Merit & new rank requirements

[Magister Magus]

I think there is a lot of hypocrisy in this thread, and I'm glad that someone says how things really are.
As I wrote in a precedent post, I'm starting to appreciate the intention behind the system, I received also some merits so - even it's hard - it doesn't appear as impossible as at the beginning.
What I found very disturbing was the bad attitude of some high rank members, that treated the rest of us with arrogance, without to see that a lot of them were just lucky shitposters and - if they were evaluated with this new system - they were still newbies. Of course, this is just a rough generalization.

Btw: it's evident that if a system rewards people for writing shit, the system will be filled soon by shitposters!
The revenue from a campaign can appear ridiculous to an average guy in USA of Europe, but for someone in other parts of the world are very big sums.
I understand that the forum must be protected, and something must be done, but when I see some "stars" of the forum talking about "3rd world monkeys" or "3rd world cancer", I think this has nothing to do with the improvement of the forum but only reveals a racist and Nazi mentality.
I'm not from 3rd world, but I think that everyone on the planet deserves respect, and actually I think that the "15 year old kid from Bangladesh" trying to make a buck on the forum should be rewarded for his good will, not insulted.
Of course, a million of 15 years old kids writing on the forum would be a tsunami, so we needed measures.

The new system is not perfect, but I was very glad to see that theymos is open to suggestions.
It's very simple to blame. I'd like to have good proposal but sincerely I don't have any, for the moment.
But I'm working on it! We'll see :-)

The last few pages of this thread actually show your position on the earth as it turns in relation to the sun.

The non-English speaking forum members wake up and attempt to speak out about what they see as a problem in the only way they can (using a translator). You English speaking posters need to calm down and realize the local subs don’t each have their own Meta section fully translated in a language they speak fluently. They need to voice their concerns here in English.

Theymos made me think hard about why some of these people are here. Many of them probably are impoverished and see the little amounts of money they can make here as a gold mine. It’s true that this forum is not a substitute worldwide welfare system and many of them will need to go away but we don’t need to treat them like shit in the meantime. Save that for the very fluent scammers and conmen stealing from people here. You can say anything you want to someone like Bryan Micon or Josh Zerlan and be justified. Talking shit to a 15 year old kid from Bangladesh probably isn’t the best thing you could be spending your time on.

[1713523275]

1713523275

[marlboroza]

I did some research last couple of days.

What I noticed so far is large number of accounts which are posting farming as usual and then all of sudden they post very constructive post just to receive merit, often paraphrasing articles and/or just copying articles here.

On the other hand, it is not really hard to post 50 short lines in off topic or games and rounds and after that to post 10 high quality posts at right place and point them to right people.
I don't think current system will decrease number of farming accounts, spam or account sales and honestly I think 10 merits to rank up to member rank is too low, because people will just create hundred accounts, do exactly what I said above and abuse signature/bounty campaigns, giveaways etc.

For every 10 Smerits received, junior member can easily send 5 Smerits to other account, from that account 2 Smerit to third account and so on - and repeat with many accounts.

So, in my honest opinion this system need little improvement:

Rank	Required activity	Required merit
Jr Member	30	0
Member	60	50
Full Member	120	150
Sr. Member	240	300
Hero Member	480	550
Legendary	Random in the range 775-1030	1050

Raising merit requirement by 50 points will make difference and should solve most "merit" issues, account farming, account sales etc(or at least make them so hard that people will give up doing it) and won't affect on number of merits required for full-hero member to rank up because older users will need the same amount of Smerit to rank up(members will need 100 SMP*, full members 150 SMP, senior member 250 SMP and hero 500 SMP) and it will actually force "new users" to write better posts from first day, which isn't the case at the moment.

However, number of Smerits given to all members should remain the same as it is now, but i guess this is irrelevant because we all already received smerits.

*SMP - sMerit points

[DarkoBlog]

As long as this new Merit points system has caused different reactions, I can personally support moderator efforts to bring some order to the forum. Every change is a subject of discussion, but better this than doing nothing.

[bitgov]

I did some research last couple of days.

What I noticed so far is large number of accounts which are posting farming as usual and then all of sudden they post very constructive post just to receive merit, often paraphrasing articles and/or just copying articles here.

