[2018-03-05] US Marshals to Sell $25 Million in Bitcoin at Auction

[ivanpoldark]

The U.S. Marshals are set to auction off nearly $25 million worth of bitcoin later this month.

The government agency announced Monday that it will put approximately 2,170 bitcoins on the auction block, with the sale planned for March 19. Would-be bidders must submit a $200,000 deposit and complete the registration requirements by March 14 to participate, according to the Marshals Service.

This month's auction will consist of 14 separate blocks, with two blocks of 500 BTC, 11 blocks of 100 BTC and one block accounting for 70 BTC.

According to the release, the bitcoins were confiscated in "connection with various federal criminal, civil and administrative cases," ranging from federal trials to Drug Enforcement Agency actions.

The provenance of most of the seized bitcoins is listed online, which notably mentions that some of the coins involved were traced to the case involving Shaun Bridges, the ex-Secret Service agent who was sentenced to prison after being accused of stealing funds during the Silk Road investigation.

The March 19 sale marks the latest bitcoin auction by the agency. Just last month, the U.S. Marshals auctioned off more than 3,600 bitcoins to five winning bidders, an amount worth more than $30 million at the time. It's also the second sale to take place within a nearly two-year period, given that prior to this year, the last auction occurred in mid-2016, when the agency sold 2,700 BTC

In what is perhaps a sign of how the value of bitcoin has increased since then, the coins on the docket that year were worth just $1.6 million at the time.

https://www.coindesk.com/us-marshals-auction-25-million-bitcoin/

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[davis196]

A 200,000 USD deposit looks pretty high to me.Only the big whales will be allowed to participate.This is kinda unfair.I`m still confused about the way US authorities look at bitcoin.They don`t consider it as a currency,but at the same time they sell all the confiscated btc.If they think that btc is not a currency nore an accet,it would be better to destroy those bitcoins.This will reduce the global btc supply and push the bitcoin price up.

[stompix]

A 200,000 USD deposit looks pretty high to me.Only the big whales will be allowed to participate.This is kinda unfair.I`m still confused about the way US authorities look at bitcoin.They don`t consider it as a currency,but at the same time they sell all the confiscated btc.If they think that btc is not a currency nore an accet,it would be better to destroy those bitcoins.This will reduce the global btc supply and push the bitcoin price up.

They don't consider it a currency but a commodity.
The IRS considers it as property so it can be legally sold.No problem there.

As for the whales, the last ones that went public saying they have won an auction are better long term holders.
Guys that only afford 1k$ are also a lot more susceptible to panic and sell everything.

[InvoKing]

The U.S. Marshals are set to auction off nearly $25 million worth of bitcoin later this month.

The government agency announced Monday that it will put approximately 2,170 bitcoins on the auction block, with the sale planned for March 19. Would-be bidders must submit a $200,000 deposit and complete the registration requirements by March 14 to participate, according to the Marshals Service.
-snip-

Huge volume will be auctioned with an enormous deposit so you can bet, this kind of stuff always worries me especially if it will have a direct impact on the bitcoin price..

[Kprawn]

No wonder these guys have undercover agents trapping unsuspected Bitcoin sellers in open markets. This is very profitable

for them to seize these coins.   ...The Bitcoin price will not even flinch with a $25 000 000 sale, if these coins even reach

the exchanges. Most of the Silkroad coins went to long-term hoarders, so nothing happened to the price, when they were

sold.  

[Betwrong]

No wonder these guys have undercover agents trapping unsuspected Bitcoin sellers in open markets. This is very profitable

for them to seize these coins.   ...The Bitcoin price will not even flinch with a $25 000 000 sale, if these coins even reach

the exchanges. Most of the Silkroad coins went to long-term hoarders, so nothing happened to the price, when they were

sold.  

That's right. With over $6 billion daily trading volume this sale will make a minor impact on Bitcoin price, if any. On the other hand, seeing today's red market I think maybe it is making an impact already. The thing is many people are either not aware of the daily trading volume or are not getting along with math very well. Those people start panic selling right after reading the news thinking that Bitcoin can crash a lot when the selling begins.

