Wall Observer - China wall movement tracker

[jl2012]

It's crazy how quick China can change things.  I guess when you have 1.4 billion people...

Another interesting graph:



Are there any Chinese on Bitcointalk (or Chinese speakers) who can provide insight into what's going on?

I'm in Hong Kong and trading bitcoin on many different platforms, both Chinese and Western

The volume spike in China is related to these reasons:

1. There is an ongoing price war in Chinese markets. Many platforms, including btcchina, the biggest and oldest one, have zero trading fee. Therefore it is a bit unfair to compare their volume with other Western markets.

2. Chinese BTC exchanges have the best integration with fiat transfer system. Taking btcchina, the biggest exchange as example. Users can transfer fiat from any major Chinese bank to the exchange instantly with zero fee. Therefore, depositing BTC is literally faster and cheaper than depositing bitcoin (as the user may need to pay 0.0001BTC as network fee, while depositing fiat is absolutely free). To withdraw, only 0.5% is deducted and in most cases it will arrive in 24 hours. No daily limit. No AML or KYC. All you need are accounts of any major Chinese bank and Tenpay (the Chinese version of Paypal).

3. The volume of some platforms are suspicious. I personally trust the volume figure of btcchina.com, bitxf.com, and rmbtb.com. Not saying that the rest are not legit, just I have never traded on them. The volume on btc100.org is high probably because they are giving share of the exchange to traders. btc008.com is a known and ongoing scam.

4. It is very difficult for Chinese people to obtain USD and wire to Western exchanges, so they have to pay premium in Chinese markets.

Although it is easy for me to deposit to btcchina, I'm only buying at btc-e since the price is much lower. If I had to sell (but not now), I will definitely do it on btcchina. (This is the advantage of Hong Kong as we are the gateway between China and the rest of the world)

With no fees, how are the exchanges earning money?

Yes, they are operating like charity now. This is really the Chinese style price war. I think btcchina is still earning about 0.25%-0.5% from CNY withdrawal. Btcchina has earned a lot during the 2013 bubble so it may  survive a while without any income. I guess their plan is to squeeze the small and new competitors to death.

I still trust btcchina because of their track record. I will never trade on other free platforms as they can suddenly disappear.

[dree12]

It's crazy how quick China can change things.  I guess when you have 1.4 billion people...

Another interesting graph:



Are there any Chinese on Bitcointalk (or Chinese speakers) who can provide insight into what's going on?

I'm in Hong Kong and trading bitcoin on many different platforms, both Chinese and Western

The volume spike in China is related to these reasons:

1. There is an ongoing price war in Chinese markets. Many platforms, including btcchina, the biggest and oldest one, have zero trading fee. Therefore it is a bit unfair to compare their volume with other Western markets.

2. Chinese BTC exchanges have the best integration with fiat transfer system. Taking btcchina, the biggest exchange as example. Users can transfer fiat from any major Chinese bank to the exchange instantly with zero fee. Therefore, depositing BTC is literally faster and cheaper than depositing bitcoin (as the user may need to pay 0.0001BTC as network fee, while depositing fiat is absolutely free). To withdraw, only 0.5% is deducted and in most cases it will arrive in 24 hours. No daily limit. No AML or KYC. All you need are accounts of any major Chinese bank and Tenpay (the Chinese version of Paypal).

3. The volume of some platforms are suspicious. I personally trust the volume figure of btcchina.com, bitxf.com, and rmbtb.com. Not saying that the rest are not legit, just I have never traded on them. The volume on btc100.org is high probably because they are giving share of the exchange to traders. btc008.com is a known and ongoing scam.

4. It is very difficult for Chinese people to obtain USD and wire to Western exchanges, so they have to pay premium in Chinese markets.

Although it is easy for me to deposit to btcchina, I'm only buying at btc-e since the price is much lower. If I had to sell (but not now), I will definitely do it on btcchina. (This is the advantage of Hong Kong as we are the gateway between China and the rest of the world)

With no fees, how are the exchanges earning money?

