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Author Topic: Single Slot Width 5770s at Overclockers.co.uk  (Read 1877 times)
catfish
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July 27, 2011, 09:10:15 AM
 #1

OK, it's not the fastest of Radeon cards and not a miner's first choice.

However, my first test-bed had an 'old' retail Sapphire 5850 (not an 'extreme') and a retail Sapphire 5770 board. The 5770 allowed monster core overclocking and I eventually got a stable 236 Mh/s out of it.

No big deal for all the recent buyers of Sapphire 5850 'extreme' cards at between £99 and £140 - especially those who have managed to get one of the better revision PCBs, have good cooling systems and can clock them up to getting over 400 Mh/s...

But these 'new' 5770s are £64.99 each. This is a special offer so I don't know how long that price will stay. The important thing is that the cards are single-slot. I'm not sure (but am going to find out!!!!) whether they overheat immediately if placed side-by-side in an average 'non-gamer-crossfire' logic board. Power requirements for these cards are lower than the 58xx series, with only one extra PCIe power cable required.

I'm realising now that I really need to invest in proper Crossfire-design logic boards before I get my extender cables to build a frame rig. But if you've got an old logic board lying around that has, say, three PCIe slots on it, and no extenders, then you can either install ONE dual-width hot-hot-hot card, like a 5850... or three of these new single-width 5770s. Assuming the new cards can be clocked as high... the 5770s win on performance quite handily.

Are these not new at all, but have been around a while? Has anyone tried them - can they effectively cool the card? My 5770 that clocked to 1033 happily was a thick twin copper heatpipe arrangement, basically looked almost identical to Sapphire's 5850 'extreme' cooler. So I have my doubts...

...so I give in to the rhythm, the click click clack
I'm too wasted to fight back...


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tritium
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July 27, 2011, 11:58:21 AM
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http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-185-XF&groupid=701&catid=56&subcat=1515

do you mean this one, I was interested in them and the possibility of running 8 of them on a big bang marshall

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July 27, 2011, 12:42:23 PM
 #3

Damn I can't find those under 100 usd on this side of the pond

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If you found that funny or something i said useful i always appreciate spare change
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mike678
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July 27, 2011, 01:45:21 PM
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Damn I can't find those under 100 usd on this side of the pond
The site linked to costs 70 pounds and that equals 115 usd Wink so neither can they.
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July 27, 2011, 01:47:28 PM
 #5

That price is before taxes, the site shows the price at purchase £83 pounds which is $135 dollars.

That's not a bargain in any sense of the word, I've seen 5770's go for $99 in clearance sales.

For $135 you could pick up a Sapphire 5850 just 2 months ago.

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July 27, 2011, 02:00:26 PM
 #6

That price is before taxes, the site shows the price at purchase £83 pounds which is $135 dollars.

That's not a bargain in any sense of the word, I've seen 5770's go for $99 in clearance sales.

For $135 you could pick up a Sapphire 5850 just 2 months ago.
I think you can almost get one today too at Ncix. $145 until tomorrow.

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July 27, 2011, 02:07:18 PM
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they used to be that price as a special offer which is $105.

I wish i got a few of the 5850s when they were £99

anyway, regardless of the price does anyone have any experience of the card, specifically mh and temps

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dextrose
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July 27, 2011, 02:48:17 PM
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I'm running one of the XFX 5770 single slot cards, along side another double width 5770.  I'm not doing any real overclocking with it (stock 1125 mV, 850 MHz core, 600 MHz memory), but I can say a few things about the XFX card:

- It runs a bit hot.  The default fan settings have it running over 80C under load.  I've set the fan manually to 80% in afterburner, which keeps the card around 75-77C with 99% GPU load.  A little toasty for my liking, but I've had no problems for the 2 or so months I've had this card.
- The fan on it is much quieter than I expected.  I only really notice it if it turn it up over 90%, and its still not too bad.
- With my settings, I'm getting about 192 mhash/sec.  I'm very concerned about noise and temperature though, and have gotten it over 200mhash/sec in some limited testing, but it of course runs hotter.

Overall, its a well made card, very tweakable, and the quietness of the fan really surprised me.  I've read reviews for the similarly priced PowerColor single slot 5770, and all the reviews complain about how loud it is, so I think the XFX is a real winner in that department.  The only downside is that it runs hot, but that's to be expected.

