[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[toknormal]

I don't want Dash to be like the other (POW) coins -- Those coins require foundations for funds, premine, ICO or other methods.   Dash has the ability to fund projects outside of Dash's code base...

Nobody's arguing against that.

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[WastedLTC]

I don't want Dash to be like the other (POW) coins -- Those coins require foundations for funds, premine, ICO or other methods.   Dash has the ability to fund projects outside of Dash's code base...

Nobody's arguing against that.

From the looks of it,  your POV is that a coin is either 100% POW or it is not.    Using a block reward for anything other than returning it to the miners would move it outside of the 100% POW classification.   Once you move out of that classification the "right" distribution percentage is up for debate.   This debate is ongoing for Dash but I don't see why some are comparing this to a pure POW crypto.   Dash will never be a pure (POW, POS, etc) coin and the block split between groups should be a fluid discussion.   I can see Dash introducing more segments outside of the 3 we have now (MN, Miners, Budget) in the future and that will bring up this whole process again around who should increase/decrease their portion of the super block.

[toknormal]

From the looks of it,  your POV is that a coin is either 100% POW or it is not.    Using a block reward for anything other than returning it to the miners would move it outside of the 100% POW classification.

Then you misinterpreted my remarks. I said that the non-mining reward should more adequately reflect the value that's invested into the network by masternode operators, albeit that there may be a profit component to it. Right now they don't invest anything. Their running costs are zero.

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

For Dash, it's all about the "EX"es!

Two recent announcements regarding new Dash functionality in the trading and sports gaming industries happened to come from two companies both ending with "EX". So although the industries they represent are different and ones that Dash stands to do well in, on this CATV episode it's all about the exes.



Thanks for watching!

[WastedLTC]

From the looks of it,  your POV is that a coin is either 100% POW or it is not.    Using a block reward for anything other than returning it to the miners would move it outside of the 100% POW classification.

Then you misinterpreted my remarks. I said that the non-mining reward should more adequately reflect the value that's invested into the network by masternode operators, albeit that there may be a profit component to it. Right now they don't invest anything. Their running costs are zero.

k!  thnx for clarifying

[afbitcoins]

Surely this is a bit extreme because Dash will be around for a long time. Those who are calling for its early demise are just not serious...

Dash won't die but if its on page two or three of coinmarket cap its as good as dead except for those diehards who will keep dashing.

[afbitcoins]

Ryans proposal is all about encouraging more masternodes to come online, so all those brand new, fresh off the shelf 1000 dash collatoral's will stop circulating in the market and bringing price down. So there will be less supply and more demand. So the number of masternodes can ever increase along the 'predicted' line on the chart, giving dash a nice warm reassuring demand in the market.

And yet, the 100% POW competitors, some of which have had much more coin inflation than dash, (real inflation not 'circulating inflation'), have much higher value blockchains than dash without a single coin 'locked' as collatoral. There is no locked litecoin, no locked XMR. Not even going into how they have much less innovation than dash. It doesn't add up. Ryan's proposal is complicated because it has to be. To obscure the reality.  

To the yes voters how you explain this? These competitors don't need to fret (at the bottom of the bear market) about how much to allocate to who. But they enjoy much more valuable blockchains. They don't even bother to troll this thread anymore.

I agree we don't want 100% proof of work. I agree it is a question of where to draw the line. I am with Dash. But Ryan is wanting to draw a new line in a place that makes an existing problem worse.

Never once has anyone important in the dash community answered (or acknowledged in any real way) toknormal's extremely well thought out and well presented alternative viewpoint. I had to sit and watch Amanda nodding and not challenging Ryan at all. Shame on you all. Ignoring facts, ignoring the challenge, ignoring the reality of the wider market.
 

[toknormal]

Some people are impatient to get off the bus. Many are deep underwater.

A quick (though brief, because it will only last until the next MN ceiling gets hit) 1000 MN exit pump may seem more appealing than long term stability and growth. The risk is we might end up with neither if the "wider market" doesn't buy it.

[jdmcg]

And yet, the 100% POW competitors, some of which have had much more coin inflation than dash, (real inflation not 'circulating inflation'), have much higher value blockchains than dash without a single coin 'locked' as collatoral. There is no locked litecoin, no locked XMR. Not even going into how they have much less innovation than dash. It doesn't add up. Ryan's proposal is complicated because it has to be. To obscure the reality.  

I don't think you should get so upset with Ryan's proposal. It does not change things significantly, it more or less keeps masternode rewards the same while slowly reducing miner rewards. What happens to BTC when miner rewards get cut in half? So if Dash's miner rewards get reduced (even if slightly) that will have an opposite effect for DASH than it does for BTC? If anything we probably should conclude that DASH should definitely not increase miner rewards.