On the other hand, it is not really hard to post 50 short lines in off topic or games and rounds and after that to post 10 high quality posts at right place and point them to right people.
I don't think current system will decrease number of farming accounts, spam or account sales and honestly I think 10 merits to rank up to member rank is too low, because people will just create hundred accounts, do exactly what I said above and abuse signature/bounty campaigns, giveaways etc.

For every 10 Smerits received, junior member can easily send 5 Smerits to other account, from that account 2 Smerit to third account and so on - and repeat with many accounts.

So, in my honest opinion this system need little improvement:

Rank	Required activity	Required merit
Jr Member	30	0
Member	60	50
Full Member	120	150
Sr. Member	240	300
Hero Member	480	550
Legendary	Random in the range 775-1030	1050

Raising merit requirement by 50 points will make difference and should solve most "merit" issues, account farming, account sales etc(or at least make them so hard that people will give up doing it) and won't affect on number of merits required for full-hero member to rank up because older users will need the same amount of Smerit to rank up(members will need 100 SMP*, full members 150 SMP, senior member 250 SMP and hero 500 SMP) and it will actually force "new users" to write better posts from first day, which isn't the case at the moment.

However, number of Smerits given to all members should remain the same as it is now, but i guess this is irrelevant because we all already received smerits.

*SMP - sMerit points

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

[QuestionAuthority]

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

You are a curious person to me. The majority of your post history is in Chinese. I randomly translated some of the older posts from that Chinese guy and he was a pretty big bitcoin supporter. He was worried about what his government would do to bitcoin.

Then *poof* as if by some kind of forum magic that Chinese guy becomes fluent in English, never posts in a Chinese language thread again, becomes a bounty hunter and only posts in threads talking about profit. I hope you didn’t spend too much for that account.

I don’t know how much I trust your opinion on the whole merit situation since you’re probably one of the people this system is supposed to eliminate.

[coolcoinz]

I did some research last couple of days.

What I noticed so far is large number of accounts which are posting farming as usual and then all of sudden they post very constructive post just to receive merit, often paraphrasing articles and/or just copying articles here.

On the other hand, it is not really hard to post 50 short lines in off topic or games and rounds and after that to post 10 high quality posts at right place and point them to right people.

That's why when you see a suspicious account you can always check their previous posts and find their true intentions. I've seen some good campaign managers do it. Shitposters won't keep pretending forever. At some point they will start doing their thing again.

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

You are a curious person to me. The majority of your post history is in Chinese. I randomly translated some of the older posts from that Chinese guy and he was a pretty big bitcoin supporter. He was worried about what his government would do to bitcoin.

Then *poof* as if by some kind of forum magic that Chinese guy becomes fluent in English, never posts in a Chinese language thread again, becomes a bounty hunter and only posts in threads talking about profit. I hope you didn’t spend too much for that account.

I don’t know how much I trust your opinion on the whole merit situation since you’re probably one of the people this system is supposed to eliminate.

It's one of the hacked accounts.
All posts in Chinese until September 19, 2014. Then we have a 3 year break in which time we had that data leak and someone grabbed it, sold and suddenly since August 11, 2017 it's running under new, English speaking management.  

[BitNaija]

This merit system introduced is a novelty. However, leaving the score in the hands of the general members will bring controversies. And it has started generating controversy. I will suppose that just the appointed persons be responsible for merit score.

[QuestionAuthority]

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

You are a curious person to me. The majority of your post history is in Chinese. I randomly translated some of the older posts from that Chinese guy and he was a pretty big bitcoin supporter. He was worried about what his government would do to bitcoin.

Then *poof* as if by some kind of forum magic that Chinese guy becomes fluent in English, never posts in a Chinese language thread again, becomes a bounty hunter and only posts in threads talking about profit. I hope you didn’t spend too much for that account.

I don’t know how much I trust your opinion on the whole merit situation since you’re probably one of the people this system is supposed to eliminate.

It's one of the hacked accounts.
All posts in Chinese until September 19, 2014. Then we have a 3 year break in which time we had that data leak and someone grabbed it, sold and suddenly since August 11, 2017 it's running under new, English speaking management.  

Ah, that makes sense then.

I guess I should give him some merit. ROFL

[Rangga27]

I see many quality post here but didn't have a merit. As I can say the problem will be the members who are not participating the purpose of the merit system.

