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Author Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information  (Read 2756163 times)
Daedelus
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March 13, 2014, 03:09:59 PM
 #43921


BCNext intended it not to be a coin to be used as currency (I think it is in the first or second part of his essay, rather than in his post history).

But you can't control how people will use it. So, sell it to them as a coin if you want, no one can stop you.

But the chances are, a better coin will be built of top of Nxt (to suit your needed use or world view of the creator). I doubt the value of the Nxts will be derived by its use as a currency in the future, more from how important it is in supporting more useful services.

I have a lot of respect for BCNext getting the ball rolling but HE HAS BAILED OUT OF THIS AIRPLANE THROUGH THE COCKPIT WINDOW.  What his intentions were about not using NXT as a coin are now IRRELEVANT.  And if we build a new coin into the NXT blockchain to be our primary unit of value as a coin (nodecoin?) then I truly believe we are going to kill NXT.  NXT will be just a token used to buy access onto an exchange.  There's money to be made in exchange fees.  There's LOTS more money to be made being an asset.  If we relegate ourselves to being an exchange fee token instead of a cryptocurrency asset, we are in big trouble.

The black and white, all or nothing arguements are tiring.

What is to stop those who see Nxt as a currency promoting it and trying to get it used in such as way?

And can we stop another nodecoin if James agrees to stop? If not, Nxt is doomed in your scenario so we should all sell up. I don't agree with this analysis so I won't support RickyJ on this issues. Others will and then help out and this is ALL FINE!

We can disagree and still progress in parallel, without falling out. Nxt as a platform has vastly more profit potential than as a currency in my opinion so I am happy to not argue against BCNext's original plan.

Others disagree so lets all enjoy this decentralised wonderland and we all support Nxt in the best way we see fit   Grin
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March 13, 2014, 03:12:53 PM
 #43922

Can i get some testnxt?

8619009819187075604

Thanks in advance!


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March 13, 2014, 03:15:19 PM
 #43923

I don't even think it was supposed to be this big, for all we know this actually might have started as a get rich quick scam by BCNext.

R u sure that u r not Emule?
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March 13, 2014, 03:16:11 PM
 #43924

Recap:
1. What is Nxt? An ecosystem, encompassing all the features already described, to which the "Nxt" token grants access.
2. Will it be used by mainstream users? As a coin: no way. But then again, the same goes for all cryptos that call themselves openly cryptos. As an underlying infrastructure: hell yeah! It has more than enough potential for that.
3. Is this different from what we were told? I don't think so, but in my previous post I have already established that the same facts may lead to wildly divergent conclusions.
4. Am I blind to the tough times we are having and the lack of direction: nope. I just don't think it's an honest assesment of the four months of work and effort we have put in. Being "headless", this is nót unexpected at all.

Agree, I think this is the likely future for Nxt.

I more like Salsacz description - Nxt will the p2p decentralized internet network. There could be hundreds and thoughts of networks like Nxt tunning in the world.

Is the Nxt p2p decentralized internet network.

and nxt coin is p2p coin in fact
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March 13, 2014, 03:22:19 PM
 #43925

Recap:
1. What is Nxt? An ecosystem, encompassing all the features already described, to which the "Nxt" token grants access.
2. Will it be used by mainstream users? As a coin: no way. But then again, the same goes for all cryptos that call themselves openly cryptos. As an underlying infrastructure: hell yeah! It has more than enough potential for that.
3. Is this different from what we were told? I don't think so, but in my previous post I have already established that the same facts may lead to wildly divergent conclusions.
4. Am I blind to the tough times we are having and the lack of direction: nope. I just don't think it's an honest assesment of the four months of work and effort we have put in. Being "headless", this is nót unexpected at all.

Agree, I think this is the likely future for Nxt.

I more like Salsacz description - Nxt will the p2p decentralized internet network. There could be hundreds and thoughts of networks like Nxt tunning in the world.

Is the Nxt p2p decentralized internet network.

and nxt coin is p2p coin in fact

I suggest we call nxt coin p2p coin to not be confused with the nxt platform

Nxt p2p decentralized internet network.
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March 13, 2014, 03:24:11 PM
 #43926

But then you're basically inflating the currency and usurping value from Nxt as it should be the unit used for these purposes, no? These are roles that Nxt would take; doing so with nodecoin reduces Nxt's functions and in turn it's demand/value as opposed to nodecoin adding value on top of the system.

+1. Totally agree and I can tell why it is true.

