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Author Topic: Republic Of Bitcoin  (Read 4492 times)
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July 29, 2011, 01:29:10 AM
 #41

Rassha, what does currency have to do with citizenship? I'm not a citizen where I work, but pay taxes where I live.

The point is that BTC offer a great way to escape from the taxman here and there. That is one of the biggest reasons why I am a believer in the project.




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July 29, 2011, 02:53:44 PM
 #42

If enough businesses start selling goods in Bitcoin, and enough black-market establishments start renting rooms for bitcoin and paying for jobs in bitcoin, it may be possible to renounce your citizenship, and just live wherever you want, earning and paying with bitcoin while avoiding things like taxes.

Rassah, what does currency have to do with citizenship? I'm not a citizen where I work, but pay taxes where I live.

Anonymous enough to avoid taxation, and can work outside of government's monitoring of the financial system. You can work for cash and pay with cash to get the same effects, but that cash is still coming from somewhere and going to somewhere and questions can be asked. With Bitcoin it may be easier to be completely under the radar.

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July 29, 2011, 03:22:30 PM
 #43

Virtual, or online societies wouldn't work, in my opinion, because trade is usually done for physical things.

An earlier poster used the analagy of people saying they are an online king and demand taxes off of everybody. It's ludicrous.

I believe Bitcoins adoption will be slow as pockets of communities reach out to each other on a global level with ease, a level that couldn't be achieved with our surrent monetary systems, this will mean local businesses will eventually pop up.

Of course, if a country wishes to adopt BitCoin as their national currency, how on Earth will they get enough to support a national economy? Will the governmetn be expected to buy millions of BitCoins from the market?

I believe if this adoption were to take place, first the government would create a paper currency which would be backed by BitCoin, (more like digital coin not a certificate for redeemable BitCoin. Self-issued credit in terms of BitCoin) as that would be easier to distribute. They would also declare BitCoins as legal tender, so slowly but surely, BitCoins will be introduced into the national economy, but the economy isn't stunted by lack of BitCoins.

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I then use the money to buy BitCoins. You can too!
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July 29, 2011, 04:05:35 PM
 #44

I believe if this adoption were to take place, first the government would create a paper currency which would be backed by BitCoin, (more like digital coin not a certificate for redeemable BitCoin. Self-issued credit in terms of BitCoin) as that would be easier to distribute. They would also declare BitCoins as legal tender, so slowly but surely, BitCoins will be introduced into the national economy, but the economy isn't stunted by lack of BitCoins.

Zimbabwe's central bank chief, Dr Gideon Gono is shopping for new currency, saying “The events of the 2008 Global Financial Crisis demand a new approach to self reliance and a stable mineral-backed currency”

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July 29, 2011, 04:22:58 PM
 #45

The Bitcoin military would have the motto, "I solemnly swear to preserve, protect, and defend the integrity of the Bitcoin blockchain, from all enemies, whether spammers, forks, or protocol attacks."
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July 29, 2011, 04:29:57 PM
 #46

The Bitcoin military would have the motto, "I solemnly swear to preserve, protect, and defend the integrity of the Bitcoin blockchain, from all enemies, whether spammers, forks, or protocol attacks."

Bitcoin is proudly and voluntarily sustained not by force.

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July 31, 2011, 05:17:30 PM
 #47

I believe if this adoption were to take place, first the government would create a paper currency which would be backed by BitCoin, (more like digital coin not a certificate for redeemable BitCoin. Self-issued credit in terms of BitCoin) as that would be easier to distribute. They would also declare BitCoins as legal tender, so slowly but surely, BitCoins will be introduced into the national economy, but the economy isn't stunted by lack of BitCoins.

Zimbabwe's central bank chief, Dr Gideon Gono is shopping for new currency, saying “The events of the 2008 Global Financial Crisis demand a new approach to self reliance and a stable mineral-backed currency”


FTW! Sound monetary policy coming from Gideon Gono?? The world has truly turned upside down  Shocked

I'm glad I haven't renounced my citizenship yet.

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July 31, 2011, 07:08:26 PM
 #48

I believe if this adoption were to take place, first the government would create a paper currency which would be backed by BitCoin, (more like digital coin not a certificate for redeemable BitCoin. Self-issued credit in terms of BitCoin) as that would be easier to distribute. They would also declare BitCoins as legal tender, so slowly but surely, BitCoins will be introduced into the national economy, but the economy isn't stunted by lack of BitCoins.

