Only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existance

[steamon]

Guys I would like to remember everyone that there are only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existence around 3 to 4 mil bitcoins are lost permanently. This means that we will have 16 mil bitcoins. Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down. They are really worried about Bitcoin and they can't shut it down. Just like skynet.  They will tax it but they can't shut it down.

Really I am having a blast when talking to people about Bitcoin. So many are still skeptical out of 5 only 1 buys. Yes, the market has to correct sometimes. Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture. The whales are lacking the tools to properly bring the market down in my opinion. The more people that buy Bitcoin today and hold the more power the whales will lose and they must buy from miners to obtain more bitcoins then.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k. 

Corrections are part of this path but we will seek higher heights. 50k+ easy this year.

[1715030354]

1715030354

[1715030354]

1715030354

[1715030354]

1715030354

[1715030354]

1715030354

[o_e_l_e_o]

Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture.

This. Open up any bitcoin graph and zoom out a bit. We are still up x10 in a year. In any traditional market this is insane growth.

Blockchain technology is here to stay. It can't be "uninvented". What percentage of people do you think know about bitcoin? 1-2%? And how many of them actually own any bitcoin? Again, 1-2%? This is still early days.

[stompix]

Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins.

No they can't.
At current prices all the bitcoins would still be around 120 billions and a small country does not have the GDP close to that, not talking about the budget which is usually around 1/3 of that.

Let's say that they are indeed planning to buy them, how will the market look after a 100 000 BTC buy ?
The price will probably shoot up to 20 000$ at least , making the remaining bitcoins double in value.
And by the time they will manage to acquire 1 million the rest will be probably worth 1 trillion.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k.

Oh, so you mean transforming bitcoin in a cartel with fixed prices.
Forget demand and offer, forget free market , forget everything. WE WANT MONEY!

The moment that happens (I pray it won't) BTC is doomed for sure.

[Dapper]

Well, they may try to buy all the bitcoins, but I'm not selling them mine.   I have fewer than a X0, but like Charlton Heston said....from my cold dead hands!

[layoutph]

The limited number of Bitcoin will make its price sky rocket in the long run. It will become so hard for a normal people to get a whole Bitcoin in the next few years.

.001btc today is already 8usd. Someday if Bitcoin enters the $100k mark. .001 will become $100.

[mk4]

1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k.  

🤦

Your logic is heavily heavily flawed. Looks like you don't have the slightest idea on how the market works. Theoretically, one small country can buy all the bitcoin; just as one single person can buy all the bitcoin IF he/she has enough money. But the question is do they have enough money to clean out all the sellers? Definitely not, not even close. Not to mention that not everyone are willing to sell.

Also, sure. Miners can sell bitcoin at a fixed price. The question is that are people going to be willing to buy at higher prices? Of course not! That's what exchanges are for: so we can set our own prices.

If bitcointalk had a de-merit feature, I'd definitely give you a lot. For sure.

[Anti-Cen]

So each time we fork we don't double the money (well err OK token supply) ?

Dear oh dear good job we cannot run out of digits or would that crash the matrix we live in

[Samarkand]

...
Forget demand and offer, forget free market , forget everything. WE WANT MONEY!

The moment that happens (I pray it won't) BTC is doomed for sure.

...

Then it might already be too late to save Bitcoin.

If you read articles like this you will see that there are definitely serious
problems in the Bitcoin market and the Bitcoin price discovery doesn´t resemble a
free market at all:
https://hackernoon.com/tether-the-tail-wagging-the-dog-3ebfd4640825

Of course the Tether story is not really newsworthy at this point, but
the ties between the various businesses in the Bitcoin scene
(CoinDesk, Tether, Coinbase, DCG) were novel at least for me.

[steamon]

Hm, a bit of negative reactions. My ideas were more to fight possible whales in controlling the market alone. Of course, 1 country is not gonna buy all the Bitcoin but I am trying to explain how rare bitcoins are if it really gets used everywhere.

