool, where vladimir tested this offer out. http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=24650.0

As soon as he was away, the pool dropped back to nothingness. If you want to have Vlad on your pool, even with perfect 0% luck (unrealistic, as variance is that big!) prepare to pay him ~2 BTC/day additional to the ~20 BTC he anyways would get in the long run.



Well nothingness might be a bit strong.  The pool is still running great and is still available for those looking for an alternative.   What really has hurt Mainframe is a very unlucky first round.   I still see new users signing up every day but i think people are just waiting to see that first block solved and paid before jumping in completely.   Our attempt was to try and hit that first block as quickly as possible and reduce some variance for the miners while the pool is young and growing and we have just run into horrible luck in the first round.  A shame really. 
phorensic
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July 13, 2011, 04:32:54 PM
 #27

You are grossly underestimating the amount of time it takes to get pushpool and mining farm(xenland)/simplecoin to work.  You don't just slap it up and hope to get rich.  I have had to recode hundreds of lines of code and diagnose for hundreds of hours to get to where we are today.  We also don't use a cheap webhost, the bill stings right now to be honest.  I have a feeling you haven't tried to get a public pool running and you are guessing with your comments.

By "You", you mean Vladimir?

I joined the Triplemining when they had 18 miners Smiley an stared my own so called "mini pool". Yes, the same one that forum administrator attacked because some morons got carried away with posting invitations.  Cry

At the moment, we are cruising along at ~40 Ghs and have about 145 active miners.
I think the pool owners have done wonderful job keeping everything up and running. Yes, we had some bad luck with a massive block an it took us forever and some miners deserted the pool (dropped from 70Ghs).
Most important for slow miner like me is this: my final payouts are slightly better than in other pools I tested, even when I have no income from my minipool members.
 
So, if any of you likes to join us on same terms as everybody else, you are more than welcome. Maybe you are better off joining us than staring another pool and going trough all the bull shit and shit storms new pools have to.

By "You" I meant Sukrim, who believes it's easy to just slap up a new public pool in a couple minutes.
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July 13, 2011, 04:40:32 PM
 #28

phorensic, I think you miss understood Sukrim initial post. 
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