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Author Topic: Economic Devastation  (Read 503951 times)
RealBitcoin
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April 17, 2016, 03:28:48 PM
 #2521

Just end the welfare system, and then all problems will be solved.

Remove the regulations, lower the taxes, encourage entrepreneurism in public schools, make more free market jobs, phase out welfare, and then we can live in prosperity.


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April 18, 2016, 07:42:21 PM
 #2522

Just end the welfare system, and then all problems will be solved.

Remove the regulations, lower the taxes, encourage entrepreneurism in public schools, make more free market jobs, phase out welfare, and then we can live in prosperity.



That's like removing greed from our gene's... unlikely
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April 19, 2016, 12:30:28 AM
 #2523

Just end the welfare system, and then all problems will be solved.

Remove the regulations, lower the taxes, encourage entrepreneurism in public schools, make more free market jobs, phase out welfare, and then we can live in prosperity.



That's like removing greed from our gene's... unlikely

I would argue that it's more like removing the tendency towards interpersonal violence from our genes.

Completely and utterly impossible over the short run. Probably spontaneous over the long run.

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April 19, 2016, 11:02:18 AM
 #2524

Just end the welfare system, and then all problems will be solved.

Remove the regulations, lower the taxes, encourage entrepreneurism in public schools, make more free market jobs, phase out welfare, and then we can live in prosperity.



That's like removing greed from our gene's... unlikely

I would argue that it's more like removing the tendency towards interpersonal violence from our genes.

Completely and utterly impossible over the short run. Probably spontaneous over the long run.

I'd really love to go off on that theoretic tangent. I have many ideas to share. But I can't right now.

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April 19, 2016, 02:45:16 PM
 #2525

Just end the welfare system, and then all problems will be solved.

Remove the regulations, lower the taxes, encourage entrepreneurism in public schools, make more free market jobs, phase out welfare, and then we can live in prosperity.



That's like removing greed from our gene's... unlikely
As you can see you see that everything is getting more online and digital and that can be good for the online payments method because it works also much faster.
Only the new things works not 100% and that is the problem it must be better later.
RealBitcoin
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April 19, 2016, 04:48:27 PM
 #2526


I'd really love to go off on that theoretic tangent. I have many ideas to share. But I can't right now.

Ok lemme share my ideas on greed.

I`m neutral about it, and I think it needs to be balanced.


Greed is good, like Gordon Gekko said, but only up to a certain point. You can wish for a good car , a house, and a beautiful wife, and by being greedy it pushes you beyond your limits, that you previously think you had.

Greed to me is the opposite of lazyness, and its good to give you motivation,and make you evolve past your limit.


But greed can only work  if you respect others too, and you have to do it inside a framework of voluntary association.



It's perfectly good if you see a 100$ bill on the street and pick it up. But it's perfectly bad if you see 100$ in somebody's pocket and you take it out!


When greed meets force and violence, then its when its getting bad.



A greedy businessman expanding his business, therefore hiring more people, and lowering the costs for his customers is perfectly ok.

Greedy socialists asking for more welfare, and thus stealing money directly out of your pocket by taxes is perfectly not ok!



So greed can never be used with violence and force!

Only voluntary greed is ok!

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April 20, 2016, 12:53:44 AM
 #2527


I'd really love to go off on that theoretic tangent. I have many ideas to share. But I can't right now.

Ok lemme share my ideas on greed.

I`m neutral about it, and I think it needs to be balanced.


Greed is good, like Gordon Gekko said, but only up to a certain point. You can wish for a good car , a house, and a beautiful wife, and by being greedy it pushes you beyond your limits, that you previously think you had.

Greed to me is the opposite of lazyness, and its good to give you motivation,and make you evolve past your limit.


But greed can only work  if you respect others too, and you have to do it inside a framework of voluntary association.



It's perfectly good if you see a 100$ bill on the street and pick it up. But it's perfectly bad if you see 100$ in somebody's pocket and you take it out!


When greed meets force and violence, then its when its getting bad.



A greedy businessman expanding his business, therefore hiring more people, and lowering the costs for his customers is perfectly ok.

Greedy socialists asking for more welfare, and thus stealing money directly out of your pocket by taxes is perfectly not ok!



So greed can never be used with violence and force!

Only voluntary greed is ok!

Well said.

You can almost say the market runs on greed. I mean in the sense that wanting more money and success means you must necessarily create value for others, who will voluntarily buy what you're producing. There is the saying that if you can find a way to help a million people or solve a problem they have, then you will necessarily be wealthy in return.

