NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[lurning]

Hey

building upon the Songs of Love fund raising I thought it was a good idea, to contact Humble Bundle. I love what they do for charity and for gamers at the same time and think that accepting something like NXT could be a huge benefit for both them and us. Let's see if they are interested

Hey guys,

first of all thanks for your great work. I barely missed any Humble Bundle so far and can’t say how much I appreciate what you are doing for charity AND for gamers!

Currently I am observing a new cryptocurrency. Its name is „NXT“ and it is supposed to be much more than a currency. It has an awesome community, which is mainly active in this forum thread. At the moment they are working on a decentralized asset exchange. But even decentralized crowd funding has been thought of already.

As a matter of promoting the usage of NXT and doing something for charity, the community has started to support Song of Love already.

However, if Humble Bundle would start accepting NXT for fund raising this could greatly increase donations AND promote an innovative cryptocurrency. By the way: NXT’s main advantage over Bitcoin is, that it is not wasting energy as bitcoin and its mining concept do.

If this could be something for you, just step into the forementioned forum thread. I bet the community will be more than willing to give you any support needed to implement NXT 

Again: Thanks for your great work. Keep it up!

-   Jan

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[swartzfeger]

Has anyone tested James' DOGE gateway yet?

[BloodyRookie]

Interesting, I could see many coins being built with this model in mind, a coin that provides a service, paid for in Nxt, and mined to keep the network strong.

Please note that just "running a node" is not the same as "forging" in terms of "protecting the network".

Although it can help with things like DDoS and for those that are blocked from accessing IP addresses the most important work is that done by "forging nodes" as only those nodes are "confirming transactions".

I don't think that this is a correct description of the relationship between nodes and forgers.
A forgers veryfies transactions and puts all new and valid transactions into his forged block. He then sends broadcasts the block.
Every node is verifying the new block and therefore is verifying all transactions in that block too.
Therefore I think nodes are very important to protect the network.

[ChuckOne]

Do you mean they should be prevented from forging for 1440 blocks every time their node goes offline?

I think you still confuse nodes and accounts.

I should have said "account" not "node".

Nodes can be offline.

Accounts cannot forge.

Offline nodes do not offer/receive blocks and transactions to/from peers.

Not-forging accounts do not contribute to finding consensus on what transaction to be verified AKA how much an account has.

The penalty ONLY matters for large accounts that often forges. Because, these accounts are penalized ONLY when TF said they should have forged. So, if your account forges once in a week, you have a very very small risk in shutting down your node for a while.

[2Kool4Skewl]

If it is the accounts turn to forge and it isn't forging, then yes, something like that?

I'm no dev. I just want this discussion to be more than just a gut feeling thing.

Then preventing an account from forging for 1440 blocks if it goes offline isn't terrible, but this doesn't reward anyone for running a node.

[bitcoinpaul]

That's why we need a nice, detailed discussion here.

I think somebody wrote this before: We need to talk about incentives for running a node and incentives for forging.

[redsn0w]

I guess i am missing something, trying to start 0.8.1e on windows, creating a bat file with the following line :

java -jar nxt.jar

the cmd just open and disappear and i can't find any log, anyone has workaround for this ?

Thanks.

Try with this code :

Code:

java -Xmx1024M -cp nxt.jar;lib\*;conf nxt.Nxt 

[2Kool4Skewl]

NXT users should be rewarded for forging or running a node.  How about after fractional amounts are implemented, we split the transaction rewards 50/50 between the account forging and the NXT nodes that are hallmarked.  Every time a block is found, half of the transaction fees are credited evenly to the hallmarked nodes.

Let's say 1000 hallmarked nodes are on the network.  A block is found that has 10 NXT transaction fee.  The forging account gets 5 NXT.  The other 5 NXT gets divided up and distributed to the 1000 accounts running on hallmarked nodes.  Each node's hallmarked account would get 5/1000 = 0.005 NXT.  The 0.005 NXT would not be broadcast as a transaction, but simply credited to the account.

This would allow smaller accounts to provide a service for NXT, running a node, and get rewarded consistently at the same time.

I do not think accounts should be penalized for not forging.  NXT should reward people and not penalize them.