Zimbabwe's central bank chief, Dr Gideon Gono is shopping for new currency, saying “The events of the 2008 Global Financial Crisis demand a new approach to self reliance and a stable mineral-backed currency”


FTW! Sound monetary policy coming from Gideon Gono?? The world has truly turned upside down  Shocked

I'm glad I haven't renounced my citizenship yet.

How about you guys write him a letter, educating him about BTCs. Lets call it the Zimbabwe Connection.
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July 31, 2011, 07:27:11 PM
 #49

What would happen if one of those Third world countries based their currency on bitcoin?

Or how about a Virtual On-line Republic with Bitcoin as their Currency?

Just a though

I like the idea, but bitcoin would have to become physical first.

What's wrong with Bitbills (http://bitbills.com/)?

If all the sovereign non-cryptocurrencies will eventually collapse from hyperinflation, you can't afford *not* to invest in Bitcoin...  See my blog at http://minetopics.blogspot.com/ .

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July 31, 2011, 08:58:03 PM
 #50

I believe if this adoption were to take place, first the government would create a paper currency which would be backed by BitCoin, (more like digital coin not a certificate for redeemable BitCoin. Self-issued credit in terms of BitCoin) as that would be easier to distribute. They would also declare BitCoins as legal tender, so slowly but surely, BitCoins will be introduced into the national economy, but the economy isn't stunted by lack of BitCoins.

Zimbabwe's central bank chief, Dr Gideon Gono is shopping for new currency, saying “The events of the 2008 Global Financial Crisis demand a new approach to self reliance and a stable mineral-backed currency”


FTW! Sound monetary policy coming from Gideon Gono?? The world has truly turned upside down  Shocked

I'm glad I haven't renounced my citizenship yet.

How about you guys write him a letter, educating him about BTCs. Lets call it the Zimbabwe Connection.

mmm... They might actually be receptive to Bitcoin. After all, Zimbabwean politicians have fallen for more ridiculous things like the Diesel N'anga

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Web definitions

    * (N'anga) Among the Shona people of Zimbabwe, a n'anga is a traditional healers which use a combination of herbs, medical/religious advice and spiritual guidance to heal people. In Zimbabwe, N'angas are recognized and registered under the ZINATHA (Zimbabwe National Traditional Healer's Association).

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August 05, 2011, 03:04:45 PM
 #51

Quote
mmm... They might actually be receptive to Bitcoin. After all, Zimbabwean politicians have fallen for more ridiculous things like the Diesel N'anga

Off topic but true. There is an Aluminum smelter down the road from me that over a period of years leaked so much diesel that you can put a pipe in the ground and out comes diesel. Perhaps a miracle awaits bitcoin..
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August 07, 2011, 11:53:39 AM
 #52

FTW! Sound monetary policy coming from Gideon Gono?? The world has truly turned upside down  Shocked

I'm glad I haven't renounced my citizenship yet.

Talking about yourself in the third person there?

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August 07, 2011, 12:45:02 PM
 #53

Fiat backed by bitcoins would be the traditional fractonal reserve banking solution. Ten of us borrow 21,000,000 bitcoins (notionally; we don't need them actually delivered to us as they cancel out in a few short steps, resulting in us paying back the interest-free loan of them so fast there is no time for any interest to accrue on them); print up 21,000,000 bitbills of face value one bitcoin each; deposit 2,100,000 bitbills each into our First National Bank of Bitcoin, use a staggeringly unheard-of-ly high reserve ratio, like huge, vast, entire points (hundredths of a percent) higher than the 10% some of the best banks in the world use, so lets say, at least 11%, heck lets blow the whole banking world's minds with an insanely outrageously high ratio of.... 20% !!!

So the First National Bank of Bitcoin can now offer loans totalling up to 84,000,000, fully fractionally-reserve-backed (hell, more than fully, this is way more than the normal full fractional reserve the world is used to).

So all ten of us borrow 8,400,000 each at the Bitcoin National Reserve Rate, which because we are going to benefactor the entire Bitcoin Nation we'll waive, being as we are the Board of Directors and Major Shareholders, we might as well waive, to encourage us to emmigrate to the Bitcoin nation and perform this massive undertaking for them.

We loan this 84,000,000 to the Bitcoin nation at some trivial rate, only enough to cover a few basic expenses such as buying up all liquidity on the planet including bitcoins, and that only over generations, not right away.

