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Author Topic: The reason why bitcoin will never *stay* below 5000$ again. PROVE ME WRONG  (Read 2153 times)
Allan Ramanda
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September 01, 2018, 01:28:08 PM
 #61

Current Market cap is 120b $ (actually real market cap much lower than that due to lost btc and so on); that could be 1000 people with 120m$ hidden. Anyone who has approximately that amount of btc would be very able to buy the market would it temporarily drop significantly below 5000$ per btc, due to the very limited (and shrinking) actual supply of bitcoin and availability in the exchanges.

I think what we witnessed in last december will happen again and at a greater extent. Don't ask me when, but that's a given.

Bitcoin has been chosen.
Why? Possibly positioning.

Price won't give a fuck on whether it can be used everyday to buy stuff. Its purpose it for wealthy billionaires to keep part of their wealth inaccessible through offline wallets.
Whether tx take 1 hours to go and cost 10 bucks each.
Whether the nodes get a little bit more or a little bit less centralized.

All that matters is the one reason I stated above.
Everything else is just smoke for sardines.
actually the price of bitcoin depends on traders and investors, we cannot predict clearly how the price of bitcoin will be in the future. but we can judge from the development of bitcoin so far, and I am very confident that the price of bitcoin will rise higher.
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September 01, 2018, 01:31:04 PM
 #62

completely agree with the author and also think that the people who wait for bitcoin for 5k are simply insane and will buy it for 12k

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September 01, 2018, 01:38:05 PM
 #63

Bitcoin and the whole cryptography industry are very different from the traditional market, and I think that to be confident in something is simply meaningless at the moment. It seems to me bitcoin can cost 3000 dollars.
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September 01, 2018, 01:56:37 PM
 #64

One of the reason why prices are likely to raise again is that the big miners (Bitmain, etc) won't allow the price to tank too much or they will lose money. They have probably sold a lot of BTCs at ATH and now they should be full loaded with cash that at some point they will use to buy back, to protect their mining investment.

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September 04, 2018, 02:01:03 PM
 #65

One of the reason why prices are likely to raise again is that the big miners (Bitmain, etc) won't allow the price to tank too much or they will lose money. They have probably sold a lot of BTCs at ATH and now they should be full loaded with cash that at some point they will use to buy back, to protect their mining investment.

That's a really good thought! I think other mining pools will do the same, becouse all huge investors have similar strategy.
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September 04, 2018, 02:15:27 PM
 #66

all the truth the author bitkoin really never already to fall below 5k precisely because its mining simply will be unprofitable

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September 05, 2018, 10:28:17 AM
 #67

Dude, you can never talk about the cost of bitcoin for sure! Since its value isn't backed up by anything!
Yes, you are very correct beside the price of cryptocurrencies are unpredictable you can't tell if it will be below or above $5000 since price changes with seconds here in crypto world. Just get this no one here is ever praying for bitcoin to be below $5000 but that does not warrants the prediction.
Bugatti73
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September 05, 2018, 06:09:05 PM
 #68

Dude, you can never talk about the cost of bitcoin for sure! Since its value isn't backed up by anything!
Yes, you are very correct beside the price of cryptocurrencies are unpredictable you can't tell if it will be below or above $5000 since price changes with seconds here in crypto world. Just get this no one here is ever praying for bitcoin to be below $5000 but that does not warrants the prediction.
You are right, but they all overpower, and this is understandable, because many people in the bitcoin have huge money.
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September 05, 2018, 06:23:05 PM
 #69

Your version deserves attention.But to argue about the value of bitcoin, I think prematurely.Prices will definitely grow, but at this time fluctuate.I hope that up to $ 5000 will not come Cool
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September 05, 2018, 06:55:14 PM
 #70

You stated in your write up that bitcoin is a way for the wealthy billionaire to store their money offline. The wealthy will always become wealthier because they always grab any promising opportunity that comes their way while the poor people are mostly full of doubt and fear. The wealthy are not stopping the poor from buying bitcoin in order to become billionaire as well.

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September 05, 2018, 07:12:24 PM
 #71

The only reason of not dropping price below 5000 usd is that mining won't be profitable.

That's not the "only" reason, but a very strong one. The reason #1 is the one I posted.

This is a very weak argument really. No one gives a fuck about mining costs, let alone there being a single cost of mining in the first place. If anything, whatever bitcoin price might be (5k or 1k), there will always be enough miners as mining will always stay profitable at any price. If mining is no longer profitable for some miners, they just leave while the rest picks up the slack instantly taking their share of the reward pie (as the reward remains the same). No offense intended, but honestly, when people bring up this argument about costs of mining, you can be certain that they don't have a clue about how everything works regarding prices, costs, and other economic matters.

