NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[BrianNowhere]

PS. CFB is orbiting the moon, staging our arrival, and there are certain parts of the day when he's on the dark side, and hence no one hears from him.

He always seems to have time to answer Emule.

My latest theory. Emule = BCNext.

[Eadeqa]

Offer stands to show where anyone else here has answered my question directly  and told me that the Nxt network will be secure with only large stakeholders forging.

I will not search that too-long thread.

Nevertheless, I do not get your question. Could you paraphrase it?

The question, which I think is important to have a mathematical answer to.

What ratio of existing accounts need to be running an open client for the network to be secure?

You were given the answer many times in this thread.  Look it up yourself. There is no definite percentage as accounts will continue to grow. All we need is that at least some big holders (with more than 300K nxt)  forge, as they get to forge almost all blocks anyway, they need to be honest with no shenanigans, and provide enough bandwidth. Since they have big investment, it's in their self interest to do that.

Nxt survives just by that.

[xlcus]

I am sure we had a Nxt forging pool,

http://www.nxtio.org

 

[EDIT] Nxtpool.net started as a forging pool. Now it's for miners.

I can not withdraw my nxt
The  Token is wrong.

Just a bit curious about the NXT pool: how can the "miners" get their interests if only forging 1 NXT?

[Daedelus]

[Daedelus]

I am sure we had a Nxt forging pool,

http://www.nxtio.org

 

[EDIT] Nxtpool.net started as a forging pool. Now it's for miners.

I can not withdraw my nxt
The  Token is wrong.

Just a bit curious about the NXT pool: how can the "miners" get their interests if only forging 1 NXT?

Nxt Indirect Mining doesn't involve forging.

The basic steps are:

1) Use mining hardware to mine PumpDumpcoin
2) Sell PumpDumpcoin for BTC
3) Use BTC to buy NXT on an exchange

Therefore you are mining and indirectly getting NXT  

[BrianNowhere]

You were given the answer many times in this thread.  Look it up yourself. There is no definite percentage as accounts will continue to grow. All we need that at least some big holders (more than 300K nxt)  forge, as they get to forge almost all blocks anyway, they need to be honest with no shenanigans, and provide enough bandwidth. Since they have big investment, it's in their self interest to do that.

Nxt survives just by that.

As I said, I'll send you 150 Nxt to show me anywhere besides the two posts above and the one from James from yesterday
where someone answered the question directly to me with an actual non-vague and/or dismissive answer. But as usual asking a valid technical question is trolling. I will be logging off permanently soon but had to respond to the FUD you threw out about me. (When people stop talking shit about me I'll stop coming here.) Despite what you've said about me, the only thing i've been told repeatedly is that I'm pest for asking too many questions (yet emule is being courted over to nxtforum.org)

Self-Interest is also Bitcoin's defense regarding 51% attacks, yet the pooling phenomenon has made this argument more specious.
A malicious agent could pose as a benevolent pool and accumulate enough mining power to take Bitcoin down. Likely? not really. Posible?
Definitely.

If i'm a huge business do I want to invest building all or part of my infrastructure around a technology that requires 50% of all stake-holders to run a computer program on their computer 24/7? Is that a mathematically feasible expectation? Is this why BCNext said Nxt will collapse if people don't "cooperate"?

These seem like really reasonable questions to me that I'd think anyone who is trying to get people to invest money in something would be happy to answer. Here it's all  evasiveness and name-calling. It's really fishy.

[Sebastien256]

Nxt Indirect Mining doesn't involve forging.

The basic steps are:

1) Use mining hardware to mine PumpDumpcoin
2) Sell PumpDumpcoin for BTC
3) Use BTC to buy NXT on an exchange

Therefore you are mining and indirectly getting NXT  

yeah, mining Nxt is nice. I see the Nxt mining as a transition from 1.0 crypto to 2.0 crypto. Eventually, mining Nxt will not be profitable, but, right now it is good, because Nxt is really undervalued.

@BrianNowhere: man, how much free time you have in your life at the moment. Recently, I almost only see post from you in this thread.  

[Daedelus]

It depends on how much currency they control.  NXT is currently susceptible to 51% currency attacks because TF isn't fully implemented yet.  If someone is able to control 51% of the currency currently forging, they can attack NXT.

I told you this yesterday.

I request you send the 200 NXT to harmony666 please 

[ShroomsKit_Disgrace]

Btw, how could harmony666 attack the Net? It was something like to prevent some accounts from forging isnt it? Is that issue solved? Why did he come almost as a terrorist and later he was so "friendly"? 

[Eadeqa]

Btw, how could harmony666 attack the Net? It was something like to prevent some accounts from forging isnt it? Is that issue solved? Why did he come almost as a terrorist and later he was so "friendly"?  

It was accident. He tried stealing money from BTER by using this attack

https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,3884.0.html

but didn't succeed, but the attack crashed some forgers which was not his original plan. The original plan was to steal money from BTER account.

[mikesbmw]

You were given the answer many times in this thread.  Look it up yourself. There is no definite percentage as accounts will continue to grow. All we need that at least some big holders (more than 300K nxt)  forge, as they get to forge almost all blocks anyway, they need to be honest with no shenanigans, and provide enough bandwidth. Since they have big investment, it's in their self interest to do that.

Nxt survives just by that.

