bitcoin-trader.biz

[thomasm1964]

I did a whois lookup (www.whois.com) of the domain name bitcoin-trader.biz, which is registered in Panama. Their contact / administration details etc, are protected by whoisguard.com which is also registered in Panama.

I have this morning sent an email to support@whoisguard.com to ask whether they have any information about the proper trading of bitcoin-trader.biz. I have specifically mentioned the website page (with link), this forum (with link) and the Facebook page (with link).

I am not sure that one email from me will cause whoisguard.com to do anything but perhaps they might if they start to receive lots of emails from different people.

The link to the whois information is http://www.whois.com/whois/bitcoin-trader.biz

The email address for whoisguard,com is support@whoisguard.com and the website for whoisguard is http://www.whoisguard.com/

I think the time is past when we owe BitCoin Trader the benefit of the doubt


Thomas.

[1713495875]

1713495875

[1713495875]

1713495875

[1713495875]

1713495875

[Rannasha]

Poking WhoisGuard won't do anything. Their entire business is to hide registration details from others and they're not going to just give you the information because you ask nicely. It would destroy trust in their operation and crash their business.

[Puppet]

If such sock puppets aren't legally complicit to fraud, then maybe they should be? Anyone who signs up to promote HYIPs that turn out to be scams, even if they aren't the actual kingpins, should be held liable to a certain extent.

(b) Prosecution of persons who aid and abet violations
For purposes of any action brought by the Commission under subparagraph (b) or (d) of section 77t of this title, any person that knowingly or recklessly provides substantial assistance to another person in violation of a provision of this subchapter, or of any rule or regulation issued under this subchapter, shall be deemed to be in violation of such provision to the same extent as the person to whom such assistance is provided.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/15/77o

So yes, he must likely is liable under SEC regulation. Just saying "I didnt know" isnt good enough  if the behavior is deemed "reckless". If you are promoting an unregistered security offered by anonymous people promising returns only a ponzi scheme can, Im pretty sure that would qualify as reckless.

[Fireinthedawn]

Everybody prepare for some shitty explanation and closure 

I call it right now:  they will come out and say they were hacked and all the bitcoin was stolen in their hot wallet.

Isn't that standard procedure?

Disclosure: I have roughly 2500 on deposit with bitcoin trader an on the line.

that would Contradict prior statements made by the group.

source: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=677591.0

and I quote

"I wonder where the trading pool funds are held? Are they held as BTC in a cold wallet somewhere? Are they held as USD in UK financial institutions? I have not got a clue. Maybe ignorance is bliss. The less we know the less the bad guys know. Eventually the funds have to get to BTC and traded on exchanges.

We try our best to keep your funds as secure as possible and as little fiat at the exchanges as manageable. Of course ALL bitcoins are in cold storage outside trading hours.
"

if they tried to claim the Hot wallet was hacked it would be an extremely unsophisticated reply  to current difficulties because those of us in the KNOW are aware that the primary store of them is in cold storage, in other words it's not connected to the internet 24/7 in order to make life harder for hackers.

the wallets are only connected when necessary.

[ElectricSavant]

I was told by support once..... that the investment would not be affected by the rise and fall of BTC as it is disconnected from the balance:

It was our intention to remove the bitcoin volatility from our investment plans and therefore decided to keep all account balances in USD. This eliminates the risk that earnings are wiped away in case of a bitcoin depreciation.

Now if you invest with bitcoin, the only risk you are facing is the period of time between the purchase of bitcoin and depostiing them with us and vice versa once from the moment you receive your cashout until the time you are able to liquidated the coins into fiat. However, both can easily be managed by picking a day when the volatility is very low.

Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.

With best regards,
Bitcoin Trader Support

[ElectricSavant]

Come on BTC trader....do the right thing. I do not want to spend time on tracking you down to get my 10k back...I still am holding out hope for you...but you have disappeared from the the support tickets and the reports on your blog. The trading has ceased and you have stopped updating the earnings calendar...My three cashout requests are still sitting unfullfilled and not being disbursed for a week now.

I am sorry to hear that you had technical troubles and from what you reported your wallet was fixed a few days ago and you are now performing maintenance. Your investors have now taken notice that their funds may be lost due to the extreme amount of time that has passed during your troubles and your recent silence has not helped. This can spiral out of control for you and your handling of this technical problem may be the cause of the spiral.

ElectricSavant

[fingertoe11]

I was told by support once..... that the investment would not be affected by the rise and fall of BTC as it is disconnected from the balance:

It was our intention to remove the bitcoin volatility from our investment plans and therefore decided to keep all account balances in USD. This eliminates the risk that earnings are wiped away in case of a bitcoin depreciation.

Now if you invest with bitcoin, the only risk you are facing is the period of time between the purchase of bitcoin and depostiing them with us and vice versa once from the moment you receive your cashout until the time you are able to liquidated the coins into fiat. However, both can easily be managed by picking a day when the volatility is very low.

Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.

With best regards,
Bitcoin Trader Support

I have been asking them for months how they would remain solvent if bitcoin dropped to 300 or so...  The shares that closed on the weekend of the crash where bought at 650 and sold <300...   They never where able to give a straight answer.  It's magic!  

So you don't really need a "hot wallet hack" to explain their cashflow issue.  Most savy traders cashed out where they thought the bottom was..  BT had to pay out at that rate which was quite steep., and their hot wallet ran empty.  

I suspect the lack of audit probably reduced the renewals and new investments more than normal on just the wrong weekend..

[conspirosphere.tk]

I will be publishing my report to my Unofficial group in a matter of time.

Please repost here your findings since several of us would not touch FB with a 10-foot pole.

[ElectricSavant]

I was told by support once..... that the investment would not be affected by the rise and fall of BTC as it is disconnected from the balance:

It was our intention to remove the bitcoin volatility from our investment plans and therefore decided to keep all account balances in USD. This eliminates the risk that earnings are wiped away in case of a bitcoin depreciation.

Now if you invest with bitcoin, the only risk you are facing is the period of time between the purchase of bitcoin and depostiing them with us and vice versa once from the moment you receive your cashout until the time you are able to liquidated the coins into fiat. However, both can easily be managed by picking a day when the volatility is very low.

Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.

With best regards,
Bitcoin Trader Support

I have been asking them for months how they would remain solvent if bitcoin dropped to 300 or so...  The shares that closed on the weekend of the crash where bought at 650 and sold <300...   They never where able to give a straight answer.  It's magic! 

So you don't really need a "hot wallet hack" to explain their cashflow issue.  Most savy traders cashed out where they thought the bottom was..  BT had to pay out at that rate which was quite steep., and their hot wallet ran empty.

I suspect the lack of audit probably reduced the renewals and new investments more than normal on just the wrong weekend..

From what I understand they use the USD as the safe haven. It is the time between the transfers where the risk lies. I suppose this could apply this to their time in the arb trade also...perhaps they get neutral daily..but the recent drop in BTC and the point made here is valid...they need more usd to process cashouts today. The various cloud mining operations that are not disbursing could reveal THAT THEY TOO WERE PONZI SCHEMES, JUST BY THE FACT THAT THEY ARE NOT PAYING OUT...BEWARE IF YOU HAVE A CLOUD MINER TELLING YOU THEY HAVE MAINTENANCE ISSUES...SAY LIKE MIMOCLOUD IS CLAIMING...

[redwraith]

Everybody prepare for some shitty explanation and closure 

I call it right now:  they will come out and say they were hacked and all the bitcoin was stolen in their hot wallet.

Isn't that standard procedure?

Disclosure: I have roughly 2500 on deposit with bitcoin trader an on the line.

that would Contradict prior statements made by the group.

source: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=677591.0

and I quote

"I wonder where the trading pool funds are held? Are they held as BTC in a cold wallet somewhere? Are they held as USD in UK financial institutions? I have not got a clue. Maybe ignorance is bliss. The less we know the less the bad guys know. Eventually the funds have to get to BTC and traded on exchanges.

We try our best to keep your funds as secure as possible and as little fiat at the exchanges as manageable. Of course ALL bitcoins are in cold storage outside trading hours.
"

if they tried to claim the Hot wallet was hacked it would be an extremely unsophisticated reply  to current difficulties because those of us in the KNOW are aware that the primary store of them is in cold storage, in other words it's not connected to the internet 24/7 in order to make life harder for hackers.

the wallets are only connected when necessary.

That is true... I was being sarcastic anyway

[ElectricSavant]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

[Illutian]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

Just wait till the US Dollar is no longer used as the World's Currency Reserve, which I might add use to be the British Pound before Nazi Germany bombed most of their economy during World War II.

Look up "BRICS" and what they're doing to dislodge the USD as the 'go to' currency for international trading of goods and services.

The day is fast approaching when the world will metaphorically walk back to the table and cut our 'credit card' up and demand cash payment (in this case for out $16+ trillion foreign debt).

The Fiat System is the largest Ponzi/Pyramid Scheme in history. Seriously, a system backed by no hard assets; just the word of the Government that issues that fiat currency. Or even better when they do back it with hard assets. It's always Gold or Silver. WHAT THE FUCK good is that shit. You can't eat it, you can't drink it.

To have a stable 'paper and coin' currency system you'd want to pick hard assets that are useful. Like land, food, water; stuff we all need to live.

[ElectricSavant]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

Just wait till the US Dollar is no longer used as the World's Currency Reserve, which I might add use to be the British Pound before Nazi Germany bombed most of their economy during World War II.

Look up "BRICS" and what they're doing to dislodge the USD as the 'go to' currency for international trading of goods and services.

The day is fast approaching when the world will metaphorically walk back to the table and cut our 'credit card' up and demand cash payment (in this case for out $16+ trillion foreign debt).