As to your claim in the OP, anyone with enough bitcoins (like the mtgox dude) can crash the price to 1k or even below and keep it there as long as he sees fit. There is no reason to prove you wrong as it is just a matter of someone with deep enough pockets, for example, Satoshi and his likes, choosing to dump enough coins. There is nothing to prove here.
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September 10, 2018, 04:11:37 PM
 #72

Current Market cap is 120b $ (actually real market cap much lower than that due to lost btc and so on); that could be 1000 people with 120m$ hidden. Anyone who has approximately that amount of btc would be very able to buy the market would it temporarily drop significantly below 5000$ per btc, due to the very limited (and shrinking) actual supply of bitcoin and availability in the exchanges.

I think what we witnessed in last december will happen again and at a greater extent. Don't ask me when, but that's a given.

Bitcoin has been chosen.
Why? Possibly positioning.

Price won't give a fuck on whether it can be used everyday to buy stuff. Its purpose it for wealthy billionaires to keep part of their wealth inaccessible through offline wallets.
Whether tx take 1 hours to go and cost 10 bucks each.
Whether the nodes get a little bit more or a little bit less centralized.

All that matters is the one reason I stated above.
Everything else is just smoke for sardines.
I also believe that Bitcoin will not stay below $5000 because the demand is more powerful than the manipulators and the dumpers.It is not like fiat currency where inflation kicks in. Bitcoin is inflation proof and it will climb no matter how hard they dump it.

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tegarp90
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September 10, 2018, 04:16:00 PM
 #73

Current Market cap is 120b $ (actually real market cap much lower than that due to lost btc and so on); that could be 1000 people with 120m$ hidden. Anyone who has approximately that amount of btc would be very able to buy the market would it temporarily drop significantly below 5000$ per btc, due to the very limited (and shrinking) actual supply of bitcoin and availability in the exchanges.

I think what we witnessed in last december will happen again and at a greater extent. Don't ask me when, but that's a given.

Bitcoin has been chosen.
Why? Possibly positioning.

Price won't give a fuck on whether it can be used everyday to buy stuff. Its purpose it for wealthy billionaires to keep part of their wealth inaccessible through offline wallets.
Whether tx take 1 hours to go and cost 10 bucks each.
Whether the nodes get a little bit more or a little bit less centralized.

All that matters is the one reason I stated above.
Everything else is just smoke for sardines.

but i think everything is possible in crypto, so we are not recommended to really trust what we trusted or analyzed before, because it can be wrong anytime
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September 10, 2018, 09:47:59 PM
 #74

The only reason of not dropping price below 5000 usd is that mining won't be profitable.

That's not the "only" reason, but a very strong one. The reason #1 is the one I posted.

This is a very weak argument really. No one gives a fuck about mining costs, let alone there being a single cost of mining in the first place. If anything, whatever bitcoin price might be (5k or 1k), there will always be enough miners as mining will always stay profitable at any price. If mining is no longer profitable for some miners, they just leave while the rest picks up the slack instantly taking their share of the reward pie (as the reward remains the same). No offense intended, but honestly, when people bring up this argument about costs of mining, you can be certain that they don't have a clue about how everything works regarding prices, costs, and other economic matters.

As to your claim in the OP, anyone with enough bitcoins (like the mtgox dude) can crash the price to 1k or even below and keep it there as long as he sees fit. There is no reason to prove you wrong as it is just a matter of someone with deep enough pockets, for example, Satoshi and his likes, choosing to dump enough coins. There is nothing to prove here.

No - it is important because people who are heavily involved in mining who happens to have a considerable wealth, will always try to manipulate the price above their profitability rate.
Manipulating up a 100B$ market is easier than manipulating it down.

Simple as that, if you disagree read again because it's a very simple concept.
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September 11, 2018, 10:46:59 AM
 #75

It wont fall again because even Bicoins price dropped but due to many negative effects it had to face from the world but the world understanding towards Bitoin is changing so we can see many industries and businesses are trying to connect Bitcoin with there core business processes and that can give a good place in the near future to increase it's price and expand more in the globe so I think the possibility of Bitcoin to go under 5000$ is minimum in the future
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September 13, 2018, 05:10:24 AM
 #76

Bitcoin will never go below 5000$ again because it is expanding at the moment in the business world in a high rate as a digital currency and soon its price will rise to the previous level or more so better to buy now without thinking twice and like you have mentioned ethereum price too is low and doing ethereum investments too will be very profitable in the future but for any now is the time to buy and hold
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September 13, 2018, 05:26:22 AM
 #77

The only reason of not dropping price below 5000 usd is that mining won't be profitable.

That's not the "only" reason, but a very strong one. The reason #1 is the one I posted.

This is a very weak argument really. No one gives a fuck about mining costs, let alone there being a single cost of mining in the first place. If anything, whatever bitcoin price might be (5k or 1k), there will always be enough miners as mining will always stay profitable at any price. If mining is no longer profitable for some miners, they just leave while the rest picks up the slack instantly taking their share of the reward pie (as the reward remains the same). No offense intended, but honestly, when people bring up this argument about costs of mining, you can be certain that they don't have a clue about how everything works regarding prices, costs, and other economic matters.

