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Author Topic: What happened to all those "distributed" exchanges  (Read 4540 times)
najzenmajsen
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February 22, 2015, 01:26:47 PM
 #21

bter isent " down " it just had a mayors setback , everything will be normal soon : )
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February 22, 2015, 01:39:02 PM
 #22

bter isent " down " it just had a mayors setback , everything will be normal soon : )

Right now it is effectively "down", since you can neither trade, nor deposit, nor withdraw. The opportunity to successfully log in there does not in the least mend the pathetic state of affairs bter presently got into. If they will be able to continue operation in the future still remains to be seen.
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February 22, 2015, 09:05:35 PM
 #23

Since BTER went down, Nxters have switched to Multigateway

http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/nxt/#markets

Liquidity is growing. Anyone who wants to give MGW I try for BTC trading (tight spreads, very very low fee), I can answer any questions.

Are orders executed real-time (or close to) there?

I still can't imagine how it would be possible to make order execution real-time at a decentralized exchange. After the bter fiasco, I'm strongly incentivized to look deeper into the matter (with safety of my money being the primary focus, of course).

That is the aim, not sure what the latest is.

I have asked in the support thread, that is a good place to ask any questions;

https://nxtforum.org/nxtservices-releases/multigateway-user-support-thread
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February 22, 2015, 09:35:31 PM
 #24

Since BTER went down, Nxters have switched to Multigateway

http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/nxt/#markets

Liquidity is growing. Anyone who wants to give MGW I try for BTC trading (tight spreads, very very low fee), I can answer any questions.

Are orders executed real-time (or close to) there?

I still can't imagine how it would be possible to make order execution real-time at a decentralized exchange. After the bter fiasco, I'm strongly incentivized to look deeper into the matter (with safety of my money being the primary focus, of course).

That is the aim, not sure what the latest is.

I have asked in the support thread, that is a good place to ask any questions;

https://nxtforum.org/nxtservices-releases/multigateway-user-support-thread

Thanks a lot for taking time to make a post there. I will watch that thread closely and hope that some of the nxters would come over here and post a layman explanation for all of us interested in decentralized exchanges.
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February 22, 2015, 10:36:47 PM
 #25

Hi you send your btc  to a multi sig address that's distributed over 3 or so servers. Then after 6 confirmations you get mgwBTC asset and you sell/bid/ask that for nxt on the asset exchange. Trades take as long as nxt blocks. Look into instantDEX for real time decentralised trading.  Smiley

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February 23, 2015, 09:57:03 AM
 #26

Hi you send your btc  to a multi sig address that's distributed over 3 or so servers. Then after 6 confirmations you get mgwBTC asset and you sell/bid/ask that for nxt on the asset exchange. Trades take as long as nxt blocks. Look into instantDEX for real time decentralised trading.  Smiley

So the trades at mgwBTC are not instantaneous? Also, how the distribution of bitcoins between 3 (or more) servers helps prevent robbery? It may make it more difficult to steal all the bitcoins from all the servers, but this still doesn't prevent server hacking AND stealing the funds, if I'm not missing something. My point being that I lose control over my funds once they are sent to the exchange. Is this not what decentralised exchanges are supposed to get rid of?
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February 23, 2015, 09:33:12 PM
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Hi you send your btc  to a multi sig address that's distributed over 3 or so servers. Then after 6 confirmations you get mgwBTC asset and you sell/bid/ask that for nxt on the asset exchange. Trades take as long as nxt blocks. Look into instantDEX for real time decentralised trading.  Smiley

So the trades at mgwBTC are not instantaneous? Also, how the distribution of bitcoins between 3 (or more) servers helps prevent robbery? It may make it more difficult to steal all the bitcoins from all the servers, but this still doesn't prevent server hacking AND stealing the funds, if I'm not missing something. My point being that I lose control over my funds once they are sent to the exchange. Is this not what decentralised exchanges are supposed to get rid of?

Trades of mgwBTC (on Multigateway > MGW), are not instantaneous. InstantDex (which makes use of MGW) is designed to be (testing next week, proof of concept showed 3-5 sec).

The three servers don't split the BTC, these are split among many accounts (proportional to the amount of users, IIRC). There is no huge hot or cold wallet. The three server operators only confirm transactions, using multisig. All three have to be in agreement before a transaction takes place. It have increased the point of failure from corrupting 1 server/exchange owner to 3. 1 server operator can't do anything on their own. I would call MGW a distributed or 'most decentralised' exchange at the moment, InstantDex is designed to be truly decentralised.

When you send 1 BTC to MGW, you automatically get sent 1 mgwBTC. This is 'backed' by BTC in the true sense of the word as it is directly convertible back to BTC (which are spread between many accounts and protected by multisig accounts above). The mgwBTC are stored in your wallet, not on the exchange so you control the keys. And the coins backing them are protected by multisig.

For instantaneous, rather than 'not centralised', transactions then I think you would be more interested in InstantDex.
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February 23, 2015, 10:00:18 PM
 #28

Hi you send your btc  to a multi sig address that's distributed over 3 or so servers. Then after 6 confirmations you get mgwBTC asset and you sell/bid/ask that for nxt on the asset exchange. Trades take as long as nxt blocks. Look into instantDEX for real time decentralised trading.  Smiley

So the trades at mgwBTC are not instantaneous? Also, how the distribution of bitcoins between 3 (or more) servers helps prevent robbery? It may make it more difficult to steal all the bitcoins from all the servers, but this still doesn't prevent server hacking AND stealing the funds, if I'm not missing something. My point being that I lose control over my funds once they are sent to the exchange. Is this not what decentralised exchanges are supposed to get rid of?

Trades of mgwBTC (on Multigateway > MGW), are not instantaneous. InstantDex (which makes use of MGW) is designed to be (testing next week, proof of concept showed 3-5 sec).