Competition in free markets is the only thing that can provide the balance you speak of. This "mixed economy" aka socialist non-sense is where greed gets out of check and rewards profiting from other peoples misfortunes.
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April 20, 2016, 01:03:06 AM
 #2528

Speaking of the Europe disaster... anyone follow Stefan Molyneux? He has tons of great videos on it.

https://www.youtube.com/user/stefbot/search?query=migrant
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April 20, 2016, 07:46:28 AM
Last edit: May 12, 2016, 09:04:38 AM by RealBitcoin
 #2529


Well said.



Of course, the only honest way to earn value is to create it.

Every person has some demand, and every person has some ability that can fill another persons demand.

If a perfect global, ultra connected market is established (which it is, with all these wonderful decentralized technologies + internet), then capitalism will ascend to another level.

Because only many entangled global voluntary markets can create a peaceful human society.

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April 20, 2016, 02:40:05 PM
 #2530


Well said.

You can almost say the market runs on greed. I mean in the sense that wanting more money and success means you must necessarily create value for others, who will voluntarily buy what you're producing. There is the saying that if you can find a way to help a million people or solve a problem they have, then you will necessarily be wealthy in return.

Competition in free markets is the only thing that can provide the balance you speak of. This "mixed economy" aka socialist non-sense is where greed gets out of check and rewards profiting from other peoples misfortunes.

Of course, the only honest way to earn value is to create it.

Every person has some demand, and every person has some ability that can fill another persons demand.

If a perfect global, ultra connected market is established (which it is, with all these wonderful decentralized technologies + internet), then capitalism will ascend to another level.

Because only many entangled global voluntary markets can create a peaceful human society.

Greed makes sure this never happens ... wanting to be ahead of peers and acquire more wealth than them.
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April 20, 2016, 08:19:52 PM
 #2531


Greed makes sure this never happens ... wanting to be ahead of peers and acquire more wealth than them.

Well then we have to find a way to make it like that, because that is the only sustainable long term solution for humanity.

Otherwise we either end up with totalitarian monopolies, or barbaric brutalism of the lazy masses.

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April 20, 2016, 09:36:00 PM
 #2532


Greed makes sure this never happens ... wanting to be ahead of peers and acquire more wealth than them.

Well then we have to find a way to make it like that, because that is the only sustainable long term solution for humanity.

Otherwise we either end up with totalitarian monopolies, or barbaric brutalism of the lazy masses.

will take generations because its pretty much embedded within our gene's... its been there since homo erectus.

Only way to evolve in thsi case is seeing pain, a multi decade depression might help.
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April 20, 2016, 11:53:21 PM
 #2533


will take generations because its pretty much embedded within our gene's... its been there since homo erectus.

Only way to evolve in thsi case is seeing pain, a multi decade depression might help.

No that doesnt help, because then people will forget what prosperity and happiness is.

Its how CoinCube mentioned Plato's cave, if a person is kept in the shadow all his life, he will probably never know anything better.


I think its the exact opposite that we need, we need huge technological innovation, that can show the masses that capitalism works, and it will make socialism obsolete once AI robots will perform surgeries on people. The free healthcare and education bullshitters will go away.



I think only technology can liberate humanity, but it depends how it's used, because those AI terminator robots are also a concern

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April 21, 2016, 12:32:16 AM
 #2534


will take generations because its pretty much embedded within our gene's... its been there since homo erectus.

Only way to evolve in thsi case is seeing pain, a multi decade depression might help.

No that doesnt help, because then people will forget what prosperity and happiness is.

Its how CoinCube mentioned Plato's cave, if a person is kept in the shadow all his life, he will probably never know anything better.


I think its the exact opposite that we need, we need huge technological innovation, that can show the masses that capitalism works, and it will make socialism obsolete once AI robots will perform surgeries on people. The free healthcare and education bullshitters will go away.



I think only technology can liberate humanity, but it depends how it's used, because those AI terminator robots are also a concern

No way to fix the system, equity markets which drives our economy today can be though of as organic mechanisms because they comprise of companies which behave like organisms which are born, live and die (because they can't keep up with innovation).. thus you will have one economy "die" and another born out of innovation and realization of a technology or idea that will uplift confidence enough for people to jump in. That is where we are at now, internet brought us through the last bubble but we are due for a bigger realization of how we work and live, and thus we need to see the current business models "die" and new ones emerge like offspring based on the new tech, which will take years (hence decades of depression like living)... theres no way around it, you can't take 100+ years of a system that has grown out of control and expect to change it on the fly, too much friction both top and bottom.
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April 21, 2016, 03:36:49 AM
 #2535

No way to fix the system, equity markets which drives our economy today can be though of as organic mechanisms because they comprise of companies which behave like organisms which are born, live and die (because they can't keep up with innovation).. thus you will have one economy "die" and another born out of innovation and realization of a technology or idea that will uplift confidence enough for people to jump in. That is where we are at now, internet brought us through the last bubble but we are due for a bigger realization of how we work and live, and thus we need to see the current business models "die" and new ones emerge like offspring based on the new tech, which will take years (hence decades of depression like living)... theres no way around it, you can't take 100+ years of a system that has grown out of control and expect to change it on the fly, too much friction both top and bottom.