[bobrova]

It is very important for us to know how merit actually, whether we can get directly what if we make a quality post, so I do not understand also about merit. whether merit can decrease by itself as well?

If you go through the response made in this thread, all your doubts will go away. But you want to be spoon fed. Right ?

[bitgov]

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

You are a curious person to me. The majority of your post history is in Chinese. I randomly translated some of the older posts from that Chinese guy and he was a pretty big bitcoin supporter. He was worried about what his government would do to bitcoin.

Then *poof* as if by some kind of forum magic that Chinese guy becomes fluent in English, never posts in a Chinese language thread again, becomes a bounty hunter and only posts in threads talking about profit. I hope you didn’t spend too much for that account.

I don’t know how much I trust your opinion on the whole merit situation since you’re probably one of the people this system is supposed to eliminate.

I bought this account.. Like we can see in posts history it was around middle of August 2017. I don't know why someone sold this account.
It is my alt account, my real account have much longer history.. almost like yours You don't need to trust my rank, because as we all know not always it have to be true . Just read what i write and think.

Merit system is not bad idea in my opinion, but as it was written account farmers can find bypass for it:

On the other hand, it is not really hard to post 50 short lines in off topic or games and rounds and after that to post 10 high quality posts at right place and point them to right people.
I don't think current system will decrease number of farming accounts, spam or account sales and honestly I think 10 merits to rank up to member rank is too low, because people will just create hundred accounts, do exactly what I said above and abuse signature/bounty campaigns, giveaways etc.

For every 10 Smerits received, junior member can easily send 5 Smerits to other account, from that account 2 Smerit to third account and so on - and repeat with many accounts.

When I write that increasing the number of merit points will be very difficult for ordinary users, I write this honestly. On the other hand, in my opinion, farmers will bypass it. But as wrote themos it is too early to verdict where it will go.
The only thing i can suggest at this point, is implementation of a moderator who will deal only with merit points.

Do I have to be eliminated by this system? I don't know - you should to decide about that. Lauda already tagged me just because someone said that my account is hacked And now i have to prove that i bought this account - what is allowed here, but in next 5 minutes The Pharmacist will give me next red tag because he don't like when someone buy account. For me behavior like this distorts reality.
Maybe my example will be interesting to talk about that system.. Let see example when someone collected thousands of merit points, and someone find out that a few years ago he bought this account .. buum - red tag! What then?

I think that trading accounts should be blocked completely and it would dispel any doubts. Don't you see a conflict of interest? On one end Administration is letting people trading accounts and on another is rewarding people for red tagging for that! Kind of Monthy Python for me ..

Sorry for little off top with this trading.

[youcansee]

I once found a conversation that essentially, they will set up a telegram group whose purpose is to exchange Smerit they have

and I realize that spammers still have a cunning way to raise their rank
if so whether this merit point system will be effective ?

[JayJuanGee]

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

You are a curious person to me. The majority of your post history is in Chinese. I randomly translated some of the older posts from that Chinese guy and he was a pretty big bitcoin supporter. He was worried about what his government would do to bitcoin.

Then *poof* as if by some kind of forum magic that Chinese guy becomes fluent in English, never posts in a Chinese language thread again, becomes a bounty hunter and only posts in threads talking about profit. I hope you didn’t spend too much for that account.

I don’t know how much I trust your opinion on the whole merit situation since you’re probably one of the people this system is supposed to eliminate.

I bought this account.. Like we can see in posts history it was around middle of August 2017. I don't know why someone sold this account.
It is my alt account, my real account have much longer history.. almost like yours You don't need to trust my rank, because as we all know not always it have to be true . Just read what i write and think.

Merit system is not bad idea in my opinion, but as it was written account farmers can find bypass for it:

On the other hand, it is not really hard to post 50 short lines in off topic or games and rounds and after that to post 10 high quality posts at right place and point them to right people.
I don't think current system will decrease number of farming accounts, spam or account sales and honestly I think 10 merits to rank up to member rank is too low, because people will just create hundred accounts, do exactly what I said above and abuse signature/bounty campaigns, giveaways etc.

For every 10 Smerits received, junior member can easily send 5 Smerits to other account, from that account 2 Smerit to third account and so on - and repeat with many accounts.

