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Question: Would you invest in a bitcoin startup who places ATM BTC machines in US cities?
Yes - 34 (44.7%)
No - 18 (23.7%)
Maybe - 24 (31.6%)
Total Voters: 76

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Author Topic: Would you invest in a bitcoin startup who places ATM BTC machines in US cities?  (Read 5124 times)
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DeathAndTaxes
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September 03, 2013, 07:10:57 AM
 #21

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You're selling Bitcoins.  MSB regulations apply.

This is wrong. For most people who are selling bitcons, MSB regulations do NOT apply. However, if you are selling AND buying bitcoins for fiat (e.g. exchanging) and doing it as a business they probably will, depending on State, blah, blah, extensive legal morass, etc.

FinCEN makes no distinction between selling Bitcoins, buying Bitcoins or buying and selling Bitcoins.   
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September 03, 2013, 07:18:27 AM
 #22

I would invest FOR CERTAIN.  If you guys are really intent on doing this (despite the stiff competition from other bitcoin atm companies [I believe there are now to at the moment in pre-order stage]), then perhaps consider putting together 5btc and then beggining an asset of shares to trade on bitfunder.  This way, you could get startup capital, and have a way to publicly trade your company like an asset. 

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September 03, 2013, 07:24:19 AM
 #23

Yes, please, not only in US

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September 03, 2013, 10:22:15 AM
 #24

not in US... other countries yes
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September 03, 2013, 05:42:14 PM
 #25

Sorry one and all (Vod) the admins moved this back to the lending section.  I'll try again....

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Gerald Davis


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September 03, 2013, 05:45:07 PM
 #26

Sorry one and all (Vod) the admins moved this back to the lending section.  I'll try again....

You can edit the first post.  At first glance it still appears you are looking for a loan rather than looking for information.  Cleaning up the OP will likely prevent future (mis)moderation.
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September 03, 2013, 09:20:37 PM
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As pointed out, you'll definitely have to register with FinCen, but the nice thing about an ATM is that you won't have to deal with 50 state MSB licensure all at once. If you start in Colorado you'll likely only need the federal registration and a Colorado MSB license (if required). Anyway, you should definitely obtain legal advice from an experienced MSB attorney because this isn't like selling any old widget. Check out the legal forum, as at lease one attorney posts there regularly.

Also, you might want to check out this project, which I believe has now started manufacturing.
https://lamassu.is/

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September 04, 2013, 01:27:44 AM
 #28

I would invest if you

a) had 1 working prototype (hence they don't sell premade, fully functional Bitcoin ATMs, yet Grin)
b) could get this arms-length agreement to multiple retail locations, in writing
c) had a rock solid plan to tackle the legal issues
d) you could prove you had some other type of collateral to recoup my investment, if the "ATM as collateral" idea goes south
d) elaborated further on you and your partner's backgrounds/experiences

Robocoin and Lamassu seem to be moving right along with this same concept. If you're serious about it, I'd get started on it ASAP


Good luck!  Wink

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September 04, 2013, 08:59:26 AM
 #29

the idea is great. i think personally i would use it. if installed in shopping centre it could draw attention for new potential users. though you might have issues with authorities when they find out that bunch of drug dealers dumping their dollars into your atm. i would also recommend you to seek professional advise. ohh and btw... good luck with the project!

"between 'lives' we all have a great laugh about the parts we have performed in the 'play', and look forward to and have great fun preparing the next chapters to act out."
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September 06, 2013, 10:00:16 PM
 #30

Bitcoin ATM already exists.

get MSB license and buy one; place in that store this fall:

https://lamassu.is/

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September 06, 2013, 11:44:04 PM
 #31

Bitcoin ATM already exists.

get MSB license and buy one; place in that store this fall:

https://lamassu.is/

I don't know, maybe I need glasses but I see "pre-order now" and not "on stock".

We all know that businesses scare competitors by announcing products just around the corner. BFL anybody?

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September 06, 2013, 11:49:42 PM
 #32

Bitcoin ATM already exists.

get MSB license and buy one; place in that store this fall:

https://lamassu.is/

I don't know, maybe I need glasses but I see "pre-order now" and not "on stock".

We all know that businesses scare competitors by announcing products just around the corner. BFL anybody?

I sense a difference here

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September 07, 2013, 09:43:05 PM
 #33

I've placed an initial loan request on BTCJam:
https://btcjam.com/listings/6769

If you have any interest in this project, please consider lending.


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Ching-Chang;Ding-Dong


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September 08, 2013, 08:27:55 AM
 #34

How do you plan on dealing with the regulatory issues?  How do you plan on identifying and verifying customer identities.  The tech is trivial, the laws/regulations not so much.  If you intend to just operate above the law, well consider how incredibly easy it is to seized an expensive public fixed asset like an ATM.

First, we don't intend to operate outside the law.  I am unaware of any law that requires a "seller of bitcoin" to do anything special.  I am aware of MSB laws but I am not sure they apply unless I am selling bitcoin that I mine or buying and selling like an exchange. 

As only a seller of "numeric codes" I'm not sure what regulations specifically apply.  FWIW these are the kind of questions we need to address before we launch so I really appreciate you asking. 


I agree the tech is trivial.  In my mind it's no different than an automatic movie ticket vending machine I see at Fandango theaters, except we won't accept credit cards ;-)



Why would bitcoin need to be distributed through a kiosk/machine?

It does not, obviously since you and I have bitcoin and we have never used such a machine.  My poll in the newbie section, however, demonstrates people are interested in using such a device. 
   I stopped reading your thread here. You are seeking a somewhat large investment and obviously don't know the very begining of the law. I suggest you head over to the legal section and spend at least 10 minutes reading about what would be required.

Luckily since you're only initially looking at one state, that may make things slightly easier, but seeing as there are KYC requirements from dollar number one, you would have to know who every customer using your machine is before they could use it (forget people walking up and buying bitcoins with cash without proving their identity first and setting up an account with you).

Good luck.     

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September 08, 2013, 08:34:42 AM
 #35

Actually I'd say I am quite aware of the requirements.  Kindly read this post and it's replies.. I welcome followup questions there:


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=289952.0

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Ching-Chang;Ding-Dong


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September 08, 2013, 08:44:02 AM
 #36

Comply with the Bank Secrecy Act.  At a minimum know your customers, collect identitifcation, record transactions, report suspicious transactions to FinCEN and develop an AML program.



If Walmart doesn't need to check ID when selling prepaid visa's, surely a machine can do the same, right?

Can't I just adopt the same policy Walmart uses where they don't check ID up to $300 per day per person?




    Wrong!

You are making horribly inaccurate assumptions!     

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Ching-Chang;Ding-Dong


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September 08, 2013, 08:45:44 AM
 #37

Actually I'd say I am quite aware of the requirements.  Kindly read this post and it's replies.. I welcome followup questions there:


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=289952.0
    Okay I see now you are talking about biometric scanning and such. Okay, i'll move dicussion to the other thread.     

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September 09, 2013, 09:10:14 PM
 #38

Coin ATM. We should talk. I will be operating a Lamassu and be fully compliant in Atlanta, GA in October.


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September 09, 2013, 09:45:48 PM
 #39

You lucky bastard! (being in Georgia).

590-4-2-.08 Invest Georgia Exemption.
http://rules.sos.state.ga.us/docs/590/4/2/08.pdf





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September 13, 2013, 07:42:44 AM
 #40

We have a commitment from an investor, thank you swordv2!

Come join us: https://btcjam.com/listings/6769

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