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Author Topic: Merit & new rank requirements  (Read 139248 times)
albermaze
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February 06, 2018, 06:30:53 PM
 #2381

I support the introduction of merit system in general. However, I would like to point out the one big problem: in future will be big gap between the same ranks. Because some people have received merit for nothing (just because they have rank) and other people will have gain it (and it seems not to be an easy task). So in future we will see, for instance, two Full Members with 100 merit points: one received it initially and the another gained it under new conditions. So it is obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different, otherwise what is the sense of ranking. I would dare to propose two solutions:
1)   Introduce the minimum requirement of merits gained for each rank for some period (3 months / 6 months). If this requirement is not met the rank should be lowered.
2)   Introduce completely new rank system which will provide no gap between “old” and “new” ranks.
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suchmoon
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February 06, 2018, 06:44:54 PM
 #2382

I support the introduction of merit system in general. However, I would like to point out the one big problem: in future will be big gap between the same ranks. Because some people have received merit for nothing (just because they have rank) and other people will have gain it (and it seems not to be an easy task). So in future we will see, for instance, two Full Members with 100 merit points: one received it initially and the another gained it under new conditions. So it is obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different, otherwise what is the sense of ranking. I would dare to propose two solutions:
1)   Introduce the minimum requirement of merits gained for each rank for some period (3 months / 6 months). If this requirement is not met the rank should be lowered.
2)   Introduce completely new rank system which will provide no gap between “old” and “new” ranks.

Why is it "obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different"?

Existing members didn't receive merit "for nothing", they got the MINIMUM matching their rank. Maybe the "old" Full Member in your example could argue this is unfair because he/she could have earned 1000 merits if the system was in place earlier. It's impossible to go back and re-evaluate millions of posts and re-merit everyone so everyone gets the minimum and needs to earn their next rank.

albermaze
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February 06, 2018, 06:51:07 PM
 #2383

I support the introduction of merit system in general. However, I would like to point out the one big problem: in future will be big gap between the same ranks. Because some people have received merit for nothing (just because they have rank) and other people will have gain it (and it seems not to be an easy task). So in future we will see, for instance, two Full Members with 100 merit points: one received it initially and the another gained it under new conditions. So it is obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different, otherwise what is the sense of ranking. I would dare to propose two solutions:
1)   Introduce the minimum requirement of merits gained for each rank for some period (3 months / 6 months). If this requirement is not met the rank should be lowered.
2)   Introduce completely new rank system which will provide no gap between “old” and “new” ranks.

Why is it "obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different"?

Existing members didn't receive merit "for nothing", they got the MINIMUM matching their rank. Maybe the "old" Full Member in your example could argue this is unfair because he/she could have earned 1000 merits if the system was in place earlier. It's impossible to go back and re-evaluate millions of posts and re-merit everyone so everyone gets the minimum and needs to earn their next rank.

Sorry, I don't want to insist but must support my thoughts:
It is obvious for situation discribed in my post. Because if in some period in future the "old" and "new" have the same merit points (for instance 100). That obviously means that one person is much more helpful for community than another (at least during this period). Thus, they should be ranked differently!
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February 06, 2018, 07:00:55 PM
 #2384

I support the introduction of merit system in general. However, I would like to point out the one big problem: in future will be big gap between the same ranks. Because some people have received merit for nothing (just because they have rank) and other people will have gain it (and it seems not to be an easy task). So in future we will see, for instance, two Full Members with 100 merit points: one received it initially and the another gained it under new conditions. So it is obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different, otherwise what is the sense of ranking. I would dare to propose two solutions:
1)   Introduce the minimum requirement of merits gained for each rank for some period (3 months / 6 months). If this requirement is not met the rank should be lowered.
2)   Introduce completely new rank system which will provide no gap between “old” and “new” ranks.

Why is it "obvious that these two accounts must be ranked different"?

Existing members didn't receive merit "for nothing", they got the MINIMUM matching their rank. Maybe the "old" Full Member in your example could argue this is unfair because he/she could have earned 1000 merits if the system was in place earlier. It's impossible to go back and re-evaluate millions of posts and re-merit everyone so everyone gets the minimum and needs to earn their next rank.

Sorry, I don't want to insist but must support my thoughts:
It is obvious for situation discribed in my post. Because if in some period in future the "old" and "new" have the same merit points (for instance 100). That obviously means that one person is much more helpful for community than another (at least during this period). Thus, they should be ranked differently!

You're saying "obviously" again and you're not really providing any substantial argument. It's far from obvious.

