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chanc3r
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February 08, 2014, 12:53:35 AM |
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ind ourself that the POSSIBILITY of 1000TPS brings us to 1000TPS in a few years. If we now state "not possible", we lose one feature.
1000TPS will not even touch the sides in a few years, if NXT manages to get it right. <SNIP> So I would plan for far higher than 1000tps, solve the accompanying block chain problem and make sure you can do instant transactions, unless you just want to nibble around the crumbs that VISA / Mastercard will drop - both of whom have bough e-money platform companies... Sorry - one thing I forgot... If you assume several billion people on the planet will continue to use text phones for the forceable future (years) then these e-moneyplatforms will stay. This does to stop the spread of crypto the processing of FIAT and E-money is expensive so I can see an evolution where these platforms swap their e-money wallets for crypto wallets and become a kind of equivalent to block chain.info for people with only text phones to access/store a digital currency from a text phone. There will probably be a period where these platforms will provide both types of wallet and it will be interesting to see where this goes. |
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^[GS]^
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February 08, 2014, 12:55:00 AM |
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Updates - 07/02/2014 - Shows multiple balances. - Shows node status (Green = ON, Blue = OFF) Now effective balance 136'722.00 NXT!!!NXTCoin first automated forging platform! Website: http://www.nxtio.org/ |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:01:00 AM |
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I can't recall keywords now, but AFAIK there is a way to validate encrypted transactions. U don't see who paid whom but u r able to check that coins r not created out of thin air. Such encrypted transactions require that at some step u reveal data of a particular transaction. Also u can't use multiplication of numbers (only 1 time is possible IIRC). Maybe it could be used for anonymization too? No need to "mix" coins, the goal is just to break the links between accounts.
crosschain transactions and zeroknowledge payments A lot of really cool tech functions revolve around very similar concepts. As soon as we solve how to implement any of these related projects, I feel that we will quickly solve the rest No, that approach doesn't use Xchain transactions nor 0-knowledge. You looked at https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Zero_Knowledge_Contingent_Payment ? |
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DrearyUrbanite
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February 08, 2014, 01:01:35 AM |
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rofl. i completely missed that thread where i was mentioned like a dozen times
U should monetize ur reputation. If u were a fiat gateway operator for Asset Exchange, u would help the community a lot. I would accept dollars issued by u without any doubt. Think of such a business plz... Anybody that runs a fiat gateway in USA will be regulated until they stop it. We need somebody who is outside of US jurisdiction and willing to never enter USA, preferably from a country without extradition treaty. I doubt they will go so far as to extradite someone over running a fiat gateway, but you never know... Maybe in a country like Ecuador that uses US $ as their national currency - just a thought. |
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nakaone
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February 08, 2014, 01:02:43 AM |
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ind ourself that the POSSIBILITY of 1000TPS brings us to 1000TPS in a few years. If we now state "not possible", we lose one feature.
1000TPS will not even touch the sides in a few years, if NXT manages to get it right. <SNIP> So I would plan for far higher than 1000tps, solve the accompanying block chain problem and make sure you can do instant transactions, unless you just want to nibble around the crumbs that VISA / Mastercard will drop - both of whom have bough e-money platform companies... Sorry - one thing I forgot... If you assume several billion people on the planet will continue to use text phones for the forceable future (years) then these e-moneyplatforms will stay. This does to stop the spread of crypto the processing of FIAT and E-money is expensive so I can see an evolution where these platforms swap their e-money wallets for crypto wallets and become a kind of equivalent to block chain.info for people with only text phones to access/store a digital currency from a text phone. There will probably be a period where these platforms will provide both types of wallet and it will be interesting to see where this goes. can u tell about transaction costs of these payment solutions |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:03:47 AM |
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rofl. i completely missed that thread where i was mentioned like a dozen times
U should monetize ur reputation. If u were a fiat gateway operator for Asset Exchange, u would help the community a lot. I would accept dollars issued by u without any doubt. Think of such a business plz... Anybody that runs a fiat gateway in USA will be regulated until they stop it. We need somebody who is outside of US jurisdiction and willing to never enter USA, preferably from a country without extradition treaty. I doubt they will go so far as to extradite someone over running a fiat gateway, but you never know... Maybe in a country like Ecuador that uses US $ as their national currency - just a thought. No extradition? I was planning on going to Ecuador next! James |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:09:55 AM |
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Using blockchain FIFO, we should only be bandwidth limited. Have not heard any objections to using FIFO for blockchain. That solves the giant HDD usage. binary format and adaptive max TPS will allow support of 1000TPS bursts with 100kbps.
this means in Belarus, bursts of 10000 TPS will not be a problem
James
P.S. Still waiting for feedback on blockchain FIFO, not sure why nobody does this.
