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Author Topic: When will those centralized payment networks be built on top of bitcoin?  (Read 1057 times)
notig (OP)
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December 09, 2013, 06:05:17 AM
 #1

If you see bitcoin as a global currency it's obvious that it's incapable of handling many transactions per second if it is really used much. Payment networks built on top of bitcoin would be the answer right?
what about ripple though... essentially ripple is already a payment network that is sort of "built on top of bitcoin" in that bitcoin could be used with it. Will it be ripple? or something else.
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December 09, 2013, 06:32:40 AM
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I assume the huge amounts of hardware coming out will help transaction times, anything less than half an hour isn't bad at all. But I see people making businesses that accept transactions with 2 confirmations for instance and treat it as confirmed earlier but also charge their users a percentage for the instant transaction.
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December 10, 2013, 02:07:14 AM
 #3

Quote
The difficulty with third-parties is achieving that trust. Outside of Bitcoin PayPal has been criticized[2] for arbitrarily freezing accounts. Within Bitcoin multiple E-Wallet services such as MyBitcoin and Instawallet have failed due to hacks as well as technical mistakes resulting in the loss of some or all funds held on behalf of their customers.

Add Inputs.io to the list.

More here: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Off-Chain_Transactions

seriouscoin
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December 10, 2013, 02:20:50 AM
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I assume the huge amounts of hardware coming out will help transaction times, anything less than half an hour isn't bad at all. But I see people making businesses that accept transactions with 2 confirmations for instance and treat it as confirmed earlier but also charge their users a percentage for the instant transaction.

Transaction time has nothing to do with confirmation time. Also the " amount of hardware" doesnt matter as a block is found in 10mins on avg.... by design

CC transaction is instant but takes 60 days to confirm.
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December 10, 2013, 02:50:45 AM
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Transaction time has nothing to do with confirmation time. Also the " amount of hardware" doesnt matter as a block is found in 10mins on avg.... by design

CC transaction is instant but takes 60 days to confirm.

Very true. And a guaranteed 'loss' of 3-5% in fees even if it does 'confirm' (i.e. if there's no reversal or chargeback).

                         
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AnonyMint
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December 10, 2013, 06:10:57 AM
Last edit: December 10, 2013, 06:42:28 AM by AnonyMint
 #6

Transaction time has nothing to do with confirmation time.

CC transaction is instant but takes 60 days to confirm.

It does matter when you have a retail transaction and you don't know who your customer is, for example the food markets in developing countries where any one can walk in and buy some fresh meat or vegetables. The vendor is moving fast. And most people don't have identification any way.

Also it would matter in retail transactions in the developed countries where fake identification would even be possible in some cases.

And do we really want to move to a world where we carry our identification on an RFID chip in our body in order to make it efficient!

True the merchant could accept the cost of fraud as a cost of doing business, as is the case with online merchants which accept credit cards. However, note that many retail merchants operate on razor thin margins. WalMart prefers debit cards I think.

Thus it is erroneous to assert that 1-confirmation delay isn't relevant in all cases.

And off-chain transactions do indeed bring us back to the issues of centralization required to deal with (abuse of) trust, which is of course a slippery slope just as how putting our gold on deposit in the 1800s and trading in certificates lead us to bank failures (due to fractional reserves lending of certificates, i.e. cheating) and then finally a central bank to prevent corrections (i.e. prevent debt defaults) and keep the debt increasing non-stop for the past 80 years or so without correction (thus leading to a horrific global implosion coming before 2020).

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