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Author Topic: Ron Paul and Bitcoin  (Read 6341 times)
netrin
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September 05, 2011, 07:23:08 PM
 #61

I'm not going to lie, flying in and seeing the land from above damn near had me in tears it was so beautiful. Sitting out along the coast of Nuuk and just looking out at the water and mountains is also a very serene experience.

Yeah, and the skies are most often clear, visibility unlimited, boring sunsets/rises are rare, something about the air (dry ambient light?) is perfect for photos. Mountains shoot a kilometer vertical from the sea. Either midnight sun or glorious northern lights a few nights a week.

Reindeer is good and muskox is quite tasty too. And its all 100% free range organic fresh and cheap (in season). Fish, whale, and seal is an acquired delicacy. Smiley Most everything imported (which is a lot of 'normal' food) is very expensive. Like a wilted yellow broccoli for $10, but we have abundant vitamin rich flora four months of the year. Most of my veggies are frozen, milk is sealed ultra pasteurized, eggs are expensive. There has been some success growing barley and other grain in the south which hadn't grown there in 400 years. We've got potatoes and such in the fjord whose output is small, but packed with flavor and vitamins (the best though most expensive strawberries come from near the arctic region, such as Norway).

Living in the city here is as I imagine it will be like to live on Mars. Its extremely modern though you never lose touch of the extremities around you.

We've got flight connections through Copenhagen and Iceland. There are charters from Canada and the States, typically from the mining and oil industry, but also tourist scientific expeditions.

Min kæreste er en smuk dansker. Er du dansk?

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Sjalq
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September 07, 2011, 12:14:06 AM
 #62

Oh man I really want to see Iceland now! Sounds simply awesome.

From a survivalist point of view though I want a place where the people are relatively non-violent and the state is relatively non-interventionist. When the tropical fruit encounters the rotary blade you will need other people you can co-operate with. I live in South Africa in Gauteng and I really don't think it will be safe here if the supply lines are up-heaved. The people are already on edge. Cape Town in the south would probably truck along like nothing happened and it is probably one of the top 10 most scenic cities on earth. Botswana and Namibia would be ideal for survivalists, lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of land and very few people (like 1 person per 3 square kilometers).

Another place on interest would be Zimbabwe. Since it was recently decimated by government hyperinflation I think they'll maintain some sanity and have already developed the means to cope with hard times and shortages and went through that time without going into full on genocide (not that I wish what did happen on anyone).

Praat enige iemand hier Afrikaans?

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Minsc
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September 07, 2011, 12:17:15 AM
 #63

@Sjalq

I read some news article where a bunch of prude women in Iceland banned all porn.  I don't think that was quite it but my memory was fuzzy and it was something like this.

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netrin
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September 07, 2011, 12:58:47 AM
 #64

Would that be the same Iceland, whose mayor Jon Gnarr of the capital, Reykjavik, paraded in drag?




Oh and Iceland != Greenland, though they are close and both were colonies under the Danish King.

Botswana and Namibia would be ideal for survivalists, lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of land and very few people (like 1 person per 3 square kilometers).

Greenland is the least densely populated nation on Earth, with 0.026 people per km2 (or 40 km2 for each inhabitant), its quite easy to find entire valleys or mountains where no one has visited in years, perhaps ever. Western Sahara, by comparison is crowded, with a couple people on each sandy km.

Nee, maar ek het jou pragtige land besoek.

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September 07, 2011, 02:02:56 AM
 #65

Goed, ek wil graag jou mooi land gaan besoek.

My concern with Iceland is that there are simply too few people.

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September 07, 2011, 03:09:52 AM
 #66

Goed, ek wil graag jou mooi land gaan besoek.

My concern with Iceland is that there are simply too few people.

Why is that a concern? If a super power wants something it don't matter how many people are there in the eyes of a nuke.

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September 07, 2011, 10:38:06 AM
 #67


Reindeer is good and muskox is quite tasty too. And its all 100% free range organic fresh and cheap (in season). Fish, whale, and seal is an acquired delicacy. Smiley Most everything imported (which is a lot of 'normal' food) is very expensive. Like a wilted yellow broccoli for $10, but we have abundant vitamin rich flora four months of the year. Most of my veggies are frozen, milk is sealed ultra pasteurized, eggs are expensive. There has been some success growing barley and other grain in the south which hadn't grown there in 400 years. We've got potatoes and such in the fjord whose output is small, but packed with flavor and vitamins (the best though most expensive strawberries come from near the arctic region, such as Norway).

Interesting. Hopefully this growth continues and some financial burden is lifted from the locals. Those block apartments could use some new paint Wink

I had the musk ox as well. Delicious. Whale was also quite good.

Quote
Living in the city here is as I imagine it will be like to live on Mars. Its extremely modern though you never lose touch of the extremities around you.

This is probably the best way to describe it. The lack of infrastructure between towns/settlements really gives it that feeling of near-isolation.