Assuming the NXT network is at 10% utilization, each block will have 25.6 NXT transaction fees.  ( 256 tx per block * 1 NXT tx fee * 10% = 25.6 NXT)  Half of this, 12.8 NXT, gets rewarded to the hallmarked nodes' accounts supporting the network.  At one block per minute, 18432 NXT will be distributed to all hallmarked node accounts per day assuming 10% network utilization.  If there are 1000 hallmarked nodes on the network, each node will earn 18.432 NXT per day and 6727.68 NXT per year.

As more transactions are issued on the network, more hallmarked nodes will come on-line to partake in earning the node reward.

The only potential issue I can see with my idea is making sure at the time of block creation all hallmarked accounts are seen.  This has to do with network topology.

[BrianNowhere]

I do not think accounts should be penalized for not forging.  NXT should reward people and not penalize them.

I think this discussion needs to be way more technical and detailed than just a "penalizing is bad, doesn't sound good" or something like that.

Agree.

There's more to life than just the technical side of things. Perception is an important of attracting users and I think 2Kool was stating that penalizing these users is bad for perception and possibly bad towards adoption.

If I'm Joe Crypto deciding whether I prefer Nxt, Ripple, Peercoin, Emunie or Novacoin, am I going to choose the currency/network that penalizes me for things I might not be able to control, like computer issues and power outages?

[jl777]

Would there be any proof of stake in your coin? What happens when the coin is mined to capacity? To me the whole issue with people who mine is that they only mine for the coins. What will happen when there are no coins left to mine? They will move on to the next coin. The whole thing about the mining logic is that they are not in it for the network (which I can understand). To me it seems that POW is not the best answer in the long term. A mined coin may get a lot of initial support but in the long run, POW is not going to compete with POS..... especially when the asset exchange allows people who don't know how to write program to create there own coins. I think for a coin to be long term successful POS or some form of rewarding has to be used to keep people using running the network once the coins are mined out. I like your idea though.

I am currently planning for the NXTcoins platform Asset to have about a 10% stake in mining output. Unlike all other presale, premine,etc., it will start with 0 coins. However, as the miners are mining the coins, the platform company will get its share. These funds will be used to pay for whatever servers the platform requires, but most importantly marketing costs.

As far as the duration of mining
1 billion issued
100,000 minedper day
10800 days = 30 years

Maybe it should be 250,000 coins per day? I really dont like the exponentially decaying output that almost all the coins have. It shouldnt be constant, but close to it. Actually, why cant it be constant. That would make it easy to code
The early adopters get a big advantage as when the first dividend comes in, they will be the ones with the biggest percentage of the coin. I am still not decided on the coin mining rate, but since the number of coins is totally independent from network security, it can be any method at all. I could build in a lottery system. Miners could get extra on their birthdays, etc.

As the network gets bigger, its value increases and as long as the marketing arm of the coin is doing its job, it will be able to bring in more revenues. Which boosts the coin value, which increases the number of miners, which increases its value.

Nice little positive feedback loop going on. I will probably only do a few coins to show an example of how it can be done and assuming the business coin does well, it will be very easy for new coins to be created to plug into the NXTcoins layer. By providing marketing and technical support for the NXTcoins, it allows someone that is totally technical to concentrate on what makes their coin unique and not have to get bogged down in the day to day details of marketing and customer support.

This also means that the NXTcoins platform company will need to hire non-programmers to help with the customer support and other non-technical tasks. The 10% of the NXTcoins and the dividends in NXT those NXTcoins get should provide enough budget to pay for whatever staff is needed. As the enterprise grows, more funds come in to pay for the costs.

James

P.S. I am looking for people to help me with my business coin. I think I can do most all the tech myself as all the hard work is already done with NXT. I just dont have the skills to do a decent website, nor the time to market this.

good idea.
I can help to promote them in Chinese forumwww.nxts.info and Nxt websiteswww.nxt123.info if needed.

Thanks! I just got the domains NXTcoins.biz and NXTcoins.co
I think they are nice names for promoting the NXTcoin development kit. NXTcoins sites are for people who want to make their own coin.

I also have CPUcoins.info and GPUcoins.info for the different type of miners, so depending on what type of mining gear they have, they can go to the .info site to find NXTcoins to mine.