The value of nodecoins solely come from the running the Nxt nodes (protecting the network) which actually has been run with Nxtcoins, for instance, running nodes have a change to win Nxtcoins as the rewards. Now on top of that the Nxtcoin rewards, nodecoins become the second rewards for that. It is a pure redundant thing to do so. If you want reward more for running Nxt nodes you can simple reward them more Nxtcoins as the transaction fees (in the future, with more business built on Nxt and more transactions running on the Nxt, the nodes/forgings will get much more reward fees event with the reduction of the transaction fee). Nxtcoins' value is from their protecting the Nxt network. The nodecoins' value is also from their protecting the Nxt network. To let nodecoins do so, you actually put nodecoins and Nxtcoins in the same position. The owners of the nodecoins will demand the same treatment/status which the Nxtcoins owners have.  Nodecoins will easily dilute Nxtcoins. We already have Nxtcoins to be used to protect the network and transactions and they are scarce. we don't need another coin to do the same work. We can create some other coins for creative business built on top of Nxt.

 "The owners of the nodecoins will demand the same treatment/status which the Nxtcoins owners have" . However, it is the Nxtcoins owners that set the price of nodecoin, not the inverse (because of NXT fee only). So I don't understand how nodecoin can dilute the value of NXT. Precise your thought please.

EDIT: IF the nodecoins' value is also ONLY come from their protecting the Nxt network. My believe is that eventually, nodecoin value will simply go to zero when a lot of Nxt node will be in place.

If your prediction becomes true then Nxtcoins value will "simply go to zero" as well.
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March 13, 2014, 03:28:11 PM
 #43927

But then you're basically inflating the currency and usurping value from Nxt as it should be the unit used for these purposes, no? These are roles that Nxt would take; doing so with nodecoin reduces Nxt's functions and in turn it's demand/value as opposed to nodecoin adding value on top of the system.

+1. Totally agree and I can tell why it is true.

The value of nodecoins solely come from the running the Nxt nodes (protecting the network) which actually has been run with Nxtcoins, for instance, running nodes have a change to win Nxtcoins as the rewards. Now on top of that the Nxtcoin rewards, nodecoins become the second rewards for that. It is a pure redundant thing to do so. If you want reward more for running Nxt nodes you can simple reward them more Nxtcoins as the transaction fees (in the future, with more business built on Nxt and more transactions running on the Nxt, the nodes/forgings will get much more reward fees event with the reduction of the transaction fee). Nxtcoins' value is from their protecting the Nxt network. The nodecoins' value is also from their protecting the Nxt network. To let nodecoins do so, you actually put nodecoins and Nxtcoins in the same position. The owners of the nodecoins will demand the same treatment/status which the Nxtcoins owners have.  Nodecoins will easily dilute Nxtcoins. We already have Nxtcoins to be used to protect the network and transactions and they are scarce. we don't need another coin to do the same work. We can create some other coins for creative business built on top of Nxt.

 "The owners of the nodecoins will demand the same treatment/status which the Nxtcoins owners have" . However, it is the Nxtcoins owners that set the price of nodecoin, not the inverse (because of NXT fee only). So I don't understand how nodecoin can dilute the value of NXT. Precise your thought please.

EDIT: IF the nodecoins' value is also ONLY come from their protecting the Nxt network. My believe is that eventually, nodecoin value will simply go to zero when a lot of Nxt node will be in place.

If your prediction becomes true then Nxtcoins value will "simply go to zero" as well.

I don't think so, protecting nxt feature is valuable for the people running software on top of nxt.

Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
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March 13, 2014, 03:31:58 PM
 #43928

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Release 0.8.9
...

WIll there be a similar update for the 0.7.x train?  Or it is obsoleted?  The reason I ask is that all of a sudden, with 0.8.x train I get isolated on my own fork very frequently, causing restart of java with old blockchain.  I went to 0.7.7 and problem went away.
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March 13, 2014, 03:39:29 PM
 #43929


I suggest we call nxt coin p2p coin to not be confused with the nxt platform

Nxt p2p decentralized internet network.

I think this idea is bad. Very techy.
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March 13, 2014, 03:43:09 PM
 #43930

Is the testnet down?

Ties are a prison for the soul...
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March 13, 2014, 03:45:26 PM
 #43931

Is the testnet down?

Seems to be re-indexing.
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March 13, 2014, 03:45:42 PM
 #43932

We shouldn't be looking at Nodecoins as a buy and sell commodity.  We should be looking at Nodecoins as a Nxt Utility coin.  For example.  If you want to use the DAC, you have to send 10 Nodecoins to retrieve Doge address, then you can transfer Doge to DAC.  If you want to use NxtCash for Mixing you have to send 10 Nodecoins to retrieve NxtCash address, then send Nxt for mixing....and so on.  We have some really great features that will be built on top of Nxt and we should charge users Nodecoins to use those features.   That will give them value.