[InvoKing]

No wonder these guys have undercover agents trapping unsuspected Bitcoin sellers in open markets. This is very profitable

for them to seize these coins.   ...The Bitcoin price will not even flinch with a $25 000 000 sale, if these coins even reach

the exchanges. Most of the Silkroad coins went to long-term hoarders, so nothing happened to the price, when they were

sold.  

That's right. With over $6 billion daily trading volume this sale will make a minor impact on Bitcoin price, if any. On the other hand, seeing today's red market I think maybe it is making an impact already. The thing is many people are either not aware of the daily trading volume or are not getting along with math very well. Those people start panic selling right after reading the news thinking that Bitcoin can crash a lot when the selling begins.

It is normal and i would say expected if ever we could link this red to the sale. People get afraid from everything they heard from the news, and hearing that a considerable amount will be add to the market, many of them will panic selling.
After all till we are above $10k, It is reassuring

[richardsNY]

That's right. With over $6 billion daily trading volume this sale will make a minor impact on Bitcoin price, if any. On the other hand, seeing today's red market I think maybe it is making an impact already. The thing is many people are either not aware of the daily trading volume or are not getting along with math very well. Those people start panic selling right after reading the news thinking that Bitcoin can crash a lot when the selling begins.

This auction has nothing to do with the price going down. It's just the market bouncing up and down without anything to actually hold on to. These auctions will never impact the market because the coins will not get dumped on the regular exchange market, or in their entirety they will not get sold at all. If they ever get sold, they'll be sold off-exchange. Main point of importance is that these auctions are exactly like over the counter sales, which is a great advantage for larger parties looking to obtain coins without touching the regular exchanges. In reality, this auction is peanuts compared to how many insane transactions happen off-exchange. With insane transactions I mean that it can range from a few million to a few hundred million worth of crypto per transaction.

[gentlemand]

That's right. With over $6 billion daily trading volume this sale will make a minor impact on Bitcoin price, if any. On the other hand, seeing today's red market I think maybe it is making an impact already. The thing is many people are either not aware of the daily trading volume or are not getting along with math very well. Those people start panic selling right after reading the news thinking that Bitcoin can crash a lot when the selling begins.

Balls.

The one and only time these auctions had an impact was the very first Silk Road one in 2014 when uncertainty reigned before. All the morons were convinced someone would buy them all and dump them. Amazingly enough that did not happen.

These auctions are a prime opportunity to buy without slippage. And more happens on OTC markets that we never hear about all the time.

[BitHodler]

In reality, this auction is peanuts compared to how many insane transactions happen off-exchange. With insane transactions I mean that it can range from a few million to a few hundred million worth of crypto per transaction.

Completely agree. If I had millions in free capital to invest in Bitcoin, I would never ever even consider using one of the currently available exchanges. I don't trust them firstly, and secondly, their order books have always been poor.

How else do people think institutions and hedge funds buy billions worth of crypto assets in some cases, through crappy exchanges? Think again, the professional market doesn't even take our current exchanges serious.

OTC is the only way to go for deep pockets, and it has always been like that. For them exchanges only serve as price tracker, and the rest will be dealt with privately between buyer and seller.

[squatter]

That's right. With over $6 billion daily trading volume this sale will make a minor impact on Bitcoin price, if any. On the other hand, seeing today's red market I think maybe it is making an impact already. The thing is many people are either not aware of the daily trading volume or are not getting along with math very well. Those people start panic selling right after reading the news thinking that Bitcoin can crash a lot when the selling begins.

Balls.

The one and only time these auctions had an impact was the very first Silk Road one in 2014 when uncertainty reigned before. All the morons were convinced someone would buy them all and dump them. Amazingly enough that did not happen.

There are other examples where USMS auctions lined up with price volatility matching this narrative, though.

The auction for the last of the Silk Road coins ended the first week of November, 2015 -- same exact story as the Draper auction. The auction end marked the top of a major rally from the historic bottom in the $100s. Price immediately dropped by 40% in less than two weeks.

I'm hoping the narrative plays out again and we rally into the March 19th sale.

