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Author Topic: What if MtGox makes good?  (Read 3624 times)
idee2013
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February 27, 2014, 01:23:57 PM
 #41

one thing i do not unterstand. I read at many sources that there are only 2000 BTC left.
But i have tracked the path of one deposit adress of gox in which i have deposited btc in dezember 2013. And the path is ending for example in this adress
https://blockchain.info/de/address/1FfdcppWbJ7FeQFznsjdLYNXdwMdoiTGSA
And there are over 10k btc...and this is only one adress.
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Wilhelm
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February 27, 2014, 01:39:57 PM
 #42

one thing i do not unterstand. I read at many sources that there are only 2000 BTC left.
But i have tracked the path of one deposit adress of gox in which i have deposited btc in dezember 2013. And the path is ending for example in this adress
https://blockchain.info/de/address/1FfdcppWbJ7FeQFznsjdLYNXdwMdoiTGSA
And there are over 10k btc...and this is only one adress.

This implies MtGOX has 10K btc and still lost 700K ?

Bitcoin is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get !!
anth0ny
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February 27, 2014, 01:42:08 PM
 #43

one thing i do not unterstand. I read at many sources that there are only 2000 BTC left.
But i have tracked the path of one deposit adress of gox in which i have deposited btc in dezember 2013. And the path is ending for example in this adress
https://blockchain.info/de/address/1FfdcppWbJ7FeQFznsjdLYNXdwMdoiTGSA
And there are over 10k btc...and this is only one adress.

Maybe you tracked the path wrong (i.e. one of those transfers in the path is a withdrawal)?
idee2013
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February 27, 2014, 01:49:02 PM
Last edit: February 27, 2014, 02:06:45 PM by idee2013
 #44

one thing i do not unterstand. I read at many sources that there are only 2000 BTC left.
But i have tracked the path of one deposit adress of gox in which i have deposited btc in dezember 2013. And the path is ending for example in this adress
https://blockchain.info/de/address/1FfdcppWbJ7FeQFznsjdLYNXdwMdoiTGSA
And there are over 10k btc...and this is only one adress.

This implies MtGOX has 10K btc and still lost 700K ?

no,

i said, if i know it right, gox had many cold storages...and this could be only one of those.... i think that the amount of only 2000 left btc is not true


Maybe you tracked the path wrong (i.e. one of those transfers in the path is a withdrawal)?


ehm...who is sending manually 100BTC or 200BTC packages ?...
anth0ny
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February 27, 2014, 02:42:13 PM
Last edit: February 27, 2014, 02:55:48 PM by anth0ny
 #45


Maybe you tracked the path wrong (i.e. one of those transfers in the path is a withdrawal)?


ehm...who is sending manually 100BTC or 200BTC packages ?...

I don't know, but apparently you think you do. (What makes you think the transfers were manual, and how is that relevant anyway?)

Do you think Gox made this transaction yesterday? They're still depositing BTC into cold storage? https://blockchain.info/tx/9ee728587d374b6e240ba0078a16eb2c2f932ba51635016c3fd52b466d261fd6
jatajuta
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February 27, 2014, 03:10:50 PM
 #46

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1z30q9/gox_has_at_least_50000_btc/

Its becoming more and more clear that they wasn't robbed but have somehow lost control of the private keys.

For security, your account has been locked. Email acctcomp15@theymos.e4ward.com
anth0ny
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February 27, 2014, 03:20:20 PM
Last edit: February 27, 2014, 04:15:11 PM by anth0ny
 #47

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1z30q9/gox_has_at_least_50000_btc/

Its becoming more and more clear that they wasn't robbed but have somehow lost control of the private keys.

"they tried to consolidate 10 50k coins into one 500k coin, and ended up with 50k in change" https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/d3d753578c1043ce3755f097ce96cc2388a08738/src/test/wallet_tests.cpp#L208

This is the 50K change? Is it real? Is it spendable? Or is it a bug?

---

EDIT: Some more:

"That was MtGox trying to consolidate 10 50k coins into a single large 500k coin. The extra 50k was added by some code in the official client that is a little too careful to avoid sub-cent change."

https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/3287/what-is-the-largest-transaction-by-value-to-date-for-bitcoin-currency

I'm still not sure exactly what that means, though.

---

EDIT 1.5:

I think what it means is that they had a wallet with at least eleven 50K coins in it (maybe some other coins, maybe not), and they tried to pay themselves 500K BTC. Instead of using ten 50K coins and converting it into one 500K coin, it took eleven 50K coins and converted it into one 500K coin and one 50K coin.

In other words, the transaction is valid, and the change is valid. The bug was that the software used more coins than was necessary.

See https://gitorious.org/bitcoin/luke-jr-bitcoin/commit/e7199041ed68440d85bafd24155b3f9b98b7b94d

---

EDIT 2:

I bet they lost the private key on that 50K (BTC) coin - either permanently or it's sitting around somewhere waiting to be found.

Thanks for the very interesting link!

---

EDIT 3:

Very interesting implications if they claim to a bankruptcy court that they lost that 50K BTC coin. It'd be plausible (especially given that the coin in question was caused by a bug and nothing from that address has ever been spent), but unprovable. And what can you do if 2, 5, 10 years later suddenly the coin gets spent? Nothing, really.

I guess it'd be the same thing with cash, but it's significantly harder to embezzle $30,000,000 in hundred dollar bills. Even hiding cash is somewhat harder.
sumantso
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February 27, 2014, 03:26:58 PM
 #48

'What if MtGox makes good?'

Stop torturing yourselves.

joehal
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February 27, 2014, 04:51:45 PM
 #49

Doesn't matter if the bitcoins are lost or not - we could still get our money back and enrich all the exchanges and bitcoin in the process :

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=489949.0  (Voluntary Reorganization Best Option for Us All)

https://www.facebook.com/pages/MtGox-Recovery-Initiative/1394428424158424
Puppet
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March 01, 2014, 08:44:45 AM
 #50

WARNING: PURE SPECULATION

I'm changing my tune.  Yesterday I thought the 750,000 BTC figure was FUD to get certain Gox creditors to voluntarily accept 10 cents on the dollar for their GoxBTC.  The theory I'm leaning towards now is that the 750,000 BTC figure is true and Gox has indeed been operating as a fractional reserve.    

I agree this is the most plausible explanation.

There is another piece of evidence pointing in the same direction Im trying to dig up. A few weeks ago, well before Gox went down, someone posted that Mark K once said there was a "secret" that needed protecting, and if unveiled, would cause tremendous damage to bitcoin. It was not a direct quote, I cant find a direct quote, I dont recall who attributed it to Mark. Anyone remember reading anything along those lines?
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