NXT Ought to be Taken Seriously

[tracphil]

A billions were released by an insider team via exchange even before the code was open sourced.
Scam scam scam! Dont understand how people fall for this.
Its biggest scam in the history of crypto currencies.

If approximately 1.5% of accounts own greater than 60% of all bitcoins, by your logic, how is bitcoin not a scam? If you can explain to  me how that distribution is fairer than Nxt, I will believe that you not an absolute idiot.

[Anon136]

A billions were released by an insider team via exchange even before the code was open sourced.
Scam scam scam! Dont understand how people fall for this.
Its biggest scam in the history of crypto currencies.

If approximately 1.5% of accounts own greater than 60% of all bitcoins, by your logic, how is bitcoin not a scam? If you can explain to  me how that distribution is fairer than Nxt, I will believe that you not an absolute idiot.

hey can you give a me a source for that? if its true than i think nxt has already surpassed bitcoin in homogeneity of distribution

[flipstyle]

It is a good article. Many valid points.
As for how to fix the hoarding of the initial funds, maybe a few of the big holders can start 1 mil nxt lotteries.

Would perhaps be more feasible if these stakeholders weren't so geared towards milking profits vs. caring about even distribution and ensuring the coin's long term success.

Makes me lulz when I see these huge stakeholders put up NXT FS threads, yet refusing to sell/trade any lower than 10% above current market value, ofentimes more.  All this when they're already sitting on 1000%+ pure profit.

[bithic]

A billions were released by an insider team via exchange even before the code was open sourced.
Scam scam scam! Dont understand how people fall for this.
Its biggest scam in the history of crypto currencies.

If approximately 1.5% of accounts own greater than 60% of all bitcoins, by your logic, how is bitcoin not a scam? If you can explain to  me how that distribution is fairer than Nxt, I will believe that you not an absolute idiot.

hey can you give a me a source for that? if its true than i think nxt has already surpassed bitcoin in homogeneity of distribution

According to the stats on http://bitcoinrichlist.com/charts/bitcoin-distribution-by-address?atblock=275000
1.18% of all non-trivial bitcoin accounts hold 68.89% of all bitcoins.

What I mean by all non-trivial bitcoin accounts is all those with more than 0.001 bitcoins. All accounts with more than 100 bitcoins make up only 1.18% of this total, yet they hold 68.89% of the wealth. So the overwhelming majority of bitcoins is controlled by the top 1.18%, and that's after 5 years of distribution.

[markm]

Well yeah sure five years is plenty of time for the rich to grab the lion's share of anything that comes along.

You could give out one whatever to each person on earth and it likely wouldn't take five years to achieve a worse skewed distribution than that, at least if what you give everyone is genuinely useful and valuable.

What are the distributions of gold, platinum, diamonds, emeralds, rubies, acres of land, dollars, yen, etc etc etc?

-MarkM-

[peterlustig]

I don't like the concept of the rich getting richer, which is why I also dislike PoS.

[axxian]

First of all I have a background in marketing and sales. NOT IT duh!

You do realised that most coins alts nxt peer etc anything you name it, are being put together by a bunch of IT guru.
In the real world IT guru's work is worthless without someone to market their product to sell. E.g. Earthcoin has a decent marketing team same goes got NXT, but they only provide information and marketing how great their coins are without some decent merchants wanting to adopt them as payment methods. Same idea as buying and owning a private jet in a no fly zone, whereas if NXT > BTC using the same example just mentioned BTC = a car but you can drive in around and get things done in a no fly zone. People just need to understand the value of a currency beyond speculation is where it can be spent. I personally think NXT is a great coin but the distribution of coin weren't professionally done, If NXT would have a relaunch and just about anyone that knows about it now can invest in the IPO I believe it will be so much popular. And if NXT marketing team stop posting how great NXT are and get some decent merchants to accept NXT would be so much more ideal. Why would people use BTC to buy NXT...and figure out to buy something with their cryptocurrency they have to transfer back their NXT to BTC to spent. Get the point people.... don't just look at the product itself...

