NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[Come-from-Beyond]

Yes yes very understandable, but as far as you are concerned, aside from testing, bug fixes/ revisions you are done with primary implementation?

Yes

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[bitcoinpaul]

[LiQio]

Did you really quoted the whole post?

bitcoinpaul, is there something you want to confess?




  just kiddin'
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=345619.msg6065100#msg6065100

[xlcus]

Below u'll find the 3rd part of Transparent Mining essay, the 1st and 2nd parts r available here - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=364218.0 and https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=458036.0. The essay is based on text written by BCNext, I paraphrase it in my own words to protect BCNext's real identity against text style analysis (as was agreed).

Bitcoin was a genious invention but implementation became corrupted by people whose aim was to make money, not bitcoins but dollars. BCNext was working on a project that required special conditions for its existence, he hoped that Bitcoin would change the society and prepare ground for the project. Half a year ago it became crystal clear for him that Bitcoin, as an idea of trustless money, had failed. A fix was required and it came in the form of Transparent Mining. "Transparent" is the key word here, it changes focus from "trust no one" to "don't let to cheat", because any cheating becomes obvious very soon (as soon as allowed by network latency). Nxt is just a work-around, it was launched to win more time and to conduct an experiment that was supposed to show if the society is ready for the main project of BCNext. He thinks that society can't be completely decentralized, and Nxt will let to measure level of decentralization after which a society can't function as a whole. Bitcoin relies only on math, but math can't solve problems arising because of illogical nature of the man. Mining in Nxt relies on cooperation of people and even forces it. Without cooperation Nxt becomes weak and can be easily attacked. It's like a system in unstable equilibrium, if people stop to care about cooperation then Nxt will fail very fast.

Now, when you know why Nxt was created your should choose what way to follow. The easiest one is to repeat the history of Bitcoin in hope that something will change. The alternative is to implement Transparent Mining and try to handle people imperfection. The latter can't be done with pure math and even if you manage to find some laws you can't be sure that these laws won't change in the future. BCNext went for good, he doesn't feel himself responsible for the future of Nxt, he implemented an idea that was obvious but noone tried to do it (maybe because creation of a Bitcoin clone was much easier). One day he will come back with his main project under his real name. Don't try to find real identity of BCNext, he intentionally copied style and ideas of different people, if you think you found him then you are likely wrong. BCNext has never existed, this sockpuppet was created only for Nxt and will never appear again.

The plan always was very simple - to show the way that very obvious but avoided for some reason. BCNext doesn't pretend that he possesses sacral knowledge and knows what is awaiting in the end. You are left on your own. Good luck.quote author=Gaman link=topic=345619.msg6066333#msg6066333 date=1396605098]
Is today when CfB will announce BCNext plans?

already released pal. ill find u a link
heres the final plan with links to p1 + p2
[/quote]

Can't understand the meaning. Can anybody summarize with one to two sentences?

[bitcoinpaul]

Did you really quoted the whole post?

bitcoinpaul, is there something you want to confess?




  just kiddin'
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=345619.msg6065100#msg6065100

 

[salsacz]

Whom will we send to Russia? http://bitcoinconf.ru Any Nxt dev living in Russia or Belarus? Register before 7 April to pay only 10k RUB 

[LiQio]

third part about transparent mining goes here


Can't understand the meaning. Can anybody summarize with one to two sentences?

Summary
------------------------
- "Bitcoin sucks"

- Nxt is currently best, but he might make better stuff and he'll show his real identity at that time -> e.g. Hello I'm Come-from-Beyond and here is Cubic

- Community is key - whales move your lazy asses (oops, did I read this between the lines)

- Identity: BCnext is a sockpuppet created for NXT
"Don't try to find real identity of BCNext, he intentionally copied style and ideas of different people, if you think you found him then you are likely wrong" -> can only be translated to: he made mistakes while trying to hide paths and he might be exposed early - why write so much about it otherwise

"doesn't pretend that he possesses sacral knowledge" -> means that he's not a top-ranking politician

-----------------------

we should never forget: everything in Nxt is made on purpose (Quote: CfB)

[Ola]

Yes yes very understandable, but as far as you are concerned, aside from testing, bug fixes/ revisions you are done with primary implementation?

