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Author Topic: Bitcoin snack machine (fast transaction problem)  (Read 28147 times)
watashi-kokoto
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January 26, 2016, 01:21:49 PM
 #121

You need to wait 10 minutes. Best create a website where person can order the food in advance and buy it for write a password to the machine.
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January 26, 2016, 01:37:16 PM
 #122

Bitcoin will never be instant regardless of block size or network configuration. The number of nodes has nothing to do with confirmation times.

We could have 10GB blocks and a Million nodes and we should still have an average wait time of 10 minutes for each confirmation with a recommended minimum of 10 confirmations before you consider your transaction complete and irreversible; for this reason Bitcoin will never be used for payment in a snack machine.

(I am a 1MB block supporter who thinks all users should be using Full-Node clients)
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January 26, 2016, 01:50:32 PM
 #123

This might be achievable if you're using an offchain Payment processor like BitPay or Coinbase to send the payments to, but you get the product usually after few transactions or zero transactions, Maybe I think it's called off chain transactions. I wonder if that could be implemented to speed up the transaction problem with your vending machine.

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January 26, 2016, 03:03:43 PM
 #124

This might be achievable if you're using an offchain Payment processor like BitPay or Coinbase to send the payments to, but you get the product usually after few transactions or zero transactions, Maybe I think it's called off chain transactions. I wonder if that could be implemented to speed up the transaction problem with your vending machine.

I do not agree with solutions like this, because we deviating from the Bitcoin path and introducing 3rd party services to solve problems that could have

been solved by our own developers. These guys are testing sidechains and other solutions for problems like these. We have to chose which role, we

want Bitcoin to fill. Option A - Payment processor for micro payments or Option B - Cheaper Remittance service and investment

commodity. If we want to do both, we would need to make some compromises somewhere else.   Sad

CuntChocula
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January 26, 2016, 03:37:32 PM
 #125

Bitcoin will never be instant regardless of block size or network configuration. The number of nodes has nothing to do with confirmation times.

We could have 10GB blocks and a Million nodes and we should still have an average wait time of 10 minutes for each confirmation with a recommended minimum of 10 confirmations before you consider your transaction complete and irreversible; Shocked for this reason Bitcoin will never be used for payment in a snack machine.
Nearly instant, they said... Sad
ranochigo
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January 26, 2016, 03:43:12 PM
 #126

Bitcoin will never be instant regardless of block size or network configuration. The number of nodes has nothing to do with confirmation times.

We could have 10GB blocks and a Million nodes and we should still have an average wait time of 10 minutes for each confirmation with a recommended minimum of 10 confirmations before you consider your transaction complete and irreversible; Shocked for this reason Bitcoin will never be used for payment in a snack machine.
Nearly instant, they said... Sad
Actually, 6 confirmations is pretty much secure with the only risk being major block re-org and 51% attack, both of which are hard to execute. 51% attacks are nearly impossible to deter unless the TX is included in a block before the last checkpoint. Other than that, transactions proporgate instantly and brick and motar merchants usually release the goods once they verify that there is a high chance that it won't be a double spend.

Inactive for sometime. Resend a PM if I do not reply within 48 hours.
bill gator
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January 26, 2016, 03:45:06 PM
 #127

Bitcoin will never be instant regardless of block size or network configuration. The number of nodes has nothing to do with confirmation times.

We could have 10GB blocks and a Million nodes and we should still have an average wait time of 10 minutes for each confirmation with a recommended minimum of 10 confirmations before you consider your transaction complete and irreversible; for this reason Bitcoin will never be used for payment in a snack machine.

"Never say Never".. Do you know how many people have eaten their words by so arrogantly blurting out things like that?

Confirmations flood in fairly quickly, and IMO bitcoin isn't ready for "mass-adoption". Obviously the capabilities of the protocol aren't perfected, because this is a work in progress. Bitcoin is being improved every single day, gaining attention, supporters and developers.

Imagine how many people 200-years ago we're talking about the impossibilities of a snack machine AT ALL, because nobody could be trusted to leave the cash, or because "In-The-Air" transactions weren't "possible".

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January 26, 2016, 05:02:07 PM
 #128

You need to wait 10 minutes. Best create a website where person can order the food in advance and buy it for write a password to the machine.
I think this will be good option to give instant service. Bitcoin payment can be good option for online ordering service, you order and get things delivered. Or it can be using multisign address to pay fully after both parties agree to do deal.