When I write that increasing the number of merit points will be very difficult for ordinary users, I write this honestly. On the other hand, in my opinion, farmers will bypass it. But as wrote themos it is too early to verdict where it will go.
The only thing i can suggest at this point, is implementation of a moderator who will deal only with merit points.

Do I have to be eliminated by this system? I don't know - you should to decide about that. Lauda already tagged me just because someone said that my account is hacked And now i have to prove that i bought this account - what is allowed here, but in next 5 minutes The Pharmacist will give me next red tag because he don't like when someone buy account. For me behavior like this distorts reality.
Maybe my example will be interesting to talk about that system.. Let see example when someone collected thousands of merit points, and someone find out that a few years ago he bought this account .. buum - red tag! What then?

I think that trading accounts should be blocked completely and it would dispel any doubts. Don't you see a conflict of interest? On one end Administration is letting people trading accounts and on another is rewarding people for red tagging for that! Kind of Monthy Python for me ..

Sorry for little off top with this trading.

I merely gave you a merit for: 1) the activity level of your account, 2) the fact that had not received any merits and 3) because of the substance of your earlier posts.  I did not research into your trust or your post history.

But even your admission here regarding the surrounding facts brings me regret for having had used one of my merits on your account.

Somehow you believe that if an account is stolen (assuming that you did not steal the account and you paid for it like you said), then someone, such as yourself, should be able to buy such account and the account would be valid because you supposedly payed for it? 

There seems to be something wrong with your thinking, in that regard, bitgov.  I will be surprised if this particular account does not get frozen or locked out - seems like you are not in a good position, because, generally, buying stolen property is not acceptable, and if you think that it is then you may be engaged in a kind of rationalization if you believe that buying stolen property should be acceptable?   

Anyhow, if you really do have another more valid account, then perhaps you (and the forum) would be better served by your using that other (presumably not stolen account) to post. 

[gslgroup]

The idea of merit is really cool. I believe that it is better to have it like it is now then not to have it at all . However, I would like to point out some disadvantages that possess the current system:

1) Forum participants are not motivated to give merit to good posts .
I see a lot of valuable posts which are not marked with merit. And I have the same experience: as a translator I’ve started around 40 topics (ANNs translations) which by definition are valuable posts. Moreover, I provide everyday a lot of updates and news to those ANN (not all, but at least some part of them must be valuable to readers!). You know what?! I haven’t got a single merit point!!!!

Solution: forum members must be motivated to give merits to quality posts. For instance, if member merits some posts he will receive back a share (let say 0.1 merit) from another merits given to that post by another members after his merit. So people are motivated to become good moderators and they receive back merit for their job! Post with high quality of merits must be moderated manually (just for the case someone will try to use this mechanism for merit redistribution).

2) Disproportion of required merit points for some ranks.
Current merit system is 0 – 10 – 100 – 250 – 500 - 1000
Initial activity system was 30 – 60 – 120 – 240 – 480 – 775+
Comparing these numbers, I see some inconsistency of rating system and namely:

A)   Merits are harder to get than activity but you need more merit points than activity to get the next rank!
B)   Activity system looks quite logical as to get the next rank you need to double your current rank activity. But merit system made a gap between Member and the Full Member as you need to increase merit points in 10 times!!!
C)   To become Jr. Member you need activities but you don’t need merits. Why?

Solution: I assume that under condition that forum users are motivated to give merits for good posts the chance to get merit writing a quality post will rise from 0,01% (which I believe is now) to 10%. So following this assumption, I would offer merit system as follows:
3 – 6 – 12 – 24 – 48 – 96 (from J. Member to Legendary)

3) Unfair starting position of merit points for different rank.
Let assume that some Hero gained his status just posting simple posts. And to become a Hero under new conditions (if it is at all possible) will be much harder. So the past Hero can’t be compared with future Hero. This is true to all other ranks.
Solution: Introduce de-rank procedure. For instance if “past” Hero gains not enough merits for some period of time it will must be de-ranked to previous rank (Sr. Member). This is true to all other ranks.

[bitgov]

It is true that in this way you will make it difficult for all account farmers, but for ordinary users, achieving more merit points will be practically impossible and then the entire ranking system loses meaning.

