[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[toknormal]

How do you prove payment with regular Bitcoin or Dash?

An auditor audits it.

To be auditable, the auditor needs to see  2 accounts - not one. A debit in one and a credit in the other.

If I'm checking a payment I made, I go to the blockchain and see it leaving my account. I also see it arriving in the other account. If I only see it leaving my account then I haven't audited anything and if the other guy only sees it arriving in his account then he hasn't audited anything either.

In the fiat world, the auditor (as far as the transactional integrity goes) is the banking system itself, not some guy that walks into your office in a pin stripe suit and only gets to look the transaction from your end.

In crypto, that counterparty has been eliminated, so Satoshi did 2 things:

[1] - broke the link between accounts and people so a blockchain address never corresponds to a person, it just corresponds to an anonymous private key instead

[2] - made the blockchain visible so that the entire world could serve as auditor and arbitror of its integrity

Take that away and you've got nothing.

What you've done is take a fiat business model (where every single peice of property of any significance is synonymous with a legal entity) and imposed it on a cryptocurrency (where it isn't). You've therefore given yourself a whole load of unnecessary problems to solve (which is why you need all that over burdening cryptography) while at the same time killing the very thing thats about 100 times more important than privacy - confidence.

With darksend you can't even do that. You have a coinjoin transaction (or a sequence of them if multiple rounds) and one/some of the inputs is/are yours but you can't prove those coins didn't go somewhere else.

Darksend simply improves the fungibility of the coins in your wallet. It's not trying to do what your doing (which is probably why your constantly criticising it). Moreover, it does so pre-emptively, exactly as real world cash does. At the point of transaction, everything is out in the open. It works exactly like bitcoin does. Privacy is already taken care of by the Satoshi model IF the blockchain is fungible enough (not invisible - different thing) which is why that challenge was addressed directly rather than indirectly.

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[cAPSLOCK]

How do you prove payment with regular Bitcoin or Dash?

An auditor audits it.

To be auditable, the auditor needs to see  2 accounts - not one. A debit in one and a credit in the other.

If I'm checking a payment I made, I go to the blockchain and see it leaving my account. I also see it arriving in the other account. If I only see it leaving my account then I haven't audited anything and if the other guy only sees it arriving in his account then he hasn't audited anything either.

In the fiat world, the auditor (as far as the transactional integrity goes) is the banking system itself, not some guy that walks into your office in a pin stripe suit and gets to look at your account.

In crypto, that counterparty has been eliminated, so Satoshi did 2 things:

[1] - broke the link between accounts and people so a blockchain address never corresponds to a person, it just corresponds to an anonymous private key instead

[2] - made the blockchain visible so that the entire world could serve as auditor and arbitror of its integrity

Take that away and you've got nothing.

What you've done is take a fiat business model (where every single peice of property of any significance is synonymous with a legal entity) and imposed it on a cryptocurrency (where it isn't). You've therefore given yourself a whole load of unnecessary problems to solve (which is why you need all that over burdening cryptography) while at the same time killing the very thing thats about 100 times more important than privacy - confidence.

With darksend you can't even do that. You have a coinjoin transaction (or a sequence of them if multiple rounds) and one/some of the inputs is/are yours but you can't prove those coins didn't go somewhere else.

Darksend simply improves the fungibility of the coins in your wallet. It's not trying to do what your doing (which is probably why your constantly criticising it). Moreover, it does so pre-emptively, exactly as real world cash does. At the point of transaction, everything is out in the open. It works exactly like bitcoin does. Privacy is already taken care of by the Satoshi model IF the blockchain is fungible enough (not invisible - different thing) which is why that challenge was addressed directly rather than indirectly.

As far as I can tell your problems mentioned are the problems of cash.  You need some trust to use it.  If you want a fully open ledger use bitcoin.  If you want true privacy you have to pay the piper in risk.  There is no in between.  The thing trying to be in between will fail and be unobscured in the end. 

[toknormal]

If you want a fully open ledger use bitcoin.  If you want true privacy you have to pay the piper in risk.

Bitcoin has two very distinct aspects. A fully public aspect and a fully private aspect. Those two aspects are distinct and mutually exclusive (the collection of public keys and the collection of private keys). The way privacy works in crypto is that the more fungible you make the "visible" part, the more private you make the "private" part - simple as that.

It's the fact that one of those is public, visible and continuous that gives the private key its value. I agree that there's no "in between", but of you go obscuring whole parts of the 'public' aspect of that common resource (and arbitrary parts of it at that) then you do have an "in between".

(Bedtime here and I'm meeting myself getting up. Very interesting discussion and informative, enjoyable interview. I have a lot more respect for fluff listening to him than reading his occasional firefighting posts   Goodnight).