Merits are not based on a specific period and that's a good thing. Users should be able to take a break from the forum without being relegated to newbies due to inactivity. Users should be able to earn the ranks at their own pace and not feel forced to post to maintain the rank - signature campaigns already create enough spam.

greeklogos
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February 06, 2018, 07:06:08 PM
 #2385

Every day I have new questions to merit. So, I have activity 238, to the next rank I miss 2. My Merit number is 101 and for the next rank requrement is 250. Will I stay in my full member rank as far as I will not add 149 merits more? Yes? No? Maybe? Smiley
cryptocommoner
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February 06, 2018, 07:08:44 PM
 #2386

Every day I have new questions to merit. So, I have activity 238, to the next rank I miss 2. My Merit number is 101 and for the next rank requrement is 250. Will I stay in my full member rank as far as I will not add 149 merits more? Yes? No? Maybe? Smiley

You are correct.  Unfortunately, you were one of the unfortunate that had just under the required activity to bump up to next rank prior to merit.  You do indeed need another149 merits.
asapjoshyy
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February 06, 2018, 07:11:01 PM
 #2387

Every day I have new questions to merit. So, I have activity 238, to the next rank I miss 2. My Merit number is 101 and for the next rank requrement is 250. Will I stay in my full member rank as far as I will not add 149 merits more? Yes? No? Maybe? Smiley

in the same boat amigo... you need 250 merit now regardless if youre 240 activity or higher .... so 250 merit or you will stay full member , even if you have the required activity it doesnt matter
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February 06, 2018, 07:34:16 PM
 #2388

So in order for me to get my merit up I have to wait until others give the smerit to me or at least hope that other memeber want to share some merit??? I'm lost.


Sure it is possible that you might receive some merit for past posts that you made, but it seems much better to NOT be lost and your chances probably increase considerably in the prospect of receiving merit based on new posts and interactions in the forum rather than sitting back and "hoping" to receive merit.

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pvk444
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February 06, 2018, 08:34:25 PM
 #2389

Every day I have new questions to merit. So, I have activity 238, to the next rank I miss 2. My Merit number is 101 and for the next rank requrement is 250. Will I stay in my full member rank as far as I will not add 149 merits more? Yes? No? Maybe? Smiley

Cases like yours show the challenge with this. I am all for a merit base system, but unless it's fair and attainable, I fear it might have the opposite effect of what it truly wants to achieve. It is darn difficult to gain merits. Unless you are active in the "right" forums it is unlikely that good quality posts will be rewarded at all. Furthermore, although it takes some time to demonstrate sufficient activity, it can take several magnitudes longer to accumulate the right amount of merits. Seeing the numbers above, I have to ask myself how long would it take somebody to accumulate 149 merits? The proportions between activity and merit just seem way out of balance.

Has anyone considered how many good quality posts it takes in general to receive a merit point (on average)? If this turns out more than say 10:1, it would somebody like greeklogos take around 1500 posts just to get to the next level. If the odds would be really this bad (and I don't have much to go on here), the merits could have the effect of destroying the incentive is wants to achieve.
btcs-favorite
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February 06, 2018, 09:00:19 PM
Merited by pvk444 (1)
 #2390

Wow how i should get that much merit Sad 100 for Full Member

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btcs-favorite
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February 06, 2018, 09:02:17 PM
 #2391

Aren't you people getting tired of all those new Merit threads already? I feel like a spammer now, answering the same questions all the time, trying not to repeat myself. Here, in Beginners and Help even in the Bounty section, it's crazy. I thought this madness will eventually stop.
Please theymos, just send a PM to all the users with the information about the new merit system so people can stop posting every day 10000 topics with the same questions generating posts.
Lets just finish with it once and for all.



Thats a nice idea!

Or add a link to this thread, when people click the "Merit" link in their profiles.

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February 06, 2018, 09:05:47 PM
 #2392

Maybe the merit system ws introduced to reduce the dominance of immigrants to the forum taking over with their bounty hunting and sig spamming. Smiley

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btcs-favorite
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February 06, 2018, 09:12:39 PM
 #2393

Every day I have new questions to merit. So, I have activity 238, to the next rank I miss 2. My Merit number is 101 and for the next rank requrement is 250. Will I stay in my full member rank as far as I will not add 149 merits more? Yes? No? Maybe? Smiley

Cases like yours show the challenge with this. I am all for a merit base system, but unless it's fair and attainable, I fear it might have the opposite effect of what it truly wants to achieve. It is darn difficult to gain merits. Unless you are active in the "right" forums it is unlikely that good quality posts will be rewarded at all. Furthermore, although it takes some time to demonstrate sufficient activity, it can take several magnitudes longer to accumulate the right amount of merits. Seeing the numbers above, I have to ask myself how long would it take somebody to accumulate 149 merits? The proportions between activity and merit just seem way out of balance.