[td services]

There was no "insider team". The release was publicly announced on this forum and everyone had plenty of opportunity to buy in before the genesis (and I wish I did!). ... The first code release was on Jan 3rd, and before that everyone had the opportunity to buy and sell Nxt on dgex.com. Now, after the code release, everyone still has that same opportunity. The reasons for a delayed/staggered code release have been much discussed, and I believe it is a necessary requirement for a truly unique offering in today's competitive market.  

This is not completely true. I was not allowed to buy in when the pre-sale was suddenly closed without prior notice while I was seeking clarification of the deadline. People were generally under the impression it was open until January 3rd. I believe the actual reason for the sudden close of the pre-sale without advance warning was to prevent further dilution of existing investment, but no one wants to admit to this. NXT from the presale started being sold a week or so later at a 4762% mark-up.



From https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=303898.480 :

Can we still join in between now and January 3? I haven't really seen any clear definition of a deadline.

I'm waiting for the answer. BCNext reads this thread.

Some changes in the plan:

1. Fundraising is over. That last 1 BTC, sent after the 2nd marking transaction, will be accepted but no more deposits should be made.
2. Nxt will be launched earlier than on the 3rd of January, right after the final test.
3. New Nxt users r supposed to be attracted by selling NXT and distributing via Nxt Faucet.
4. Messaging feature will be released later to avoid situation when somebody attempts to bloat the blockchain making it too huge for newcomers.

BTW we need one more bootstrapping server, coz 2 servers is not enough.

So, if I understand this correctly:

1) the main dev (BCNext) no longer posts directly to this thread but you purport to communicate with him and speak for him about the project, something we can't confirm,
2) the deadline for contributing BTC to acquire Nxt, which was originally described as being open until the genesis block was approved by the community sometimes at least a month from now, is now suddenly declared over with no advance warning; and
3) the BTC that were already sent to acquire Nxt, which the main dev (BCNext) promised earlier in this thread not to touch until the genesis block was generated, have now been moved.

[msin]

There was no "insider team". The release was publicly announced on this forum and everyone had plenty of opportunity to buy in before the genesis (and I wish I did!). ... The first code release was on Jan 3rd, and before that everyone had the opportunity to buy and sell Nxt on dgex.com. Now, after the code release, everyone still has that same opportunity. The reasons for a delayed/staggered code release have been much discussed, and I believe it is a necessary requirement for a truly unique offering in today's competitive market.  

This is not completely true. I was not allowed to buy in when the pre-sale was suddenly closed without prior notice while I was seeking clarification of the deadline. People were generally under the impression it was open until January 3rd. I believe the actual reason for the sudden close of the pre-sale without advance warning was to prevent further dilution of existing investment, but no one wants to admit to this.



From https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=303898.480 :

Can we still join in between now and January 3? I haven't really seen any clear definition of a deadline.

I'm waiting for the answer. BCNext reads this thread.

Some changes in the plan:

1. Fundraising is over. That last 1 BTC, sent after the 2nd marking transaction, will be accepted but no more deposits should be made.
2. Nxt will be launched earlier than on the 3rd of January, right after the final test.
3. New Nxt users r supposed to be attracted by selling NXT and distributing via Nxt Faucet.
4. Messaging feature will be released later to avoid situation when somebody attempts to bloat the blockchain making it too huge for newcomers.

BTW we need one more bootstrapping server, coz 2 servers is not enough.

So, if I understand this correctly:

1) the main dev (BCNext) no longer posts directly to this thread but you purport to communicate with him and speak for him about the project, something we can't confirm,
2) the deadline for contributing BTC to acquire Nxt, which was originally described as being open until the genesis block was approved by the community sometimes at least a month from now, is now suddenly declared over with no advance warning; and
3) the BTC that were already sent to acquire Nxt, which the main dev (BCNext) promised earlier in this thread not to touch until the genesis block was generated, have now been moved.

So what, neither was I, but I don't go around complaining about it.  Stay with Ethereum, you can put in 10BTC and it will drown out by several thousand BTC from idiot investors looking to get rich quick.  You are an idiot to think the decision has anything to do with dilution.

[td services]

I am refuting all claims that everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to invest in NXT. This is simply not true.

[Anon136]

Well yeah sure five years is plenty of time for the rich to grab the lion's share of anything that comes along.

You could give out one whatever to each person on earth and it likely wouldn't take five years to achieve a worse skewed distribution than that, at least if what you give everyone is genuinely useful and valuable.