The Fiat System is the largest Ponzi/Pyramid Scheme in history. Seriously, a system backed by no hard assets; just the word of the Government that issues that fiat currency. Or even better when they do back it with hard assets. It's always Gold or Silver. WHAT THE FUCK good is that shit. You can't eat it, you can't drink it.

To have a stable 'paper and coin' currency system you'd want to pick hard assets that are useful. Like land, food, water; stuff we all need to live.

You know...I think Warren Buffett might agree with you...

[Puppet]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

Wait so people who invested fiat money in this scam will get their money back you think?
Ha!

Its a scam, it doesnt matter if you gave them dollars, gold or bitcoin. If you are dumb enough not to see something ran by an anonymous group who claim to make > 3000% YoY with your money is a scam or ponzi, you only have yourself to blame. Try sending dollars to the next Nigerian Prince who emails you and see how that works out.

[ElectricSavant]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

Wait so people who invested fiat money in this scam will get their money back you think?
Ha!

Its a scam, it doesnt matter if you gave them dollars, gold or bitcoin. If you are dumb enough not to see something ran by an anonymous group who claim to make > 3000% YoY with your money is a scam or ponzi, you only have yourself to blame. Try sending dollars to the next Nigerian Prince who emails you and see how that works out.

I deserved that.

LookingforprofitinallthewrongplacesSavant

[redwraith]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

Thieves and scammers use Paypal and Western Union too.  It's not a bitcoin problem, it comes down to how careful each individual is with where they put their money and HOW they use their money.  Whether it's bitcoin or fiat,  as long as something has a perceived value, a percentage of the population will try to trick you out of it.

[ElectricSavant]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

Thieves and scammers use Paypal and Western Union too.  It's not a bitcoin problem, it comes down to how careful each individual is with where they put their money and HOW they use their money.  Whether it's bitcoin or fiat,  as long as something has a perceived value, a percentage of the population will try to trick you out of it.

This is true and BTC is the logical anonymous magnet..I do not need btc to transfer money...I do not have the calling. We all make choices and I have decided for myself btc is going nowhere its just a passing fancy. I have been wrong all my life about things...so chances are that I am wrong...I have a bitter taste in my mouth from btc and my decisions...can't change that.

[Rannasha]

You know folks...I have not been able to make any money with bitcoin it is just a passing scam...We have paypal and transfer systems much more reliable and that are not a hotbed for snake oiling scamming theives (the anonymous nature of BTC is their magnet).

I am tending to side with Warren Buffett recently.

ElectricSavant

The fact that you haven't made any money with Bitcoin is not Bitcoins fault considering the fact that you're willingly putting your money into Ponzi schemes.

[Puppet]

This is true and BTC is the logical anonymous magnet..I do not need btc to transfer money...I do not have the calling. We all make choices and I have decided for myself btc is going nowhere its just a passing fancy. I have been wrong all my life about things...so chances are that I am wrong...I have a bitter taste in my mouth from btc and my decisions...can't change that.

You didnt "invest" in this scam to transfer money, you did so expecting a fat profit. The same reason may lead you to buy and hold bitcoins (in cold storage). Mine so far have gone up ~10000% in just a few years; while that may not happen again, Im still confident it will go up further and  I dont get why people think that potential is not enough and waste their precious coins on scams hoping to do better.

[ElectricSavant]

This is true and BTC is the logical anonymous magnet..I do not need btc to transfer money...I do not have the calling. We all make choices and I have decided for myself btc is going nowhere its just a passing fancy. I have been wrong all my life about things...so chances are that I am wrong...I have a bitter taste in my mouth from btc and my decisions...can't change that.

You didnt "invest" in this scam to transfer money, you did so expecting a fat profit. The same reason may lead you to buy and hold bitcoins (in cold storage). Mine so far have gone up ~10000% in just a few years; while that may not happen again, Im still confident it will go up further and  I dont get why people think that potential is not enough and waste their precious coins on scams hoping to do better.

Don't get me wrong....If BTC were more traceable and trackable where accountability could be enforced...it would be my transfer system of choice. You folks can beat me over the head as much as you want...I made a mistake..so there now beat me...You guys remind me of my wife...reveal a weakness and she is all over it. BTC sucks as a transfer system so there!!

Besides the banks in the USA who hold all of our mortgages and have all of the power will never allow virtual currencies to take away their market share...

Give up your calling all of you  progressives...Obama lovers....ETC....The world is what it is and I have no faith in mankind. BTC is not your answer. There is no perfect world that you are going to achieve, so get out of the fantasy and look around you.

LordoftheFliesSavant

P.S. A friend of mine that is older than I is much much more skeptical and cynical than I...but I consider him wise...He makes no friends as he does not put himself out there with a trusting attitude. He makes no investments other than tangible ones because he believes everybody offering investments are the only ones that make any money. Wifey agrees with him too..perhaps this is my new handle...ElectricStopsChasingAfterRainbowsSavant.