A real cartel will be bad for the price but the final bitcoins will go away for very high prices. They can decide the price.

[stompix]

A real cartel will be bad for the price but the final bitcoins will go away for very high prices. They can decide the price.

This is a real problem and I really don't understand how is that you can't see you're transforming BTC in fiat!!

What is this obsession a lot of users here have with fixed value?Why does it have to be fixed, why must we put barriers so the value can't go down.You're acting exactly like the central banks that people criticize.

Was this the purpose of bitcoin? To make everybody who holds coins for decade rich?
I think I somehow missed that in the whitepaper Satoshi wrote....

[cryptokingmaker]

already 70 percent bitcoin mine so only left 30 percent will be completed 2040 all bitcoin will be mined

[BtcSs1]

Yes, not buying now is the worst thing you can do I think...

[QuestionAuthority]

Guys I would like to remember everyone that there are only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existence around 3 to 4 mil bitcoins are lost permanently. This means that we will have 16 mil bitcoins. Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down. They are really worried about Bitcoin and they can't shut it down. Just like skynet.  They will tax it but they can't shut it down.

Really I am having a blast when talking to people about Bitcoin. So many are still skeptical out of 5 only 1 buys. Yes, the market has to correct sometimes. Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture. The whales are lacking the tools to properly bring the market down in my opinion. The more people that buy Bitcoin today and hold the more power the whales will lose and they must buy from miners to obtain more bitcoins then.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k. 

Corrections are part of this path but we will seek higher heights. 50k+ easy this year.

Satoshi saw a couple of problems with internet finance and sought out one solution using cryptographic security. He wanted to create a “cash” or currency that in the source code he called “coins” capable of making internet payments when two parties don’t know or trust each other. He said, “Commerce on the Internet has come to rely almost exclusively on financial institutions serving as trusted third parties to process electronic payments.”

He wanted to remove any doubt that the transaction will fail. In other words, he saw transaction reversal as a big problem on the internet. He said, “Completely non-reversible transactions are not really possible, since financial institutions cannot avoid mediating disputes.”

He wanted to allow people transacting business on the internet to keep their personal information as private as possible. He said, “Merchants must be wary of their customers, hassling them for more information than they would otherwise need.”

He saw the current trusted third party financial system that is used to make internet payments as a wasteful step that costs too much. He said, “A certain percentage of fraud is accepted as unavoidable. These costs and payment uncertainties can be avoided in person by using physical currency, but no mechanism exists to make payments over a communications channel (the internet) without a trusted party.”

He chose to create a fixed quantity of only 2.1 quadrillion individual units because that was believed to be enough to absorb the global M1 money supply. He said, “Once a predetermined number of coins have entered circulation, the incentive can transition entirely to transaction fees and be completely inflation free.”

He clearly didn’t anticipate many of the problems associated with making a currency. Deflation creates its own problems but he wanted a deflationary currency. He wanted businesses to stop being ripped off but created the opposite and made a currency that will allow businesses to steal from their customers. These things may be wrong but they are bitcoin and to use bitcoin you must accept them. The only alternative is to make your own “coin” and plenty of people have done that. Go find one that suits you instead of trying to change bitcoin.

[Dapper]

The limited number of Bitcoin will make its price sky rocket in the long run.

Maybe or maybe not.   Rare baseball cards, Pokemon, or Furbies are not necessarily valuable.

[Jaya912]

Guys I would like to remember everyone that there are only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existence around 3 to 4 mil bitcoins are lost permanently. This means that we will have 16 mil bitcoins. Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down. They are really worried about Bitcoin and they can't shut it down. Just like skynet.  They will tax it but they can't shut it down.

Its like in the movie. Skynet. Very good from you.
How they can tax bitcoin if we dont know the holder from which country? Or maybe they will make own exchanger belong to government and all user have to pay the tax.