I'd love to run several of these side by side (in a big bang motherboard) as well, but I think the heat may be too much without extra cooling.  I'd love to hear if anyone has tried this though, as I really like this card and would love to pick up some more if they're cheap enough.
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July 27, 2011, 04:15:24 PM
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what case do you have them in and what sort of cooling?

I recently upgraded my main PC from a thermaltake armour with some additional 12cm top exaust fans which had 2 5830s in and would only stay under 80C if the side of the case was off and some fans bluetacked onto the cards

to a xigmatek elysium which now has a 5850 and 2 5830s with no blutacked fans and the cards all run at around 65C with the side on

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catfish
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July 27, 2011, 05:54:03 PM
 #10

they used to be that price as a special offer which is $105.

I wish i got a few of the 5850s when they were £99

anyway, regardless of the price does anyone have any experience of the card, specifically mh and temps
Quite.

Pissing contests between the prices of technology in the USA and the UK aren't particularly helpful - they certainly don't help answer my questions. American members - please note that UK prices include 20% VAT (sales tax, aka 'nothing for something'). There's also the 'Rip-Off Britain' factor where things are *always* more expensive in the UK - there is import duty on most components made elsewhere.

Why didn't I include the 20% VAT in my price quote? Well, firstly to flatten the playing field somewhat (online purchases in the USA avoid state sales taxes IIRC), and secondly because I own a VAT registered company and can reclaim the VAT... so that's the price *I* pay.

It's not helpful to tell me that I could have bought a 5850 for less in dollar terms 2 months ago... not only has the FX rate changed since then, but even if cable had stayed flat (sorry, bad double pun), I'd have to pay shipping from the US (unlike free next-day delivery in the UK), then Customs would add import duty, then 20% VAT on top of that (I'd claim the VAT, of course, but the duty and shipping on less than £100 items becomes *significant* - especially when firms like UPS and DHL charge a £10 flat rate 'handling fee' for any Customs charges due). Hell, I've had £6.14 customs charges before now on an item imported from Australia. I had to pay UPS £16.14 because of their 'handling fee'. And shipping cost half the value of the product.

Show me *UK* prices of the same product that are much cheaper, and you'll show that these aren't much of a bargain. But it'd be more polite to notify the USA members of this forum that the cards are not a bargain or worth considering *IN THE USA* due to market conditions... however, they very well may be useful in the UK due to UK prices.


Anyhoooo. The feedback from dextrose sounds promising. I was planning to run one of these cards in each PCIe x1 slot on the big logic board I've got on order - it has three x16 slots (which will use extenders to feed 5850s), and two or three x1 slots, between the x16 slots. I've got x1 to x16 extender cables, which I will use to feed the 5770s, which have a much lower power consumption and should hopefully be OK without overloading the logic board or PSU.

So far it doesn't seem to work very well having mining rigs inside PC cases - even gamer cases with loads of fans - because with 100% load dual 5850-class GPUs overclocked even to only 900 MHz core clock, the temperatures rise far too high. Taking the side panel off and pointing a desk fan into the case works, but the components are open to inquisitive cats etc. which is the whole point of buying a case...

...so I give in to the rhythm, the click click clack
I'm too wasted to fight back...


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dextrose
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July 27, 2011, 06:36:58 PM
 #11

what case do you have them in and what sort of cooling?

I recently upgraded my main PC from a thermaltake armour with some additional 12cm top exaust fans which had 2 5830s in and would only stay under 80C if the side of the case was off and some fans bluetacked onto the cards

to a xigmatek elysium which now has a 5850 and 2 5830s with no blutacked fans and the cards all run at around 65C with the side on

I use an Azza Solano (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811517006) with just the stock fans, nothing special.  FWIW, my other 5770 is a Gigabyte GV-R577SO-1GD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125327) which runs at 65C with some slight overclocking.  All temps are with the side on for the very reason catfish mentioned: inquisitive cats  Cheesy
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July 27, 2011, 06:57:56 PM
 #12

I got my 5770s for $80 each off of anandtech forums...

These would be cool if the price was lower.  Great for board w\ 5-6 pcie slots.
catfish
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July 28, 2011, 05:50:21 AM
 #13

This is what attracted me to them. I've got a 3-big slot logic board coming tomorrow - it has 3 x16 slots and hence should eat all of the 'extreme' 5850s and prove a useful box (if all three can run in a case). However using dual-width cards like this wastes the x1 slots between the x16 slots. I think the board has 5 PCIe slots in total.

