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Poll
Question: Why do you mine on deepbit?
Because everybody mine there
Because I thought it invests the earned money in good anti-DDoS firewall
Because my friend told me
Because it has sound name
Because Tycho is a good man
Are there more pools!!??

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Author Topic: Why do you mine on deepbit?  (Read 7355 times)
Jezzz
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October 13, 2011, 09:38:59 PM
 #21

For those who PPS mine, BTC Guild's PPS Pool is by far the best in terms of performance, stability and payout options. I don't understand why more people don't use it.

- Instant payouts (no waiting for a block to end, no confirmations...just a running total of your earnings available at any time).
- Insanely LOW Stales etc.....like INSANELY LOW (4/4000 shares ON A BAD DAY, for me anyways...closer to 4/40000 most times).
- Established Pool with history.
- Standard 7% PPS Fee.

This is an insane big fee.
Compared to the 10% PPS Fee @ Deepbit ? ....... What PURE-PPS Pools offer a lower fee with stability and under 1% Stale count ? ..not to mention, paying out for bad blocks.....IMMEDIATELY, no wait.

No, compared to 0% fee of arsbitcoin and eligius, 7% is infinitely big.

About waiting: I'm not hurry.

About stability: BTCguild has a black past managing DDoS.
Must I really say P P S once again ?

In a world where 0% PPS is available, I don't know why you would mine at a 7% pool.  Longevity is irrelevant.  Why wouldn't you take the 0% and then move to a different 0% pool if/when it collapses?  Or move to your 7% pool.  Just seems illogical that you're giving away 7 points.
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Brian DeLoach
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October 13, 2011, 11:04:06 PM
 #22

What is ABC's current payout per share ?

50 / 1689334.4045971 = 0.0000295974555801 per share.

0% means they take no portion of shares. Longevity is largely irrelevant, you can do auto-payouts so they don't ever hold a meaningful portion of your coins.

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October 13, 2011, 11:35:44 PM
 #23

The difference between PPS and SMPPS... with SMPPS, there's some delay/risk if the pool's buffer runs dry; with pure PPS, if the pool's "buffer" runs dry, the pool shuts down and your miners are idle Wink

Besides, with Eligius's buffer usually about 1000 BTC (and only ever hitting 0 for very brief single rounds), there is no practical difference unless you're so broke that you need that 0.00001 BTC right this instant to pay for your kids' food.

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October 14, 2011, 12:19:17 AM
 #24

i thought bigger Mhash are bigger payout. but i was wrong  Sad.now im mining on biggest PPS pool like abc or arbitcoin
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October 14, 2011, 02:24:11 AM
 #25

I'm really shocked about how many people still mine on deepbit: big fees, no 8-decimal pays, no particular clear interface, no repayment after leaving, risk of deepbit getting more than 50% hash power... with the result it is the most powerful pool.

On the other hand, somebody could think they are using the income in good DDoS-reluctant counter measures, so those disadvantages are a worthy price for security. But the early catastrophe proves this is not true.

That is why I launch the poll, because I'm really curious about the matter of advantages mining in deepbit, even as a backup pool. Feel free to answer here, if your option is not in the poll.

They payout 8 decimals... 3% isn't that big of a fee if you factor in invalids being paid out. The interface is alot easier to figure than some of these smaller pools. And for the most part its a stable pool.

You do understand paying invalids in a proportional pool is simply a marketing gimmick.  The pool isn't giving you anything.  Your invalids are paid but so is the entire pools invalids.  Thus your share of the block reward doesn't change.  i.e. if you had 1% of pool's hashing power w/o invalids and your invalid rate is similar to pool average than you have 1% of pool's hashing power w/ invalids.  Either way you are getting 1% of the block (minus 3% fee).

The only time that paying invalids is a net positive is for people who can't get it together and have massively high invalids.  If your invalid rate is significantly higher than the pool average you are coming out ahead.  Conversely if you are like me with <0.05% invalid rate then you come out behind.
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October 14, 2011, 02:25:50 AM
 #26

I'm really shocked about how many people still mine on deepbit: big fees, no 8-decimal pays, no particular clear interface, no repayment after leaving, risk of deepbit getting more than 50% hash power... with the result it is the most powerful pool.

On the other hand, somebody could think they are using the income in good DDoS-reluctant counter measures, so those disadvantages are a worthy price for security. But the early catastrophe proves this is not true.