Really I am having a blast when talking to people about Bitcoin. So many are still skeptical out of 5 only 1 buys. Yes, the market has to correct sometimes. Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture. The whales are lacking the tools to properly bring the market down in my opinion. The more people that buy Bitcoin today and hold the more power the whales will lose and they must buy from miners to obtain more bitcoins then.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k. 

Corrections are part of this path but we will seek higher heights. 50k+ easy this year.

I like your optimistic. $50k by this year is not easy mate.
I will most like if bitcoin can be back like old price and not expect higher at the moment.

[steamon]

Guys I would like to remember everyone that there are only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existence around 3 to 4 mil bitcoins are lost permanently. This means that we will have 16 mil bitcoins. Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down. They are really worried about Bitcoin and they can't shut it down. Just like skynet.   They will tax it but they can't shut it down.

Its like in the movie. Skynet. Very good from you.
How they can tax bitcoin if we dont know the holder from which country? Or maybe they will make own exchanger belong to government and all user have to pay the tax.

Really I am having a blast when talking to people about Bitcoin. So many are still skeptical out of 5 only 1 buys. Yes, the market has to correct sometimes. Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture. The whales are lacking the tools to properly bring the market down in my opinion. The more people that buy Bitcoin today and hold the more power the whales will lose and they must buy from miners to obtain more bitcoins then.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k.  

Corrections are part of this path but we will seek higher heights. 50k+ easy this year.

I like your optimistic. $50k by this year is not easy mate.
I will most like if bitcoin can be back like old price and not expect higher at the moment.

Yea the only way to regulate it is to make a digital cage around it and set regulate rules to exchanges. But there are still plenty of ways to stay hidden. Also with MAST, you can do private transactions on Bitcoin. Lightning network coming this year. So I am still bullish on Bitcoin long term. You are right that 50k bitcoin requires a lot more money then it was from 1k to 20k. A lot of consumers are feeling blown off that they lost money from the recent 60% correction. At around April, we know more what Bitcoin can do this year.

Honestly, you don't want those people in Bitcoin waiting to make a quick buck. Still, we are today where there are Bitcoin futures. I have mined a few bitcoins in the past and still holding them today. No problem in holding them a year or 3 more and even then I won't sell all.

Bitcoin replacing other currencies is a nice dream but very hard to pull off. I am ready for such digital age. But I must also pay my bills in real life from time to time. What we first must achieve is that Bitcoin lands next to gold as digital gold and then we can look further. Lets see how G20 in April talks about Bitcoin. It's in our fingertips to make it happen collectively.

[filharvey]

I think that imagination is going far beyond than the existing people.A single country could only be able to buy all of the bitcoins only when every one is ready to sell their bitcoins.Not all of the bitcoin holders are like newbies just selling bitcoins without any ideas.We could hope that considerable volume of bitcoin users will be early investors who would like to hold it for more time.So,such an idea really would not work out.

[alonrono]

Guys I would like to remember everyone that there are only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existence around 3 to 4 mil bitcoins are lost permanently. This means that we will have 16 mil bitcoins. Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down. They are really worried about Bitcoin and they can't shut it down. Just like skynet.  They will tax it but they can't shut it down.

Really I am having a blast when talking to people about Bitcoin. So many are still skeptical out of 5 only 1 buys. Yes, the market has to correct sometimes. Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture. The whales are lacking the tools to properly bring the market down in my opinion. The more people that buy Bitcoin today and hold the more power the whales will lose and they must buy from miners to obtain more bitcoins then.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k. 

Corrections are part of this path but we will seek higher heights. 50k+ easy this year.

I also believe Bitcoin will be 100,000K easy.
There always will be crashes but he always rise up stronger.
Wait a little bit and I think he will go up in few months

[steamon]

I think that imagination is going far beyond than the existing people.A single country could only be able to buy all of the bitcoins only when every one is ready to sell their bitcoins.Not all of the bitcoin holders are like newbies just selling bitcoins without any ideas.We could hope that considerable volume of bitcoin users will be early investors who would like to hold it for more time.So,such an idea really would not work out.

