[Guide] Dogie's Comprehensive Manufacturer Trustworthiness Guide [1st Feb 2016]

[bolehvpn]

Please kindly add BitCrane to your list of manufacturers. http://www.bitcrane.com/

They have a phone number and a business address and they respond readily to e-mail and also have shipped their products out with no issues.

I've had extensive dealings with them and they're a stand up company with a track record of at least two iterations of miners (the T110 and T110S) which actually are still selling units. They also ship from stock.

Leaving them out would be unfair given their thus far excellent business practices. I think Dogie, bobsag3 and maidak all received their units as well.

[1713491644]

1713491644

[1713491644]

1713491644

[Blazed]

It will be interesting to see this updated...AM did pre orders, Bitmain had a sort of rocky launch with s4.

[dogie]

Changelog 10/20/2014
Company changes:

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.
• ASICMiner communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
• Bitmain Hardware Issues down from 'No' to 'Minor' (10 to 6).
• Bitmain Commuication up from 'Good' to 'Great' (7 to 10).
• XBTech On Time not changed, but receives a warning for original Pacific 1250 delays.
• RockMiner Hardware Issues up from 'Minor' to 'No' (6 to 10).
• SpondooliesTech Size up from 'Large' to 'Huge' (7 to 10).
• BTCGarden Hardware issues clarrified that its due to the % of DOA boards.
• BTCGarden Communcation up from 'Okay' to 'Good' (4 to 7).
• Bitmine Communaction down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
• KNC Miner Hardware Issues down from 'Minor' to 'Major' (6 to 1) - suffered minor to moderate problems on both product launches.
• KNC Miner Ethics, F up from FF (-4 to -2) - removed FF criteria from rating system due to being potentially speculative.
• CoinTerra refund issues from 'No' to 'Some' (10 to 5).
• Blackarrow Hardware Issues down to Major due to X3 total recall.
• AMT Communication down from 'Okay' to 'Bad' (4 to 1).
• BFL Hardware Issues up from 'Minor' to 'No' (6 to 10).
• BitCrane added (76).
• Bitcrane size being considered for Medium if newer offerings sell better.
• Bitcrane communication being considered for Good, again on the basis that newer offerings sell better and there is more engagement.
• Canaan Creative Communication down from 'Good' to 'Okay' (7 to 4).
• Bitmine Refund Issues down from 'Some' to 'Yes' (5 to 1).

[PatMan]

Bitmain Hardware Issues down from 'No' to 'Minor' (10 to 6)  
Bitmain Communication up from 'Good' to 'Great' (7 to 10)   

Erm.........

[jimmothy]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

[PatMan]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

Cos he works for Bitmain?........

[dogie]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

Cos he works for Bitmain?........

What would that have anything to do with BTCGarden, and it would be pretty cool if my contract extended back in time by 3 months.

Anyway... BTCGarden have received an O infraction because they do have a moderate DOA rate but won't address the issue. In fact, they posted data which suggested they have an extremely low rate, which just wasn't matching up with the deliveries.

[RoadStress]

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.

Wait a minute. SP-Tech always had batches and they were "Mixed" and now they are "Yes" on the pre-order category. Care to explain? If you are unaware of the batches they are "first half of the month" and "second half of the month". I understand that there was a pre-order for SP30, but the SP30 was launched in August. Since then only batches were available to order.

[philipma1957]

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.

Wait a minute. SP-Tech always had batches and they were "Mixed" and now they are "Yes" on the pre-order category. Care to explain? If you are unaware of the batches they are "first half of the month" and "second half of the month". I understand that there was a pre-order for SP30, but the SP30 was launched in August. Since then only batches were available to order.

 your sp10's were not preorders.  the rest are.

To be fair just about every one is selling preorders.  the u3's are preorders .

[jimmothy]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

Cos he works for Bitmain?........

What would that have anything to do with BTCGarden, and it would be pretty cool if my contract extended back in time by 3 months.

Anyway... BTCGarden have received an O infraction because they do have a moderate DOA rate but won't address the issue. In fact, they posted data which suggested they have an extremely low rate, which just wasn't matching up with the deliveries.

That sounds like total BS. How could you possibly know if their data is accurate or not?

Can you show me posts where their customers are complaining about no returns or any other issues?

In my experience (and everyone elses as far as I can tell) support has been extremely quick and generous. I had a broken fan and rPi which they gave me a partial refund of the full amount it cost me to purchase replacements locally.