As I said, I'll send you 150 Nxt to show me anywhere besides the two posts above and the one from James from yesterday
where someone answered the question directly to me with an actual non-vague and/or dismissive answer. But as usual asking a valid technical question is trolling. I will be logging off permanently soon but had to respond to the FUD you threw out about me. (When people stop talking shit about me I'll stop coming here.) Despite what you've said about me, the only thing i've been told repeatedly is that I'm pest for asking too many questions (yet emule is being courted over to nxtforum.org)

Self-Interest is also Bitcoin's defense regarding 51% attacks, yet the pooling phenomenon has made this argument more specious.
A malicious agent could pose as a benevolent pool and accumulate enough mining power to take Bitcoin down. Likely? not really. Posible?
Definitely.

If i'm a huge business do I want to invest building all or part of my infrastructure around a technology that requires 50% of all stake-holders to run a computer program on their computer 24/7? Is that a mathematically feasible expectation? Is this why BCNext said Nxt will collapse if people don't "cooperate"?

These seem like really reasonable questions to me that I'd think anyone who is trying to get people to invest money in something would be happy to answer. Here it's all  evasiveness and name-calling. It's really fishy.

Guys, now I want to now as well.

Could someone give ME an answer then? Or do I have to go through the whole thread as well?
Is there a percentage? Is it a fixed number of users with a minimum about of NXT?

[Eadeqa]

Self-Interest is also Bitcoin's defense regarding 51% attacks, yet the pooling phenomenon has made this argument more specious.
A malicious agent could pose as a benevolent pool and accumulate enough mining power to take Bitcoin down. Likely? not really. Posible?
Definitely.

We don't have pools, but even if we do, we have like 150 people with over 1 million nxt? As long as some of them are forging, no pool is going to forge 10 blocks in a row anytime soon

 

[Eadeqa]

Could someone give ME an answer then? Or do I have to go through the whole thread as well?
Is there a percentage? Is it a fixed number of users with a minimum about of NXT?

There is no percentage or fixed number or definite answer. I don't believe Brian with 12K nxt ever forger a block (correct me if I am wrong). Most blocks are forged by big holders and it's in their self interest to run nodes and forge, as they have big investment in the system.

[BrianNowhere]

It depends on how much currency they control.  NXT is currently susceptible to 51% currency attacks because TF isn't fully implemented yet.  If someone is able to control 51% of the currency currently forging, they can attack NXT.

I told you this yesterday.

I request you send the 200 NXT to harmony666 please  

I ruled out yesterday in the original offer.

150 Nxt goes to the person who can show conclusively that I have been "told this repeatedly", before yesterday, when James finally answered me with a somewhat definitive answer (that still has no mathematical proof), here in these threads or anywhere else.
You get 200 Nxt if you can show C-F-B directly answering me regarding the above question.

[BrianNowhere]

I don't believe Brian with 12K nxt ever forger a block (correct me if I am wrong).

My account number is below. I ran an open client 24/7 from the day I opened it,  had over 23K a large part of that time and never forged a single block.

[Eadeqa]

I don't believe Brian with 12K nxt ever forger a block (correct me if I am wrong).

My account number is below. I ran an open client 24/7 from the day I opened it,  had over 23K a large part of that time and never forged a single block.

Great.  Doesn't that answer your own question? Not everyone with small amount of nxt is needed as they can't forge anyway.

[instacalm]

I don't believe Brian with 12K nxt ever forger a block (correct me if I am wrong).

My account number is below. I ran an open client 24/7 from the day I opened it,  had over 23K a large part of that time and never forged a single block.

Great.  Doesn't that answer your own question? Not everyone with small amount of nxt is needed as they can't forge anyway.

The frustration of being unable to forge blocks is justified  (and if one actually does forge, it's peanuts). Not only users with a 23k stake dislike this, 100k/200k/300k's do too. I've heard it countless times. I have about 100k NXT and I do not bother forging to earn more Nxt, I only bother forging for the network itself. Without incentive though, I am not the only one who believes this to be a key issue of the network.  Yes yes, I know, nodecoin is supposed to solve this issue, yet that's kind of a workaround.

Reality is that forging is not profitable at all. The problem is that people misunderstand Nxt's forging model as an actual alternative to "mining". Why? Because it was partially marketed this way: I remember this video comparing heavy mining machines in Iceland with a guy on a boat forging Nxt with his phone.

[BrianNowhere]

We don't have pools, but even if we do, we have like 150 people with over 1 million nxt? As long as some of them are forging, no pool is going to forge 10 blocks in a row anytime soon  

150 ppl holding 150 Million is not half of a 1 billion. You need 351 more millionaires to protect the network.
can there never be pools with Nxt? Everything that's going on today is not what will be going on tomorrow.

[Eadeqa]

We don't have pools, but even if we do, we have like 150 people with over 1 million nxt? As long as some of them are forging, no pool is going to forge 10 blocks in a row anytime soon  

150 ppl holding 150 Million is not half of a 1 billion. You need 351 more millionaires to protect the network.
can there never be pools with Nxt? Everything that's going on today is not what will be going on tomorrow.

Why? The rest of billion nxt would be distributed among so many different users, they will never be able to coordinate together to launch a double spending attack (even if individually all are dishonest).

[BrianNowhere]

Reality is that forging is not profitable at all. The problem about the forging model is that people misunderstand it as an actual alternative to "mining".

The problem is also that if 50% of all stake is not "forging" (running open client), the network will be vulnerable to attack. If Nxt becomes too widely distributed it becomes a big problem. The network is self incentivized to stay more centralized with a cadre of very large stakeholders who will protect the network. Meanwhile these large stakeholders will get all the forging rewards.

Nxt should just come out and say don't bother forging unless you have 100K Nxt. The big shareholders will protect you.
That's not what the marketing says.