Multi-Sig Strategy to Keep Bitcoin is not the Ideal Solutions for Individuals

[hosseinimr93]

It seems to  me you missed the point of my message.

I completely got you.

What I meant was,  eventually,  someone could  have the ability  to  access all your  seed phrases.

What you are saying is like saying there is no difference between having 1 lock or 2 locks to secure a front door. The thief can eventually break all the locks. 
What's the point of having 2 locks, if they all can be opened using a single key?

Again, we use a multi-signature wallet, so that we eliminate any single point of failure. 

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[alastantiger]

It seems like topics like this keep coming up every now and then where someone is arguing that a particular method is not suitable, not ideal or outright insecure just because people that are using it may not do it correctly.
For example we've had this argument with regarding paper wallets and the bitcoin wiki is still calling them "obsolete and unsafe" which is wrong.

Everything in Bitcoin has pros and cons, from bitcoin itself with its volatile price to the wallet types we use. For example you can't say "bitcoin core is not an ideal solution for individuals because it takes a long time to sync" just as you can't say "multi-sig is not suitable because it is hard to setup and backup correctly".

Multi-sig wallets have their benefits even for individuals but they obviously require more effort to setup, backup and use. The important thing is for people to learn how to choose the most suitable tool for them and understand how to take advantage of what it offers. If the benefits of multi-sig wallet is what an individual looks for, they will also accept the extra effort that it demands.

I see the point you are trying to make is that multi-sign wallets shouldn't be labelled as not ideal for individuals because of human error. I understand that if I want to set up and use the multi-sig wallet my first step to take is to get educated and learn how to use it the right way and understand the advantages and disadvantages inherent in it. From your reply I understand that using a multi-sig wallet is in tandem with the core principle of decentralization where I and other people have control over their own assets and security.

[pooya87]

I see the point you are trying to make is that multi-sign wallets shouldn't be labelled as not ideal for individuals because of human error. I understand that if I want to set up and use the multi-sig wallet my first step to take is to get educated and learn how to use it the right way and understand the advantages and disadvantages inherent in it. From your reply I understand that using a multi-sig wallet is in tandem with the core principle of decentralization where I and other people have control over their own assets and security.

Exactly. In decentralized system where every user is responsible for their own security, they must first educate themselves. Of course in such a system without a central authority it is up to us (who know a tiny bit more) to provide them with the best and most accurate information to help guide them in their decision making.

[o_e_l_e_o]

Moreover I believe people  play hanky-panky when talking about different geolocations  of their backups, It’s easier said than done.

That's another possible use of multi-sig, though. If you truly have nowhere secure offsite where you can store a copy of a single sig seed phrase, then multi-sig allows you to compromise a little on that. I could set up a 3-of-5 multi-sig and store one back up with 5 friends, for example. Perhaps I don't trust any one of these friends enough to give them a single sig seed phrase, but I collectively trust them enough to know that 3 of them won't all try to betray me.

As pooya87 has said above, it's all about pros and cons, risks and benefits. Is the increased risk of theft offset by the decreased risk of accidental loss? Is the increased redundancy offset by the increased chance of discovery? It's up to the user to decide, but blanket statements like "Don't use multi-sig" are not helpful.

Having said that, in terms of your master seed proposal, I think it is less than ideal. Multi-sig is not just safer because it decentralizes your back ups; it is also safer because it decentralizes your seed creation process. If I have a device which is generating weak seed phrase (see the Libbitcoin Explorer vulnerability as an example), and I create a single sig wallet using it, my coins are lost. If I use it to create one seed phrase of a multi-sig set up with the other 2 (or 4, or whatever) seed phrases coming from a different device which is generating strong seed phrases, then I am protected from loss despite my weak seed phrase. If however I generate a master seed using that weak RNG, and then derive all my seed phrases for my multi-sig from this one weak seed, then again my coins are at risk of theft.

If you are going to generate a multi-sig from one source of entropy and store all your seed phrases as one single back up, then you've not really achieved anything at all. A single sig cold wallet would be a better choice.