Yes

nice how did you manage to finish this in a month? or have you been working on it all along?

[zorke]

Guys can I use any special character for a password? And what is a maximal length of a password?

Thanks

[apenzl]

I am sure we had a Nxt forging pool,

http://www.nxtio.org

 

[EDIT] Nxtpool.net started as a forging pool. Now it's for miners.

[instacalm]

i do not have a real account

That's not true. Your posting format/style and common mistakes have already revealed your real account.
I am not going to post names but it is pretty obvious, in my eyes at least.

And hey, it's ok to have the opinions you have, but you could have posted with your real id in the first place. Nevermind...

[yassin54]

I am sure we had a Nxt forging pool,

http://www.nxtio.org

 

[EDIT] Nxtpool.net started as a forging pool. Now it's for miners.

I can not withdraw my nxt
The  Token is wrong.

[BrianNowhere]

If there are say, 100,000 Nxt accounts, what percentage of them need to be running open clients for the system to be secure?
Is it 10% 20% 50% 75%? Does anyone even know? Nobody answers when I ask.
The only reason I've harped on the same question is because no one has given a satisfactory answer. In fact this is when the devs get very slippery and evasive and people start calling me a troll.

This question has been answered a million times. Since only big holders get to forge most often, only a few big holders are needed. They have self interest to not only forge, but be honest forgers, as anything bad and  dishonest (like double spending)  would hurt nxt credibility, which would result in killing their own investment. That's proof of stake at work.

I know this thread is very long, but this question has been answered multiple times.

Despite the long thread, he has been told this repeatedly. He just keeps posting the same thing over and over again, along with why ripple is better.

150 Nxt goes to the person who can show conclusively that I have been "told this repeatedly", before yesterday, when James finally answered me with a somewhat definitive answer (that still has no mathematical proof), here in these threads or anywhere else.
You get 200 Nxt if you can show C-F-B directly answering me regarding the above question.

The closest answer I got before yesterday was James telling me that for X amount of existing nodes X% / needs to be forging and that I should forge if I give a shit about the network. No other person has given me a straight, solid answer on this question before yesterday.

(I lplanned to ogged out permanently yesterday (can't seem to be able to delete the account) but saw this and had to issue the challenge to this bullshit charge) prove me wrong and prove Eadeqa right and win 150 to 200 Nxt.

[Fatih87SK]

If there are say, 100,000 Nxt accounts, what percentage of them need to be running open clients for the system to be secure?
Is it 10% 20% 50% 75%? Does anyone even know? Nobody answers when I ask.
The only reason I've harped on the same question is because no one has given a satisfactory answer. In fact this is when the devs get very slippery and evasive and people start calling me a troll.

This question has been answered a million times. Since only big holders get to forge most often, only a few big holders are needed. They have self interest to not only forge, but be honest forgers, as anything bad and  dishonest (like double spending)  would hurt nxt credibility, which would result in killing their own investment. That's proof of stake at work.

I know this thread is very long, but this question has been answered multiple times.

Despite the long thread, he has been told this repeatedly. He just keeps posting the same thing over and over again, along with why ripple is better.

150 Nxt goes to the person who can show conclusively that I have been "told this repeatedly", before yesterday, when James finally answered me with a somewhat definitive answer (that still has no mathematical proof), here in these threads or anywhere else.
You get 200 Nxt if you can show C-F-B directly answering me regarding the above question.

The closest answer I got before yesterday was James telling me that for X amount of existing nodes X% needs to be forging and that I should forge if I give a shit about the network. No other person has given me a straight, solid answer on this question before yesterday.