Just checked back for the previous post and this FIFO idea makes sense to me anyway. The high volume transaction systems I am talking about achieve this by DB partitioning - i.e. they keep the transactions they care about or are live in one partition and shove all the others elsewhere - this helps keep the processing speed high. These systems can be viewed as centralised because typically multiple processing nodes are localised to a single database(block chain?) but in practice the transaction processors are all async and running in parallel sharing the DB(block chain) copy, the NXT equivalent is all transaction processors or forgers need a copy of the DB or block chain - its been highlighted in a number of posts this is not scaleable and needs fixing so FIFO or something like it to move block chain history off the transaction processors (forgers) will help. No need for any centralization using blockchain FIFO. It just might take a while to reparse so many gigabytes of blockchain from genesis, so every weekly checkpoints would help immensely. Each node should be able to process at full speed, even with NXT VM (turing complete scripts), since we can match the fees for NXT VM to use less than 50% CPU while it is waiting for bandwidth. My guess is NXT core is currently using small percentage of CPU, maybe even less than 5% on average? As soon as a node is caught up to current block, then all it needs is enough bandwidth to stay caught up. 100kbps is my estimate for peak 1000TPS and 250TPS sustained capability. James |
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chanc3r
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February 08, 2014, 01:10:31 AM |
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can u tell about transaction costs of these payment solutions
I can't tell you exactly but what I can tell you one solution is somewhere less than one cent per transaction. Lots of the small ones are more expensive than this - depends on how well you invest. |
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allwelder
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February 08, 2014, 01:12:56 AM |
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I would say we finish this and implement the 0.1 NXT fee. we should continue to vote. I think Nxt transaction fee is too little,we may need increase fee to let the nodes be willing to run for fees. |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:20:47 AM |
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I would say we finish this and implement the 0.1 NXT fee. we should continue to vote. I think Nxt transaction fee is too little,we may need increase fee to let the nodes be willing to run for fees. Sometimes, less is more. With NXT being able to be used for more than payments, we need to make sure we are not pricing the usage too high. We could very well end up with higher forging per block with a lower minimum fee! Basically, 99% taxation appears to get a much higher tax revenue than 10% taxation. however, the higher rate kills any economy while the lower rate could easily generate more than 10 times the revenues. James |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:24:29 AM |
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Any fatal flaws with blockchain FIFO? Any serious ones? If not, the question goes to jean-luc as far as practicality of having blockchain FIFO size specifiable in web.xml. Just set it to big enough number and all nodes will be using a FIFO, just of different sizes to match their HDD space budget.
James
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btc2nxt
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February 08, 2014, 01:27:33 AM |
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Everyone feel free to donate to my account to help fund something not yet seen in the world of Nxt that will help people get in touch with ease.
Yes, I am pretty much a stranger here.
Yes, I am quite serious.
In the unlikely event that nothing useful (product launch) will come out of this until February 28, I'll send any donation back to the donor, minus transaction fee matching the fee paid in the originating transaction.
Thank you for listening and keep up all the great efforts!
Well, a little disappointing that the interest seems to be close to none. I guess that's my own fault, though. If you are curious what I want to do and why donating makes sense:I want to create a person-to-person exchange for NXT, similar to the functionality of LocalBitcoins.com, providing a secure and easy way to trade NXT (for fiat). In case you have any wishes or suggestions on how you would want to use it and what to expect from such a service, please let me know. Also, I remember there being at least one bounty offered for accomplishing this task. Are these offers still valid? Of course the idea itself is interesting enough to invest effort and time, yet neither infrastructure is for free nor do my living expenses pay for themselves once I go full time on this project. +1 |
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allwelder
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February 08, 2014, 01:47:27 AM |
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Nxt funding should reward nxt-e.com if it run normally,whether whoever is the owner. It provide another platform of exchange Nxt,and this is good for Nxt liquidity. |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:49:56 AM |
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Maybe being cutoff from Internet is not so bad after all.