Today the Netherlands said it has 500k+ users in cryptocurrencies and in October it was only 150k still. So it will most likely exceed 1 mil this year. Then look to possible growth from the US. Gonna become crazy this year no way to deny it.

[South Park]

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k. 

What a terrible idea, if the miners did that, what makes you think any other holders of bitcoin are going to do the same, miners will be doing everyone a favor except to themselves, remember they are mining to get profits nothing more, so they need to sell some of their bitcoins to pay for their expenses, this is why to try to set any kind of price in an artificial way has always failed, so this suggestion is never going to work.

[Beefcake]

I doubt the 3-4 million lost number, I think many of those will turn up eventually.

However, spot on when it comes to scarcity.  Compare to XOM, which sometimes has a similar market cap.  XOM has over 4 BILLION shares outstanding!  And more printed all the time!  People who say its a bubble don't truely understand the scarcity of bitcoins.  17 million SOUNDS like a lot, but really it isn't.  If every household in the top 10 nations got even amounts, it would be something like .018 bitcoins each.  This is not individuals and  does not count many many people such as those living in non-traditional households.  By comparison, if everyone wanted to own shares of XOM, they would gladly print more to accommodate as needed.

[steamon]

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k. 

What a terrible idea, if the miners did that, what makes you think any other holders of bitcoin are going to do the same, miners will be doing everyone a favor except to themselves, remember they are mining to get profits nothing more, so they need to sell some of their bitcoins to pay for their expenses, this is why to try to set any kind of price in an artificial way has always failed, so this suggestion is never going to work.

Yea I understand. When Bitcoin hit around 5.9k the cost to make 1 bitcoin it jumped up straight away. Curious how the rest of the year will go.

[aintnopassincraze]

A simple reason why Bitcoin will never go to $0 is because there are people out there that will snap up every last single one at a given price point (myself included). Keep that in mind next time you are in fear of $0 Bitcoin.

[Cryptonite310]

A simple reason why Bitcoin will never go to $0 is because there are people out there that will snap up every last single one at a given price point (myself included). Keep that in mind next time you are in fear of $0 Bitcoin.

If at some point where the mining farms go out. Say they just don't wanna mine anymore cuz they ain't making any money to pay for the energy.
Then the blockchain would be so slow, nothing would be able to run right?

Or would the chain change difficulty to accustomed the new mining computers?
But that'll take 2 weeks. Most other coins update difficulty every block. BitCoin takes 2 weeks right?

[BelieveInBitcoin]

A simple reason why Bitcoin will never go to $0 is because there are people out there that will snap up every last single one at a given price point (myself included). Keep that in mind next time you are in fear of $0 Bitcoin.

Or would the chain change difficulty to accustomed the new mining computers?
But that'll take 2 weeks. Most other coins update difficulty every block. BitCoin takes 2 weeks right?

That's right - not a perfect system, but it has worked pretty well so far.

[zirt]

Yes, only 21000 btc, that's why all smart guys should have at least 0.5 btc they keep forever, like they would keep gold.
Maybe in a few times 4 BTC can buy an house. Not to mention other promising alts.

[richardsNY]

Or would the chain change difficulty to accustomed the new mining computers?
But that'll take 2 weeks. Most other coins update difficulty every block. BitCoin takes 2 weeks right?

Bitcoin indeed needs around 14 days (2016 blocks) to adjust the difficulty. After the adjustment the network will more and more operate on a normal level again. It has already happened with some of the forks we experienced. Due to the massive difference in difficulty and actual network power, confirmations were taking ages to come through, till the difficulty adjusted itself accordingly, and the block times recovered. Another thing to point out is how miners are playing with Bitcoin in the last months. The constant major jumps in difficulty lead to block times being pushed closer to the 14-15 minute level, while it normally should be closer to the 10 minute level. It's a nasty game being played.