As to your claim in the OP, anyone with enough bitcoins (like the mtgox dude) can crash the price to 1k or even below and keep it there as long as he sees fit. There is no reason to prove you wrong as it is just a matter of someone with deep enough pockets, for example, Satoshi and his likes, choosing to dump enough coins. There is nothing to prove here.

No - it is important because people who are heavily involved in mining who happens to have a considerable wealth, will always try to manipulate the price above their profitability rate.
Manipulating up a 100B$ market is easier than manipulating it down.

Simple as that, if you disagree read again because it's a very simple concept.
If there are some legit investors who want to exit from the crypto currency hereafter the prices may drop too because the investment made in the bitcoin by everyone from millionaires to small traders so if the some of the pull out their investment capital because of long time tiring bear market it can bring the prices to $5000 too.But the whales won't let that happen I think since we have seen many crashes in the bitcoin price but still it can be hang around at $6000 level.
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September 13, 2018, 07:08:13 AM
 #78

OP is wrong
the topic is good. but his reasoning lacks...

because his whole comment is based on market cap. and he talks about it as if there is a stockpile of dollars held somewhere holding the price up.
sorry there isnt

bitcoins price is made up from a seller having coins and finding a buyer that agrees with the price. the price moves depending on the price agreed.

market cap is just a multiplication of that price.
EG i can make 5 trillion coins. sell 1 coin for $1 and have $5trill cap.. that does not mean there is actually $5trill holding up the price. there is only $1
now there is also no central holding of the dollars to back it up. the person that sold they have taken the funds and moved on.

but lets pretend there was a central store
if i tried to sell my coins. i would not get 5trillion. i would end up with 0.0000000000002 per coin ($1) if sold all the coins to get to that $1 held

in short market caps are MEANINGLESS!!!

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Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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September 13, 2018, 07:11:53 AM
 #79

now here is why bitcoin wont go down
acquisition costs
1. mining. right now miners have to buy equipment and pay electric to acquire fresh coins. the cost of this is, based on this months LOW hashrate of 42exa(5th sept) =$5670.. only the mining pool that mined coins at 42exa's block would sell their coins for $5670 to just break even. no mining pool will sell their coins at a loss so the other coins they mine this month at higher hashrates would have a higher cost average.

2. trading. since november 2017 and retested end of june 2018. no trader has sold below $5800. there has been 10 months of oppertunity for anyone who is happy to sell below $5800 to actually sell below $5800... no one has.
as for those that did sell at $5800 in november and june they sold, they are out they took their funds and left. the buyer of those coins now has a cost of $5800 and they wont stupidly sell for less.

3. looking at the UTXO data over 65% of coins have moved/changed hands since the $5,800 price point. and they have not sold below $5800. the other 35% are older coins. which some say could be lost keys, held in trust/for retirement. locked in bankrupcy legal blackholes(mtgox). so in short 2 thirds of the community dont want to sell for less because they have ben active enough to show they had oppertunity. but have not sold when they had the chance


4. so since the november and retested a few times. people with coins and mining coins have to a majority of over 65% collectively agreed they wont sell below $5800.

now lets imagine that the $5800 could be broken.
the idea is that of the 35% that didnt move/spend/sell even though their costs are below $5800 is because they:
have not checked the price for a year and didnt realise the price
lost their keys.
not ready to sell yet

now we all know that the 35% doesnt belong to one person. and if it was a group and they wanted to collectively collude. they would have done so already. they had many chances to group up.
but if one person had 5000btc to sell down the market volume of bitfinex to $5800 or 2000btc to sell down the market of GDAX. before they even get to sell their last coin. the market buyers wishing to buy over $5800 would be grabbing coins before 5800 and the price wont get to what the seller wants to push it down to, in short it would flash crash and then the buyers will see it as a discount opportunity and recover the price back up.

it would require alot of coins to tank the price and then perpetually keep it down to fight off the buyers who will be counteracting those efforts.
this worry is the whole thing about the "what if MTGox,, what if satoshi" .. well as i said earlier. they have had plenty of chances while the price is above $5800 to sell

but because 10 months of opportunity has shown no desire to do it and the mining costs show pools wont. id say thats a good case and percentage we wont see the bottom fall out of the market

I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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September 15, 2018, 12:48:11 PM
 #80

No one can predict certainly that bitcoin will never go under that amount and I too cannot do that because we saw unthinkable happen since we came to the crypto market but I do think still there is a possibility we can make profits from bitcoin investment because in the past Countries tried make restrictions against Bitcoin and some tried to ban and with the price fall many thought Bitcoin will disappeared but now it is recovering like it didn't even care what happened and the possibility is high that bitcoin soon will gain it's previous price very easily without any problem but it depends how external factors reacts on bitcoin in the future
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