Ripple: The Best Way To Legitimize Bitcoin

[dancupid]

I'm sorry to say, but I won't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of Dancupid....and I would hope you don't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of PirateButtercup ;-)

I won't be extending any trust to the Ripple concept - so I won't be using it.

I know someone who's wife left them because she met an old fling on Facebook....he won't use FB now.

I know someone who actually fell for that Nigerian email scam years ago....and they never use email now.

I know someone who owned a Mac in that late 80's that broke ...  he won't buy another Apple product.

I understand you've got some of TradeFortress's BTC...that sucks....and I understand why you won't be using Ripple now.



BTW...I recently learned of DATA (Digital Asset Transfer Authority) that is being set up to self-regulate the virtual money industry before governments start sledgehammering regulations. Bitcoin, Ripple and Ven seem to be the 3 represented bodies. It'll be interesting to see what they do to stop people like TradeFortress, or the robberies of earlier BTC sites.

Wish you luck, man....

I won't be using it because I have 4 bitcoins in my ripple account that aren't real. If I add more bitcoins then I won't know which bitcoins are real and which aren't - it doesn't work, so I can't and wont use it.
I'm unwilling to risk my money

[PirateButtercup]

Ripple is a bogus, central banker-initiated, attempt at usurping the truly decentralized nature of bitcoin and similar cryptos.

Ripple is not decentralized, it is distributed, big difference.  There's nothing peer-to-peer about ripple.  It relies on 'trusted gateways'.

If it were bank initiated, it certainly wouldn't be open source. Actually it was initiated by the founder of Coin Base, et al and received significant seed money from the Bitcoin Opportunity Fund. If it were a scam, it would have came up during the vetting process of any of it's several rounds of raising capital.

It is no way similar to any of the cryptos. It is a system of transferring and exchanging value. XRP are not designed to be a container of value. They simply lubricate the system by preventing spam and denial of service attacks.

Here are some videos to help you around the learning curve and correct misconceptions:

Here's an overview of Ripple ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zxA3Gt7y3c

Here is an explanation of Ripple in 60 seconds ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwyIEMyMfqs

Here is a video to help you understand how a Gateway works ...  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M16ZatXbmLg

Here is a video to help you understand how the consensus ledger works ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj1QVb1vlC0

Perhaps this video will help you understand how the client works ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06H86TNeJMw

Cheers!

[mmeijeri]

I won't be using it because I have 4 bitcoins in my ripple account that aren't real. If I add more bitcoins then I won't know which bitcoins are real and which aren't - it doesn't work, so I can't and wont use it.
I'm unwilling to risk my money

This is just like having an account at a bitcoin exchange, or a bank, with the difference that with Ripple it is a neutral and algorithmic P2P network that is keeping the books, not the bank or exchange itself. Don't extend trust to anyone you wouldn't open an online account with.

[PirateButtercup]

I'm sorry to say, but I won't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of Dancupid....and I would hope you don't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of PirateButtercup ;-)

I won't be extending any trust to the Ripple concept - so I won't be using it.

I know someone who's wife left them because she met an old fling on Facebook....he won't use FB now.

I know someone who actually fell for that Nigerian email scam years ago....and they never use email now.

I know someone who owned a Mac in that late 80's that broke ...  he won't buy another Apple product.

I understand you've got some of TradeFortress's BTC...that sucks....and I understand why you won't be using Ripple now.



BTW...I recently learned of DATA (Digital Asset Transfer Authority) that is being set up to self-regulate the virtual money industry before governments start sledgehammering regulations. Bitcoin, Ripple and Ven seem to be the 3 represented bodies. It'll be interesting to see what they do to stop people like TradeFortress, or the robberies of earlier BTC sites.

Wish you luck, man....

I won't be using it because I have 4 bitcoins in my ripple account that aren't real. If I add more bitcoins then I won't know which bitcoins are real and which aren't - it doesn't work, so I can't and wont use it.
I'm unwilling to risk my money

Oh...I understand now...sorry. Actually whenever you attempt to trade currency it will ask you which BTC you wanna use....BTC-Bitstamp, BTC-JustCoin, etc. or which dollars you wanna use USD-Bitstamp, USD-JustCoin, etc.