[rockyfeller]

Yes, only 21000 btc, that's why all smart guys should have at least 0.5 btc they keep forever, like they would keep gold.
Maybe in a few times 4 BTC can buy an house. Not to mention other promising alts.

I agree with you we should keep fraction of bitcoin because in the next 10 years bitcoin won't be the same. Price will increase technology emerge and other alts as well. Just hold some bitcoin and don't regret about the price that you buy. it's a matter of time,just be patience!

[Random Seller]

Guys I would like to remember everyone that there are only 21.000.000 Bitcoins in existence around 3 to 4 mil bitcoins are lost permanently. This means that we will have 16 mil bitcoins. Now the twist. 1 small country can buy all the bitcoins. The media has to fud to bring the prices down. They are really worried about Bitcoin and they can't shut it down. Just like skynet.   They will tax it but they can't shut it down.

Really I am having a blast when talking to people about Bitcoin. So many are still skeptical out of 5 only 1 buys. Yes, the market has to correct sometimes. Some are angry at me that they bought in December but they are not seeing the bigger picture. The whales are lacking the tools to properly bring the market down in my opinion. The more people that buy Bitcoin today and hold the more power the whales will lose and they must buy from miners to obtain more bitcoins then.

We can even make our own prices if all miners agreed to sell 10k only price will be 10k. 100k only 100k.  

Corrections are part of this path but we will seek higher heights. 50k+ easy this year.

If miners were to set prices at 10k artificially, the big buyers could just setup mining farms and put miners out of business...

Buying some bitcoins to hold is a good idea, but you need to pay attention when you buy. The bitcoin market is way to volatile now.

It is true the number of bitcoins is finite, but the theoretical number of decimal places is infinite.

[levvv]

Yes it is, bitcoin has a low supply, with a high value in the market.
the manipulator want to buy bitcoin with the cheap parice, so they spread fud that can make bitcoin price go down.
well done manipulator.

[elisabetheva]

Yes, only 21000 btc, that's why all smart guys should have at least 0.5 btc they keep forever, like they would keep gold.
Maybe in a few times 4 BTC can buy an house. Not to mention other promising alts.

really hope it can happen, but until when ... because maybe this month the price is very stable, whether it will happen as at the end of last year? waiting for it because I also want it.

[asdalani]

I doubt the 3-4 million lost number, I think many of those will turn up eventually.

However, spot on when it comes to scarcity.  Compare to XOM, which sometimes has a similar market cap.  XOM has over 4 BILLION shares outstanding!  And more printed all the time!  People who say its a bubble don't truely understand the scarcity of bitcoins.  17 million SOUNDS like a lot, but really it isn't.  If every household in the top 10 nations got even amounts, it would be something like .018 bitcoins each.  This is not individuals and  does not count many many people such as those living in non-traditional households.  By comparison, if everyone wanted to own shares of XOM, they would gladly print more to accommodate as needed.

3 or 4 million Bitcoins can get lost since there is a lot of people dying and not telling people about their coins, throwing computers away, sending to the wrong address and so forth.

[LuanX3]

I can't see the point of this discussion though. There is nothing here to discuss about the 21 MLN Bitcoin in existence and this is just plainly speculating the price will go up without any basis but the supply of bitcoins being something finite and there is such a thing like correction (like all things traded, this happens).  I would suggest that you further the discussion by adding something new to everyone reading and not some plain BS like this.

[BrewMaster]

Yes it is, bitcoin has a low supply, with a high value in the market.
the manipulator want to buy bitcoin with the cheap parice, so they spread fud that can make bitcoin price go down.
well done manipulator.

it is not a "low" supply. it is more like a reasonable amount than low or high.

but the important thing about bitcoin's supply is that it is limited. which means there can not be more than 21 million coins no matter what. unlike the traditional money and a lot of altcoins such as ethereum which print unlimited amount of it.