That governmental obligation (to pay the interest on the loan), which of course the government will tax the citizenry to cover, we'll call Bitcoin Treasury Notes, and keep in our digital vaults as reserves so we don't need any actual bitcoins in our reserves, these Bitcoin Treasury Notes are worth four times as much as a paltry 21,000,000 bitcoins (84,000,000 plus interest!) so forget about the bitcoins, we don't need them, as I said at the start they were purely notional...

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August 07, 2011, 06:51:06 PM
 #54

Fiat backed by bitcoins would be the traditional fractonal reserve banking solution. Ten of us borrow 21,000,000 bitcoins (notionally; we don't need them actually delivered to us as they cancel out in a few short steps, resulting in us paying back the interest-free loan of them so fast there is no time for any interest to accrue on them); print up 21,000,000 bitbills of face value one bitcoin each; deposit 2,100,000 bitbills each into our First National Bank of Bitcoin, use a staggeringly unheard-of-ly high reserve ratio, like huge, vast, entire points (hundredths of a percent) higher than the 10% some of the best banks in the world use, so lets say, at least 11%, heck lets blow the whole banking world's minds with an insanely outrageously high ratio of.... 20% !!!

So the First National Bank of Bitcoin can now offer loans totalling up to 84,000,000, fully fractionally-reserve-backed (hell, more than fully, this is way more than the normal full fractional reserve the world is used to).

So all ten of us borrow 8,400,000 each at the Bitcoin National Reserve Rate, which because we are going to benefactor the entire Bitcoin Nation we'll waive, being as we are the Board of Directors and Major Shareholders, we might as well waive, to encourage us to emmigrate to the Bitcoin nation and perform this massive undertaking for them.

We loan this 84,000,000 to the Bitcoin nation at some trivial rate, only enough to cover a few basic expenses such as buying up all liquidity on the planet including bitcoins, and that only over generations, not right away.

That governmental obligation (to pay the interest on the loan), which of course the government will tax the citizenry to cover, we'll call Bitcoin Treasury Notes, and keep in our digital vaults as reserves so we don't need any actual bitcoins in our reserves, these Bitcoin Treasury Notes are worth four times as much as a paltry 21,000,000 bitcoins (84,000,000 plus interest!) so forget about the bitcoins, we don't need them, as I said at the start they were purely notional...

-MarkM-

A bank that did this with Bitcoin would be out of business in a week. If it ever opened its doors in the first place.

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August 07, 2011, 08:13:50 PM
 #55

excellent point. This is American ignorance at its finest. Most there don't even realize that they are quite low on the list of countries with bandwidth access. Many parts of Asia enjoy cheaper cellular and internet access rates as a percentage of their income than Americans do.

And don't mind these folks - most of them don't even realize that America looks to be heading in the direction of a third-world country. Maybe there should be an official term for this. As opposed to "developing nation", perhaps "devolving nation" would be the right phrase?


third world countries don't have computers  Huh

Maybe (old) computers... but lousy internet connections! A friend of mine told me that it takes him ~5 minutes for a google search - and this is not the PC being slow...
Until Bitcoin could be adopted there, the Blockchain would be so enormous that they can't even update it in realtime!

Well I dont know about other third world countires but I live in a third world country JAMAICA and actually our IT infrastructure is pretty good as far as I think we have up to 100mbit connections available in all cities and also 95% 3g coverage at (1.5mbps) and 95% 4g coverage at 6mbps (I can drive around and be connected monitoring my miners anywhere I go no problem). I'm pretty sure there are lots of places in the USA that cant get anywhere near those connection speeds.

Right now the average Jamaican is connecting to the internet at 20mbps, so dont knock third world countries

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August 08, 2011, 12:40:48 AM
 #56

Though gold and platinum are obvious choices for Rhodesia, bitcoin is not an absurd option. The average Zimbabwean need not be a bitcoin miner. They already trade ZAR and USD every day and digital money transfers and banking via mobile telephone are more common in East Africa than most anywhere else in the world.

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August 08, 2011, 05:52:35 PM
 #57

And don't mind these folks - most of them don't even realize that America looks to be heading in the direction of a third-world country. Maybe there should be an official term for this. As opposed to "developing nation", perhaps "devolving nation" would be the right phrase?

We are a "crumbling empire"

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August 08, 2011, 09:52:15 PM
 #58

http://www.africanbusinessreview.co.za/money_matters/bitcoin-an-african-finance-revolution

Written last month by Marco Thomas Picardi,
Centre for African Development and Security
http://cads-cdsa.org/2011/06/bitcoin-an-african-finance-revolution/

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