/Users/Harpool/Desktop/Screen Shot 2013-12-13 at 11.04.18 PM.jpg


(I hope that screenshot shows up....again...kinda new at this forum)

Now...in terms of how to get rid of the bogus BTC completely...I dunno. I'll have to explore that myself.  (Historically, it may be kinda neat that you have them.) I set up 5 or 6 accounts and started moving stuff all around, adjust trust lines, etc....just playing. When I'm finished I'm just gonna move my stuff out and let those accounts go unused.

In the end, I'm thinking it may be best to have one "In" account...one "Out" account... and one that never trusts anyone (including Gateways)....but I dunno yet...

[opticalcarrier]

Is it possible to buy bitcoins via ripple directly from your bank, instead of going through localbitcoins (dangerous) or coinbase (takes too long)

[opticalcarrier]

Is it possible to buy bitcoins via ripple directly from your bank, instead of going through localbitcoins (dangerous) or coinbase (takes too long)

I mean, how quick is it to set up a ripple account, and fund it from your bank, then buy BTC from somewhere?  Where would you buy it from?

[PirateButtercup]

Just check out www.ripplescam.com

From their site:
"Ripple™: It’s highly misleading and not what you think it is. Ripple is a centralized payment system that allows the transfer of artificially printed tokens that claims to be money, like “USD” or “BTC”. OpenCoin Inc goes to great lengths to camouflage the fact that they have total control over the Ripple network, and calls themselves a distributed payment network."

The true power in Bitcoin and the like is:

1)  The inflation rate is known and can't be manipulated.
2)  The total number of bitcoins that can ever be created is known.

Central bankers don't like that...so the created Ripple, for which the number of coins can be increased at their whim.  Also, the upper number could be increased at their whim.  Just because they tell us there is an upper limit means nothing, since Ripple is not based on mining.  They can overnight say, actually, we just created another billion coins.  Just like central banks, which are printing $85 Billion per month and in the coming months they plan to increase this even further.  This type of inflation is not practically possible with Bitcoin and other cryptos, unless it is done at the outset.

If you notice the author of that site has not allowed publication of ANY comments since Ripple went Open Source. His information is misleading at times and he is misinformed at others. He will not allow authorization of any post that conflicts with his initial opinion.

Check out some of the videos that I've posted in others comments.

Also, check out some of these sites that I copied from the Ripple Federation:

Official site - ripple.com
Official forum - ripple.com/forum
Ripple Wiki - ripple.com/wiki
Ripple Blog - ripple.com/blog
A list of Ripple Gateways - ripple.com/gateways
Ripple network graph - ripple.com/graph
Server uptime - status.ripple.com
Instructional Articles and White Papers

Ripple, or Bills of Exchange 2.0 by J.P. Koning (copy)
OpenGateway by Bob Way (pdf)
Bitcoin: A P2P Electronic Cash System by S.Nakamoto (pdf)
How to Set Up a Trust Line for SnapSwap in your Ripple Wallet (copy)
Ripple Security: pass-phrase and secret key by Dave Chapeskie
Ripple Wallet Review by Donald McIntyre (copy)
SmartPhone Penetration Argentina and Brazil
More Community Pages

International Ripple Business Association - XRPga.org
Information on the latest giveaways - RippleGiveaway.com
A good alternative Ripple forum - XRPtalk.org
Chinese Ripple website with several services - ripplecn.org
The 'All things Ripple/XRP' page on bitcointalk.org
Chinese Ripple forum - ripplechina.net
Reddit discussions - reddit.com/r/Ripple+Ripplers

ORGANIZATIONS
 
Ripple Labs - Creators of the Ripple Protocol, a peer-to-peer payment network. Visit Ripple.com for more information.
International Ripple Business Association - The IRBA provides unified procedures to establish trustworthy and secure services for Ripple customers. (discussion)
Ripple Federation - Nonprofit working to inform and empower users of Ripple. (discussion)


GATEWAYS AND EXCHANGES
 
Kraken - A new standard for secure, feature-rich digital asset trading. (discussion)
Wisepass - Gateway offering trading in many different currencies. (discussion)
Dividend Rippler - Anonymous gateway dealing in Bitcoin and Litecoin (discussion)
SnapSwap - Gateway serving U.S. customers. (discussion)
Bitstamp - Established Bitcoin exchange now supporting trading of many currencies in Ripple. (discussion)
RippleCN - Chinese gateway offering a range of products and services. (discussion)
RippleChina - Chinese gateway offering a range of products and services.
XRPChina - Chinese gateway with a specialty of quotes and markets.
The Rock Trading - Gateway based in Italy dealing with EUR, USD, and various virtual currencies. (discussion)
WeExchange - Australian gateway dealing with Bitcoin, USD, AUD, and CAD. (discussion)
Ripple Israel / Bitcoin Israel - Oldest Bitcoin exchange in Israel still in full operation, now offering Ripple services. (discussion)
Justcoin - Gateway and Bitcoin exchange based in Norway.