The three servers don't split the BTC, these are split among many accounts (proportional to the amount of users, IIRC). There is no huge hot or cold wallet. The three server operators only confirm transactions, using multisig. All three have to be in agreement before a transaction takes place. It have increased the point of failure from corrupting 1 server/exchange owner to 3. 1 server operator can't do anything on their own. I would call MGW a distributed or 'most decentralised' exchange at the moment, InstantDex is designed to be truly decentralised.

When you send 1 BTC to MGW, you automatically get sent 1 mgwBTC. This is 'backed' by BTC in the true sense of the word as it is directly convertible back to BTC (which are spread between many accounts and protected by multisig accounts above). The mgwBTC are stored in your wallet, not on the exchange so you control the keys. And the coins backing them are protected by multisig.

If my real bitcoins nevertheless got stolen (or rather all bitcoins of all clients at the exchange), what purpose will these mgwBTCs serve to me? In fact, I don't see any real difference they make since my bitcoins are still at the exchange.

For instantaneous, rather than 'not centralised', transactions then I think you would be more interested in InstantDex.

Yes, I keep an intent eye on it, but I still don't understand the principle behind it. What puzzles me is how I can maintain control over my coins (the essence of a decentralized exchange as I see it) and at the same time be able to make instant trades. Could you expand more on this?
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February 23, 2015, 11:01:19 PM
 #29

Hi you send your btc  to a multi sig address that's distributed over 3 or so servers. Then after 6 confirmations you get mgwBTC asset and you sell/bid/ask that for nxt on the asset exchange. Trades take as long as nxt blocks. Look into instantDEX for real time decentralised trading.  Smiley

So the trades at mgwBTC are not instantaneous? Also, how the distribution of bitcoins between 3 (or more) servers helps prevent robbery? It may make it more difficult to steal all the bitcoins from all the servers, but this still doesn't prevent server hacking AND stealing the funds, if I'm not missing something. My point being that I lose control over my funds once they are sent to the exchange. Is this not what decentralised exchanges are supposed to get rid of?

Trades of mgwBTC (on Multigateway > MGW), are not instantaneous. InstantDex (which makes use of MGW) is designed to be (testing next week, proof of concept showed 3-5 sec).

The three servers don't split the BTC, these are split among many accounts (proportional to the amount of users, IIRC). There is no huge hot or cold wallet. The three server operators only confirm transactions, using multisig. All three have to be in agreement before a transaction takes place. It have increased the point of failure from corrupting 1 server/exchange owner to 3. 1 server operator can't do anything on their own. I would call MGW a distributed or 'most decentralised' exchange at the moment, InstantDex is designed to be truly decentralised.

When you send 1 BTC to MGW, you automatically get sent 1 mgwBTC. This is 'backed' by BTC in the true sense of the word as it is directly convertible back to BTC (which are spread between many accounts and protected by multisig accounts above). The mgwBTC are stored in your wallet, not on the exchange so you control the keys. And the coins backing them are protected by multisig.

If my real bitcoins nevertheless got stolen (or rather all bitcoins of all clients at the exchange), what purpose will these mgwBTCs serve to me? In fact, I don't see any real difference they make since my bitcoins are still at the exchange.

For instantaneous, rather than 'not centralised', transactions then I think you would be more interested in InstantDex.

Yes, I keep an intent eye on it, but I still don't understand the principle behind it. What puzzles me is how I can maintain control over my coins (the essence of a decentralized exchange as I see it) and at the same time be able to make instant trades. Could you expand more on this?
MGW is not fully decentralized, but also it is not centralized. Not perfect, but seems safer than alternative.
Soon, I will add an automated "deposit, trade, withdraw" mechanism so the time you are not in control of your funds is limited, but this requires InstantDEX and Tradebots first.
At that point your risk is time limited and if that is too much risk, you can always do it in increments

I also have some ideas to fully decentralize all of this, but need to get to these next steps first.

As far as how it can be instant, it is a time shift by using offchain exchange of signed transaction bytes. So both parties have the signed transaction bytes that they can submit to the blockchain. Like having a signed check, its not in your account yet, but just a matter for the next block. This means you cant retrade what you got instantly till the next block, but you can lock in a trade at a known price, regardless of how long the next block is

James

P.S. these offchain transactions are linked and execute all or none

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
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February 26, 2015, 02:40:30 AM
 #30

After the GOX melt down earlier this year, there were 100's of threads and a Chinese wall of text on distributed exchanges, replete with picture, flow charts, etc

now nothing has come of it, that I can see.

Did any of them go anywhere?

I said at the time, if they spent as much time cutting code as wall of text, they could have made something.


I wrote a nice multivalent-amount library, so you could have a txout representing any of thousands of different coins all trading on the same chain.  It would require some support from the clients (and miners) of the various altcoins to allow coins to move back and forth from their native chains though.  I was even sorta getting ready to maybe launch it.

But then I looked around at the altcoin markets and decided that most altcoins are scams and I didn't want to contribute to that.

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February 27, 2015, 12:26:53 PM
 #31

bpay some how go all the Australian banks to open up their codes and servers to let any one pay any one.....why can't some bitcoin company do this?

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February 27, 2015, 08:50:47 PM
 #32

Only bitstamp is still standing, with btc-e thats about it.

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March 10, 2015, 12:11:30 AM
 #33

Update: InstantDex GUI released (with a bitcoinwisdom vibe) with video and demo. Try it yourself.






https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=974417.0

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March 13, 2015, 01:31:55 PM
 #34

Its nice to have more options and Im also grateful that BTER is back online for Nxt'ers to exchange and withdraw again. More distribution for all is better no matter how you look at it.

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