So... I'm deciding to go the whole hog and build a Messhead box. I'm dusting off my carpentry skillz and will be building a frame out of wood - the logic board will sit on the base, two butchered desk fans will move air from one side to the other, and none of the cards will be in the slots.

Due to power concerns, running 5 of the power cards like 5850s or 5870s will require extreme PSUs (i.e. very expensive ones) - or I could try bridging a bunch of 300-500W salvaged-from-PCs PSUs (all bronze-stickered). Also, the cost of such a rig is going to be monstrously expensive - I've got four 5850s right now but buying a load more is out of the question. Buying 5870s? Forget it.

What I *do* have is my 'old' ultra-overclockable Sapphire 5850, an extra 'extreme', an original Sapphire 5770 (dual slot with a cooler like the 5850 'extreme'), and three of these single-slot 5770s arriving along with the logic board.

It's an addiction, I tell you! An addiction!!! (though it's a damn sight less harmful than my usual habits, I guess. Ahem)

So keeping the power to a safe level with the decent but mid-power PSUs I've acquired, and with the possibility that the logic board *itself* isn't actually rated to supply 75W to *each and every PCIe slot at the SAME TIME*, I'm going to run three dual-slot cards (the 'old' dual-slot 5770 showed itself as an adept overclocker) and two single-slot 5770s. If power is too close to my PSU's limit, then I'll run all three of the single-slot 5770s and two of the 5850s.

Two mildly overclocked 5850 'extreme' cards pull 440W from the wall with my Miner Box 1 - that's the entire system, loads of big fans and all (though my rigs are *seriously* stripped - there's no hard drive, no CD - just a card reader connected to the internal USB2 bus, which runs my customised Ubuntu setup off a SDHC or compact-flash card.

I've got a CoolerMaster 600W PSU that got a great review... and the Corsair 800W intended for the frame rig. Both should thus handle the cards I happen to own. I've not seen any problems with x1 to x16 extender cables either - without Molex power seems fine for lower-power cards like the 5850 and 5770. So I will have all five cards on extenders in the wood frame.

Then it's just a case of decent mesh that permits full airflow - my cats are very inquisitive, but they're not small enough to get into tiny spaces like your average cat... Ozzy is still an 18 month old kitten and is over 6 kg already... and he's only started gaining weight since last Christmas (he was 5.5 kg last December) due to an illness. The Americans here will know *exactly* what I'm talking about... they're my favourite breed, from the USA, and get rather large Smiley Four to five years is usual time till full adulthood so Ozzy has some time to get to his dad's size of 15 kg... The weird thing is that they're called 'Maine Coons'... you'd have thought with the biggest domestic cats out there, they'd be 'Texas Coons' surely - everything's bigger in Texas, right? Or would 'Coon' cause complications in the south (please say I'm behind the times!) Smiley (yeah, lame joke, I know the origin of the name Maine Coon... people from Maine must be odd if they think cats could cross-breed with raccoons... is Maine one of those states where teaching evolution is banned??? OOoooooh.... controversial!!!! Please forgive my English piss-take sense of humour, no flamebait intended)...  Embarrassed

The flip side of the coin is that both cats are strong enough to pull network cables / power leads out of the computers, and even push a standing tower case over. My 'mesh protective screen' will have to be rigid metal, as chicken-wire or plastic mesh isn't going to cut it (well the cats certainly will).


Basically it's all getting out of hand, and I want to consolidate my early failed or inadequate attempts at mining machines to 3 machines maximum. Each machine should have two 5850s (or equivalent ~400 Mh/s cards) and the rest of the cards should be very cheap but capable of over 250 Mh/s. This should do me just fine. Above that, the hardware cost starts taking a LONG time to pay back... and who knows what a bitcoin will be worth, or how hard it will be to mine them, looking too far forward into the future?

The problem is that I love collecting silver coins. And there's a merchant who takes bitcoins, confirms the transaction and sends you a silver Maple the next day (it's a Canadian one ounce bullion silver coin - very popular, very attractive coins, and very pure silver - most countries' bullion silver is 99.9% but Maples are 99.99%). Once my bitcoin rigs are mining enough to 'earn' me one silver one-ounce bullion coin every week... I will find it hard to avoid wanting to upgrade or add to my mining rigs. It's free money - *real* money with similar anti-inflationary properties, but without any of the risks of bitcoin (infrastructure attack, social breakdown, successful black-hat exploits destroying trust in the system, etc.). Hold a silver ounce coin in your hand and it is satisfying.