But then you're basically inflating the currency and usurping value from Nxt as it should be the unit used for these purposes, no? These are roles that Nxt would take; doing so with nodecoin reduces Nxt's functions and in turn it's demand/value as opposed to nodecoin adding value on top of the system.
I am not sure if there is any usurping going on. Using this logic, if we started trading BTC using NXT AE, then somehow this hurts NXT? I dont think that is what would happen. I think the value of NXT would be proportional to the sum of the values of all of the NXT AE assets plus the current value. So if nodecoins become worth something, then NXT becomes incrementally more valuable.

Also, you are not taking into account the fact that without NXT, there is no nodecoin. This also seems to be what BCNext wanted from what I can remember.

If people deposit $1 billion USD into NXT and we have that much USD assets floating around inside AE, would that suck all the value out of NXT?

If nodecoins became worth $1 USD each, would that suck all the value out of NXT?

James

Trying to catch up on thread but wanted to comment on Nodecoin.  Why not make Nodecoin unlimited, is that possible in AE?  That way if you want to use DAC, NxtCash (or any Nxt service) and you don't have nodecoin, you have to run the client and mine nodecoin.  No one should have to purchase nodecoin from a miner.  
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March 13, 2014, 03:50:24 PM
 #43933

We shouldn't be looking at Nodecoins as a buy and sell commodity.  We should be looking at Nodecoins as a Nxt Utility coin.  For example.  If you want to use the DAC, you have to send 10 Nodecoins to retrieve Doge address, then you can transfer Doge to DAC.  If you want to use NxtCash for Mixing you have to send 10 Nodecoins to retrieve NxtCash address, then send Nxt for mixing....and so on.  We have some really great features that will be built on top of Nxt and we should charge users Nodecoins to use those features.   That will give them value.

But then you're basically inflating the currency and usurping value from Nxt as it should be the unit used for these purposes, no? These are roles that Nxt would take; doing so with nodecoin reduces Nxt's functions and in turn it's demand/value as opposed to nodecoin adding value on top of the system.
I am not sure if there is any usurping going on. Using this logic, if we started trading BTC using NXT AE, then somehow this hurts NXT? I dont think that is what would happen. I think the value of NXT would be proportional to the sum of the values of all of the NXT AE assets plus the current value. So if nodecoins become worth something, then NXT becomes incrementally more valuable.

Also, you are not taking into account the fact that without NXT, there is no nodecoin. This also seems to be what BCNext wanted from what I can remember.

If people deposit $1 billion USD into NXT and we have that much USD assets floating around inside AE, would that suck all the value out of NXT?

If nodecoins became worth $1 USD each, would that suck all the value out of NXT?

James

Trying to catch up on thread but wanted to comment on Nodecoin.  Why not make Nodecoin unlimited, is that possible in AE?  That way if you want to use DAC, NxtCash (or any Nxt service) and you don't have nodecoin, you have to run the client and mine nodecoin.  No one should have to purchase nodecoin from a miner.  

Why nodecoin would be required to use Nxt services? That would kill Nxt, i believe.

Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
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March 13, 2014, 03:50:38 PM
 #43934

They still think NXT is a coin, if I start mentioning asset exchange I can guarantee you they will be completely turned off and not even interested anymore.

They care about NXT as a coin/currency, not another stock market type system.

Why do you care?

Just use an appropriate language to explain it to them. Do not care if it is NXTcoin or just NXT. As you said, they do not care.

E.g you can use: NXT-Exchange for the AE where AE is the technical term.
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March 13, 2014, 03:55:16 PM
 #43935

I don't even think it was supposed to be this big, for all we know this actually might have started as a get rich quick scam by BCNext.

R u sure that u r not Emule?

This is just to clarify, I AM NOT EMULE.

I am someone who had hopes for NXT as the crypto 2.0, but not anymore.

I invested a large amount of fiat into it, I want NXT to be succesful but seeing how this community actually works has turned me off.

What about you? Are you sure you're not BCNext posing under a different surname?

If you'd like heres a little about me:

At 15 I taught myself HTML (yes I can code whole website systems just with notepad), Flash 5 (I'm old), some Python, Java, and even a bit of C++.
I taught myself fine arts and have become a master artist since then.
I have also been an electrician, electronics engineer (not quite good), was majoring in electrical engineering but recently my studies have refocused to Biology, Biotechnology, and Physics.

So no, I am not emule. I am just a well rounded human being that wants the current economic structure to be reset to something that will help all of humanity and not just the chosen few.
NXT seemed like a good idea up until now that the community can't even get together to decide on something as simple as "Is it a coin or an exchange or a potato or a banana?"