 

[PirateButtercup]

Is it possible to buy bitcoins via ripple directly from your bank, instead of going through localbitcoins (dangerous) or coinbase (takes too long)

I read yesterday of a place that you could buy XRP with a credit card. I have not vetted them myself, so I'm not recommending them. I like buying my Bitcoin through Coinbase because I've got my account verified and they let me buy them instantly. One of the Chinese gateways lets you use Paypal, but I don't know Chinese, don't trust Google translate enough with my money and have a sneaky suspicion that Paypal China is different than Paypal US.

If you're American, you can wire money to SnapSwap.us and (because they don't have a wallet service) they will pump it directly into your Ripple account. But, again, I have not personally vetted them....and it takes that same ridiculous 3 days to wire money .... which is completely alleviated once your in the Ripple system. They do meet the seal of approval of the International Ripple Business Association.

Bitstamp is great. And, if you're not American, I've been having a good experience with TheRockTrading (in Malta). I'm not finished doing my background check on them yet though....

[PirateButtercup]

You will accept a check, right? Checks....also known as IOUs....have been a cornerstone of the finance industry for centuries.

Checks are not IOUs. An IOU for $1 million means "I'll pay you $1 million at some time in the future". A check for $1 million means "that $1 million I have in the bank is now yours".

The equivalent of a Bitcoin check is simply a 0-confirmation transaction. It hasn't cleared yet, but unless the person who signed the check has double-spent the money, it's yours. In fact, a 0-confirmation transaction is significantly better than a check, in that you can confirm to a high degree of probability that the person did have that X BTC in the account less than an hour ago, and the account can't really be overdrawn accidentally - if the payment doesn't clear the payee has probably committed fraud.

There's no need for Ripple to accept Bitcoin checks. They can be accepted just like any other check. Have the check-writer show ID, and get the police to prosecute them if they write a bad check.

Yes...a check is an IOU. It is an IOU issued by my bank (it's got their name on it, not Uncle Sam's) that I can give to anyone. Some places don't accept those IOUs even though they are made in dollars. It is a receipt showing that my bank owes whoever I gave it to that much in USD.

Even the dollar is an IOU. Historically it's been an IOU for silver (silver certificates) or gold (until we came off the gold standard). That's the issue with fiat currency, you know...now it's an IOU for absolutely nothing. People shifted the trust that the government would give them silver/gold into just trust of the government. The government has been taking advantage of that trust by printing money like there's no tomorrow. That is another reason I really love Bitcoin...cause they ain't making any new ones. 

There are numerous articles online regarding the history of currency and checking. Perhaps you may wanna get a bit more historical perspective on this.

Comparing Bitcoin and Ripple is comparing cars to a highway. I know both of them VERY well...that's why I started the entire post. Please look at some of the videos that I've posted and read a bit. Your comments seem to me to demonstrate that your knowledge of Ripple is about on par with your knowledge of fiat. 

[PirateButtercup]

Is it possible to buy bitcoins via ripple directly from your bank, instead of going through localbitcoins (dangerous) or coinbase (takes too long)

I mean, how quick is it to set up a ripple account, and fund it from your bank, then buy BTC from somewhere?  Where would you buy it from?

Because I'm setup, I've been helping my friends buy BTC and XRP within minutes. If you've got a friend who's already built the infrastructure for immediate transactions, I'd recommend you go to him and try a few small amounts until you've got your feet wet.

If you don't have a friend (already set up) then my experience is that it's just gonna take you time until you get everything verified and rolling (minimum of 3 days). It's the damn banks and their pokey systems that are proving to be the barrier to entry into Ripple, Bitcoin, Litecoin, etc.

[bibbit]

I won't be using it because I have 4 bitcoins in my ripple account that aren't real. If I add more bitcoins then I won't know which bitcoins are real and which aren't - it doesn't work, so I can't and wont use it.
I'm unwilling to risk my money

I still have graphite in my left hand from when I stabbed myself with a pencil in first grade. However, I still use both pencils and my left hand as I find them both to be extremely useful.