[smooth]

In crypto, that counterparty has been eliminated, so Satoshi did 2 things:

[1] - broke the link between accounts and people so a blockchain address never corresponds to a person, it just corresponds to an anonymous private key instead

[2] - made the blockchain visible so that the entire world could serve as auditor and arbitror of its integrity

Take that away and you've got nothing.

Well in practice [1] is not true which is why coins like Dash and Monero even exist in the first place. Blockchain analysis exists and is probably much more effective than what has been published.

But otherwise, it sounds like Monero should meet with your approval. Everything on the blockchain in terms of the integrity of the coin supply is verifiable by the entire world.

Consider also that Monero allows you to operate in exactly the same manner as Dash, if you like. That is, you can do traceable transactions with other parties, and then send the coins back to yourself with mixing. The main difference is that the additional step isn't required (but it is permitted) and that the masternode middleman has been eliminated, so the process is faster, safer, more efficient and probably ultimately lower cost.

[bigrcanada]

Little help folks

I've never imported a private key and I was given a nice gift, for another coin and I need to get the coins in the wallet

Within the console I inputed: importprivkey <private key> [gift]
but I keep getting

Error adding key to wallet (code -4)

any thoughts?
ugh


This gift is equal to and/or comparable to approx 29230.77DASH in percentage of max coins (approx. 0.132% of max coins) but not in $USD$ unfortunately. It would be a shame to not get it inputed into my wallet -

Please Help :-(

OH....that is a nice gift! 

[smooth]

Little help folks

I've never imported a private key and I was given a nice gift, for another coin and I need to get the coins in the wallet

Within the console I inputed: importprivkey <private key> [gift]
but I keep getting

Error adding key to wallet (code -4)

any thoughts?
ugh


This gift is equal to and/or comparable to approx 29230.77DASH in percentage of max coins (approx. 0.132% of max coins) but not in $USD$ unfortunately. It would be a shame to not get it inputed into my wallet -

Please Help :-(

Unlock the wallet first (walletpassphrase)?

My recollection is that you need to give a timeout on that long enough for the rescan.

[smooth]

Nope - I was wrong

Coin count is about right


THAT WAS SO FUCKING COOL !!!!

I want to do it again - lol

edit
THX Smooth

Just do me a favor Smooth - Please stop being a dick - K

You're welcome. Next tip: sweep those coins to a new address. That way no one who has seen that private key before (or does in the future) can take them from you.

[k0vic]

Nope - I was wrong

Coin count is about right


THAT WAS SO FUCKING COOL !!!!

I want to do it again - lol

edit
THX Smooth

Just do me a favor Smooth - Please stop being a dick - K

You're welcome. Next tip: sweep those coins to a new address. That way no one who has seen that private key before (or does in the future) can take them from you.

Yeah then dump them and buy 29k worth of dash.

[oblox]

Nope - I was wrong

Coin count is about right


THAT WAS SO FUCKING COOL !!!!

I want to do it again - lol

edit
THX Smooth

Just do me a favor Smooth - Please stop being a dick - K

You're welcome. Next tip: sweep those coins to a new address. That way no one who has seen that private key before (or does in the future) can take them from you.

Yeah then dump them and buy 29k worth of dash.

As tempting as that would be - it's only 29K worth of DASH when you compare the total number of coins to be produced.

It's not the same as the dollar amount because the coin is not listed on any exchange so we don't have an actual dollar amount to compare it to.

I'm not even sure what the last listed dollar amount was - lol


edit: I now have : 1.22% of total coins available
and
0.16% of what will be total max coins

If you compared it to DASH total coins that would be.......

64216.2494DASH = 1.22% of total coins available
and
35200.0000DASH of what will be total max coins

respectfully

Why are you comparing your holdings of a completely different coin to what they would translate into as a percentage of Dash?

[TanteStefana2]

-snip-
[Don't forget: A vote for Coins101 is a vote for Beer, Babes and Boobs at every foundation board meeting. Would it be a wasted vote? Probably.]

You are hilarious Coins101!

(not that you'll see this with everyone on ignore)

Yep, you're currently on ignore. Vote for me and I'll make an exception 

Yet, he always knows what's going on, LOL

[TanteStefana2]

How do you prove payment with regular Bitcoin or Dash?

An auditor audits it.

To be auditable, the auditor needs to see  2 accounts - not one. A debit in one and a credit in the other.

If I'm checking a payment I made, I go to the blockchain and see it leaving my account. I also see it arriving in the other account. If I only see it leaving my account then I haven't audited anything and if the other guy only sees it arriving in his account then he hasn't audited anything either.