Good day
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March 13, 2014, 03:58:40 PM
 #43936

I don't even think it was supposed to be this big, for all we know this actually might have started as a get rich quick scam by BCNext.

R u sure that u r not Emule?

This is just to clarify, I AM NOT EMULE.

I am someone who had hopes for NXT as the crypto 2.0, but not anymore.

I invested a large amount of fiat into it, I want NXT to be succesful but seeing how this community actually works has turned me off.

What about you? Are you sure you're not BCNext posing under a different surname?

If you'd like heres a little about me:

At 15 I taught myself HTML (yes I can code whole website systems just with notepad), Flash 5 (I'm old), some Python, Java, and even a bit of C++.
I taught myself fine arts and have become a master artist since then.
I have also been an electrician, electronics engineer (not quite good), was majoring in electrical engineering but recently my studies have refocused to Biology, Biotechnology, and Physics.

So no, I am not emule. I am just a well rounded human being that wants the current economic structure to be reset to something that will help all of humanity and not just the chosen few.
NXT seemed like a good idea up until now that the community can't even get together to decide on something as simple as "Is it a coin or an exchange or a potato or a banana?"

Good day


Dear LemonAndFries, Nxt is a protocol that everyone can build on top of it. It will become what people works for.

Edit: @CfB, I understand why LemonAndFries is upset. You troll him when the guy is searching for honest answer. Please be kind. You are like the Master over here and it was not kind to make illusion to emule. My sincere opinion. hope you take this comment with a grain of salt.

Nxt official forum at: https://nxtforum.org/
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March 13, 2014, 03:59:25 PM
 #43937

Can i get some testnxt?

8619009819187075604

Thanks in advance!


Sent 15 k TestNxt  , enjoy it Wink .
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March 13, 2014, 04:04:53 PM
 #43938

Don't worry Nxt and I think I support nodecoin.

If it's not James who developed nodecoin, some other will develop it because nodecoin is just developed and based on Nxt according to Nxt rule. I got more than 500 nodecoins during the past 24 hours though I don't fully understand the details of nodecoin. I don't think nodecoin has a lot impact on Nxt value. If the total amount of nodecoin is unlimited, we can't see a lot value in nodecoin after building a big and saturate Nxt network. Even if it is limited, it seems that the nodecoin are not circulated as a reward to protect Nxt network, so the nodecoin in hand can only be traded and it won't have so much correlation with network protection, and in such a case will nodecoin have so much value and dilute Nxt value?

Thanks to Nxt's unique feature, tons of "nodecoin" or other altcoins will be built in the AE asset way or in the parallel chain way. Nxt provides a platform for the cryptocurrency, just like those altcoins based on bitcoin code base. We haven't seen bitcoin's value is threatened so much by altcoins.

So don't worry nodecoin. James is working on nodecoin, and some other developers can work on AE, parallel chain, block chain pruning, and so on.


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March 13, 2014, 04:12:08 PM
 #43939

Don't worry Nxt and I think I support nodecoin.

If it's not James who developed nodecoin, some other will develop it because nodecoin is just developed and based on Nxt according to Nxt rule. I got more than 500 nodecoins during the past 24 hours though I don't fully understand the details of nodecoin. I don't think nodecoin will affect a lot on Nxt price. If the total amount of nodecoin is unlimited, we can't see a lot value in nodecoin after building a big and saturate Nxt network. Even if it is limited, it seems that the nodecoin are not circulated as a reward to protect Nxt network, so the nodecoin in hand can only be traded and it will have not so much correlation with network protection, and in such a case will nodecoin have so much value and dilute Nxt value?

Thanks to Nxt's unique feature, tons of "nodecoin" or other altcoins will be built in the AE asset way or in the parallel chain way. Nxt provides a platform for the cryptocurrency, just like those altcoins based on bitcoin code base. We haven't see bitcoin's value is threatened so much by altcoins.

So don't worry nodecoin. James is working on nodecoin, and some other developers can work on AE, parallel chain, block chain pruning, and so on.




Anything issued in the asset exchange as it is today is limited to 1 billion.



Jl777's post history has the full development of nodecoin if you want to understand the thinking, how it is structured and incentives behind it.

If you have any questions, we might be lucky and will return here to answer them Grin

Moving on... Tongue
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March 13, 2014, 04:12:48 PM
 #43940

Can we please stop with the "The sky is falling!!!!1!!1one!!1" posts?

There are issues, yes....but there are a whole hell of a lot of shades of grey between black and white. We're still young.
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