What are the distributions of gold, platinum, diamonds, emeralds, rubies, acres of land, dollars, yen, etc etc etc?

-MarkM-

Hey mark what did you think of the essay? Did you find any mistakes?

[td services]

I am refuting all claims that everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to invest in NXT. This is simply not true.

The sooner you realize that "everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to invest in NXT" BEFORE THE GENESIS BLOCK WAS GENERATED, the better it will be for your psychological well-being.

This could apply in other situations as well... the sooner one realizes that "everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to" mine thousands of BTC BEFORE DIFFICULTY EXPLODED, the better it will be for his/her psychological well-being.

The genesis block was not created yet. Further discussion is pointless at this point, and you are correct that my emotions regarding NXT have been toxic. I was moving on to other things, but continued to see NXT come up in forums on other projects I'm following with initial claims that the distribution was fair and that everyone had the opportunity to invest in it. The boil which festered for the last 2 months has popped and drained.

[msin]

I am refuting all claims that everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to invest in NXT. This is simply not true.

The sooner you realize that "everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to invest in NXT" BEFORE THE GENESIS BLOCK WAS GENERATED, the better it will be for your psychological well-being.

This could apply in other situations as well... the sooner one realizes that "everyone who wanted to and knew about it were able to" mine thousands of BTC BEFORE DIFFICULTY EXPLODED, the better it will be for his/her psychological well-being.

The genesis block was not created yet. Further discussion is pointless at this point, and you are correct that my emotions regarding NXT have been toxic. I was moving on to other things, but continued to see NXT come up in forums on other projects I'm following with initial claims that the distribution was fair and that everyone had the opportunity to invest in it. The boil which festered for the last 2 months has popped and drained.

Congratulations, you have officially become a troll.

[td services]

The genesis block was not created yet.

For some reason you are choosing to NOT face the facts... it is ONLY because the Genesis Block WAS generated by BCNext that you did not have a chance to send BTC + Hash. The next opportunity was to buy at 0.000001 NXT/BTC, until a few posts back you could buy as low as 0.000035, and starting today who knows how high of a rate you will get.

It must be clear... I truly DO NOT believe you have not understood how this all went down. You are choosing to present the facts in a way that is not representative of how the Genesis Block of a secure 100% POS cryptocurrency gets generated... you only know why. I just hope you picked up a few NXT in the process... SERIOUSLY!  

From https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=303898.480 , note dates:

Can we still join in between now and January 3? I haven't really seen any clear definition of a deadline.

I'm waiting for the answer. BCNext reads this thread.

Some changes in the plan:

1. Fundraising is over. That last 1 BTC, sent after the 2nd marking transaction, will be accepted but no more deposits should be made.
2. Nxt will be launched earlier than on the 3rd of January, right after the final test.
3. New Nxt users r supposed to be attracted by selling NXT and distributing via Nxt Faucet.
4. Messaging feature will be released later to avoid situation when somebody attempts to bloat the blockchain making it too huge for newcomers.

BTW we need one more bootstrapping server, coz 2 servers is not enough.

1) the main dev (BCNext) no longer posts directly to this thread but you purport to communicate with him and speak for him about the project, something we can't confirm,

Yes.

2) the deadline for contributing BTC to acquire Nxt, which was originally described as being open until the genesis block was approved by the community sometimes at least a month from now, is now suddenly declared over with no advance warning;

Yes. He is working on genesis block now that why deposits r not accepted.

3) the BTC that were already sent to acquire Nxt, which the main dev (BCNext) promised earlier in this thread not to touch until the genesis block was generated, have now been moved.

Yes. The bitcoins weren't touched to avoid accusations that he reuses them to increase his own Nxt stake. Now, when deposits r not accepted there is no sense to keep them untouched.

Note that the genesis block had not been created before investment was closed, and this still does not change the fact that no advance notice was given prior to closing the sale.

[SyRenity]

Note that the genesis block had not been created before investment was closed, and this still does not change the fact that no advance notice was given prior to closing the sale.

+1, the original date in post was always 3/1/14.
Also add to this the fact that last released source code is from 3/1/14, and does not include any advanced feature promised.