There will always be pockets of robust health even in an unhealthy and overall depressed system. Once you identify the near term trajectory as toxic or depressed the next step is to identify and join one of these pockets.   

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April 21, 2016, 05:25:52 AM
 #2536

No way to fix the system, equity markets which drives our economy today can be though of as organic mechanisms because they comprise of companies which behave like organisms which are born, live and die (because they can't keep up with innovation).. thus you will have one economy "die" and another born out of innovation and realization of a technology or idea that will uplift confidence enough for people to jump in. That is where we are at now, internet brought us through the last bubble but we are due for a bigger realization of how we work and live, and thus we need to see the current business models "die" and new ones emerge like offspring based on the new tech, which will take years (hence decades of depression like living)... theres no way around it, you can't take 100+ years of a system that has grown out of control and expect to change it on the fly, too much friction both top and bottom.

There will always be pockets of robust health even in an unhealthy and overall depressed system. Once you identify the near term trajectory as toxic or depressed the next step is to identify and join one of these pockets.   
we are talking about society as a whole, pockets are outliers.
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April 21, 2016, 08:47:54 AM
 #2537

Bitcoin and the crypto economy is doing pretty well in this global recession.

I mean wages are dropping worldwide, taxes increse, jobs losses over the board, young guys cant find jobs,etc..

Yet people here earn pretty well, because investors fund our bitcoin project, and we all benefit from it in some way.

I just hope more people will join us, actually i dont just hope, i try to make it happen as well.

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April 24, 2016, 02:33:51 AM
 #2538

Since economics is a zero sum game

Nope. Because saplings grow to oak trees, but oak trees don't grow to the moon and beyond, they rot and decay.

The larger your wealth, the less fast you can grow it because your economy-of-scale is too large for the smaller faster growing opportunities. The new minnows race past you, and the cycle repeats over and over again.

Sorry the fundamental matter of the universe is cyclical, because without friction the speed-of-life would be infinite and thus past and future would collapse into the nothingness of an infinitesimal point in spacetime. We exists only because of friction and cycles.



We exist only because of friction and cycles.

Which backs what I said about a zero sum game when even the universe probably is one.  That everything you look around and see is the more long drawn out equivalent of a quantum fluctuation, some type of energy or matter briefly appearing then disappearing back to the void.

The "no free lunch" zero energy universe:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-energy_universe

Sorry incorrect again. The Second Law of Thermodynamics (which Einstein remarked is fundamental because it is due to the irreversibility of the forward change in time) insures the entropy of the universe is always trending to maximum, not to some limit. So our diversity and opportunity are always increasing.

Man r0ach, don't be so depressed. Life is great!

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April 27, 2016, 12:46:35 AM
 #2539

The purpose of mining is to create a permanent decentralized exchange, which thus results in a permissionless system.

And even better than Bitcoin will be the coin where those newly mined coins are mined by the millions and billions of users, not by few 100s of professional miners (which is where Bitcoin is rapidly centralizing to). The only way to achieve this is to make mining unprofitable. I've explained this design, yet so many people remain skeptical. I'll finish the 'plaining in a white paper after it is too late to copy the design.

Absent an automatic means in the economy where money naturally moves from the power law distribution wealthy back to the masses, then Socialism erects to do the job, which is then captured by the same power law which ends up in periodic 600 year Dark Ages.

It is time for something better. Even better than Bitcoin. At least we have a somewhat decentralized Bitcoin in the meantime.

I have work to do.

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April 27, 2016, 01:48:36 AM
 #2540

The purpose of mining is to create a permanent decentralized exchange, which thus results in a permissionless system.

And even better than Bitcoin will be the coin where those newly mined coins are mined by the millions and billions of users, not by few 100s of professional miners (which is where Bitcoin is rapidly centralizing to). The only way to achieve this is to make mining unprofitable. I've explained this design, yet so many people remain skeptical. I'll finish the 'plaining in a white paper after it is too late to copy the design.

Absent an automatic means in the economy where money naturally moves from the power law distribution wealthy back to the masses, then Socialism erects to do the job, which is then captured by the same power law which ends up in periodic 600 year Dark Ages.

It is time for something better. Even better than Bitcoin. At least we have a somewhat decentralized Bitcoin in the meantime.

I have work to do.



Then get your a$$ back to work!

Smiley    Tongue    Smiley    Tongue


I can write that because I'm older than you are, smile.  But, really, do what you have to do...
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