[jimmothy]

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.

Wait a minute. SP-Tech always had batches and they were "Mixed" and now they are "Yes" on the pre-order category. Care to explain? If you are unaware of the batches they are "first half of the month" and "second half of the month". I understand that there was a pre-order for SP30, but the SP30 was launched in August. Since then only batches were available to order.

If the hardware has been built, tested, and is ready to be produced, it's BTO.

If the hardware yet to be tested and the specs are estimations, it's a preorder.

[dogie]

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.

Wait a minute. SP-Tech always had batches and they were "Mixed" and now they are "Yes" on the pre-order category. Care to explain? If you are unaware of the batches they are "first half of the month" and "second half of the month". I understand that there was a pre-order for SP30, but the SP30 was launched in August. Since then only batches were available to order.

They've been preorders for the vast majority of their sales from day 1. There's no way to get around the fact that all the risk is put on the customer, which can backfire [as with SP30s]. Even with compensation, customers got a very different product than they had ordered 3-4 months before. [This rating hasn't changed for months and months, and was an error when it was listed as batch.]

[dogie]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

Cos he works for Bitmain?........

What would that have anything to do with BTCGarden, and it would be pretty cool if my contract extended back in time by 3 months.

Anyway... BTCGarden have received an O infraction because they do have a moderate DOA rate but won't address the issue. In fact, they posted data which suggested they have an extremely low rate, which just wasn't matching up with the deliveries.

That sounds like total BS. How could you possibly know if their data is accurate or not?

Can you show me posts where their customers are complaining about no returns or any other issues?

In my experience (and everyone elses as far as I can tell) support has been extremely quick and generous. I had a broken fan and rPi which they gave me a partial refund of the full amount it cost me to purchase replacements locally.

They've taken the graph down now, but they claimed there was an insanely low number of DOA units. I had one dead blade, the other major reviewer had BOTH blades dead. Take a look at my thread - the same problem which comes up again and again is the blade the Pi is plugged into is DOA so it doesn't see any of them.

Come at it from another angle... why would one post a graph of DOA units % when you've only been selling for about a week if there were no problems with DOA numbers?

[jimmothy]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

Cos he works for Bitmain?........

What would that have anything to do with BTCGarden, and it would be pretty cool if my contract extended back in time by 3 months.

Anyway... BTCGarden have received an O infraction because they do have a moderate DOA rate but won't address the issue. In fact, they posted data which suggested they have an extremely low rate, which just wasn't matching up with the deliveries.

That sounds like total BS. How could you possibly know if their data is accurate or not?

Can you show me posts where their customers are complaining about no returns or any other issues?

In my experience (and everyone elses as far as I can tell) support has been extremely quick and generous. I had a broken fan and rPi which they gave me a partial refund of the full amount it cost me to purchase replacements locally.

They've taken the graph down now, but they claimed there was an insanely low number of DOA units. I had one dead blade, the other major reviewer had BOTH blades dead. Take a look at my thread - the same problem which comes up again and again is the blade the Pi is plugged into is DOA so it doesn't see any of them.

Come at it from another angle... why would one post a graph of DOA units % when you've only been selling for about a week if there were no problems with DOA numbers?

I can see your point I just don't think it's worth 5/10 for ethics.

Yes there are DOA issues like any other manufacturer and they might have even lied about their DOA % but customers seem happy.

How can they have a high DOA rate, bad customer support, and no negative trust ratings or scam accusations?

I think you might be the only one who has bought from BTCGarden and think they are unethical.

[dogie]

Why is BTCGarden 5/10 for ethics?

Cos he works for Bitmain?........

What would that have anything to do with BTCGarden, and it would be pretty cool if my contract extended back in time by 3 months.

Anyway... BTCGarden have received an O infraction because they do have a moderate DOA rate but won't address the issue. In fact, they posted data which suggested they have an extremely low rate, which just wasn't matching up with the deliveries.

That sounds like total BS. How could you possibly know if their data is accurate or not?

Can you show me posts where their customers are complaining about no returns or any other issues?

In my experience (and everyone elses as far as I can tell) support has been extremely quick and generous. I had a broken fan and rPi which they gave me a partial refund of the full amount it cost me to purchase replacements locally.

They've taken the graph down now, but they claimed there was an insanely low number of DOA units. I had one dead blade, the other major reviewer had BOTH blades dead. Take a look at my thread - the same problem which comes up again and again is the blade the Pi is plugged into is DOA so it doesn't see any of them.