Quote
We've got flight connections through Copenhagen and Iceland. There are charters from Canada and the States, typically from the mining and oil industry, but also tourist scientific expeditions.

I think flying to Reykjavik and then to Greenland is still the cheapest option, and it's still damn expensive for such a short flight. I would not want to pay direct from the US/Canada.

Quote
Min kæreste er en smuk dansker. Er du dansk?

Måske Smiley


@Sjalq

I read some news article where a bunch of prude women in Iceland banned all porn.  I don't think that was quite it but my memory was fuzzy and it was something like this.

They succeeded in banning the production of pornography in Iceland. Very, very tragic. They also ended their flirtation with prostitution.


Goed, ek wil graag jou mooi land gaan besoek.

My concern with Iceland is that there are simply too few people.

If you mean Iceland and not Greenland, just consider that the majority of the population resides in and around Reykjavik. When you go around the island you will come across almost depressingly small towns, but the city population is substantial.

Also, Iceland is probably the most beautiful place on earth <3

The western fjords... goddamn!

Oh yeah and Ron Paul and BC and stuff!
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September 08, 2011, 08:47:10 AM
 #68

My concern is that lots of the comforts we now enjoy are the result of fine divisions of labour and the ability to trade.

The city I live in has 7x the pop of the entirety of Iceland.

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netrin
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September 08, 2011, 01:42:55 PM
 #69

My concern is that lots of the comforts we now enjoy are the result of fine divisions of labour and the ability to trade.

Maybe we define comforts differently, but the females of Iceland are hot.

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September 08, 2011, 06:28:26 PM
 #70

Maybe we define comforts differently, but the females of Iceland are hot.

Yes, women with little Eumelanin (the useful one) and women with a lot of Pheomelanin (useless for UV protection as causes cancer on exposure to sunlight but also is what causes freckles and red hair) is what makes women look good.

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September 08, 2011, 07:12:12 PM
 #71

Ron Paul's bill would be the best thing that ever happened to bitcoin:

H.R. 1098: Free Competition in Currency Act of 2011
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h112-1098

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To repeal the legal tender laws, to prohibit taxation on certain coins and bullion, and to repeal superfluous sections related to coinage.

Quote
no State may assess any tax or fee on any currency, or any other monetary instrument, which is used in the transaction of interstate commerce or commerce with a foreign country.

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netrin
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September 08, 2011, 09:48:22 PM
 #72

The following summary was written by the Congressional Research Service, a well-respected nonpartisan arm of the Library of Congress.
Quote
3/15/2011--Introduced.

Free Competition in Currency Act of 2011 - Repeals the federal law establishing U.S. coins, currency, and reserve notes as legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Prohibits any tax on any coin, medal, token, or gold, silver, platinum, palladium, or rhodium bullion issued by a state, the United States, a foreign government, or any other person. Prohibits states from assessing any tax or fee on any currency or other monetary instrument that is used in interstate or foreign commerce and that has legal tender status under the Constitution. Repeals provisions of the federal criminal code relating to uttering coins of gold, silver, or other metal for use as current money and making or possessing likenesses of such coins. Abates any current prosecution under such provisions and nullifies any previous convictions.

How should the first sentence be interpreted: "Repeals the federal law establishing U.S. coins, currency, and reserve notes as legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues." That dollars are not longer legal tender, that they are no longer the ONLY legal tender, or what is meant here?

Also what about "Repeals provisions of the federal criminal code relating to uttering coins of gold, ..."? American's can't currently talk about gold coins?

Do these 'repeals' only mean that this bill overrides previous bills?

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September 08, 2011, 10:12:20 PM
 #73

The following summary was written by the Congressional Research Service, a well-respected nonpartisan arm of the Library of Congress.
Quote
3/15/2011--Introduced.

Free Competition in Currency Act of 2011 - Repeals the federal law establishing U.S. coins, currency, and reserve notes as legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Prohibits any tax on any coin, medal, token, or gold, silver, platinum, palladium, or rhodium bullion issued by a state, the United States, a foreign government, or any other person. Prohibits states from assessing any tax or fee on any currency or other monetary instrument that is used in interstate or foreign commerce and that has legal tender status under the Constitution. Repeals provisions of the federal criminal code relating to uttering coins of gold, silver, or other metal for use as current money and making or possessing likenesses of such coins. Abates any current prosecution under such provisions and nullifies any previous convictions.

How should the first sentence be interpreted: "Repeals the federal law establishing U.S. coins, currency, and reserve notes as legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues." That dollars are not longer legal tender, that they are no longer the ONLY legal tender, or what is meant here?

Also what about "Repeals provisions of the federal criminal code relating to uttering coins of gold, ..."? American's can't currently talk about gold coins?

Do these 'repeals' only mean that this bill overrides previous bills?

No longer the ONLY legal tender, But as soon as the restrictions are lifted it will quickly loose any users.
I refer you to Google Bernard von NotHaus and the Liberty Dollar

You can no longer be a gold changer with out being licensed. And if you a serf hording gold your targeted as a domestic terrorist. Shhhh The simple act of supporting Ron Paul is cause for the current establishment to label you as such.