You are a curious person to me. The majority of your post history is in Chinese. I randomly translated some of the older posts from that Chinese guy and he was a pretty big bitcoin supporter. He was worried about what his government would do to bitcoin.

Then *poof* as if by some kind of forum magic that Chinese guy becomes fluent in English, never posts in a Chinese language thread again, becomes a bounty hunter and only posts in threads talking about profit. I hope you didn’t spend too much for that account.

I don’t know how much I trust your opinion on the whole merit situation since you’re probably one of the people this system is supposed to eliminate.

I bought this account.. Like we can see in posts history it was around middle of August 2017. I don't know why someone sold this account.
It is my alt account, my real account have much longer history.. almost like yours You don't need to trust my rank, because as we all know not always it have to be true . Just read what i write and think.

Merit system is not bad idea in my opinion, but as it was written account farmers can find bypass for it:

On the other hand, it is not really hard to post 50 short lines in off topic or games and rounds and after that to post 10 high quality posts at right place and point them to right people.
I don't think current system will decrease number of farming accounts, spam or account sales and honestly I think 10 merits to rank up to member rank is too low, because people will just create hundred accounts, do exactly what I said above and abuse signature/bounty campaigns, giveaways etc.

For every 10 Smerits received, junior member can easily send 5 Smerits to other account, from that account 2 Smerit to third account and so on - and repeat with many accounts.

When I write that increasing the number of merit points will be very difficult for ordinary users, I write this honestly. On the other hand, in my opinion, farmers will bypass it. But as wrote themos it is too early to verdict where it will go.
The only thing i can suggest at this point, is implementation of a moderator who will deal only with merit points.

Do I have to be eliminated by this system? I don't know - you should to decide about that. Lauda already tagged me just because someone said that my account is hacked And now i have to prove that i bought this account - what is allowed here, but in next 5 minutes The Pharmacist will give me next red tag because he don't like when someone buy account. For me behavior like this distorts reality.
Maybe my example will be interesting to talk about that system.. Let see example when someone collected thousands of merit points, and someone find out that a few years ago he bought this account .. buum - red tag! What then?

I think that trading accounts should be blocked completely and it would dispel any doubts. Don't you see a conflict of interest? On one end Administration is letting people trading accounts and on another is rewarding people for red tagging for that! Kind of Monthy Python for me ..

Sorry for little off top with this trading.

I merely gave you a merit for: 1) the activity level of your account, 2) the fact that had not received any merits and 3) because of the substance of your earlier posts.  I did not research into your trust or your post history.

But even your admission here regarding the surrounding facts brings me regret for having had used one of my merits on your account.

Somehow you believe that if an account is stolen (assuming that you did not steal the account and you paid for it like you said), then someone, such as yourself, should be able to buy such account and the account would be valid because you supposedly payed for it? 

There seems to be something wrong with your thinking, in that regard, bitgov.  I will be surprised if this particular account does not get frozen or locked out - seems like you are not in a good position, because, generally, buying stolen property is not acceptable, and if you think that it is then you may be engaged in a kind of rationalization if you believe that buying stolen property should be acceptable?   

Anyhow, if you really do have another more valid account, then perhaps you (and the forum) would be better served by your using that other (presumably not stolen account) to post. 

To be honest I don't know how to check if this account was stolen..  I just have to belive that i bought this account from real, first owner. If there is any option i will feel much better when someone can help me to confirm that.
Of course I am against using stolen accounts.
Perhaps there is a paradox in the fact that I bought this account, and at the same time I argue that accounts trading should be banned.
I bought this account because it is allowed.
I argue that account trading should be banned because in my opinion it is the main reason why account farmers earn and do what they do. And account trading mainly distorts the ranking system and merit point system.
I'm surprised that nobody talks about it till now!?

[The Sceptical Chymist]

forum members must be motivated to give merits to quality posts.

That's true.  I don't get any sort of reward for giving people merit points--but the thing is is that I like this forum and want to reward people who put in some effort in their posts.  That's the whole reason I spent my time giving negative feedback to shitposters.  So I will certainly give out some merit points when I see people writing good things, and I know other senior members feel likewise. 

Yes, this whole system makes it harder for people to rank up, but that's the point.  And to people who are put off by this:  Why is it so damn important that you rank up?  My guess is that the only reason you're concerned is so that you can earn more money.  Historically, that's been a very bad reason to be here. 