Hold 6 Maples that you've bought with bitcoins (effectively received for free... once hardware is paid for)... now *that* is satisfying. The chap also supplies Krugers but I'm not waiting until my bitcoin wallet accrues that sort of money, the time taken between transactions is too long, hence higher risk. The silver plan is nice, regular, feels like I'm actually making real money for a change from my messing about with computers... and is frequent enough to give ample warning of market doom.

One has to want to invest in physical silver, of course. I work with investment managers for my day job, and *my* views are considered fairly off-piste... so it's not for everyone. For those in the UK who like silver... remember buying with Bitcoins isn't *yet* a financial transaction. So the dreaded 20% VAT, which ruins silver investment for non-corporates in the UK, doesn't apply Smiley However the vendor is well aware of this, and charges the bitcoin equivalent of more than my best online supplier, and that's *with* paying the 20% tax. This chap is literally coining it in (sorry). He's got the market to himself, so I would too.

I could, too... but I don't want to sell my silver for bitcoins! Even if the BTC value of his silver is overpriced, and he only has Maples and no other interesting coins (check out the Mexican Liberdads - utterly, utterly beautiful for a bullion coin, and the Chinese Panda is always a stunning proof coin. My current favourite is Perth Mint's 'High Relief' Aussie Kangaroo - twice the thickness, smaller diameter, big concave surfaces. Exquisite), if I'm earning the bitcoins for free (or a damn sight less than the real exchanged value - electricity isn't extortionate, and the PCs can be repurposed and expensed for other purposes) then it doesn't really matter if he's profiteering...


Current goal is to get a coin a week. This, with 4 constantly running *mildly* overclocked 5850s, is looking very possible (I use Slush's pool). However, with all the extra 5770s and maybe more 5850s if OcUK comes up with another offer... we could be looking at more than one coin a week. This is a very good way to protect the earnings from this interesting enterprise... and silver gained 100% last year (it was actually 99%, but what the hell). It's a volatile instrument to invest in, because it's half precious metal and half industrial commodity - hence twice the number of stories can move the market, plus it's well known that the Comex silver futures exchange is a criminally rigged casino... the investigation has been going on for years, but the prime witnesses have odd car accidents and often switch personalities from 'let's clean this place up' to 'oh well, the status quo isn't so bad after all' - complete turnarounds that make no psychological sense unless coercion is involved...

I'm not a practising financial adviser but I believe that my qualifications permit me to deal on the behalf of clients... not retail 'unsophisticated' clients though, so don't listen to me unless you *already* like silver. Using a well-set-up mining rig (or three) to acquire bitcoins at a reasonable rate, and then buying silver bullion coins with the proceeds, is basically tax-free, untraceable, unrecorded on a regulatory basis, and the only records potentially kept would be by the dealer who sells the coins... the fact that he asks for my postal address and bitcoin sending address *every time* I buy a coin (even though it's a regular occurrence) suggests that he doesn't actually keep any records. The package is printed with my address, a coin is popped in, the package is posted, and then the transaction is deleted from his database. Perfectly legal since no *financial* transaction has taken place - protects him completely, but also protects me. A criminal breaking into the dealer's premises wouldn't get a list of customers and hence a nice easy route from house to house with his Transit van to collect coins.

The only risk is that the emails are intercepted by a sniffer on the network (this would have to be a cracker working at an ISP, basically) where a buyer is using some ancient or cluelessly-configured email client that doesn't support TLS. I'm confident that my emails to the dealer are secure, as I own the email server and have watched the handshake with his mail provider... looks good to me.


I definitely recommend him. Midas Bitcoin is the chap. Not cheap - definitely not cheap. But if your BTC are *mined* and not bought at current FX rates... it doesn't matter until he has much cheaper competition. And a decent mining rig can accumulate enough per day to buy a silver coin every 5 days or so...


(actually this isn't 'Hardware' at all, but some 'finance' or 'investment' forum... mods please move this post if required...)

Smiley

...so I give in to the rhythm, the click click clack
I'm too wasted to fight back...


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