Solution #1: If you want to see how much of each type of BTC you hold, go to the Trust tab in your Ripple client. It will not only show you the trust lines that you have open for each issuer and currency, but it will also show you how much of each type of currency you hold from them. While you have the Trust tab open, set TradeFortress's trust setting to 0.

Solution #2: If you really want to liquidate your stock of 4 TradeFortress BTC, I have just placed an offer on the order book giving 0.001 XRP per TradeFortress BTC. Go to the Trade tab, select the BTC/XRP dropdown and enter TradeFortress's address (rH3bZsvVUhzugvcYuJVoSYCEMHkfK6wHNv) as the BTC issuer. Then cross the trade. If you only hold TradeFortress BTC, you can skip the Trade tab entirely and just use the Convert tab.

This will allow you to clear out those worthless BTC and put this episode behind you. Then you can move on with your Ripple usage, knowing that you should only trust gateways worthy of your trust. Bitstamp is a good place to start.

[tehbizz]

So, what's your role with Ripple? Obviously not just a patron.

A straight answer, you will not get.  It's obvious this person is a part of Ripple-affiliated organization but can't say so for whatever reason.  In fact, some quick Googling of usernames from this thread will show that some of the people in this thread have been propping up XRP for quite some time.

[PirateButtercup]

Yes...a check is an IOU. It is an IOU issued by my bank (it's got their name on it, not Uncle Sam's) that I can give to anyone.

Well, I guess you can use whatever notion of IOU you want. But a check is a "draft", which is an "order". It is not a "promise" or a "note" (which is what I'd consider an "IOU"). http://www.law.cornell.edu/ucc/3/3-104

Given our screwed up fractional-reserve banking system this may be mostly a distinction which only matters when it comes to legal matters like check fraud and check kiting, but from a legal perspective at least, there's a huge difference between a check and an IOU.

It's legal for me to write an IOU for $1 million when I don't have $1 million in the bank. It's illegal for me to write a check for $1 million when I don't have $1 million in the bank.

Comparing Bitcoin and Ripple is comparing cars to a highway. I know both of them VERY well...

And I know the UCC VERY well. A check is not an IOU.

Well...it's not illegal for you to write a check for a million dollars if you don't have it in your account. It's illegal of you to intentionally use that check to defraud someone....and intentional fraud, be it with TradFortress-USD in the Ripple system or with defective whoopi-cushions is a crime. Additionally, as I'm sure you noticed, none of this industry has been regulated .... YET. Thanks to thefts from various online wallets, Silk Road, etc. the hammer may be falling soon....

My use of 'IOU' and 'checks' and 'credit' is merely meant to help people conceptualize what Trustlines. They developed this term, and others like it, to cut loose baggage concepts like interest rates, overdraft fees, etc.

Trustlines are technically not like checks no more than checks are IOUs. To my knowledge know one within Ripple nor any of it's Gateways would accept a check.

[PirateButtercup]

So, what's your role with Ripple? Obviously not just a patron.

A straight answer, you will not get.  It's obvious this person is a part of Ripple-affiliated organization but can't say so for whatever reason.

Geeze...I think I've answered this twice now, haven't I?

You must be one of those Birthers still who think Obama is from Kenya. I mean, seriously....you want a urine test or what?

My question is ... Why are do people intentionally slag off something they don't understand?

Or, why be willfully ignorant?

Study a concept THEN falsify it.

Support your arguments with evidence...statistics, quotes and examples..... not opinions, heresay or conjecture.....

....and now that I've written that, it's painfully evident to me that I teach English.....

[PirateButtercup]

Well...it's not illegal for you to write a check for a million dollars if you don't have it in your account.

Is this some play on words where if you write the check but don't actually give it to anyone then you're in the clear? If not:

It is unlawful for any person, firm or corporation, to draw, make, utter or issue and deliver to another, any check or draft on any bank or depository, for the payment of money or its equivalent, knowing at the time of the making, drawing, uttering, issuing and delivering the check or draft, that the maker or drawer of it has not sufficient funds on deposit in or credit with the bank or depository with which to pay the check or draft upon presentation.

My use of 'IOU' and 'checks' and 'credit' is merely meant to help people conceptualize what Trustlines.