The people who are most concerned about the money have turned out to be the worst posters.

[vapourminer]

1) Forum participants are not motivated to give merit to good posts .

i have my own motivation for meriting posts that ive also seen others mention: a way to make the best, most informative posts in a thread stand out. because hopefully at some point we will be have a way to be able to view only posts that have merit value as a way to quickly skim the best posts in a thread instead of reading pages of drivel or random banter.

there are many threads about things i would like to learn about but usually i quickly lose interest as only one post in ten have useful info. i soon just stop reading it. if i could only see the best posts to get a feel for the threads usefulness i can then go back and read all of it if i want.

of course we would need a merit filter for threads or something but im sure that can be done if this merit thing works out. even now though posts that have merit tend to stand out while scrolling so i can zero in on those posts even as is stands.

[JayJuanGee]

[edited out]

To be honest I don't know how to check if this account was stolen.. 

First of all.  Yes, I think that there is a preference for members to be honest, and it is not easy to gage honesty over the internet, except maybe with the passage of time - or  maybe if given some responsibility or time to admit wrongdoing and things like that.  So, there may be a certain level of assumption that posters are being honest, until there is evidence that they are not... And, then when there is a system of dishonesty that develops, then the new presumption might unfairly become that newbies are dishonest, until they are proven otherwise.  So yeah, you have problematic aspects of your account, and doubtful that anyone is against the buying/selling of legitimate accounts, but if they are stolen, then seems that caveat emptor would apply.. which means you are likely a loser if there is any decent level of evidence that your account was not acquired legitimately.

I just have to belive that i bought this account from real, first owner. If there is any option i will feel much better when someone can help me to confirm that.

I doubt that there is much of any recourse for you if it is determined that the account was not legitimately transferred.

Of course I am against using stolen accounts.

I think almost anyone agrees about that, except perhaps folks who either engage in crime or endorse it or people with very poor logic skills.

Perhaps there is a paradox in the fact that I bought this account, and at the same time I argue that accounts trading should be banned.
I bought this account because it is allowed.

I don't know if that is a paradox, or just a kind of attempt at rationalization of your likely bad situation.. seemingly logical to lose the account.

I argue that account trading should be banned because in my opinion it is the main reason why account farmers earn and do what they do. And account trading mainly distorts the ranking system and merit point system.
I'm surprised that nobody talks about it till now!?

I doubt that account trading, farming or the ability to sell is a new topic.  I have seen older post on the topic, so difficult to argue that it is some kind of new phenomenon.

I recall that I lost access to my account twice.  Once was my own fault to screw up my method of signing in, and my account got frozen for nearly a month; however, another time, my account was taken over by a hacker. 

Having my account taken over by a hacker caused me to recognize the value of my account and its history, so I did jump through several hoops, and fairly promptly to get access to my account back.  Sometimes, it can take several weeks or longer before legitimate owners might have realized that there account had been compromised, or what to do about such compromised situation.  Further, I imagine that it can be a fairly time-consuming and tedious activity for forum administrators to be returning legitimate access (and verifying) actual owners during seemingly ongoing hacking situations.

[bitgov]

[edited out]

To be honest I don't know how to check if this account was stolen.. 

First of all.  Yes, I think that there is a preference for members to be honest, and it is not easy to gage honesty over the internet, except maybe with the passage of time - or  maybe if given some responsibility or time to admit wrongdoing and things like that.  So, there may be a certain level of assumption that posters are being honest, until there is evidence that they are not... And, then when there is a system of dishonesty that develops, then the new presumption might unfairly become that newbies are dishonest, until they are proven otherwise.  So yeah, you have problematic aspects of your account, and doubtful that anyone is against the buying/selling of legitimate accounts, but if they are stolen, then seems that caveat emptor would apply.. which means you are likely a loser if there is any decent level of evidence that your account was not acquired legitimately.

I just have to belive that i bought this account from real, first owner. If there is any option i will feel much better when someone can help me to confirm that.

I doubt that there is much of any recourse for you if it is determined that the account was not legitimately transferred.

Of course I am against using stolen accounts.

I think almost anyone agrees about that, except perhaps folks who either engage in crime or endorse it or people with very poor logic skills.