[cc001]

could anybody send some testNXT to 14982679201235752929 please? thanks

I've send you 1KTestNxt 

received, thx

[bitcoinpaul]

And the most important feature:
The network can detect which miners don't take part in block generation and act accordingly.

CIYAM's opinion yesterday on this was something like "only penalize bigger accounts".

[BrianNowhere]

That's why we need a nice, detailed discussion here.

I think somebody wrote this before: We need to talk about incentives for running a node and incentives for forging.

can we get some clear definitions on these terms? (sorry if I missed this happening elsewhere)


1. Forging = Running an open client that contains some Nxt in it.

2. Running a Node = ?? Is this Hallmarking?

[^[GS]^]

If you enable SSL, you need to set nxt.keyStorePath and nxt.keyStorePassword, and obviously you need to have your own SSL certificate (self-signed or signed by a CA) in a keystore file.

How i can make a self-signed certificate? Some guide step to step?

[jl777]

When is the decentralized exchange coming? I don't mean the asset exchange, I mean decentralized which allows Nxt to BTC directly, and hopefully eventually fiat though I don't know if I see that being easily implemented for a long time to come.

In the wake of this Mt. Gox catastrophy.. seems like it might be very nice to be able to say that you can directly buy coins from within the client and don't need to trust any exchanges or anyone else to hold onto them for you.

The other idea to throw out there is something like this decentralized insurance idea:
https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,4186.0.html

I think the decentralized exchange should be enough though.

Totally off-topic for this: Totally agree users should be rewarded for running a node, it doesn't need to be a whole lot but it needs to be worth their while.  You may still get volunteers otherwise but you want people to thing off forging as cool and something that helps draw people to this amazing coin, that is so much more than just a coin.

Combine the automated multisig gateway and AE and we have a decentralized exchange!
That is why I have been working so hard to get a release out. Depositing is very close to atomic exchange. For withdrawals, the 2 of 3 multisig requires all withdrawals to be verified and even though everybody can see the funds are in the account, nobody is able to withdraw it by themselves.

James

[longzai1988]

Try with this code :

Code:

java -Xmx1024M -cp nxt.jar;lib\*;conf nxt.Nxt 

TYVM  

[jl777]

It's impossible to do "decentralized" fiat exchanged. Fiat is not crypto currency, so I don't see how it can ever be possible to have decentralized fiat withot trusted gateway.

Indeed I wouldn't be holding my breath waiting for fiat but I think you'll find that crypto to crypto will be operating on Nxt within a few months.

weeks

[ChuckOne]

That's why we need a nice, detailed discussion here.

I think somebody wrote this before: We need to talk about incentives for running a node and incentives for forging.

can we get some clear definitions on these terms? (sorry if I missed this happening elsewhere)


1. Forging = Running an open client that contains some Nxt in it.

2. Running a Node = ?? Is this Hallmarking?

1) Forging is done by a node that have the private keys of at least one account that is due to forge. <<< is that understandable?
2) Running a node is running a node. Performing necessary computations for:
 - answering peer requests
 - storing and redistributing the blocks and transactions

[TM]

By the way: NXT’s main advantage over Bitcoin is, that it is not wasting energy as bitcoin and its mining concept do.

If this does got out to Humble Bundle I think there should be more of an incentive for mining/foraging (joining NXT) than its "not wasting energy" and "green".  This should be one element on the NXT platform were pushing not the primary one I'm hoping/assuming.

[jl777]

Interesting, I could see many coins being built with this model in mind, a coin that provides a service, paid for in Nxt, and mined to keep the network strong.

Please note that just "running a node" is not the same as "forging" in terms of "protecting the network".

Although it can help with things like DDoS and for those that are blocked from accessing IP addresses the most important work is that done by "forging nodes" as only those nodes are "confirming transactions".

I am confused again. I thought that all you had to do to forge was to have your account unlocked. Also, in order to make API calls that you have to have your account unlocked. If this is not the case, I will just make it so that forging is enabled by default when you are "mining" NXTcoins.

Wouldnt that be "protecting the network"?

James

If you have your node running, but don't have any NXT, you are not securing the blockchain.

This is why the NXTcoins will payout dividends in NXT. for a signing bonus, I will probably just seed every miner with 1 NXT