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January 26, 2016, 05:49:13 PM
 #129

Bitcoin will never be instant regardless of block size or network configuration. The number of nodes has nothing to do with confirmation times.

We could have 10GB blocks and a Million nodes and we should still have an average wait time of 10 minutes for each confirmation with a recommended minimum of 10 confirmations before you consider your transaction complete and irreversible; Shocked for this reason Bitcoin will never be used for payment in a snack machine.
Nearly instant, they said... Sad
Actually, 6 confirmations is pretty much secure with the only risk being major block re-org and 51% attack, both of which are hard to execute.

Only an hour then. cool beans.

Quote
51% attacks are nearly impossible to deter unless the TX is included in a block before the last checkpoint. Other than that, transactions proporgate instantly and brick and motar merchants usually release the goods once they verify that there is a high chance that it won't be a double spend.

Because payment processors Smiley
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/40ejy8/peter_todd_with_my_doublespendpy_tool_with/cytut1p
Betwrong
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January 26, 2016, 05:58:01 PM
 #130

You need to wait 10 minutes. Best create a website where person can order the food in advance and buy it for write a password to the machine.

I think this is the best solution.

And also I think that creating such Bitcoin snack machine nowadays may be a good start for a business: people would use the opportunity to buy a snack with Bitcoin even if they normally wouldn't the buy snack, just for fun. Someone should try to make it real.

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January 26, 2016, 06:09:03 PM
 #131

You can wait until the lightning network is working so we can have this type of super fast 0 confirmation while secure payments, until then i would not worry a lot about it, we can't deal with this type of thing using on-chain transactions.

StevenS
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January 26, 2016, 07:20:45 PM
 #132

We could have 10GB blocks and a Million nodes and we should still have an average wait time of 10 minutes for each confirmation with a recommended minimum of 10 confirmations before you consider your transaction complete and irreversible; for this reason Bitcoin will never be used for payment in a snack machine.
The price of a snack is an acceptable risk to accept payments with 0 confirmations.
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January 26, 2016, 10:40:54 PM
 #133


Quote
51% attacks are nearly impossible to deter unless the TX is included in a block before the last checkpoint. Other than that, transactions proporgate instantly and brick and motar merchants usually release the goods once they verify that there is a high chance that it won't be a double spend.

Because payment processors Smiley
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/40ejy8/peter_todd_with_my_doublespendpy_tool_with/cytut1p

Shapeshift deactivated 0conf as users were exploiting miner's differing policy to accepting transactions. It can easily be migrated by requiring a conf for those TXes that miners are unlikely to accept. ATMs are the likely victims and for vending machines, not so much.  The double spend above is more for 0 conf than 1conf+. It is safe to assume that transactions with 1 confirmations are hard to reverse unless there's a fork.

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Anegg
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January 26, 2016, 10:50:42 PM
 #134

accept 0 confirm, but have a camera taking buyer face, and having show ID, and have an algor to check if both match
If you did that, no one would want to use the snack machine anymore. That process is way too long.
ShrykeZ
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January 26, 2016, 10:53:31 PM
 #135

Double spend and get free snacks all-day. A lot would actually do this which makes the no confirms possibly a bad idea.

The Pharmacist
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January 27, 2016, 03:00:57 AM
 #136

And how much for the transaction fee?  I don't know, this is kind of like the idea of the bitcoin arcade that was floated on here recently.  It's just so much easier to use quarters or dimes in a vending machine.  And pocket change is completely anonymous unless the vending machine has a camera on it.  There are some things bitcoin is not practical for, and this is one of them.
romjpn
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January 27, 2016, 03:14:32 AM
 #137

You can do it like in Japan with those IC cards you can recharge with FIAT (SUICA, PASMO). Just make it works with Bitcoin, load a card you can use everywhere (vending machine, convenience stores etc.) and it will work well. Of course, that does mean a 3rd party is involved with off-chain transactions.
Or we can just wait until developers figure out how to make fast and secure transactions for everyday expenses.

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February 19, 2016, 12:21:01 PM
 #138

Aw. I thought you were actually going to post an actual photo of a Bitcoin snack machine. Either way, this discussion is fine without it.


I think it'd work by entering a code, entering your address then taking the funds out to give you a candy bar.
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