That is why I launch the poll, because I'm really curious about the matter of advantages mining in deepbit, even as a backup pool. Feel free to answer here, if your option is not in the poll.

They payout 8 decimals... 3% isn't that big of a fee if you factor in invalids being paid out. The interface is alot easier to figure than some of these smaller pools. And for the most part its a stable pool.

You do understand paying invalids in a proportional pool is simply a marketing gimmick.  The pool isn't giving you anything.  Your invalids are paid but so is the entire pools invalids.  Thus your share of the block reward doesn't change.  i.e. if you had 1% of pool's hashing power w/o invalids and your invalid rate is similar to pool average than you have 1% of pool's hashing power w/ invalids.  Either way you are getting 1% of the block (minus 3% fee).

The only time that paying invalids is a net positive is for people who can't get it together and have massively high invalids.  If your invalid rate is significantly higher than the pool average you are coming out ahead.  Conversely if you are like me with <0.05% invalid rate then you come out behind.
Pretty sure Deepbit and he mean invalid blocks. Ie, if their block is invalid, Deepbit still pays 48.50 BTC out to miners

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October 14, 2011, 02:31:24 AM
 #27

Pretty sure Deepbit and he mean invalid blocks. Ie, if their block is invalid, Deepbit still pays 48.50 BTC out to miners
^This.  I think invalids and stales were mixed up.

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DeathAndTaxes
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October 14, 2011, 02:49:28 AM
 #28

Pretty sure Deepbit and he mean invalid blocks. Ie, if their block is invalid, Deepbit still pays 48.50 BTC out to miners

DOH.  Total and complete brain fart on my part.  Then again I am on some pain drugs right now.  Yeah I think I will blame the drugs.

In that case I guess the value of the feature would depend on how many invalid blocks deepbit has had (as a %).
bitlane
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October 14, 2011, 03:31:33 AM
 #29

Well, I will end by saying this:

My comparison (ON TOPIC AT THAT) was between Deepbit and BTC Guild ONLY..... 10% vs 7% for PPS payouts.

Frankly, most other pools mentioned in this thread, with the exception of Luke's pool and Slush's Pool, do not even belong in the same sentance, let alone the same thread as either 1.....especially being compared to.

These are the 2 largest Pools and are 2 of the oldest/most established pools.

Now, let's see a 0% Fee PPS Pool rack up the stats that either of these pools has done regardless of their fees, then we can talk.

BTC Guild - FTW ! .....Currently paying 0.00003167154226788676/share after the difficulty change...and I am FINE with that.

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October 14, 2011, 03:42:08 AM
 #30

While Eligus and Ars aren't PPS I have never had a significant fraction of my total earnings in the buffer.  If either of them went bankrupt tomorrow my lifetime loss rate would likely be <1% far cheaper than a guaranteed loss rate of 7% or 10% (in fees).

I mean if someone is so broke they absolutely need every single bitcent paid within seconds of earning it well then maybe Deepbit or BTCGuild are worth it but honestly if you are in that boat you likely shouldn't be mining anyways.   Roll Eyes
Luke-Jr
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October 14, 2011, 03:45:07 AM
 #31

While Eligus and Ars aren't PPS I have never had a significant fraction of my total earnings in the buffer.  If either of them went bankrupt tomorrow my lifetime loss rate would likely be <1% far cheaper than a guaranteed loss rate of 7% or 10% (in fees).
Both Ars and Eligius have positive buffers right now, and have therefore paid 100% of PPS to every miner on them. So 0% loss. Since at least Eligius's buffer is huge, the chance of being paid less than 100% of straight PPS is extremely small.

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October 14, 2011, 03:55:19 AM
 #32

Both Ars and Eligius have positive buffers right now, and have therefore paid 100% of PPS to every miner on them. So 0% loss. Since at least Eligius's buffer is huge, the chance of being paid less than 100% of straight PPS is extremely small.

Absolutely.  I was just pointing out that worst case scenario at some point in the future IF (and I agree it is very unlikely) the buffer went negative and pool closed any loss I would take (on either pool) is significantly less than 7%/10% of lifetime earnings.  Hell it likely isn't even 0.5% of lifetime earnings.   