[Betwrong]

That's right. With over $6 billion daily trading volume this sale will make a minor impact on Bitcoin price, if any. On the other hand, seeing today's red market I think maybe it is making an impact already. The thing is many people are either not aware of the daily trading volume or are not getting along with math very well. Those people start panic selling right after reading the news thinking that Bitcoin can crash a lot when the selling begins.

Balls.

The one and only time these auctions had an impact was the very first Silk Road one in 2014 when uncertainty reigned before. All the morons were convinced someone would buy them all and dump them. Amazingly enough that did not happen.

There are other examples where USMS auctions lined up with price volatility matching this narrative, though.

The auction for the last of the Silk Road coins ended the first week of November, 2015 -- same exact story as the Draper auction. The auction end marked the top of a major rally from the historic bottom in the $100s. Price immediately dropped by 40% in less than two weeks.

I'm hoping the narrative plays out again and we rally into the March 19th sale.

Exactly! Although the price had recovered a month later and never has been below $375 since then, the selling did make an impact. That's why I think maybe something like that is happening this time too. Should it make an impact is another question. As I said earlier, I think it should not, because $25 million is nothing compared to $7 billion daily trading volume, as it is today for example. But still, how to explain the today's red market then? So, it's possible that the history repeats itself and thus people who are selling now at $10,500 will regret it later as well as those who were selling at $320 in November 2015.

[cryptbit.man]

This is quite impressive. I am curious to find out how did the cease the bitcoins from the criminals in the first place. Did they happen to go through the HDs in their home and found an offline wallet? Or did the criminal voluntarily handed over their tokens? And once they were found and ceased, how were they transported and how were they stored? Did the US government have to hire a crypto specialist to figure out how to deal with the currency?

[RamonBTC]

The silkroad controversy still undead, after this big profits for government more raid will happen. An auction with 200000$ as deposit is huge. This will be a change maker as many more investors on mainstream will be curious of what is bitcoin, and how it goes at this prices. If I were part of the team who will auctioned it, this be better if the date is much earlier, last year in a month of November and December as the prices and hype is much intense.

[stompix]

This is quite impressive. I am curious to find out how did the cease the bitcoins from the criminals in the first place. Did they happen to go through the HDs in their home and found an offline wallet? Or did the criminal voluntarily handed over their tokens? And once they were found and ceased, how were they transported and how were they stored? Did the US government have to hire a crypto specialist to figure out how to deal with the currency?

They no longer need "specialists".
They had years to have their own men trained for such things.

This is no longer 2011 when the police and the feds didn't have a clue about BTC, and unfortunately I must say that probably they know more right now than 90% of this forum  

About the "transportation" I know they do have their own wallet so it's basically a transaction made from the seized wallet to their own. Nothing spectacular, although I remember in one case they really went for the cheapest fee possible but I'm not sure it was SR or other.

As for the actual seizing of the coins I have no clue about this case but in most they make sure that the culprit has its wallet unlocked before they storm the building or the car .... and they have quite an imagination on staging things:
http://www.businessinsider.com/ross-ulbricht-will-be-sentenced-soon--heres-how-he-was-arrested-2015-5

Exactly! Although the price had recovered a month later and never has been below $375 since then, the selling did make an impact. That's why I think maybe something like that is happening this time too. Should it make an impact is another question. As I said earlier, I think it should not, because $25 million is nothing compared to $7 billion daily trading volume, as it is today for example. But still, how to explain the today's red market then? So, it's possible that the history repeats itself and thus people who are selling now at $10,500 will regret it later as well as those who were selling at $320 in November 2015.

What is to explain? Shift happens
If there would be a logical explanation for every market move we would all be expert traders by now and we could pinpoint the price on 12-11-2056.

But the thing about volume..
Forgetting that most is fake, a lot of it is made by traders who buy sell buy generating a volume that day 10 or 20 the actual size of their stash.

[squatter]

Exactly! Although the price had recovered a month later and never has been below $375 since then, the selling did make an impact. That's why I think maybe something like that is happening this time too. Should it make an impact is another question. As I said earlier, I think it should not, because $25 million is nothing compared to $7 billion daily trading volume, as it is today for example. But still, how to explain the today's red market then? So, it's possible that the history repeats itself and thus people who are selling now at $10,500 will regret it later as well as those who were selling at $320 in November 2015.