In the fiat world, the auditor (as far as the transactional integrity goes) is the banking system itself, not some guy that walks into your office in a pin stripe suit and gets to look at your account.

In crypto, that counterparty has been eliminated, so Satoshi did 2 things:

[1] - broke the link between accounts and people so a blockchain address never corresponds to a person, it just corresponds to an anonymous private key instead

[2] - made the blockchain visible so that the entire world could serve as auditor and arbitror of its integrity

Take that away and you've got nothing.

What you've done is take a fiat business model (where every single peice of property of any significance is synonymous with a legal entity) and imposed it on a cryptocurrency (where it isn't). You've therefore given yourself a whole load of unnecessary problems to solve (which is why you need all that over burdening cryptography) while at the same time killing the very thing thats about 100 times more important than privacy - confidence.

With darksend you can't even do that. You have a coinjoin transaction (or a sequence of them if multiple rounds) and one/some of the inputs is/are yours but you can't prove those coins didn't go somewhere else.

Darksend simply improves the fungibility of the coins in your wallet. It's not trying to do what your doing (which is probably why your constantly criticising it). Moreover, it does so pre-emptively, exactly as real world cash does. At the point of transaction, everything is out in the open. It works exactly like bitcoin does. Privacy is already taken care of by the Satoshi model IF the blockchain is fungible enough (not invisible - different thing) which is why that challenge was addressed directly rather than indirectly.

As far as I can tell your problems mentioned are the problems of cash.  You need some trust to use it.  If you want a fully open ledger use bitcoin.  If you want true privacy you have to pay the piper in risk.  There is no in between.  The thing trying to be in between will fail and be unobscured in the end. 

I don't think you understand, in simplest terms, if I may try, if you transact with another person, that one transaction is visible to both parties.  However, those coins do not connect you to any other coins.  Nobody can see what's inside your wallet, only the coins you pulled out of it.  The next transaction you have with another person is the same.  An outsider, can't tell at all who the two parties are unless they reveal or track that information.  It might be revealed in a merchant's  logs if they keep detailed records as to which coins came from which person, but I don't see why a merchant would bother beyond saying "this customer paid".  Then when auditing is done by the government, they could see which customer bought that sleeping bag and what account it came from.  But they still couldn't see any other coins or connect any other transactions to you or your wallet.

Does that help?

[TanteStefana2]

That was actually my plan
:-D
The blockchain is a bit slow since we have very few people running the wallet


Also deleted the message that was sent to me :-)

I'm just curious mangled, how do coins from a project that no longer has a development team and very few miners still have value?  I mean, are people still buying it?  Just curious what's up??

Also, wherever the message came from, they undoubtedly still have a copy of the private key, so if you don't want them taken back, you should send them to a new address like smooth said

A funny thing I just remembered, there were people already at least a year ago that were collecting dead coins, LOL.  New hobby, have dead coin wallets with coins

[Lebubar]

Right at this moment I'd say this is a super solid play:

Snip.

The best way to Exit  

Oh so funny, told at your dev that they have work to do, instead of posting bullshit they asked you to post.
Omg really nothing to do, those pseudo-dev.

Trolleros Really pathetics!

[arielbit]

hey darkcoin copycats, scammers and schemers just continue licking you scamcoin..

this is opensource, the devs of monero are not work slaves and they can post and trade if they want

the core devs were just a bunch of volunteers exploited for the big thing. the extended darkcoin team was the same with even a lower place to sit on that pyramid.

[Kai Proctor]

A word about the Foundation, it's mission and directors

https://dashtalk.org/threads/a-word-about-the-foundation-its-mission-and-directors.4616/

[bigrcanada]

Is there a simple tool I can use to check individual MN addresses to see if they are up and running?  Thanks.

[Lebubar]

Is there a simple tool I can use to check individual MN addresses to see if they are up and running?  Thanks.

https://dashninja.pl/?mnregexp=(XYourMN1AddressHere|XoYourMN2AddressThere|MN3Address)#mnlistdetail

[Kienbui]

I still need to purchase more Dash to build master nodes.

Hopping to have good chance to buy with cheap price.

[Terzo2]

Lets dump that DASH !
I wish i had it dumped before  !

[Rux]

Mangled Blue and whats the point of your story with these hidden coins?

what do you want to with this? brag? i dont understand

you dump it or hold it, dont make rocket science with it

as of rest of you... you should be ashamed of your self, sr.members posting FUD like kids... and wondering why your scamero coin wont go UP

every day this thread is going to the oblivion and one day nobody will even try to read it, not only because of FUDers... some of DASH guys are doing the same thing