Compare this to any other alt. coin project out there, or to bitcoin itself.

[tstang]

Personally,

the concept of Proof of Stake (POS) by NXT coin is interesting and different compare to Proof of Work (POW) used by Bitcoin.

I think during infancy stage, like Bitcoin, it would be beneficial and FAIR to everyone, especially miners to use POW concept.

Once reached a certain threshold, maybe 50%, 80% or 100%, then the concept of POS will be more relevant to sustained the network and miners.


Currently, in NXT coin the early stakeholders are hording all the coins and benefiting them only. There is very little volume and the TRUE value is not reflected as there is no liquidity in the system.

This is not a True and Fair concept of decentralized Crypto currency in the first place.

[Anon136]

There is very little volume and the TRUE value is not reflected as there is no liquidity in the system.

Lol what theory of value are you operating under? there is no such thing as "true vale" because value is not a property of the object its self. Value is a property that is imbued on an object by an actor making a value judgment. Everyone knows about the initial investors, everyone knows what the volume is like, these things are priced in. The price that we have now is not fake, it is what people value nxt at WITH all of the factors you mentioned being taken into consideration

[Uniqueorn]

Personally,

the concept of Proof of Stake (POS) by NXT coin is interesting and different compare to Proof of Work (POW) used by Bitcoin.

I think during infancy stage, like Bitcoin, it would be beneficial and FAIR to everyone, especially miners to use POW concept.

Once reached a certain threshold, maybe 50%, 80% or 100%, then the concept of POS will be more relevant to sustained the network and miners.


Currently, in NXT coin the early stakeholders are hording all the coins and benefiting them only. There is very little volume and the TRUE value is not reflected as there is no liquidity in the system.

This is not a True and Fair concept of decentralized Crypto currency in the first place.

ONCE AGAIN this myth is spread: http://nxtcoin.blogspot.com get educated little one

[bithic]

Personally,

the concept of Proof of Stake (POS) by NXT coin is interesting and different compare to Proof of Work (POW) used by Bitcoin.

I think during infancy stage, like Bitcoin, it would be beneficial and FAIR to everyone, especially miners to use POW concept.

Once reached a certain threshold, maybe 50%, 80% or 100%, then the concept of POS will be more relevant to sustained the network and miners.


Currently, in NXT coin the early stakeholders are hording all the coins and benefiting them only. There is very little volume and the TRUE value is not reflected as there is no liquidity in the system.

This is not a True and Fair concept of decentralized Crypto currency in the first place.

Hi tstang, I'd say volume is pretty good, given the very early (beta, in fact) stage Nxt is currently in. It will improve as more exchanges list it (Bter just added it today!) and as the clients and features mature.

Regarding true and fair decentralization, I think PoS offers more opportunity for decentralization because hardware costs are not a barrier to entry in supporting the network. And for distribution, things aren't as bad as you might think. Here are some more stats about Nxt distribution vs Bitcoin pulled from http://nxtcoin.blogspot.ca/2014/01/nxt-volume-history.html

Nxt
28.9% is owned by 0.07%
21.5% is owned by  0.14%  : 2x
24.8% is owned by  0.55%  : 7.9x
20.7% is owned by  99.76% : 1425x
vs:
Bitcoin
28.9%: 0.005%
21.5%: 0.087%  : 17.4x
24.8%: 0.98%    : 196x
20.7%: 98.928% : 19786x

Based on this I think things are looking very positive for Nxt.

Could Nxt have been initially launched with a better distribution? Probably, but it's far from terrible and getting better as more buyers enter the market. The community is very active, development is happening quickly, and support is growing. I think these will have more of an impact on Nxt's future than how ideal the initial launch was. These are also why it will be hard for a clone to compete with Nxt.

[bithic]

I don't like the concept of the rich getting richer, which is why I also dislike PoS.

I think this is why you should like PoS. With Nxt's PoS forging, the ROI is the same percentage whether you invest $100 or $100000. This is as fair as it gets. Both investments will grow at the same rate. PoW mining such as that used in Bitcoin is not this fair. Why? Because the nature of hardware/electricity costs and economy-of-scale gives an advantage to the rich. For instance, they can buy 100 or 1000 miners (or manufacture their own!) for a much better deal than the little guy who can only afford one.