Come at it from another angle... why would one post a graph of DOA units % when you've only been selling for about a week if there were no problems with DOA numbers?

I can see your point I just don't think it's worth 5/10 for ethics.

Yes there are DOA issues like any other manufacturer and they might have even lied about their DOA % but customers seem happy.

How can they have a high DOA rate, bad customer support, and no negative trust ratings or scam accusations?

I think you might be the only one who has bought from BTCGarden and think they are unethical.

They can have a high DOA rate as long as they fix them [they didn't mine, or the other reviewers and ignored the emails], which is why they've got 10/10 for hardware problems.  But they'll still pick up the infraction for covering it up / hiding it. If you've got problems, own them rather than actively trying to hide them.

Its listed an 'other' infraction'. Its not directly saying they're unethical, rather that things could be better.

[RoadStress]

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.

Wait a minute. SP-Tech always had batches and they were "Mixed" and now they are "Yes" on the pre-order category. Care to explain? If you are unaware of the batches they are "first half of the month" and "second half of the month". I understand that there was a pre-order for SP30, but the SP30 was launched in August. Since then only batches were available to order.

They've been preorders for the vast majority of their sales from day 1. There's no way to get around the fact that all the risk is put on the customer, which can backfire [as with SP30s]. Even with compensation, customers got a very different product than they had ordered 3-4 months before. [This rating hasn't changed for months and months, and was an error when it was listed as batch.]

Ok, but please explain me the difference from SP-Tech pre-orders and AM's pre-orders. The way I see it is that since August the SP30 is a developed product just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities. If I am wrong please enlighten me.

[jimmothy]

Ok, but please explain me the difference from SP-Tech pre-orders and AM's pre-orders. The way I see it is that since August the SP30 is a developed product just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities. If I am wrong please enlighten me.

Are purposely being obtuse or do you actually not see the difference?

Spondoolies is not selling tested hardware. They are selling hardware with estimated specs.

[dogie]

• ASICMiner Preorders down from 'Yes' to 'Batch' (20 to 16) - Not considered full preorders as the Prisma was fully designed and just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities.

Wait a minute. SP-Tech always had batches and they were "Mixed" and now they are "Yes" on the pre-order category. Care to explain? If you are unaware of the batches they are "first half of the month" and "second half of the month". I understand that there was a pre-order for SP30, but the SP30 was launched in August. Since then only batches were available to order.

They've been preorders for the vast majority of their sales from day 1. There's no way to get around the fact that all the risk is put on the customer, which can backfire [as with SP30s]. Even with compensation, customers got a very different product than they had ordered 3-4 months before. [This rating hasn't changed for months and months, and was an error when it was listed as batch.]

Ok, but please explain me the difference from SP-Tech pre-orders and AM's pre-orders. The way I see it is that since August the SP30 is a developed product just waiting to be produced in sufficient quantities. If I am wrong please enlighten me.

AM's preorders were batch products with a longer leadtime than usual due to a 9 day public holiday being in the middle. The Prismas already existed and were just being made in sufficient quantities. The SPTech preorders were based on chips which didn't exist yet to go into miners which hadn't been produced yet. As you saw, this meant that the final product came back at 75% hash rate and 30% higher power consumption. AND, the SPTech preorders were over a 3-4 month period, not 4 weeks.

[RoadStress]

AM's preorders were batch products with a longer leadtime than usual due to a 9 day public holiday being in the middle. The Prismas already existed and were just being made in sufficient quantities. The SPTech preorders were based on chips which didn't exist yet to go into miners which hadn't been produced yet. As you saw, this meant that the final product came back at 75% hash rate and 30% higher power consumption. AND, the SPTech preorders were over a 3-4 month period, not 4 weeks.

You still don't get it. Or don't want to. What you said about SP-Tech preorders was available until August when the first units of SP30s shipped. Afterwards the product existed and was just being made in sufficient quantities. Since August there were no pre-orders. Only batch products with a lead time. We are past half October. That's over 2 months since the SP30s exist on the market. Am I wrong? Even now you can order the SP35 Novermber Batch 1. Where is the pre-order?

[Blazed]

I agree with dogie on this.. AM was not really a pre order since they had chips in hand. AM just needed new boards and they had a holiday. SP is defently a pre order company...


Now scamalon being rated higher than AM is just silly though.