(I lplanned to ogged out permanently yesterday (can't seem to be able to delete the account) but saw this and had to issue the challenge to this bullshit charge) prove me wrong and prove Eadeqa right and win 150 to 200 Nxt.

I give you 350 NXT if you leave us.

[BrianNowhere]

I give you 350 NXT if you leave us.

Deal. My Acct # is below.

[BrianNowhere]

Here are the two best answers on the subject I received before yesterday. to the question: "Is there a mathematical known ratio regarding this? ie: For every 10 users 1 needs to be forging?"

to which i then went on to add: "If a significant number of users can keep their clients locked without it being a problem then I am satisfied. I would do it for free."

Two best answers before yesterday:

It depends on how much currency they control.  NXT is currently susceptible to 51% currency attacks because TF isn't fully implemented yet.  If someone is able to control 51% of the currency currently forging, they can attack NXT.

At any given time if X% of the stake is forging, then X/2% can do a 51% attack.
So yes, this is quite important
It is NOT about earning spam prevention fees
It is about securing the network
If you own NXT. FORGE.
Otherwise it is like letting a mining pool get 75% of the new blocks. Just asking for trouble.

Stop focusing on what fees you are earning or not. Start forging to protect the network. Every little bit counts

James

Offer stands to show where anyone else here has answered my question directly  and told me that the Nxt network will be secure with only large stakeholders forging.
It's a legitimate fucking question. C-F-B always seems to go very very quiet when I ask about this. Would love to get a statement from him.  

[bitcoinpaul]

I give you 350 NXT if you leave us.

made me smile

[ChuckOne]

Offer stands to show where anyone else here has answered my question directly  and told me that the Nxt network will be secure with only large stakeholders forging.

I will not search that too-long thread.

Nevertheless, I do not get your question. Could you paraphrase it?

[msin]

Here are the two best answers on the subject I received before yesterday. to the question: "Is there a mathematical known ratio regarding this? ie: For every 10 users 1 needs to be forging?"

to which i then went on to add: "If a significant number of users can keep their clients locked without it being a problem then I am satisfied. I would do it for free."

Two best answers before yesterday:

It depends on how much currency they control.  NXT is currently susceptible to 51% currency attacks because TF isn't fully implemented yet.  If someone is able to control 51% of the currency currently forging, they can attack NXT.

At any given time if X% of the stake is forging, then X/2% can do a 51% attack.
So yes, this is quite important
It is NOT about earning spam prevention fees
It is about securing the network
If you own NXT. FORGE.
Otherwise it is like letting a mining pool get 75% of the new blocks. Just asking for trouble.

Stop focusing on what fees you are earning or not. Start forging to protect the network. Every little bit counts

James

Offer stands to show where anyone else here has answered my question directly  and told me that the Nxt network will be secure with only large stakeholders forging.
It's a legitimate fucking question. C-F-B always seems to go very very quiet when I ask about this. Would love to get a statement from him.  

Just can't stay away, I'm starting to like you  

PS. CFB is orbiting the moon, staging our arrival, and there are certain parts of the day when he's on the dark side, and hence no one hears from him.

[BrianNowhere]

Offer stands to show where anyone else here has answered my question directly  and told me that the Nxt network will be secure with only large stakeholders forging.

I will not search that too-long thread.

Nevertheless, I do not get your question. Could you paraphrase it?

The question, which I think is important to have a mathematical answer to.

What ratio of existing accounts need to be running an open client for the network to be secure?

My concern is that since small stakeholders do not get NXT (not nodecoin) rewards for running an open client, what will happen
if most of these people lock their clients once Nxt gets widely distributed?

Hypothetical: What if all the Nxt in existence were divided equally amongst 2,000,000 accounts? where each would have 500 Nxt.
What if most of these people didn't open their clients? What would happen?  

According to James if more than a million people locked their clients nxt would be vulnerable. That is until transparent forging is implemented, at which point DDOS attacks to individual nodes becomes the new problem.

Seems the answer is to keep Nxt from getting too widely distributed. God bless the 1%