Yes, they are operating like charity now. This is really the Chinese style price war. I think btcchina is still earning about 0.25%-0.5% from CNY withdrawal. Btcchina has earned a lot during the 2013 bubble so it may  survive a while without any income. I guess their plan is to squeeze the small and new competitors to death.

I still trust btcchina because of their track record. I will never trade on other free platforms as they can suddenly disappear.

Wow, that's smart. SatoshiDICE should have done that when its competitors appeared. Had it offered 0% (or other super-low) house edge for a while, it would have retained its #1 share instead of losing it to Just-Dice and the other dice sites.

[SheHadMANHands]

Wow, that's smart. SatoshiDICE should have done that when its competitors appeared. Had it offered 0% (or other super-low) house edge for a while, it would have retained its #1 share instead of losing it to Just-Dice and the other dice sites.

I don't think that would have worked.  True, SatoshiDICE's competitors would have disappeared for a while, but eventually they would have to return to charging a house edge, at which point competitors would have flooded back in offering lower fees.  Till then, they would just be offering a 0% house edge and losing money with no competition.

[jl2012]

Wow, that's smart. SatoshiDICE should have done that when its competitors appeared. Had it offered 0% (or other super-low) house edge for a while, it would have retained its #1 share instead of losing it to Just-Dice and the other dice sites.

Yes, for btcchina keeping the #1 position is probably more valuable than the 0.6% fee (0.3% from buyer and 0.3% from seller) they charged. Now the whole bitcoin world (not just China) is talking about btcchina. This is priceless.

Just not sure how long the the price war will last, but I'm sure some (if not many) new competitors won't survive and some users will get burnt.

[Wary]

4. It is very difficult for Chinese people to obtain USD and wire to Western exchanges, so they have to pay premium in Chinese markets.

So some high Chinese officials that can wire to West, are probably making big money on arbitrage?

[bobdude17]

China is awake now, and up it goes!

849.50

Was at 841 like 5 minutes ago.

[chriswilmer]

Exciting day for BTCChina

[totaleclipseofthebank]

868 now.

nn ch nn ch nn ch nn ch
nn ch nn ch nn ch nn ch

[chriswilmer]

875, go China go!

[cypherdoc]

nice thread

[erk]

Is this some kind of a hedge by the Chinese public against the $USD crashing if they can't raise the debt ceiling this week?

[bobdude17]

Is this some kind of a hedge by the Chinese public against the $USD crashing if they can't raise the debt ceing this week?

That's my thinking as well.


885!!

China is killin it right now!

[chriswilmer]

Isn't 888 a lucky number in China? 

[cypherdoc]

Isn't 888 a lucky number in China? 

no, it's 8888.

[chriswilmer]

Isn't 888 a lucky number in China? 

no, it's 8888.

Does 8888 really have special significance over other 8-based numbers? Wikipedia indicates that pretty much anything with 8's is good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_in_Chinese_culture#Eight

[cypherdoc]

Isn't 888 a lucky number in China? 

no, it's 8888.

Does 8888 really have special significance over other 8-based numbers? Wikipedia indicates that pretty much anything with 8's is good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_in_Chinese_culture#Eight

ok, let me be a bit more clear:  no, it's 8888 

[chriswilmer]

Isn't 888 a lucky number in China? 

no, it's 8888.

Does 8888 really have special significance over other 8-based numbers? Wikipedia indicates that pretty much anything with 8's is good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_in_Chinese_culture#Eight

ok, let me be a bit more clear:  no, it's 8888 

That's not more clear! Please elaborate!

[pand70]

What's going on? China drives the price now?  

[chriswilmer]

What's going on? China drives the price now?  

Yup. All day today... maybe this will be the norm from now on. I for one welcome our new Chinese overlords.

[jl2012]

Isn't 888 a lucky number in China? 

no, it's 8888.

Does 8888 really have special significance over other 8-based numbers? Wikipedia indicates that pretty much anything with 8's is good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_in_Chinese_culture#Eight

ok, let me be a bit more clear:  no, it's 8888 

That's not more clear! Please elaborate!

More 8s is better, of course. And they don't like 4 and 7, as they are related the death