I must agree with you, but i can only repeat that I don't know how to confirm that my account was bought from real, first owner. I will be very heppy if someone can help me with that.

Perhaps there is a paradox in the fact that I bought this account, and at the same time I argue that accounts trading should be banned.
I bought this account because it is allowed.

I don't know if that is a paradox, or just a kind of attempt at rationalization of your likely bad situation.. seemingly logical to lose the account.

Why do you think that my situation is bad?

I argue that account trading should be banned because in my opinion it is the main reason why account farmers earn and do what they do. And account trading mainly distorts the ranking system and merit point system.
I'm surprised that nobody talks about it till now!?

I doubt that account trading, farming or the ability to sell is a new topic.  I have seen older post on the topic, so difficult to argue that it is some kind of new phenomenon.

I recall that I lost access to my account twice.  Once was my own fault to screw up my method of signing in, and my account got frozen for nearly a month; however, another time, my account was taken over by a hacker. 

Having my account taken over by a hacker caused me to recognize the value of my account and its history, so I did jump through several hoops, and fairly promptly to get access to my account back.  Sometimes, it can take several weeks or longer before legitimate owners might have realized that there account had been compromised, or what to do about such compromised situation.  Further, I imagine that it can be a fairly time-consuming and tedious activity for forum administrators to be returning legitimate access (and verifying) actual owners during seemingly ongoing hacking situations.

Hacking accounts is other problem, we can do nothing about it, and in my opinion merit system have not much to do with that.

If the topic of accounts trading was discussed (I missed it), I think we should keep it up. I'm sure that this is what makes the biggest problem for merit and rank system, and certainly there also would be less hacked accounts. I think that Theymos one more time should consider to ban this.

[JayJuanGee]

Perhaps there is a paradox in the fact that I bought this account, and at the same time I argue that accounts trading should be banned.
I bought this account because it is allowed.

I don't know if that is a paradox, or just a kind of attempt at rationalization of your likely bad situation.. seemingly logical to lose the account.

Why do you think that my situation is bad?

I think that I already said as much as I want to say on the topic.  Ultimately it is up to the administrators what to do with your account, and they would likely have access to information that I don't have and I don't know if you have such information, either.

I argue that account trading should be banned because in my opinion it is the main reason why account farmers earn and do what they do. And account trading mainly distorts the ranking system and merit point system.
I'm surprised that nobody talks about it till now!?

I doubt that account trading, farming or the ability to sell is a new topic.  I have seen older post on the topic, so difficult to argue that it is some kind of new phenomenon.

I recall that I lost access to my account twice.  Once was my own fault to screw up my method of signing in, and my account got frozen for nearly a month; however, another time, my account was taken over by a hacker. 

Having my account taken over by a hacker caused me to recognize the value of my account and its history, so I did jump through several hoops, and fairly promptly to get access to my account back.  Sometimes, it can take several weeks or longer before legitimate owners might have realized that there account had been compromised, or what to do about such compromised situation.  Further, I imagine that it can be a fairly time-consuming and tedious activity for forum administrators to be returning legitimate access (and verifying) actual owners during seemingly ongoing hacking situations.

Hacking accounts is other problem, we can do nothing about it, and in my opinion merit system have not much to do with that.

Hacking accounts has to do with ownership claims rather than being a merit system specific topic.    Yet, if merit is given to an account prior to knowing whether there are hacking and/or ownership disputes, then those kinds of questions have been raised in the context of merit, fair merit distribution, etc.

If the topic of accounts trading was discussed (I missed it), I think we should keep it up.

I don't know how you would have missed the topic, because it was raised in light of your own account and in the context of your posting in this thread.

I'm sure that this is what makes the biggest problem for merit and rank system

Again, it is not a merit/rank specific topic, and it mostly seems to have come up in connection with your account.

, and certainly there also would be less hacked accounts. I think that Theymos one more time should consider to ban this.

You seem to be both repeating a point that you already made and NOT making such point very clearly.  Buying/selling accounts is not banned; however, if the account was stolen or compromised in that kind of way, then that seems to b where there becomes an issue.  Sure Theymos could change the policy regarding having more than one account and regarding selling/trading accounts, but that does not seem to be a change that is the works, currently... and really, given your current status and situation, I doubt that your input or suggestion would carry very much weight with Theymos were he deliberating changes in such policy/practices.