What is to explain? Shift happens
If there would be a logical explanation for every market move we would all be expert traders by now and we could pinpoint the price on 12-11-2056.

Yup, that's how the cookie crumbles. If everyone thinks the market will rally into the auction, the opposite should happen. The market usually likes to screw over as many people as possible.

But the thing about volume..
Forgetting that most is fake, a lot of it is made by traders who buy sell buy generating a volume that day 10 or 20 the actual size of their stash.

Why is most of it fake? That was true in the heyday of the Chinese exchanges who had no-fee trading -- they had millions of BTC traded in daily volume. There is no comparison today. The highest volume exchanges (Bitfinex, Okex, Binance, GDAX, Upbit, Bitflyer) all charge fees now.

Leveraged orders = liquidity that all of us can buy and sell into. So it's just as "real" as spot trading volumes.

[Betwrong]

Exactly! Although the price had recovered a month later and never has been below $375 since then, the selling did make an impact. That's why I think maybe something like that is happening this time too. Should it make an impact is another question. As I said earlier, I think it should not, because $25 million is nothing compared to $7 billion daily trading volume, as it is today for example. But still, how to explain the today's red market then? So, it's possible that the history repeats itself and thus people who are selling now at $10,500 will regret it later as well as those who were selling at $320 in November 2015.

What is to explain? Shift happens
If there would be a logical explanation for every market move we would all be expert traders by now and we could pinpoint the price on 12-11-2056.

But the thing about volume..
Forgetting that most is fake, a lot of it is made by traders who buy sell buy generating a volume that day 10 or 20 the actual size of their stash.

Imo it doesn't matter whether traders are moving their own money back and forth 20 times per day or doing that just ones per day regarding the impact of additional $25 million selling on the market. In any way this amount can't cause any effect on the price objectively. But the subjective impacts from the news are unpredictable.

[sindikat]

It's funny. The us government says bitcoin is a bubble. They say that this is a Scam, but at the same time arranged an auction for the sale of bitcoins. It turns out that they recognize that bitcoin is a commodity that brings them huge profits. Or participants in the fraudulent scheme. What version do you think they'll choose?

[InvoKing]

It's funny. The us government says bitcoin is a bubble. They say that this is a Scam, but at the same time arranged an auction for the sale of bitcoins. It turns out that they recognize that bitcoin is a commodity that brings them huge profits. Or participants in the fraudulent scheme. What version do you think they'll choose?

I think that i already read a title of an article saying that the US is considering Bitcoin as a commodity.
You know where you find money, you find the government (oil, gold & uranium mines, Bitcoin...), hopefully for Kim that he doesn't own anything valuable tho else he will join the fallen club.

[stompix]

But the thing about volume..
Forgetting that most is fake, a lot of it is made by traders who buy sell buy generating a volume that day 10 or 20 the actual size of their stash.

Why is most of it fake? That was true in the heyday of the Chinese exchanges who had no-fee trading -- they had millions of BTC traded in daily volume. There is no comparison today. The highest volume exchanges (Bitfinex, Okex, Binance, GDAX, Upbit, Bitflyer) all charge fees now.

Leveraged orders = liquidity that all of us can buy and sell into. So it's just as "real" as spot trading volumes.

Lately I've become a pessimist, that might be one of the reasons 
Joking aside, I don't consider  0 fee volume fake as long as it is done by real people.
In the case of Huobi it was volume made by scripts , and I suspect that a lot of exchnges are amplifying their volumes by various means even now.
In case of Huobi (or OkChina, I don't remember that well), there were times when it was just multiplying the orders or adding trades that did not reflect on the walls.

Why I still believe this is that we had quite a few pretty weird situations where the volume didn't spike an inch but the price moved 10 times more.
It's insane and from my point of view pretty unnatural to have 1000 BTC moving around at 10500-600 let's say an then just 100 BTC to drive the price down by 500$, and I'm not referring to a sudden dump.

But in the end... what is natural in the BTC world