Came up with blockchain FIFO and NXT plugins (both hardcoded and external) and I am getting close to understanding how AE can work with automatic gateways, in fact, that was that specific problem that was generalized into NXT plugins.
I can't see jean-luc agreeing to add Java implementation of bitcoind (does it exist?) into NXT core. If we can hardcode the bitcoind into the NXTcore, then we get verifiable bitcoind ability added to what NXT can do. I know, horrible security issues could arise. However, now that Dr. Evil/Jesse James is here, I am hopeful that we can create an architecture that Evil Bob can't take advantage of.
There are all these trustless escrow algos, zeroknowledge, etc. that say they can do some pretty powerful things. I just wish I was smart enough to figure out how to combine them to create a decentralized gateway for other cryptos. For NXT, I can see that we can send NXT to a special address and the network can credit us with the appropriate NXTcash (or other goodie), then on redemption, the special address converts to NXT. The problem with other crypto is that while everyone can publicly verify that address XYZ deposited BTC to gateway account, how to do a cryptographically safe withdrawal from a single acct stumps me...
One klunky way would be to have N accounts of 0.1 BTC each and limit withdrawals to that resolution. Then using the multisig secret sharing approach I am pretty sure would allow cashing out of the right number of 0.1 BTC accts to fulfill the withdrawal request. The problem is that 10 BTC withdrawal would get hit with .01 BTC fees, but maybe its not so bad?
I am pushing for several different tech initiatives:
NXTcash (zerocoin/zerocash added to NXT)
NXT layers (VM, language + tool set, DAC components)
NXT plugins (solve trusting external code using RT hash of plugin code space?)
NXT automated gateway DAC
NXT crosschain trading of other cryptos
I have called for help in defining the layers, but so far CfB is the only one that posted about VM layer. The above list is my attempt at making the abstract "we need NXT layers defined" into more concrete definitions. I want to anchor super useful functionality (NXTcash, crosschain, gateway DAC) and make sure whatever low level VM we end up with and all layers in between actually helps implement the reference higher level projects.
A simple proof of concept NXTplugin that I hope jean-luc will build into NXTcore would be a NXTsmtp. I think it is pretty simple to generate email from AM contents with some sort of flag to trigger actually sending out the email. If email is encrypted so issuing accts public key can decrypt the contents, then private emails can be sent using decentralized network. I think that is pretty cool even if NXT isn't the first method to be able to do that. Confirmation that email has been sent can be added to blockchain with hash of email content/recipient. Of course, anybody can decrypt the content using public key, but at least the email is not sent in plaintext over Internet.
I am 100% sure I have messed up on details in the above, please use this as starting point to get actual solution. I am sure I have not dealt with any error handling, but using TF we can know what node will attempt to send email, so we know when to check for email sending errors and all nodes can therefore have deterministic way of processing all emails.
If anybody has any really cool high level functionality, just post it. Dont worry if you have no idea how it can be done, I usually dont at first either. All we need is one person to come up with a way to implement part of the cool idea. Then others follow and before you know it, it will end up on the NXT projects list with funding, devs and projected release dates.