For those of us who know what terms like "IOU" and "check" and "credit" actually mean, this may be counter-productive.

I wouldn't call that a play on words. I would call it a tidy summation of the exact quote you just posted. I felt that you were intentionally ignoring the forest for the trees....that is an analogy, by the way (in the event you're a forest ranger), meaning that you were getting so obsessed with the specifics that you were missing the big picture....that is another analogy, by the way (in the event that you're a painter or photographer) meaning that you'd lost the plot ... which is indeed another analogy, in case you are a writer....etc.,

Perhaps in your excitement to read my response you overlooked the word 'conceptualize'. Perhaps I was wrong to think that you understood that I was speaking analogously.

To return to the topic, if you have a legitimate, reasoned and supportable objection to any of the facts that I have laid out about how important and valuable I deem Bitcoin or how it can be better mainstreamed through the use of the Ripple system....by all means, let me know...

[PirateButtercup]

OK...I have said about ALL that I can say on this. I have spent enough time. I'm gonna get back to trying to set up my own RippleD server.

I'm not gonna post anymore on this topic as there are other things that I need to learn about (Like this Digital Asset Transfer Authority that's been established!)

In addition to the numerous links I've posted, here is a great article I just found a few hours ago called

Ripple: Bitcoin in Business Attire

It says what I've been saying.....Ripple is a great middle ground between the crypto currencies and the fiat currencies.....plus a bunch more

http://web.appstorm.net/reviews/finances-reviews/ripple-bitcoin-in-business-atire/

[tehbizz]

So, what's your role with Ripple? Obviously not just a patron.

A straight answer, you will not get.  It's obvious this person is a part of Ripple-affiliated organization but can't say so for whatever reason.

Geeze...I think I've answered this twice now, haven't I?

...

My question is ... Why are do people intentionally slag off something they don't understand?

Or, why be willfully ignorant?

Study a concept THEN falsify it.

Support your arguments with evidence...statistics, quotes and examples..... not opinions, heresay or conjecture.....

....and now that I've written that, it's painfully evident to me that I teach English.....

Actually, you answered it once prior.  And it's extremely suspicious when someone is so GLOWINGLY enthusiastic about Ripple, a gateway/payment system that is not only confusing (on purpose) but quite obfuscated.  But yet, Ripple has been out for quite some time and pretty much no one else on this board is this enthusiastic about it, so this makes this look like some serious astroturfing job.  I have not, at all, tried in any way to falsify anything about Ripple, its network, or anything about it at all, I haven't tried to falsify anything.

But like I said, some quick Google-fu reveals interesting things.  Such as, this is the only place you've used the handle PirateButtercup to discuss Ripple.  In fact, it's only in the Newbies section of the forum as well and not in any other sub-forums.  So while you are obviously over-the-moon about Ripple and its concept, if you're talking about it elsewhere, you're using another handle to do so.  That in and of itself is revelatory.  And like I said, other people propping up Ripple are from other forums that are Ripple/XRP-centric, so this all comes across as a giant promotion (like I said originally).  This is why many people are so skeptical, it's not because of Ripple or any misunderstanding of it, it's because this looks like astroturfing.

[nahtnam]

Also now that its "open source" are you able to mine it?

Being Open Source has nothing to do with mining, but if you want to use your computer to crunch numbers and get XRP, you can do that.

Go to www.ComputingForGood.org and get started. One big difference is that when you trade computation for XRP, you aren't just generating heat like with Bitcoin mining. Instead, you are crunching results for scientific research (mostly AIDS and research).

I know that open source has nothing to do wit mining, I just forgot a ".". Do they have a GUI or is it just a pool sort of thing?

[nahtnam]

Whats funny is that Ripple inst (fully) open source. They are like twitter, claiming to be open source because a tiny part of their script is online.

Your right, Ripple is affraid their brand is not recognized enough to allow publish full open source, and they are right

Sure are. I was just going to suggest that since Ripple is open source, we should create a Ripple with BTC (or NMC) as the native currency (instead of XRP), and thus resolve the issue that the initial creators controlled 100% of the XRP.

Still, if the underlying idea isn't patented, isn't this something we could do?

That would be an online wallet. As I said before, Ripple isnt fully open source.

[mmeijeri]

That would be an online wallet. As I said before, Ripple isnt fully open source.

You've said it before, and you're wrong. Ripple is now fully open source.