I was just pointing out (maybe poorly) that the idea of paying 7%/10% (a guaranteed 7%/10% loss) to maybe avoid a tiny loss in the future (which may never happen) is illogical.  Seems more like justification that rational thought.
bitlane
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October 14, 2011, 04:32:28 AM
 #33

I mean if someone is so broke they absolutely need every single bitcent paid within seconds of earning it well then maybe Deepbit or BTCGuild are worth it but honestly if you are in that boat you likely shouldn't be mining anyways.   Roll Eyes
Well, considering it's the BROKE PEOPLE who reign supreme (or so the Total Hash rates say for the network as a whole) while mining Deepbit & BTCG, I'd say it's a safe bet that anyone who says anything bad about them is either a jelous pool owner themselves, or far too rich and shouldn't concern themselves with the lowly miners to begin with  Roll Eyes

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October 14, 2011, 04:34:43 AM
 #34

I'm really shocked about how many people still mine on deepbit: big fees, no 8-decimal pays, no particular clear interface, no repayment after leaving, risk of deepbit getting more than 50% hash power... with the result it is the most powerful pool.

maybe that's the reason?

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bitlane
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October 14, 2011, 04:36:36 AM
 #35

How about THIS:

The 1 Month Challenge......

I feel comfortable enough to mine for an entire month long WITHOUT A WITHDRAWL and feel confident in my funds still being there after 30 days. How about we both try this with about 3 GH/s using PPS....me on BTCG and YOU on your 0% Fee Pool.
Let's see who can sleep at night after the second week and who can not (while pretending BTC=$25 USD/BTC.....LOL).

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October 14, 2011, 04:37:32 AM
 #36

I don't think most deepbit miners are broke.  I think many are simply uninformed.  In a proportional pool size certainly matters and proportional is where mining pools began.  But with PPS/PPLNS/SMPPS reward systems size isn't important thus paying a huge premium to be part of a big pool is a non issue.  

Many miners are simply uninformed.  I mean look at all the data on proportional pools and how much 24/7 miners lose to hoppers yet many people still mine on proportional pools.  Hell people keep forming new proportional mining pools despite the evidence.  

The broke reference was tongue in cheek.  I doubt anyone is that broke that they need 0.03 BTC NOW, not 3 hours from now, not tomorrow but absolutely NOW and is making an informed choice to pay the 10% vig to get that $0.12 RIGHT NOW!

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Gerald Davis


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October 14, 2011, 04:40:48 AM
 #37

How about THIS:

The 1 Month Challenge......

I feel comfortable enough to mine for an entire month long WITHOUT A WITHDRAWL and feel confident in my funds still being there after 30 days. How about we both try this with about 3 GH/s using PPS....me on BTCG and YOU on your 0% Fee Pool.
Let's see who can sleep at night after the second week and who can not (while pretending BTC=$10 USD/BTC.....LOL).

I challenge you to eat dogshit for an entire month and see if your health improves.

Seriously what benefit does a miner get for leaving money on the pool for a whole month?  Given the volatility in exchange rates even if mining pool accounts were FDIC insured I wouldn't leave funds on there for a month.
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October 14, 2011, 05:12:09 AM
 #38

The 1 Month Challenge......

I feel comfortable enough to mine for an entire month long WITHOUT A WITHDRAWL and feel confident in my funds still being there after 30 days. How about we both try this with about 3 GH/s using PPS....me on BTCG and YOU on your 0% Fee Pool.
Let's see who can sleep at night after the second week and who can not (while pretending BTC=$25 USD/BTC.....LOL).
Eligius won't even let miners do this, despite being one of the oldest pools around. Wink

(Mere) pools have no business carrying balances.

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October 14, 2011, 05:26:49 AM
 #39

Deepbit miners obviously are the lazy type who do not look around for better possibilities. You could also see that during DDoS. Instead of looking for alternatives the miners went idle and lots of hash power was lost causing the diff to drop pretty heavily in the most recent hours before retarget.

# BTCServ - EU based Mining Pool
# 0% PPS - 0.0000399757 - Hopping Proof
# Official Thread
bitlane
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October 14, 2011, 06:41:51 AM
 #40

I challenge you to eat dogshit for an entire month and see if your health improves.
Perhaps you might want to create a Java app for that ? .....but then again, with it, I might be forced to eat only your dog shit and not have a choice in the end......  Roll Eyes

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