Besides... the proposal hasn't been implemented yet, DASH's price movement over the last 4 years has occurred with the same DASH you bought into so not sure why you think DASH's price has anything to do with this proposal... Also DASH entered 2020 at around $44 or so... less than XMR and about the same as LTC. It's likely $40 was the bottom for DASH, and you are already seeing DASH recovering faster than its competitors. It likely will continue to do so over the next 6 months, it's just waiting, like the rest of the altcoin market, for BTC to give it permission...

To the yes voters how you explain this? These competitors don't need to fret (at the bottom of the bear market) about how much to allocate to who. But they enjoy much more valuable blockchains. They don't even bother to troll this thread anymore.

Hard for trolls to have much to say for a coin that's hovering around $70 USD... Also, wasn't trolling more a 2014-2016 thing?

I agree we don't want 100% proof of work. I agree it is a question of where to draw the line. I am with Dash. But Ryan is wanting to draw a new line in a place that makes an existing problem worse.

What is this existing problem you're so worried about?

Never once has anyone important in the dash community answered (or acknowledged in any real way) toknormal's extremely well thought out and well presented alternative viewpoint. I had to sit and watch Amanda nodding and not challenging Ryan at all. Shame on you all. Ignoring facts, ignoring the challenge, ignoring the reality of the wider market.

Has toknormal presented his viewpoint to them somewhere?

Personally I'm not convinced by his viewpoint and I've already outlined why more than once. Seems like many are just panicking in a bear market.

What you're seeing now is mostly speculators speculating and a cycle of adoption for a new tech (all cryptocurrencies, not just DASH). Prices increase slowly, then rush to top out and the bubble bursts, prices crash and contract (many altcoins become similarly valued) and then the survivors repeat the process. So far, DASH looks like a clear survivor... it still needs to break out of the descending trend line against BTC but so does BTC need to break out of the descending trend line against USD... but it looks like both may occur very soon...

[Tungi17]

BelnCrypto interview with Ryan Taylor from Dash
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2HqTPtNMGY

[qwizzie]

BelnCrypto interview with Ryan Taylor from Dash
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2HqTPtNMGY

Dash is lucky to have a Dash spokes person like Ryan Taylor, who has such an articulate and easy to follow language style.
In some ways i find him even better then Evan Duffield, when he was still active as a Dash spokes person (first few years).

Ryan is always to the point, is very good at explaining things in normal plain English and almost never lose track of any question that he is addressing.
He may not have the charisma of a Roger Ver, but he does have his own style and i think it works for a hype-free crypto project like Dash.

Same for Amanda B Johnson, who i wish could be deployed as Dash spokes person more. We could use some new Dash Detailed type shows of her,
with a focus on Dash Platform for example and on new Dash developments.

Here is a little flashback of her reporting on Dash first DDoS network attack : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkKKRJLeDBA

Cultivating and maintaining their role as Dash spokes persons would benefit Dash i think.
I am not sure if Amanda still sees herself as a Dash spokes person though.

[ampu18]

The best cryptocurrency for long-term investment, as for me.

[toknormal]

What is this existing problem you're so worried about?

The existing problem is we have a split reward system which pays masternodes a lot for doing nothing and investors very little for doing everything. (since they cover the cost of mining of the primary supply).

The existing problem is we have proven to be less competitive instead of more. Our 100% mining reward contemporaries have become way more valuable than we have over the same period of time.

Do yourself a little calculation. Take the masternode count, multiply it by the weekly MN reward, then multiply that by the Dash/USD exchange rate. Then multiply that by 52 (to get the annual amount). Then multiply that by 5 (to project a nominal 500% gain to a Dash price of, say $350).

As masternode holders, if we intend to pay ourselves that amount of annual revenue drawn from the blockchain each year without incurring ANY cost (i.e. near 100% pure margin) then I'd say we have some due diligence to do in terms of identifying who is on the other side of that revenue stream. (i.e. who incurs the cost, even though it may be nominal). You cannot have revenue without cost, doesn't matter whether the rewards get liquidated or not.

In our case, this is the value of Dash being withheld from investors. It's the value that would otherwise have been delivered into the hands of those paying for the primary supply and therefore represents a nominal cost to them. When investing in our 100% mining-reward competitors, investors do not incur such a cost which is why we're sharing the bottom of this list with a joke coin while they are not.

You can look at it the other way if you want: That the mining supply is fully delivered to those who pay for it and the masternode supply is independent, created by way of nominal growth instead of through competitive mining and that this purely numerical inflation is "gifted" to masternodes. But then the market is at liberty to value that portion of the supply at zero (which is its opening price to the masternode recipient). It amounts to the same result - a cratering of our marketcap relative to our fully mined contemporaries.

Reducing the mining reward in the name of improving store-of-value has it exactly the wrong way around. It needs o be increased otherwise the adverse competitive is just going to continue and worsen.

[WastedLTC]

.....

