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Author Topic: watching bitcoin price and discussing it on this forum  (Read 5685 times)
bassclef
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December 29, 2013, 05:32:34 PM
 #21

watching the price of bitcoin is like watching "how I met your mother", you get pissed because of not knowing the mother but at the same time you do not want to know who is the mother because simply the show will end Smiley

Read up on Schrödinger's Cat, it is a thought experiment in a similar vein, it will blow your mind Wink .


I am trying to understand the experiment but Quantum physic in general is one of the things that I want to spend more time to study ( try to understand ).... thank you for the link already bookmarked it to read the full article later.

this is a little off-topic, but physics is my thing, and i'd love to try to give a layman's interpretation of such a technical thought experiment Grin

the idea is that the classic notion of determinism, that one can use trajectory and velocity and momentum to determine the future state of a given system (similarly to how one judges and executes shots on a pool table), breaks down completely on small enough scales.

in pool each of the balls has a definite location. you can strike one, giving it a definite velocity in a definite direction and with practice pretty handily work backwards through the physics that governs the behavior of the balls and, remarkably consistently, make difficult shots.

if the pool table were the size of an atom, however, and the balls were subatomic particles, the game would be significantly harder. the early pioneers of quantum mechanics (quantum meaning "unit", like the indivisible subatomic particles) realized quickly that the smaller something is, the more strangely it behaved when they tried to "find" it -- that is, determine its location.

it turns out that nothing has a definite location, which is hard to wrap one's head around, but for small things at small scales it's very obvious and a whole new physics needed to be developed. when measuring an electron, for instance, its location seemed to correspond with the amplitude of a wave, with different probabilities of finding the particle in a certain location corresponding to the amplitude of the wave at different points. this, incidentally, is the basis of Schrodinger's Equation, which formalized de Broglie's work.

in the image i linked, the sharp and pointy distribution corresponds to a very massive thing, like a billiard-ball, whose location is much more definite than a very light thing, like an electron (lighter by about 30 orders of magnitude!), about which it isn't an exaggeration to say that it could be anywhere in the universe.

this brings us to the star of Schrodinger's thought experiment, a heavy atom undergoing radioactive decay. one of the insights that quantum mechanics gave us is an explanation of this strange phenomenon. some atoms, for reasons previously unknown, randomly and violently ejected bits of the nucleus from time to time. the strangest thing about this is that is is impossible to know exactly when this event would occur for a single atom, but groups of the same isotope always obey a half-life rule, such that after one half-life (a constant) for a given isotope has passed, exactly half of a given sample of isotope will have decayed.

sounds like quantum weirdness, doesn't it? that's because it is!

what's actually happening is that the particles in the nucleus suddenly find themselves outside of it and are ejected away by the electrostatic force that causes protons to repel each other. weird.

but this leaves us in a quagmire of conceptualization. is it really true that the deterministic world we perceive is really made up of unfathomable masses of fuzzy, random, indistinct processes?

Schrodinger tried to bridge the gap to demonstrate just how weird the implications of this are. if we arrange things so that the radioactive decay of an atom, for which it is literally impossible to know whether or not it has decayed after a certain time t, is tied to a mechanism that will kill a cat (why a cat? ask Schrodinger), then we end up in a situation in which the entire state of the box becomes quantumly uncertain. generally, we model this uncertainty on the subatomic scale as a superposition of every possibility, i.e. a probability curve, but it seems extremely counterintuitive to try to conceptualize the contents of the box as a superposition of live cat and dead cat (and if time t is the isotope's half-life, the chances are exactly 50-50!).

anyway, i hope you appreciated the explanation Wink i tried to give a complete picture of the conceptual underpinnings without going into too much detail. lots of good vocabulary to wiki for future inquiries, too!

--arepo

Wow thanks for the pre-coffee read. I was fascinated by this stuff in high school but went to a conservatory to study music instead. Very cool.
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December 29, 2013, 05:34:19 PM
 #22

Never too late to do what you love

mmitech (OP)
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December 29, 2013, 05:54:30 PM
 #23

Who is the mother??

I know some people who doesnt know yet will have to see who is the mother, but they will find out anyway because the season sucks really.


hint: I know you thought it will be robin (at least I did) or one of the characters already playing but it is not...

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December 31, 2013, 05:48:26 AM
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Quote from: arepo
anyway, i hope you appreciated the explanation Wink i tried to give a complete picture of the conceptual underpinnings without going into too much detail. lots of good vocabulary to wiki for future inquiries, too!

--arepo

Very good write up. Not the first one I've read, but one of the better ones for sure. Thanks.
thank you very much for the effort, I realy like how you tried to keep it as simple as it can be, you must be a teacher ?  it is not my domain of work but I remember studying Structure of materials at university, and it was a hell of fun, but since then I didn't read any relatedcscience articles or magazines, I would love to make sometime to educate my self..

 maybe spending less time on these forum and stop reading some worthless posts and trolls will spare me the time to do so Smiley
Much appreciated. And one of the reasons I'm also addicted to this forum. You just never know what will show up.   Cool
Wow thanks for the pre-coffee read. I was fascinated by this stuff in high school but went to a conservatory to study music instead. Very cool.

thanks for the feedback guys! i'm not a teacher by profession, but i'm definitely an educator at heart. i love being back here on the forums because it has always been a great place for both learning from and teaching the community, what i can. in fact, most of my TA posts aim at helping those who are trading with their gut (read: gambling with their money) learn some basic techniques for gauging the various aspects of the market that you can glean from price and volume data. in fact, i just started a thread detailing a few notes about the current situation. if my work is well-received, it will be the first of many reports Smiley i very much appreciate the feedback.

--arepo

this sentence has fifteen words, seventy-four letters, four commas, one hyphen, and a period.
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