It will NULLIFY (a magic word "they" don't want you to know) All the Previous BS that protected the current world currency in use and FREE all those falsely convicted of crimes which the Federal Reserve and others had put in place.

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September 08, 2011, 10:23:09 PM
 #74

The following summary was written by the Congressional Research Service, a well-respected nonpartisan arm of the Library of Congress.
Quote
3/15/2011--Introduced.

Free Competition in Currency Act of 2011 - Repeals the federal law establishing U.S. coins, currency, and reserve notes as legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. Prohibits any tax on any coin, medal, token, or gold, silver, platinum, palladium, or rhodium bullion issued by a state, the United States, a foreign government, or any other person. Prohibits states from assessing any tax or fee on any currency or other monetary instrument that is used in interstate or foreign commerce and that has legal tender status under the Constitution. Repeals provisions of the federal criminal code relating to uttering coins of gold, silver, or other metal for use as current money and making or possessing likenesses of such coins. Abates any current prosecution under such provisions and nullifies any previous convictions.

How should the first sentence be interpreted: "Repeals the federal law establishing U.S. coins, currency, and reserve notes as legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues." That dollars are not longer legal tender, that they are no longer the ONLY legal tender, or what is meant here?

Also what about "Repeals provisions of the federal criminal code relating to uttering coins of gold, ..."? American's can't currently talk about gold coins?

Do these 'repeals' only mean that this bill overrides previous bills?

With the federal laws repealed, or with a court willing to read the clear language of Article I, section 10 of the Constitution, no currency would have any special legal status.  This would be the prompt demise of Federal Reserve Notes, because those are only used because federal law says that people must accept them for repayment of debts.

Basically a dollar was once a silver coin of a given weight.  Eventually, we had silver certificates that were redeemable for silver coins.  Fractional reserve isn't exactly a new invention, so people wouldn't always accept these paper dollars.  So, they added a legal tender law.  Before the tender laws, if you borrowed silver dollars, your creditor could make you repay with silver dollars, and a court would enforce a judgment against you if you didn't pay in kind.  After the law, the courts recognized the paper dollars as extinguishing any debt, no matter what the note said.  So, your creditor no longer had the option of suing you to force repayment in metal.

That law is pretty much the key to inflation.  Paper money can be debased without limit, because it looked just as worthless before as it does after.  Metal debasement is a bit harder to do, because people can easily spot differences in metal coins of different compositions.  Not that it stopped the Romans from reducing the silver in their coins from nearly 100% down to homeopathic levels.

Wikipedia has a decent article on Legal Tender.  The section on United States gives a very abridged history of how it played out here.  If you want a complete history of these games, you'll have to dig up a copy of Pieces of Eight by Edwin Vieira.

Oh, and uttering is related to forgery.

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September 08, 2011, 11:22:05 PM
 #75

My concern is that lots of the comforts we now enjoy are the result of fine divisions of labour and the ability to trade.

Maybe we define comforts differently, but the females of Iceland are hot.

Second only to the ladies of the Faroes Wink
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September 08, 2011, 11:39:12 PM
 #76

From the First Article of the United States Constitution

Quote
Section 8: Powers of Congress >> Enumerated powers

The Congress shall have power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow Money on the credit of the United States;

To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

...

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current coin of the United States;

...

To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

...

Section 10: Limits on the States >> Clause 1: Contracts Clause

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

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September 14, 2011, 08:09:47 AM
 #77


Bitcoin mentioned by Lawrence White in...
Hearing on Free Competition in Currency Act of 2011
http://financialservices.house.gov/Calendar/EventSingle.aspx?EventID=258253

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netrin
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September 14, 2011, 08:35:37 AM
 #78

Interesting... Do you mind summarizing? I can't retrieve the audio or video.

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September 14, 2011, 12:58:30 PM
 #79

This gives some details:
http://www.goldmoney.com/gold-research/gold-money-and-currency-competition-in-the-us.html

Gold money and currency competition in the US

Quote
Dr. Lawrence Parks, of FAME, who was interviewed by James Turk for the GoldMoney Foundation not long ago, testified on the severity of the fiat currency situation and the very real danger of a dollar collapse. Dr. Lawrence H. White, author of “Competition and Currency”, also testified. Many of the subjects discussed at these hearings will be familiar to our readers: fiat money, competing currencies, gold money, legal tender, inflation, the gold standard and full reserve banking.

Of course the political discussion is no longer academic, since a growing number of alternative currencies already exist, and history is also full of long lasting real life examples, many of which you can learn about at the GoldMoney Foundation.

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September 14, 2011, 01:01:01 PM
 #80

Interesting... Do you mind summarizing? I can't retrieve the audio or video.

He is just telling a list of posible competing currencies and the last one is Bitcoin. Its nice to hear Bitcoin named as currency in the USA Congress.
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