As more MNs go online payments get smaller and we have the block reduction -- you make it sound like purchasing a $70,000 MN to receive $11 per day coupled with the trend that slopes down and the block reduction is "free money".   Yes, it is different from running a graphics card or spending $5k on a miner but don't talk about free money.   MN owners have been put through the ringer and continue to support this project and right now it would be tough to explain why a new MN owner should jump on board with these incentives.   Maybe we do need to make the MN investment better!   Dash did much better than other ALTS in the 2017 bull run and now we have fallen back and we will do good in the next one.   Making such a big deal over this proposal is just odd to me.  I think Ryan is doing a job well and DCG is moving the needle.  They have worked on, proposed a solution, and I accept this solution. Let's see where it takes us.   

At this point are you fighting just to fight?   

 

[JollyGood]

It is not just the Dash Core team that are an asset to the project, the various language based communities worldwide are doing much to spread the word and have Dash to a new level. Dash local community groups in some African nations and South American nations are very prolific.

The flashback video you linked is interesting even though it is over 3 years old, she seems to articulate her points very carefully and presents in a professional manner. It shows Dash is heading in the right direction when intelligent and well spoken people that can hold an audience are able to make interesting and entertaining videos about Dash and other crypto keeping it in the news.

Dash is lucky to have a Dash spokes person like Ryan Taylor, who has such an articulate and easy to follow language style.
In some ways i find him even better then Evan Duffield, when he was still active as a Dash spokes person (first few years).

Ryan is always to the point, is very good at explaining things in normal plain English and almost never lose track of any question that he is addressing.
He may not have the charisma of a Roger Ver, but he does have his own style and i think it works for a hype-free crypto project like Dash.

Same for Amanda B Johnson, who i wish could be deployed as Dash spokes person more. We could use some new Dash Detailed type shows of her,
with a focus on Dash Platform for example and on new Dash developments.

Here is a little flashback of her reporting on Dash first DDoS network attack : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkKKRJLeDBA

Cultivating and maintaining their role as Dash spokes persons would benefit Dash i think.
I am not sure if Amanda still sees herself as a Dash spokes person though.

[toknormal]

At this point are you fighting just to fight?

No, just responding to relevant commentary. I do try to put some constructive thought into each post.

Saying that "masternodes have been put through the ringer" isn't a justification for an unsustainable protocol that has been demonstrated to haemorrhage marketcap to other coins IMO.

Nor is saying Dash did much better than other ALTS in the 2017 bull run and now we have fallen back and we will do good in the next one. The market conditions now and then have no comparison. Dash was a market leader at that time and served as one of the main hedges against bitcoin's impending "doom" of a contentious hardfork. We've not only fallen back from there against bitcoin but gone beyond it and lost half the value that the 2017 pump launched off.

IMO it's important that this proposal does not go unchallenged because it represents an endorsement of the prevailing strategy which has not been successful or worked as intended. The principle of the split reward system is that it improves competitiveness, not erodes it.

Pay masternodes enough to justify their added value and it will work as intended, make Dash more competitive and gain it marketcap.

Use MN rewards as bottomless well of bribery payments in exchange for hodling, and it'll do the exact opposite.

[hd49728]

It is not just the Dash Core team that are an asset to the project, the various language based communities worldwide are doing much to spread the word and have Dash to a new level. Dash local community groups in some African nations and South American nations are very prolific.

The flashback video you linked is interesting even though it is over 3 years old, she seems to articulate her points very carefully and presents in a professional manner. It shows Dash is heading in the right direction when intelligent and well spoken people that can hold an audience are able to make interesting and entertaining videos about Dash and other crypto keeping it in the news.

DASH communities have been built gradually since 2018. Maybe many investors don't pay their attention on such slowly growth of DASH behind the scene. Maybe one of reasons come from crypto bearish market in the whole 2018 till early months of 2019.

I saw the community growth 2 days ago and it has not stopped up till now. Strong communities, in many nations, in many continents, prolific partnerships globally. The crypto market has jumped to its new period latest months and we will see DASH growths in price on market soon. LEND is very impressive example that how an altcoin can skyrocket at its right period.

[qwizzie]

Maybe a little bit off topic, but lets do a little game : what do you guys think these cryptocurrencies have in common currently ?

https://cryptowat.ch/charts/HITBTC:DOGE-BTC?period=3d
https://cryptowat.ch/charts/HITBTC:LINK-BTC?period=1d
https://cryptowat.ch/charts/HITBTC:VET-BTC?period=3d
https://cryptowat.ch/charts/HITBTC:XLM-BTC?period=3d
https://cryptowat.ch/charts/HITBTC:XTZ-BTC?period=3d

Lets also include a snapshot, as this little game of mine could take awhile to finish and will require some patience.

[toknormal]

They all got pumped....and your point is ?  

...that Dash will soon get pumped and everything will be alright.

[Tungi17]

Venezuelan Delivery Service Piiddo Adds Dash for Payments, Expands to Second City
https://lbry.tv/@DigitalCashNetwork:c/Piiddo:c?r=Gd7GBo8adnW7dSEBDc2pPP8Ytw9Rw3L9