Has anyone considered how many good quality posts it takes in general to receive a merit point (on average)? If this turns out more than say 10:1, it would somebody like greeklogos take around 1500 posts just to get to the next level. If the odds would be really this bad (and I don't have much to go on here), the merits could have the effect of destroying the incentive is wants to achieve.

Thank you for the merit:)

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adetos
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February 06, 2018, 09:21:08 PM
 #2394

I dont know what is wrong with my account, before the merit system was deployed, I ought to have become Member from Jnr. Member. Can I get a help from admin? or can i get analysis of my account or is there any admin to help me out
The Pharmacist
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February 06, 2018, 09:23:51 PM
 #2395

I dont know what is wrong with my account, before the merit system was deployed, I ought to have become Member from Jnr. Member. Can I get a help from admin? or can i get analysis of my account or is there any admin to help me out
There's nothing wrong with your account.  Perhaps if you read about how the merit system works, you'll figure out that you now need merit points in addiction to activity in order to rank up.

The hard part is earning merit, because for that you have to write interesting/important/informative posts AND you're at the mercy of other people giving you merit for those posts.  So good luck.  Yes, it's now much harder to rank up, but this is the way it's supposed to be.

adetos
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February 06, 2018, 09:25:38 PM
 #2396

I dont know what is wrong with my account, before the merit system was deployed, I ought to have become Member from Jnr. Member. Can I get a help from admin? or can i get analysis of my account or is there any admin to help me out
There's nothing wrong with your account.  Perhaps if you read about how the merit system works, you'll figure out that you now need merit points in addiction to activity in order to rank up.

The hard part is earning merit, because for that you have to write interesting/important/informative posts AND you're at the mercy of other people giving you merit for those posts.  So good luck.  Yes, it's now much harder to rank up, but this is the way it's supposed to be.

thanks
adetos
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February 06, 2018, 09:28:37 PM
 #2397

In what forums here can one make post to earn merits
fishfishfish313
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February 06, 2018, 09:55:32 PM
 #2398

In what forums here can one make post to earn merits

I believe that any post has the potential to earn merits, provided people choose to give them to you.

In other words, create thoughtful and intelligent posts that add to the conversation and theoretically, you should be awarded with merits over time.

From the Original Post:

Quote
I'm hoping that this system will increase post quality by:
 - Forcing people to post high-quality stuff in order to rank up. If you just post garbage, you will never get even 1 merit point, and you will therefore never be able to put links in your signature, etc.
 - Highlighting good posts with the "Merited by" line.



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pvk444
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February 06, 2018, 10:05:41 PM
 #2399

In what forums here can one make post to earn merits

I believe that any post has the potential to earn merits, provided people choose to give them to you.

In other words, create thoughtful and intelligent posts that add to the conversation and theoretically, you should be awarded with merits over time.


In theory, you might be right. In practice, there are more high quality post which don't receive any merits than those that have received merits.

Looking through the forums and the posts, I noticed that one is MUCH more likely to get noticed and receive merits, if you start a new topic. Hope this will not lead to unintended consequence of people abandoning discussions early.
LoyceV
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February 06, 2018, 10:05:54 PM
 #2400

or can i get analysis of my account
You must have one of the highest Activity numbers for a Jr. Member now. Your account had a large "potential activity". This means you didn't post many messages, but the ones you posted had enough time between them to cover each "14-days Activity period".
Right after the Merit system was introduced, you started posting many posts per day (including crossposting of the same post in different threads), which means your post count and thus Activity went up quickly. You even started a thread, in which these questions were answered already.
So far my analysis.

In what forums here can one make post to earn merits
Any post can earn merits.
But, if you mainly post in threads where nobody else has earned any merits, it's very unlikely you'll get them there. In that case the whole thread isn't worth any merits, and people post there only for bounties or to increase their post count.
Example: this thread has 96 posts, but it only has 1 post from a user who has earned 6 Merit points. Several other people who posted in that thread have 100, 250 or 500 Merit points, but they got them at the introduction, and not based on their post quality.

Note: this doesn't mean you should start posting irrelevant posts in threads/boards with people who have earned many Merits just to earn them.

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