James
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gs02xzz
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February 08, 2014, 01:52:45 AM |
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I would say we finish this and implement the 0.1 NXT fee. we should continue to vote. I think Nxt transaction fee is too little,we may need increase fee to let the nodes be willing to run for fees. Sometimes, less is more. With NXT being able to be used for more than payments, we need to make sure we are not pricing the usage too high. We could very well end up with higher forging per block with a lower minimum fee! Basically, 99% taxation appears to get a much higher tax revenue than 10% taxation. however, the higher rate kills any economy while the lower rate could easily generate more than 10 times the revenues. James 0.1 |
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jl777
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February 08, 2014, 01:52:59 AM |
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Nxt funding should reward nxt-e.com,whether whoever is the owner. It provide another platform of exchange Nxt,and this is good for Nxt liquidity. Sorry, but I am concentrating on things that haven't been done yet, especially the things that are supposed to be impossible, but are in fact just really difficult. If you run an exchange, there is ~10BTC bounty for adding XCP: https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,61.0.htmlDescription: The Counterparty Team is now hosting a bounty for the creation of a centralized exchange, supporting XCP and BTC, or adding XCP and BTC support to an existing centralized exchange. The bounty funds will be distributed based on a consensus of PhantomPhreak, xnova, and myself. The Counterparty Team will start the bounty funds with a donation of 4.5 BTC and 1500 XCP to the donation address. The bounty will be paid on February 25. That's pretty good money for adding a single new crypto. I hope all the guys with centralized exchanges for NXT will take the day or two needed to add XCP support. James |
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allwelder
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February 08, 2014, 02:01:31 AM |
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Nxt funding should reward nxt-e.com,whether whoever is the owner. It provide another platform of exchange Nxt,and this is good for Nxt liquidity. Sorry, but I am concentrating on things that haven't been done yet, especially the things that are supposed to be impossible, but are in fact just really difficult. If you run an exchange, there is ~10BTC bounty for adding XCP: https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,61.0.htmlDescription: The Counterparty Team is now hosting a bounty for the creation of a centralized exchange, supporting XCP and BTC, or adding XCP and BTC support to an existing centralized exchange. The bounty funds will be distributed based on a consensus of PhantomPhreak, xnova, and myself. The Counterparty Team will start the bounty funds with a donation of 4.5 BTC and 1500 XCP to the donation address. The bounty will be paid on February 25. That's pretty good money for adding a single new crypto. I hope all the guys with centralized exchanges for NXT will take the day or two needed to add XCP support. James yes,the precondition of reward is that the web platform run normally. |
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swartzfeger
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February 08, 2014, 02:21:09 AM |
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James, have you read up on CoinJoin, CoinWitness or Bitprivacy?
I'd post links but here at work on my phone it's tough.
Check out those three and their respective threads, there might be something relevant there (iirc all are short 2 page threads).
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xyzzyx
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I don't really come from outer space.
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February 08, 2014, 02:31:55 AM |
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Maybe we could create an asset organisation in some exotic liberal country? Would you pay me for living in Seychelles or in Panama?  If one were truly committed to creating a NXT/Fiat gateway... the best way to go would be through a Belize International Business Company (IBC) that is owned by a Belize Trust. Here is how you do it: a. You create the Belize Trust (Trustees, Beneficiaries, etc.) b. The Trust incorporates the IBC; thus the Trust is the owner of the IBC and not the beneficiaries of the Trust. c. IBC creates a business presence online (website, NXT Asset Exchange gateway, etc.) d. All bank, merchant, exchange, etc. accounts are opened by the IBC. e. Belize bank account is in $. f. The physical address associated with all accounts is the corporate address of the IBC. g) There is NO TAX for income earned from IBCs outside Belize.You are looking at $1500-2000 to set this up and around $1000 yearly expenses to renew the Belize contracts. And YES... it is all COMPLETELY LEGAL!!!  BUMP |
"An awful lot of code is being written ... in languages that aren't very good by people who don't know what they're doing." -- Barbara Liskov
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mcjavar
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February 08, 2014, 02:36:03 AM |
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Maybe we could create an asset organisation in some exotic liberal country? Would you pay me for living in Seychelles or in Panama? If one were truly committed to creating a NXT/Fiat gateway... the best way to go would be through a Belize International Business Company (IBC) that is owned by a Belize Trust. Here is how you do it: a. You create the Belize Trust (Trustees, Beneficiaries, etc.) b. The Trust incorporates the IBC; thus the Trust is the owner of the IBC and not the beneficiaries of the Trust. c. IBC creates a business presence online (website, NXT Asset Exchange gateway, etc.) d. All bank, merchant, exchange, etc. accounts are opened by the IBC. e. Belize bank account is in $. f. The physical address associated with all accounts is the corporate address of the IBC. g) There is NO TAX for income earned from IBCs outside Belize.You are looking at $1500-2000 to set this up and around $1000 yearly expenses to renew the Belize contracts. And YES... it is all COMPLETELY LEGAL!!! BUMP Still looking for someone to do this with. PM me if interested! |
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